AudioCircle
Industry Circles => Hollis Audio Labs => Topic started by: S Clark on 10 Sep 2011, 08:51 pm
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I liked it. A lot. :D It has significantly enhanced detail and imaging compared to a Virtue Piano playing through a Dodd Battery/Twisted Pear Buffalo DAC. Interestingly (to me) CD's ripped through Exact Audio Copy to this server played cleaner through the server than through the original cd.
Very bravely, fellow AC member HAL (Rich) sent me one of his Windows 7 based Music servers to try out. You see, he understood that I have just become comfortable with Windows XP. Unlike most of the folks on this circle, I use computers until I can't, then haul them to someone to fix it. When they finally tell me it can't be repaired because they don't make the stylus/clay tablet operating system anymore, I buy a rebuilt Dell and move on.
In spite of my computer ignorance (or possibly because of it), Rich decided to have me do a test drive.
The very small computer arrived, and in short order all things were hooked up and set up. A few songs were pre- loaded, and I got them playing quickly. Downloading HD files was a bit of a challenge. I had never ripped a cd before. It took a significant amount of Rich's time to bring me up speed, but finally, I could sit in my listening position, access the server though a laptop, and listen to music. Sure it would have been faster if I'd had a teenager in the house, but I managed, even at 59.
There are lots of systems here in AC land fancier than mine, but mine isn't shabby. Moscode 401HR with Mundorf caps, Dodd battery pre, Silkworms, GR-Research LS-9 kit with a properly deadened cabinet and quality xover, and a fair amount of room treatment. The Music Server USB was run to Musiland and to the Sabre Dac.
Well, the HD stuff was excellent- to be expected. But ripping some of my top Redbook cd's to the server, and playing them back was unexpectedly much different- improved detail (some never heard before), tighter imaging, more real vocals, better defined bass. I don't know what creates these improvements- although no spinning hard drive is supposedly quite important to eliminate jitter as well as other computer stuff. But I know when I have heard an improved product, and it usually cost me $$ when I hear it. So now I have to send Rich a check, because he isn't getting his semi prototype back. Fortunately it isn't a great big check. I don't know if Rich is ready to get into production, but watch for it.
I think the bit of feedback that Rich most liked was when I told him that my LS9's finally matched the sound of the prototypes in Danny Richie's living room. Danny has a heck of a rig, and moving to that level is quite an achievement.
I almost forgot to mention, this thing is tiny... think small cigar box. The wife likes it.
If, like me, you have seen that computerized music is coming, but have been reluctant to jump in, this may be what you have been waiting for. This is a very high quality way to move to computers. Congrats, Rich. :bowdown:
Scott
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Scott,
Thanks for the very nice write-up!
Glad that you like the HAL Music Server and we got all the functionallity going that you wanted!
I am building these for friends at this point that want to get started in Music Servers. It has been a fun process learning and building these and finding out fun stuff along the way in HiRez music.
The unit Scott has is a modified PC to make it very low noise. This was key to getting one for my room as it has a very low noise floor.
One thing that Scott did not mention is that the unit can be run off a 12VDC battery. I am experimenting with one of the PI Audio Group's BatteryBUSS setup for this system. Dave has been great to work with on modding the unit.
Will be using my unit with Gary Dodd's Battery Buffer and my DIY battery powered DAC.
Edit:
Here is the link to Larry Borden's Dagogo.com review of the MS-1
http://dagogo.com/hollis-audio-labs-ms-1-music-server-review (http://dagogo.com/hollis-audio-labs-ms-1-music-server-review)
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What about some pics and specs? :D
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What about some pics and specs? :D
Count me in as well, I'm curious.
Great review Scott...
Anand.
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Pics? We don't need no stinkin' pics- not when you have a wordsmith like me!!
Its a black box about 5"X 8"X 2.5" with some holes for wires.
Rich will have to chime in with specs.
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No pics yet until the new wood top is completed!
Specs:
Windows 7 x64
Intel Atom 330 CPU
NVidia ION GPU
2GB RAM
64GB SSD
802.11 B/G WiFi or no WiFi
Gigabit Ethernet port
eSATA port
HDMI and DVI video output
Will do 1080i Blu-Ray video and multichannel sound via the HDMI output
5 USB 2 ports
12VDC power input with external AC power supply
Power consumption 24 watts
Cost $699 + shipping USA only
Note: HDMI video resolution info updated after mfg info was received.
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Cool deal, Scott. Rich has been slaving on a Windows based mini music server for a while. Looks like he has done a good thing.
