AudioCircle
Audio/Video Gear and Systems => The Apple Core => Topic started by: JohnR on 25 Jun 2012, 09:30 am
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Hi all, I've written an introductory tutorial on computer audio on the Mac:
http://www.hifizine.com/2012/06/computer-audio-on-the-mac-getting-started/
It's the best one ever. Really! ;) Let me know if you agree or disagree :)
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:thumb:
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Very well done. :thumb:
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John, that rocked, very thorough. But you don't need to convince me, I'm a mac mini convert! :thumb:
Anand.
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Very nicely done. Thanks for the effort.
Rocket_Ronny
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Thanks guys :)
Tell all your friends! (It was a lot of work...)
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Very interesting. I just browsed through it and noted a few items I'll need to check on my mac mini when I have more time tonight. Very thorough and a recommended read for anyone getting started.
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Very helpfull John. As a non computer type it was easy to follow and understand. Good job sir.
charles
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Thanks guys :)
Tell all your friends! (It was a lot of work...)
I can only imagine. You had to put it in prose/vernacular so everybody could understand it. Most of us are not computer savvy :rules:
Anand.
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John:
I have always used a PC for my computer playback. However, I have looked into going to a Mac Mini and have gotten assistance from Jason(jtrace).
Your article is very well written. Thanks for writing it. :thumb:
Regards
Randy
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Thanks for the excellent article. I am relatively new to computer audio and this is helpful. Last night I downloaded Audirvana Plus and I look forward to your thoughts on that product. I am a bit embarrassed to admit it, but I don't understand a great many of the features.
QUESTION: The sound with AP is awesome, but sometimes it skips a bit right at the beginning of a new song. Did I overlook some basic setup feature? Thanks for any help.
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I haven't had skips specifically at the start of tracks, although that is when A+ is processing the track and loading it into memory. Perhaps there is something else going on on your computer. However, try turning on the SysOptimizer settings.
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Thanks. I have read half of it, and it is making me finally starting to understand this computer audio thing, which seemed a black box to me. I have been thinking of adding a computer server for some time now, and this info will certainly help me. Good job on the good writing and visual aids.
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Thanks Andre :)
I realized there's a photo missing that I never got around to taking. So here it is (not that exciting but may be helpful to illustrate)
(http://www.hifizine.com/files/2012/06/Audio-connections-to-Mac-mini.jpg)
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John,
If you have a 27" iMac music server and want to control via screenshare you can turn down the display resolution of the iMac.
dave
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Thank you John R for a such a simple, logical and well planned primer. Simplicity is not easy to achieve. The section on the itunes library is the best explanation I have come across for someone who has struggled to make sense of this. And I have never come across the "Option key" tip before. I am looking forward to the next instalment.
As a 60yo newcomer to computer sourced music, this has been so useful and I really appreciate the time you obviously put into writing this guide.
One thing that eludes me with my setup, is that from what i understand, I would be better served SQ wise getting rid of the music off the macmini and playing it from my MiniStack 2.5 backup.
The problem is I can't get the macmini to play my itunes music from my Mini Stack which I have connected by a firewire 400 cable. I carboncloned the macmini to the Stack, but now I realize I just needed to copy the Itunes library.
I can set the' start up' disk as the Mini Stack and play itunes, but most articles I have read say I should be able to play the backup disk with no issues. Where did i go wrong?
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If you have a 27" iMac music server and want to control via screenshare you can turn down the display resolution of the iMac.
Yes, until you need to do something on the 27" iMac, when you need to change it back again. Then a bit later back in the LP and it has to be done again, with windows are the wrong sizes and in the wrong places, etc...
I still don't understand why Apple don't make a version of Remote that works on Macs. I'd pay for it...
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One thing that eludes me with my setup, is that from what i understand, I would be better served SQ wise getting rid of the music off the macmini and playing it from my MiniStack 2.5 backup.
The problem is I can't get the macmini to play my itunes music from my Mini Stack which I have connected by a firewire 400 cable. I carboncloned the macmini to the Stack, but now I realize I just needed to copy the Itunes library.
I can set the' start up' disk as the Mini Stack and play itunes, but most articles I have read say I should be able to play the backup disk with no issues. Where did i go wrong?
Hi, thanks for the kind words :)
If I understand correctly, you can do the Option-on-iTunes-startup procedure. Then select the library located on the external drive.
