soundstage ? again

hairofthedawg · « **on:** 25 Dec 2002, 01:05 pm »

I posted awhile back about my lack of experience with a soundstage and dialling in. I've got the speakers positioned, I think, where they should be and with the new cables Klaus sent, I have a pretty good one. It's laid back, has quite a bit of depth and most instruments are very localized, at least as far as one can localize rock recordings. I have had to use the balance control on the Erleuchtung preamp very slightly. I'm pretty sure the slight imbalance is due to the room as the speakers are as close to equidistant as I can get them without hiring a surveyor.

I was listening to the New Radicals "Maybe You've been Brainwashed too!" awhile ago and heard some sounds definitely coming from the rear and to the left of me, this is while listening to two channels only and from my CD player. Klaus said it was the recording, not anything in my system. Last night I turned on VH1 classic rock and heard the same thing again, except this time from both sides and it sounded great, like the soundstage had exploded in width. I think it was Aerosmith's "Jamie's got a gun", but can't be positive. There's also a VH1 commercial that sounds the same way. The rest of the music is positioned pretty much between the speakers with a lot of depth. I'm running the audio from my TV and HTPC through a Classe SSP-30 before the Erleuchtung, but it's in stereo mode so it shouldn't be doing anything to the signal.

Has anyone else heard something like this with two channels? I'm wondering if this is just an oddity or whether I've got my speakers close enough to a position where some songs or sounds exhibit this super wide soundstage and some don't?

cheers,

Dick

Marbles · « **Reply #1 on:** 25 Dec 2002, 01:42 pm »

Sounds in back of you are caused by phase shifts in the signal...Roger Waters did this on purpose on his Amused To Death CD. He called it Q sound.

A 180 degree soundstage is wonderful!!! Congratulations!

hairofthedawg · « **Reply #2 on:** 25 Dec 2002, 02:12 pm »

Damn, you're up early, no wait, you're in the midwest...then again, you could just be up late

I figured that's what it was, but sure wish all music sounded that way. It's such a shock when it happens that I just sit there sort of flabbergasted and listen instead of remember what I'm listening to.

rock on,

Dick

Marbles · « **Reply #3 on:** 25 Dec 2002, 02:37 pm »

Merry Christmas Dick...

Your right on both counts..I was up late last night, and the kids woke me up early this AM to get their presents

rosconey · « **Reply #4 on:** 25 Dec 2002, 03:23 pm »

i had the same experiece, it is cool as hell.
when i first hooked up my new speakers and had a friend over, played some pink floyd-echoes cd-my buuddy got up a couple times and made sure the side speakers were not on.happens on my dave mathews live cd also-folsom field-people screaming in the audience come from behind once in a while

Ferdi · « **Reply #5 on:** 25 Dec 2002, 03:40 pm »

I found the same on a couple of CDs. The best example is Waters' Amused to Death. I have found that my room has a huge impact on imaging/soundstage. Even more than positioning of the speaker. I have recently hung a few paintings on my back wall and it's made a biiiig difference to the overall music experience. In the most extreme case in Amused to Death, I had a piano standing right next to my couch. Very well localized and solid but certainly not between the speakers.

It's a lot of fun to go back to material I haven't heard for a while and than listen to that again after achieving improvements like this.

lo mein · « **Reply #6 on:** 25 Dec 2002, 10:27 pm »

For some really good live recording, try these 2 Véronique Sanson's live recordings.

Véronique Sanson is the ex-wife of Stephen Stills (CSN&Y). Her music is jazzy/bluesy-Euro Rock.

*The lyrics are en français. Very accessable though.

The sound qualities are really excellent, the soundstaging, and imaging are very distint, with very good depth. Some of the best recorded live bass.

The presence of the shows are very convincing.

Get either one of the live CDs, and the "Les Moments importants...", if you're new to her music.

"Olympia 1985" by Véronique Sanson. (Live)

"Avec Vous" by Véronique Sanson. (Live)

"Les Moments importants - Edition digipack" by Véronique Sanson.

Enjoy.

Alex

bob82274 · « **Reply #7 on:** 25 Dec 2002, 10:39 pm »

I have to agree on amused to death too as I was listening and all of the sudden it sounded like my rears were playing. A unique feeling to say the least.

Hantra · « **Reply #8 on:** 26 Dec 2002, 01:16 pm »

I have noticed since I spent 30+ hours on speaker placement, this happens to me quite a bit. The good thing is that I don't have any rear speakers, so I don't have to wonder if they're on!

On The Final Cut, I had the most revealing and startling experience once I got this right. There is a track called "Paranoid Eyes" on that disc, and you hear footsteps at the beginning of the song. When I heard footsteps BEHIND me, then I knew it was right! The song is about paranoia! So, it makes sense that the steps should be behind me! They were not before.

What a great experience it is when you get that from a disc that is not Q-Sound.

B

nathanm · « **Reply #9 on:** 27 Dec 2002, 12:26 am »

The coolest imaging\soundtstage effect I ever heard was on a Stereophile test CD. There's a track where they test different microphones in a church and there's this one made by Schoeps which is like this plastic sphere with two diaphragms on it. Anyway, I was listening to that with headphones and when the guy was on the far right and left it sounded like I was not even wearing headphones. It was an out-of-body experience! The first time I whipped the headphones off my head cause I was scared! I turned to my left thinking, "what was that noise!?" I've never heard anything like that before. I played it over speakers and it wasn't quite as cool. Maybe with the right positioning etc. it would work.

Anyone know of musical recordings made with this thing? Or binaural recordings perhaps? If the Schoeps mic wasn't as costly as my car I would buy one in a heartbeat. Imagine how awesome it would be to make a purist recording of a 4-piece metal band playing in a room with such a mic. Minimalist metal, that's my dream. Nobody ever does it in this genre.

cjr888 · « **Reply #10 on:** 27 Dec 2002, 03:47 am »

Quote from: nathanm

.

Anyone know of musical recordings made with this thing? Or binaural recordings perhaps? If the Schoeps mic wasn't as costly as my car I would buy one in a heartbeat. Imagine how awesome it would be to make a purist recording of a 4-piece metal band playing in a room with such a mic. Minimalist metal, that's my dream. Nobody ever does it in this genre.

http://www.binaural.com

A search on google will return tons of material:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=%22binaural+recordings%22

But environmental soundscapes done in a binaural recording? This has got to be really neat:

http://www.newagemusic.com/down.html

Time to get a pair of headphones...

G-7 · « **Reply #11 on:** 31 Dec 2002, 02:13 am »

recording does matter and also quality , OK, OK, I would say more analytical (without distortion) equipment is the bigger (wider) sounstage you get, speakers also do matter

Tyson · « **Reply #12 on:** 31 Dec 2002, 02:32 am »

The best method I've found is to invite a buddy over, then while you are in the sweet spot, the buddy moves the speakers around and adjusts the angles. Also, moving the sweet spot forward or back can have a large impact on soundstaging. In most cases it's a tedious process, but worth it when you get it all dialed in.