Great job, Rich!!! :thumb:
<><
Dave
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Dave,
And thank you for the inspiration to keep going! :thumb:
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The Music Server is optimized for external USB DAC's. I use mine with an M2Tech hiFace Evo and drive my DIY DAC via the I2S Bus. The Evo also provides Toslink, Laserlink, Coaxial and BNC S/PDIF outputs.
The MS does have a Toslink S/PDIF output for external DAC's.
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The specs look a lot like the fanless PC I have in my car, which runs off of 12V DC. Biggest difference is that I run an AMD Brazos (Zacate E-350) platform motherboard, which offers a bit more CPU power and better video performance for the nav system.
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Here is a picture of the Music Server prototype with solid wood top. This has been modifed for improved cooling.
Will post new pictures once the final version of the top is completed.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=51205)
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That's a computer?? Super nice Rich!
Can you post a rear panel pic in your next batch of pics? Thanks
Rich
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Rich,
Will do once I have the new tops. :D
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I think I've figured out what that 30' of Cat 5e is worth. :wink:
:lol:
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Jason,
I promise if you want one you get a special deal for past help! :thumb:
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It looks great, Rich!! Congrats!
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Nhan,
Thanks! It has been a fun project!
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That looks very cool...really sharp....So is it like a Vortexbox without the hard drives??? It could run Squeezeserver for a SB Touch and also provide USB output for a DAC and run like JRiver Media Center for an onscreen interface when having a party or family over for fun....am I on the right track, if so thats exactly what I was going to try and make for myself to run those two apps and maybe netflix if I could squeeze a video card with HDMI in it??? I just don't have the experience to know enough about what I'm doing to feel comfortable pulling the trigger on the parts and not end up with some I can't use. Let us know if you decide to sell some of these, I may be more than casually interested. Nice stuff HAL!!! :thumb:
OOps....I didn't see post #5 before I wrote all that...Good luck with them!!!!
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Ed,
On my prototype setup, I run Squeezeserver for my SB Touch and Foobar2000 for my USB DAC tied to the Music Server. JRiver should also work as I tried the trial version. I still like the Foobar2000 interface as it is simple.
It has a 64GB solid state hard drive and an eSATA port to attach external high speed drives. There are also two unused USB2 ports if three are used for keyboard, mouse and USB DAC.
I also set mine up so that I can use a web browser on another Netbook to remote control Foobar2000. Have not worked with JRiver enough to know if it will also give that function. For the remote function you can use either WiFi or hard wired Ethernet as long as both devices are on the same network.
The PC has both DVI and HDMI outputs for monitors. There is no display, USB keyboard or USB mouse supplied as most folks already have those peripherals.
I will sell them if folks are interested for the price I listed. It will be about 2 weeks for a build due to getting all the parts.
PM me if you are interested.
Best,
Rich
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Ed,
Also if you would like, I can load Squeezeboxserver 7.6.1. before shipping.
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Ed,
On my prototype setup, I run Squeezeserver for my SB Touch and Foobar2000 for my USB DAC tied to the Music Server. JRiver should also work as I tried the trial version. I still like the Foobar2000 interface as it is simple.
It has a 64GB solid state hard drive and an eSATA port to attach external high speed drives. There are also two unused USB2 ports if three are used for keyboard, mouse and USB DAC.
I also set mine up so that I can use a web browser on another Netbook to remote control Foobar2000. Have not worked with JRiver enough to know if it will also give that function. For the remote function you can use either WiFi or hard wired Ethernet as long as both devices are on the same network.
The PC has both DVI and HDMI outputs for monitors. There is no display, USB keyboard or USB mouse supplied as most folks already have those peripherals.
I will sell them if folks are interested for the price I listed. It will be about 2 weeks for a build due to getting all the parts.
PM me if you are interested.
Best,
Rich
Rich, before I defected to the other side, I used Foobar with the AQvox ASIO driver. I don't know if the audio of Windows 7 would benefit or not, but it was far and away the best sounding of all of the drivers when playing .wav files in Windows.
I'm just sayin' 8)
Dave
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Dave,
I am using Foobar2000 and using the new Windows audio interface. I like it alot! :D
The setup that Scott reviewed is running Foobar2000 for two channel audio.
Will preload Foobar2000 for anyone interested and set it up for use. I also setup the web browser based remote control in Foobar.