I'm not sure that there's an inherent benefit to what you are doing though, unless you're running out of space on the internal drive. Some recommend using an internal SSD for the OS and putting the music on an external (non SSD) drive. Then you can RAID the external drive. However you're not doing any of that - ?
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JohnR,
I have been reading about how to set up my Mac mini for a few months now with some success, but your explanation is by far the best I have come across. Thank You very much for putting in what must have a boat load of time and effort.
Although from your direction, but not exactly, I was able to drag and drop my iTunes folder into one of my external hard drives, (I am not a Mac user). Now what I don't know how to do and would like to do is have my music load directly onto my external hard drives when I burn it and would also like to play music directly from one of my external hard drives while using the other one as a backup. The idea is to remove all of the music from my Mac mini hard drive as I've read this improves SQ. I've also noticed some slowing down of iTunes and a few glitches at times since I have loaded my extensive CD collection. I currently have a 500GB hard drive and 4GB of ram but with two 1TB hard drives why use it.
So, how do I do this and will I still need my iTunes program on my macmini?
Thank You again!
Greg
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Now what I don't know how to do and would like to do is have my music load directly onto my external hard drives when I burn it and would also like to play music directly from one of my external hard drives while using the other one as a backup.
As long as you have the options set as in the screenshot below, the files should load into the external library. Here's a test to try: burn a new CD, then right-click on one of the newly loaded tracks and select "Show in Finder." Does it show up as being on the external drive?
For backups, I can't say what the best approach would be. I just use rsync to copy my library from the mini to my desktop, but that's not very user-friendly. I hadn't thought about putting anything about that in the article... hm...
You will still need iTunes on your mini, regardless of where the files are stored.
(http://www.hifizine.com/files/2012/06/Advanced-Preferences.png)
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Greg, I'm just wondering if you have iTunes set to use the external library at all. If not, quit iTunes, then hold down the option key and open iTunes again. You'll get this:
(http://www.hifizine.com/files/2012/06/Choose-iTunes-Library.png)
Then select Choose Library and navigate to the library on the external drive.
Let us know how you go!
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Yes I have 640gb on macmini and am getting close to filling it. I have deleted perhaps 50 less played albums from the macmini but they are preserved on the ministack.
At present the Mini Stack has a 750gb drive but I have a spare 1tb external harddrive.
As the macmini is used only for music I thought i would get rid of anything not required and play music from an external drive. My understanding was that was the best setup for getting improved SQ playback?
I will follow your guide and copy the music folder on the mini stack to the spare hard disk, take out the 750gb drive and put the 1gb drive in the ministack.
If i chose the ministack itunes library to play music instead of the macmini, would i need to have a copy of audirvana plus in there also?
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Hello JohjR
This article is an excellent idea. I actually knew a good bit of the information, but this is about all I know. I hope you will continue writing (and find a way to market what you are doing). There must be others like me who are audiophile hobbyists and want to make the move into digital audio. I have a reasonable knowledge of computers, however, I have always used PC's and now have a Mac mini. I definitely think that something like "Computer and Digital Audio for Dummies" would be well received. Anyway... A hardy thanks.
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Thanks, Chipbyrd, for the encouragement :)
My understanding was that was the best setup for getting improved SQ playback?
I haven't gotten my system to this point yet, but the recommendation by Oliver Masciarotte in his book (and I have read it elsewhere also) is to put an SSD in the computer, and use an external drive for the music, preferably RAID. My understanding is that this minimizes load on the power supply. It's one of those things that really "shouldn't" make much of a difference, but....
If you're interested, here's the link to the book:
http://www.lulu.com/shop/oa-masciarotte/to-serve-groove-a-comprehensive-compendium-of-numerically-disposed-mellifluous-servitude/ebook/product-20251949.html
or
http://www.lulu.com/shop/oa-masciarotte/to-serve-groove-a-comprehensive-compendium-of-numerically-disposed-mellifluous-servitude/paperback/product-20219985.html
My review of it:
http://www.hifizine.com/2012/06/to-serve-and-groove-oliver-masciarotte/
If i chose the ministack itunes library to play music instead of the macmini, would i need to have a copy of audirvana plus in there also?
No, I would think just leave Audirvana in the Applications folder on the internal drive.
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Thanks’ JohnR, I did have my media folder set up this way but I didn't know how to point to different libraries. I will give this a try and test a song as you suggest.
Now I am getting exited!
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John R, Thank you for your assistance. Have the new library setup and working,
Will look into SSD for internal drive.
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JohnR,
After not remembering and then not seeing an (option) button on my keyboard, I asked my friend Google and was able to follow your instructions. Did I say I’m not a Mac user?
Anyway, thanks to you my Mac mini is now loading to and playing from my external hard drive. Now the only thing I need to figure out is how to get my other external hard drive to back up the one I load music onto. I read something about time machine but it looks like it backs up the entire computer and not just the music. Maybe that’s not a big deal, any thoughts on this?
Thanks’ again!
Greg
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John R, Well the Mini Stack 2.5 as a back up is fine, but it is way too noisy to use as the source for my music. My daughter said I should just make a playlist and put it on a 64 gb usb stick. Would a USB stick be ok for good playback? My music is AIFF so I think I should get up to 90 albums on one.
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Now the only thing I need to figure out is how to get my other external hard drive to back up the one I load music onto. I read something about time machine but it looks like it backs up the entire computer and not just the music. Maybe that’s not a big deal, any thoughts on this?
Greg, glad I could help. It is possible to set Time Machine to "exclude" specific directories. So I expect you could set it to exclude your internal drive, although I have not tried it myself.
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John R, Well the Mini Stack 2.5 as a back up is fine, but it is way too noisy to use as the source for my music. My daughter said I should just make a playlist and put it on a 64 gb usb stick. Would a USB stick be ok for good playback? My music is AIFF so I think I should get up to 90 albums on one.
Yes, that is a problem with desktop drives in general, and one reason why I am still using the internal drive. However, I don't think a 64 GB USB stick would be a great idea, or not at least with iTunes, as iTunes maintains a separate file that indexes the entire contents of the library. In effect, you would end up having to build up some number of independent libraries.
Another option would be to use a player that allows you to play files directly by selecting them from the file system. IIRC Fidelia and Decibel will do this, and probably others. In that case you could select the files from the 64G stick.
I just bought a portable USB/Firewire drive to try, to see if it's quieter, but haven't received it yet.
If you're not running out of space, I guess my thought is that the simple approach is to stick with the internal drive for a while as SSDs will become larger and cheaper quite quickly I expect.
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It works! And it works well :D, sounds fantastic!
I got my daughter a MacBook Pro 13-inches for her 17th birthday last year, 4Gb memory, 2.7 GHz Intel i7. And... today I borrowed it, followed John instructions (plus downloaded the eastern electric minimax dac plus file drivers - ee site say drivers are for snow leopard, but it works on OS X Lion 10.7.2 fine) and IT WORKS!
Now I have an Apple mac music server as well. All that I can tell to beginners, such as I am/was, don't be intimidated (like I think I was) to try a computer as music server. It is very convenient and the sound quality is really good. I can't distinguish a difference from my CDplayer.
:thumb: :D :thumb: :D
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=65548)
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JR said "Another option would be to use a player that allows you to play files directly by selecting them from the file system. IIRC Fidelia and Decibel will do this, and probably others. In that case you could select the files from the 64G stick."
That's what I was thinking of doing with Audirvana Plus. Had a try on a 1gb stick and it played onto A+ in memory mode. Just double clicked on the first song and it played the entire album. Didn't hear any difference from internal drive but if its going to ram memory,(6 of 8gb allocated to A+) then I suppose logically it would sound the same?
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It works! And it works well :D, sounds fantastic!
Excellent :thumb: But won't your daughter want her MacBook back? :lol: ;)
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That's what I was thinking of doing with Audirvana Plus. Had a try on a 1gb stick and it played onto A+ in memory mode. Just double clicked on the first song and it played the entire album. Didn't hear any difference from internal drive but if its going to ram memory,(6 of 8gb allocated to A+) then I suppose logically it would sound the same?
Hm, I never tried that. I'm not having the same effect, unless I already have itunes running on the same library. However, this is something I've never experimented with, so if it's working for you, great :thumb:
Audirvana loads the whole track into memory when it starts, so other than the first few seconds, there should be no difference, that I would anticipate anyway...
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Has anyone by chance used the something like the Rii Touch remotes http://riiminikeyboards.com/ (http://riiminikeyboards.com/) or the Mobile Mouse application http://mobilemouse.com/ (http://mobilemouse.com/) to control their headless Mac mini?