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I like J.River because of WASAPI that bypasses the windows drivers and it sounds great to me. Hal thanks but I'm gonna do a VB and give my laptop back to myself. I can get a Vortexbox for around 4 so it will solve alot of storage issues i would have etc....I will also have it rip and store DVD's and maybe BD's so I'm set...thanks though HAL...keep cranking them out....great idea.
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I like J.River because of WASAPI that bypasses the windows drivers and it sounds great to me. Hal thanks but I'm gonna do a VB and give my laptop back to myself. I can get a Vortexbox for around 4 so it will solve alot of storage issues i would have etc....I will also have it rip and store DVD's and maybe BD's so I'm set...thanks though HAL...keep cranking them out....great idea.
You HAVE to bypass the Windows driver in any event. I tried the Wasapi drivers in Foobar and the AQvox driver won easily. The part that sucks is the price tag... it was worth it though... :D
Dave
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No pics yet until the new wood top is completed!
Specs:
Intel Atom 330 CPU
NVidia ION GPU
Cost $699 + shipping USA only
I really like the fact it can be run off a 12V battery, but that Atom 330 is an old processor, replaced by 4, 5, 6xx series in 2010, which IMO offers the advantage of offering on-board graphics, enabling you to skip on a separate, often-bad-for-sound, graphics card.
Have you looked at the load on the processor while running a foobar upsampler to say 192kHz? IME, something like that can seriously tax even much faster processors..
Lastly, what would cost be if a more recent Atom processor is used in this build instead with a firewire output? :green:
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Jon,
I have not tried any upsampling, as my files are being played at native sample and bit rates. Playback with native rate 24bit/192KHz files is around 2% CPU load with this machine. I have tried upsampling externally and do not like. My oversampling DAC sounds very good with the setup, as did Scott's Buffalo DAC.
With the ION GPU on the motherboard, I hear no audio degredation as compared to my newer Atom based Netbook. See no reason to upgrade for this application as intended until the unit I use is no longer available.
I find USB to be a very good interface to my external DAC using an asynchronous USB device, so no need for Firewire. More importantly the USB to I2S Bus interface is a major sound quality improvement for the DAC.
Running it off 12VDC is just icing on the cake! :thumb:
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Dave,
I will give the ASIO driver a try in the future.
If it sounds better than Win7 WASAPI with an Async USB interface it will be something special.
The battery powered M2Tech hiFace Evo is really something special from my listening experiences! :D
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Ed,
A laptop is not needed for the Music Server if you add a HDMI or DVI display, USB keyboard and USB mouse. The laptop can be used as a remote control for the system if the user wishes, it is not needed. It is a fully stand alone PC if you add a large external drive with the music library via either USB2 or eSATA interfaces. Since uncompressed or losslessly compresed music are large files, putting them on the internal drive is not the way to go.
Foobar2000 also uses WASAPI when setup. I tried both here and found no difference that I could tell reliably.
Good luck with the VB.
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Shipping one out tomorrow to a good friend. Will be interesting to get his feedback.
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Did you by any chance compare one of these to an Alix PC at any time? Have you optimized it for music playback, or is it still pretty general so it could also be an HTPC?
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Where do you control it? Could you add a 10"'touch screen? Where is the music stored?
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Good stuff Rich! :thumb:
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Ed,
Good luck with the VB.
Thanks!!!!!! HAL!!!! :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:
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Did you by any chance compare one of these to an Alix PC at any time? Have you optimized it for music playback, or is it still pretty general so it could also be an HTPC?
I did not compare it to an Alix. Since I wanted to use Win7, that did not look like and option, and there have been reported issues with AMD processors and the Win 7 drivers I am using.
The unit starts life as a HTPC. I optimized the setup for Music Server operations, but that does not preclude it being used for other uses.
I have used it with PowerDVD11 and a Blu-Ray drive for Blu-Ray playback of movies and music video's. I just used the HDMI output to drive the HDTV directly, no surround processor. My main purpose is for music replay, so no extensive trials as a video and multichannel source.
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Where do you control it? Could you add a 10"'touch screen? Where is the music stored?
You have two options. Add a USB Mouse, USB Keyboard and video monitor for direct control via Windows 7, or use a compatible web browser on a laptop as a remote control. Those are left to the user.
Music storage is via an external hard drive. It can be either a USB2 or eSATA drive. The drive is not provided. Large hard drives are available at lower costs than I can provide for music storage.
About 20GB of storage is available on the internal SSD. That is for software updates and a small amount of music.
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Good stuff Rich! :thumb:
Thanks! :D
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Looking around found a nice Acer 23" HDMI touch screen with USB interface that might work well with the Music Server. About the smallest one that I found easily is 15" with touch screen. These would all be stand alone, not integrated.
Since this would be tied to the Music Server via USB, it should work well as a pointing device with Windows 7.
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You have two options. Add a USB Mouse, USB Keyboard and video monitor for direct control via Windows 7, or use a compatible web browser on a laptop as a remote control. Those are left to the user.
Music storage is via an external hard drive. It can be either a USB2 or eSATA drive. The drive is not provided. Large hard drives are available at lower costs than I can provide for music storage.
About 20GB of storage is available on the internal SSD. That is for software updates and a small amount of music.
eSATA sounds much, much better than 2.0, IME with my Windows based server.
Dave
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Dave,
Agree!
That is why I have the little 2.5" eSATA chassis for an external 640GB drive and 5VDC power supply from the BatteryBUSS.
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Dave,
Agree!
That is why I have the little 2.5" eSATA chassis for an external 640GB drive and 5VDC power supply from the BatteryBUSS.
:thumb:
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Unit #2 is with it's new owner at this point. Will be interesting to hear comments when he is ready.
Unit #3 was installed at my friend Bob's this evening. We played it for a few hours in his setup. Will let him post comments if he would like to.
Unit #4 will be shipped tomorrow.
:D
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I'm eager to read their impressions. I continue to be impressed with the sound quality of mine.
Scott
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Unit #4 is shipped. :D
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Got my Droid X2 phone working as a remote control for the Music Server via WiFi. Still learning all the controls.
Also have my iPod Touch working as well as a remote control. Like the bigger screen on the X2 more.
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Install #3 went well and Chris is up and running. :D
Install #4 is ongoing.
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The owner of Music Server #3 is going to stop by and do a write-up when he can. He liked it from our conversation! :D
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Rich,
Do you know if a standard Felix (I believe rated at 3 amps) will provide adequate power to the server?
Scott
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Scott,
The current requirement for the MS is about 120VAC @ 0.25A. The Felix with a 120VAC @ 3A rating should be fine.
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Thanks to Rich, I have unit #4. It looks nicely put together, and I am anxious to get started. Had to go out yesterday and pick up a mouse, keyboard, and monitor before I could do anything. Unfortunately, there will be a delay before I can get the setup started. My son is coming to town today to vistit for a few days, and then I leave Saturday and will be gone all week working. I promise as soon as I return I will get started with the setup. I am sure I will be pestering Rich continuously until I get everything done. He is going to hate me before it is over.
I plan to compare the MS to cd's played through a PS Audio PW Transport and DAC. I also want to do a careful comparison between data ripped to FLAC, and data in WAV format. It will be interesting.
Thanks Rich,
Mark
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Mark,
No problem with helping on MS setup. It is actually a fun process to me. :D
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It looks like we have a new home for the thread. :D The folks here at AC contacted me about the move.
Will do an introduction for HAL and the folks here said they would merge the thread into that.
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I think the PC Music Server ate Chris! :o
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Chris has been working on his house, so will stop by when he can.
Fun news is I have a Nook Color running the Foobar2000 remote interface and able to scroll through the music library. I like the large 7" display! This is fun! :D
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Chris has been working on his house, so will stop by when he can.
Fun news is I have a Nook Color running the Foobar2000 remote interface and able to scroll through the music library. I like the large 7" display! This is fun! :D
…not only the house, but the 24 acres of very remote, gorgeously prime timberland that surrounds it, before the rain / snow season in the Oregon Cascades starts. Not to mention trying to get my main listening room finished! 8)
HAL, aka Audio Mad Scientist has an Insidious Plan. :evil: He has taken control of vertical and horizontal as well as 3D Aural / Spatial.
If you acquire any HAL design or product, you will get absolutely ZERO accomplished for your Honey Do, Weekend Chores, etc.
You will be Listening. You cannot resist. HAL makes the concept of “Assimilation” just plain understatedly silly.