For me, that's the worst part - using the Mac mini as a music and entertainment server would mean having it hooked to the TV. The operating system is designed to be used with a keyboard and mouse, though. If it could be controlled without a keyboard and/or mouse, it would be great.
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Has anyone by chance used the something like the Rii Touch remotes http://riiminikeyboards.com/ (http://riiminikeyboards.com/) or the Mobile Mouse application http://mobilemouse.com/ (http://mobilemouse.com/) to control their headless Mac mini?
For me, that's the worst part - using the Mac mini as a music and entertainment server would mean having it hooked to the TV. The operating system is designed to be used with a keyboard and mouse, though. If it could be controlled without a keyboard and/or mouse, it would be great.
Hi shortcut, I'm not sure what these would provide over a regular Bluetooth keyboard and mouse? The range of Bluetooth is larger than I would have thought, I had problems with a BT keyboard connecting to the mini from several rooms away. after I forgot to unpair it.
I think that a small (inexpensive) tablet would be the ideal way to control a mini music server. This is just emerging now.
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Well, the advantage is that they aren't a bluetooth keyboard and mouse. My audio system is also my home theatre system; ideally, I could play movies, music, etc. all via my computer being used with TV output.
However, as it stands, yes, one would need a keyboard and mouse and would have to "operate" the computer from their couch. And that's incredibly annoying - no one wants to have to have that on their lap in order to play a song, for example. Let alone the annoyance of having a keyboard and mouse scattered all over the room. Ideally, I'd want a simple remote so I can easily control the thing with one hand while sitting on the couch with a beer in my other hand. :D
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Well, there's the Remote app for iphones, ipod touch and ipad. http://www.apple.com/itunes/remote/
There are also similar things for Android. e.g. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=hyperfine.hftunes.release&hl=en
Is that the kind of thing you had in mind?
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I really wish someone would do a "lite" version of Mach2 mods for the mini (no SSD to save $$) with options to set up iPad/iTouch applications and the matching Apple super drive for ripping. 8) Whatever happened to those guys, I thought it was a great idea. :scratch:
Olive is on the right track (ripping service, all in one, streaming included, built in CDP/display), but don't like the propriatary files or the high prices (plus I rather use my own DAC). :?
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Excellent :thumb: But won't your daughter want her MacBook back? :lol: ;)
I did. So... today I went to best buy to get an hp laptop, on sale for about $800.
and :drums: this is what I ended up with:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=66067)
which is a 27-inch mac :rotflmao:
forget the pc, i'm a mac guy now! :D
I have it already setup and it is playing some dave brubeck quartet nicely!!!
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I am so happy with my 27-inch mac as music server :D :thumb:
Here is a video showing it playing Dave Brubeck Quartet
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmVAPmWnVhc&feature=plcp
Last night I download Audirvana Plus and PureMusic on a trial basis. Listening to Mozart violin concerto #4 which I downloaded from HD Tracks. Certainly the HD sound is a bit more natural than the CD, and cleaner. I should have gotten a mac years ago.
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I really wish someone would do a "lite" version of Mach2 mods for the mini [...] Whatever happened to those guys, I thought it was a great idea. :scratch:
Anybody know anything about the Mojo Audio mods that have been advertised recently?
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Anybody know anything about the Mojo Audio mods that have been advertised recently?
No, but perhaps you could start another thread on that one? (This thread is about the Getting Started guide ;) )
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Shortcuttomoncton said "For me, that's the worst part - using the Mac mini as a music and entertainment server would mean having it hooked to the TV. The operating system is designed to be used with a keyboard and mouse, though. If it could be controlled without a keyboard and/or mouse, it would be great."
I control the macmini with my macbook via VNC "Screen Share"
There are two issues I find with it though. First the address changes its last number every now and then. That means I have to guess the new nos. Usually it is 101or 102 or 103; Two- it can take a couple of minutes for Screen Share to connect and display on the macbook. If I have to try 2 new numbers that means it can take around maybe 5-10 minutes to connect. Other than that, it's great controlling the mac mini from my recliner.
Q> Is there a way to make SS connect faster?
I read that the US is going through a drought and some hot weather at the moment. Coming from Australia we know all about that type of weather.
It has been in the back of my mind to run a cool running/ green music system in summer when our temps reach 90-100+F regularly.