No matter how hard you try, you WILL find yourself back in the Sweet Spot; mesmerized, and hopelessly held captive in Audio Nirvana. Just, ya know- kind of a head’s-up on that :tempted:
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I couldn’t agree more with Scott’s (very nice word-smithing indeed) comments! I’m running the same “whisper mode” HAL-modded Amazingly Incredible Nearly Prototpe Music Server (HAL AINPMS) unit he is. I think for brevity (ironically, not something I’m known for since I don’t have much time to post or hang-out on the forums. So please don’t be offended if you post something and I don’t respond / see it), I’ll refer to it as the “HAL MS-1”. Any acronym with “PMS” in it is kind of a buzz kill. :P Rich, you’ll just have to come up with an “Official” name, with a milspec part number. :lol:
I had the HAL MS-1 out of the box and playing music very quickly. I stick to .wav’s only at this point. Ripped my entire collection which did take a bit of time! Like months; given 60+ hr. work weeks.
I added a SIIG 7 port powered USB hub to take unnecessary a/c requirements off of the HAL MS-1. The SIIG will do USB 1.1, 2.0 and 3.0. Nice little unit!
To that, I added a Dell Ultrasharp 19’ monitor, a Logitech wireless illuminated keyboard, and Logitech wireless mouse. These are used basically for system maintenance and moving files around, as I did moving my audio collection from a 1TB WD USB HDD to a Samsung eSATA 1TB 2.5” HDD. I also added a USB Toshiba Super Multi Drive DVD+/-RW. So with the 7 port SIIG USB hub, I only use one USB port, and the eSATA port on the HAL MS-1.
I’m also using the M2Tech hiFace Evo running on battery power, and have driven an April Music DA100 Signature DAC, a highly modded PT P-3A as well as other borrowed DACs in multiple price ranges. Haven’t tried the PS Audio DAC/Transport so I’ll look forward to Stu’s comments on that. My favorite however is as Rich’s setup; using a battery powered DIY DAC via I2S bus. Ultimately, the HAL MS-1 will be battery powered as well. I think I know someone in this group who can set me up with that 8)
Rich is playing with different WiFi devices such as smart-phones and tablets for controlling Foobar 2000, so I’m waiting for him to give the most positive nod to one of them. Right now, I’m just using a small laptop for wireless connection/ remote control. Quick and easy! The only thing I had to call Rich about was the Super Decoder Ring URL to access the remote app within Foobar. Works like a charm!
I’ve been looking at the idea of music servers for quite a long time (listened to just about every single one at every RMAF), but what I was seeing / hearing, was IMO, too high-priced and the technology not really anything that would make me want to lay out that kind of cash compared to a high quality DAC and Transport. Certainly, having one’s entire music collection, ripped at highest quality on an ultra flexible and convenient to use platform would be great. But what about the sound itself? As with anything worth waiting for, patience has paid off.
I never would have believed it myself, but just starting out playing EAC-ripped Redbook CDs 16bit/44.1kHz at their native rate is just truly stunning. The HD stuff is out of this world. So playing any music back at the native rate at which it was recorded, with a high quality interface and DAC is the way to go for me.
As Scott mentioned, the detail, imaging and definition really stunned me; having the same realization that EAC-ripped .wav’s played through two separate systems + Senn HD600s sounded better than the CD using very high quality DACs and transports. I have to be careful here, since this is a subjective thing but very simply: The HAL MS-1 integrates perfectly in the process of translating digital to analog as any high $$$$ digital system I’ve used / borrowed to date. I started long ago with an AA DDS PRO, DDE 3.0 + DTI PRO32.
How do I really “measure” what I’m subjectively hearing? Keeping in mind of course that’s just me and my experience; I’ve spent a LOT of time in recording studios with 2” 24 trk Ampex machines running at 30ips and own a Studer A-810 ½ track mastering machine. To me, the sound is noticeably more like I’m listening to the players in the room itself or analog playback right after the track has been laid down. For me, I’m not left wanting. It’s really that good.
I have a few older 1st gen. Redbook CDs that are just unbearable to listen to via the CD, but are actually very listenable as .wav-ripped through this system. Now that’s not to say (obviously) that it fixes horribly recorded and mastered sessions, but still, very impressive!
The rest of the system? OK, this is really going overboard here; but you may as well have the whole story…
Audible Illusions L-1 tube preamp (temporarily while I’m expecting delivery of my “new baby”- end of October). May borrow a Dodd Battery Buffer in the mean time, but I’m getting close to this custom tube preamp finally breathing music after years of design, re-design, and hand-built quality. I’ll let that cat out of the bag once I get it (need a "cat in a bag" icon for this one)
Bryston 7B-SST Mono Blocs. Great Clean Power (galore).
April Music Stello DA100 Signature DAC (I2S)
April Music Stello CDT100 Transport (I2S) Simon Lee (April Music) is a very talented designer. Many have not heard of him, but if you have the pleasure to listen his designs, you would most likely be very pleased.
Studer A-810 ½ Track Mastering Recorder. You just have to hear it to believe it. Hopefully, there will be at least one at RMAF this year, as there was last year.
Audiolab 8000T Tuner Yep. I love this tuner. Use it with a Magnum Dynalab ST-2 FM antenna and Terk indoor AM Advantage antenna. My house is located way up in the Oregon Cascade Foothills, and this setup pulls excellent signals in from a LONG ways away and reproduces them in a way which to me is very pleasurable. There is a lot on both FM and AM radio which is still true to the intended goals of long ago :singing:
Custom Built GR-Research LS-9s. These were truly a team effort. Hugh Nguyen, owner of Angel City Audio brought it all together for me. Flawless Piano Black cabinets built by Mr. Pu/ Sound Art China. Hugh provided and loaded the full compliment of No-Rez, Danny Richie, Owner of GR Research and designer of the LS-9s built the Upgraded Custom X-Overs and Sean Ries, Owner and “Head Gouda” of Skiing Ninja (who can also supply the same ultra high quality custom x-overs) loaded the drivers and wired the x-overs. Hugh also supplied gorgeous, “floating” custom Piano Black bases. :notworthy:
Analysis Plus Black Oval 9 Speaker cables.
Electra Inter-connects
Revelation Audio Labs I2S and Power Cables for April Music transport/DAC setup.
This is the Music Server System I’ve been waiting for, and the HAL MS-1 is obviously an integral part of it. Plus, with anything Rich designs, it evolves. Kind of like a “Transformer” (little double-entendre there ;) )
It will be highly scalable, based on the PC design for connectivity to products such as the “Squeeze-X” stuff.
Rich is a cherished friend and THE Audio Mad Scientist. I’ve had the pleasure of joining him in many excellent audio adventures. His insidious plan is to share his achievements with those of us seeking Audio Nirvana without having to sell your soul or [insert body parts here].
Now, you may think I have a bias here; but try this: have Rich send you one of these and decide for yourself!
Thanks Rich. See ya next week at RMAF! :beer:
Chris
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Mark's Music Server is up and running. He is starting his WAV vs FLAC experiments.
Looking forward to what he finds.
More top information on Saturday if things go well!
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I think Chris like it! :D
Ok, here are the pictures of the final version of the HAL PC Music Server with solid wood top:
Front
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=52217)
Back
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=52216)
Side
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=52218)
Better Living through Audio Nirvana!
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I want to give my initial observations about the MS-1 ( looks like that is the official name, for now ). I have unit #4 thanks to HAL. Like Chris (hi Chris! ) I have been looking at getting into servers for a whlie, but I was concerned about sound quailty. I did not want anything that would not be at least as good as my reference, the PS Audio Perfect Wave Transport (PWT) and DAC (PWD). Since getting those two pieces, my system has been outstanding. I did not want to go backwards in sound quality.
Unfortunately, due to family issues and work, I have not had as much time to play with the MS as I would have liked. But last week I did have a chance to get started with the setup, and do some initial listening. I ripped a standard cd into both wav and flac, and compared both of those to the PWT. All 3 fed the PWD. I have read that in some cases, wav can sound better than flac. Most people think that it all depends on how hard the system has to work to decode the flac files before sending the data to the dac. Rich's system must not use much cpu power during playback, because as hard as I tried, I could not tell which file was wav and which was flac. I had pretty much decided I would use wav for ripping, but now I will probably use flac. I will do one more test before I start ripping all my music, but based on what the first results were, I doubt if that will change.
So, how did the MS compare to the PWT? Again, I could not tell ANY difference between the two. The PWT has the best reproduction of soundstage width and depth that I have heard in my system, and the MS matched the PWT in those areas. All other areas of the reproduction were also equal. The PWT is an amazing piece. I have had mine in at least 4 different systems, and each time it totally transformed the sound of the dac being used. It was easy to hear the improvements. For the MS to sound the same as the PWT, at least on cd's, that says a lot. I did not get a chance yet to compare hirez playback on each system, but will try to do that next week.
I stiil have some minor setup up issues, but I am keeping the MS-1. Sound quality is what I want, and this server gives that to me. Not interested in trying anything else that might take me backwards.
Thanks rich!
Mark
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Mark,
Glad you like the PC Music Server! It has been a fun project and the sound quality is very good at my place. Happy to hear that it compares well to the PWT! That is saying a lot to me.