Would a macbook running on its internal battery give out a similar quality sound to a mains powered mac mini?
I have a dac running on a li-po battery and a small, efficient Temple Audio" Bantam Gold " digital amp that can also operate from a li-po battery and runs very cool. I could recharge the batteries at night on off-peak rates.
One other question: What gives the better SQ? a glass toslink or a USB to Spdif thingy? I have a good toslink and don't want to spend the money on a USB connection unless there is a guaranteed improvement to be had.
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I control the macmini with my macbook via VNC "Screen Share"
There are two issues I find with it though. First the address changes its last number every now and then. That means I have to guess the new nos. Usually it is 101or 102 or 103;
Hi, which VNC version are you using specifically? Have you tried the inbuilt Apple screen sharing?
To provide an address in the VNC client, you should be able to use the mini's machine name with ".local" at the end. For example, if you named your mini "fred" then you would use "fred.local" instead of guessing at the assigned IP address.
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JR, Yes I use the inbuilt screen share but never seem to have any success with greg.local.
After a while in the network screen a vnc://192.168.1.101 or 103 etc. comes up. That is what changes from time to time.
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Hm, you are using "Connect to Server"?
Does the machine show up in the left sidebar of the Finder?
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JR
Not as far as i know and No to second question. I did at one stage drag the address into the left side of the finder to speed things along and save me typing the address each time.
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Hm, I'm afraid I'm lost. You should see the machine in the Finder and be able to just click on a Screen Sharing button, like this:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=63740)
Perhaps it would be best to start a new thread with specifics like which version of OSX you are using and screenshots.
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Thanks for the big help John R, but looks like I may have gotten too late of a start. iTunes 11 interface (OS 10.8.4, 2.7 GHz i5, 8 GB,1600 MHz DDR3) doesn't seem to match the instructions. Looking for "Audio MIDI setup."
Trying to finally move from CDP to iMac, but I'm as computer dumb as a bag or rocks, any help?
Do I need to re-rip the CD's already done?
TIA
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Hi Jeff, Audio Midi Setup is not anything to do with iTunes, you can find it in the Applications->Utilities folder.
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Thanks John. Still new to Apple. All their menus/screens look alike. Hard to recall where I might have seen one versus another or how to follow 'the enlightened' path.
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I've checked the article, all of the setup screens are pretty much the same. It's only the views that are different. I'll try and do a short update for iTunes 11 when I get chance.
Do I need to re-rip the CD's already done?
No, you shouldn't have to, if you ripped them in lossless format already. If you ripped them in a lossy format (e.g. AAC the default) then you may want to redo them.
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Thanks for the great information. This has helped me optimize my MacBook Pro for use with Tidal Hifi.
I appreciate how simple your explanations were, as I am definitely not very computer literate!
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So much to read - in 2020, is it still the right time to be optimizing a MacMini for music? I still find the wide array of MIDI settings and proper conversation of formats to be - overwhelming. Hope I can see through some of this.
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Good information. Thank you for taking the time to post such a detailed help guide. I love apple products and sometimes find it difficult to set things up compared to Windows.
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Thank you for the major effort and helpful info.
A couple of things though:
The optical output in the headphone jack was discontinued starting with the Macbook Pro in 2016, disappearing with subsequent updates across the product line shortly after, so no current or particularly recent Mac supports it. Too bad. They cut it out of the Apple TV box too. No version of Mac OS after Mojave (superseded 2018) supports iTunes. iTunes has been showing its age for awhile. I recommend giving Audirvana a try- FLAC support, support for Tidal and Qobuz, direct control of your DAC by the player so no transcoding to pass through your DAC- none of which iTunes does.
Be careful running legacy versions of Mac OS as streamers due to security risk. Run whatever the latest version your machine supports is. Support for more modern players on legacy OS's varies.
You can repurpose a vintage Mac as described in the article but frankly I wouldn't do it unless you just have the machine lying around. If starting from scratch, I'd get a Raspberry Pi for a fraction of the cost. Hook it up to a good DAC and you're off to the races.
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So much to read - in 2020, is it still the right time to be optimizing a MacMini for music? I still find the wide array of MIDI settings and proper conversation of formats to be - overwhelming. Hope I can see through some of this.
Audirvana makes these settings for you on the fly. Just hit Play and fuhgeddaboutit.