We will get EAC humming shortly.
BTW Chris says Hi as well. :D
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Had a great time at RMAF. Got to meet Scott and hang out with Chris. I did bring a music server and thanks to friends got to listen to it after hours in a system. Hi Rez music was fun to reproduce in a great sounding setup.
Looking forward to next year!
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Meeting new people that share a passion for audio is one of those things that makes life great. Finally getting to meet Rich face to face and just hanging out with Danny, Gary, Dave, and Chris were the highpoints of the show. The equipment was amazingly cool, but the people are the real joy. There was some seriously good sound in the GR room, and all of it related to each of these guys (well, maybe not Chris, but anyone that brings his own habeneros to grind on his mexican food is ok in my book :thumb:). A big thanks for letting me hear all the neat stuff created by very talented people :beer: :bowdown:
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Pardon the Newbie question:
Are the battery operation and SSD the main advantages over (1) a Netbook, or
(2) a touch-screen-all-in-one computer such as one of these (http://www.dell.com/content/topics/segtopic.aspx/inspiron-one) (the price of which is similar to this unit + monitor + keyboard + mouse)?
Thanks in advance.
Larry
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Pardon the Newbie question:
Are the battery operation and SSD the main advantages over (1) a Netbook, or
(2) a touch-screen-all-in-one computer such as one of these (http://www.dell.com/content/topics/segtopic.aspx/inspiron-one) (the price of which is similar to this unit + monitor + keyboard + mouse)?
Thanks in advance.
Larry
Larry,
One of the advantages of going to the small MS-1 format was getting the power supplies out of the unit. The Netbook is a great starting system, but found that the display power supply was causing some noise issues. This was eliminated with the MS-1.
I do use the Netbook as the remote control for the MS-1 as well as an Android Tablet. I find the Netbook is a bit easier to use for remote control as I am still getting use to the Tablet format touch screen. Integrating it with a touch screen monitor is possible, but not tested at this time.
All the users so far are running the MS-1 off the external AC supply. The comments so far are based on that configuration.
I am using a BatteryBUSS with my unit and learning what is best for the setup. Once I have it optimzed then I will be able to discuss what is the next step.
Hope this helps.
Rich
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Much obliged Rich. It sounds like you have a real winner on you hands.
Larry
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Looks like I will be delivering unit #5 in person for listening trials. :D
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"for listening trials."
Thankfully, without the tribulations. :)
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For customers that purchase an external 1TB eSATA drive with the MS-1, I will preload the sampler HiRez files from four of the on-line music websites.
Here is the list:
HDTracks
HDTT
BlueCoastRecords
LessLoss
They are identified as each company on the disc.
This should make it easy to start your HiRez listening experience and expose folks to websites where to obtain HiRez downloads. These include 24bit/96KHz, 24bit/192KHz and DSDIFF stereo files.
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Rich, I'm curious about your take on battery power for the MS-1. Any impressions yet?
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Scott,
I am home with sinus issues, so my ears are not the best at this point. :(
The BatteryBUSS is ready and will setup the battery powered Borbely headphone amp today for trials against AC power. This is going to be tried with my 12VDC@40Ah LiFe battery pack. :D
If you hear a loud noise, it might be me with singed eye brows and hair standing on end! :o
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Ok, the battery voltage has to get to 13.2VDC so the MS-1 power supply will start-up. It has been at 13.3VDC for a week with the DAC running. I think I need to build a voltage dropping circuit to give this a try. :scratch:
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Building unit #6 for my sister-in-law as a HTPC.
Will see what happens when we tie it to her HDTV.
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The MS-1 #6 install as a HTPC is complete. She bought a copy of The Green Lantern to check out Blu-Ray video and it looked very good using the HDMI interface to her 1080p HDTV. The Blu-Ray drive worked well with Cyberlink PowerDVD11 Ultra!
Replaced the SSD with a 500GB SATA drive for her to store pictures and videos of the family.
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MS-1 #7 is built and will be installed tomorrow at my friends house.
Will also bring along a Musiland Monitor 01US asyncronous USB DAC for him to try in his system.
This should be interesting.
Will be going back to my 12V 75Ah AGM battery for the DC trials coming up. :D
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Did not get to the battery trials this weekend.
Did the install of Unit #6 and so far it is doing very well as her HTPC. Added the WiFi setup for her today and got her interconnect connection working again so she can do internet radio and streaming video via her HDTV.
Unit #7 is an interesting story. It went to another friends house for initial trials for gaming and high quality audio. Looking forward to his comments after the integration is complete and his game arrives.
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Do you currently have the MS plugged directly into the wall, or is there Uberbuss/equivalent reducing noise?
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Scott,
I have it plugged directly into the wall at this point.
The UberBUSS is yet another trial. I have to take it out of the system to give it a try with the MS-1.
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MS-1, unit #5 is ready for install this Saturday. :D
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MS-1 #5 is installed and sounded very good to me with the customers DAC and system. :D
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As the recipient of MS-1 unit #5, I am very impressed. It is an excellent addition to my system, and sounds better than my optical drive. I am indebted to Rich for his help in setting it up, and for his patience in teaching me the procedures for its use.
Regards,
Larry Borden
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Larry,
I am very glad that you like listening to the MS-1. That is what made this a fun project helping folks get better sounding music from their existing collection. Accessing the HiRez music libraries that now exist just adds to the musical experience.
It was my pleasure to install it and teach you the functionality. Had a great time listening to your setup while giving it a trial without tribulation! :wink:
Best,
Rich
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Back to some listening trials.
Connected the PC system to the BatteryBUSS using my 75Ah AGM battery with a full charge. Dave suppled me with cables for both the MS-1 and the external eSATA drive. Tied this to my DIY DAC and Borbely Audio SE DC coupled headphone amp driving my Sennheiser HD650's running off separate battery supplies as they do not run off 12VDC.
The last vestiges of noise floor are gone, leaving low level details to be there when expected, in comparison to the 12V and 5V switching power supplies they normally require. This is noticable in low level passages in music. This seems to help the most with classical and jazz recordings, but even in some rock/pop recordings can be evident.
Is this a huge change, no. It is more like the icing on the cake! :D
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Showing my ignorance, what does the battery buss do? I see why AC would need cleaning, but why batteries?
Scott
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Scott,
The Music Server setup needs 12VDC and 5VDC to run. The BatteryBUSS does the DC regulation for 5VDC and provides the multiple DC outlets needed. There is also filtering on the 12VDC high power connections to eliminate any power supply noise crossfeed to the different loads.
The one I had Dave build has two high power DC outlets for the MS-1 and Dodd Audio Battery Buffer. There are four dual voltage (5VDC and 12VDC) low power DC outlets for peripherals like the external eSATA drive.
Dave also provided the DC power cabling I needed for all the connections, as there are many different size coaxial DC connectors and Neutrik Powercon connectors in the setup.
In the headphone setup that I am using at this time, I only need the MS-1 and eSATA on DC power. In the future I can also run the DIY DAC on the same BatteryBUSS.
It also provides a power switch, breaker and reversed DC connection protection in case of a problem downstream from the battery. Important operation and safety precautions needed for the battery.
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Ok, that clear up quite a bit. If my buffer ever goes back into my main system with the MS-1, I may ask Dave to fix up something similar.
Scott
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Wishing everyone Happy Holiday's to you and yours! :D
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Thanks Rich. The same to you and all the AC family. :xmas:
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Hi Rich,
Happy Holidays and happy new year to you too. One of the highlights of 2012 for me was getting to meet and spend time with you and Danny at AXPONA. It is always fun to meet new friends that share a common interest.
BTW, I spent last night at the BWI airport Marriot, and we are also scheduled to return late tonight. Of course, that is always subject to change.
Take care,
Mark
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Mark,
There is a Duclaw's Microbrewery in BWI! They have decent beers and very good food if you are in the mood.
It is about 2 hours from my place.
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Rich,
I am sitting in the airport lounge in PIT right now. We brought a passenger here from BWI, and we take him back late tonight. We get back about 11:00pm tonight. Scheduled to leave BWI in the morning about 11:30 for Charlotte,N.C. If it wasn't for the glamour, this job would suck! :lol:
Maybe next ime.
Mark
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MS-1 owners announcement:
I have heard via the grape vine (what else do you have when the woodworker has no phone?) that the wood tops should be available this week! :D
Will be taking a trip to the shop mid week to collect the finished units. Once I have them, will ship them to the owners!
Once I have them, will post an update with pictures!
Almost made it for Christmas. Hopefully before New Years!
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It's like it's Christmas again! :xmas:
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Thanks Rich, I look forward to the "new look".
Happy New Year!!!
Mark
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Will pick the tops up tonight and get them ready tomorrow to ship. :D
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YES, pics please. :green:
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Ok here is a picture of the raw tops from my woodworker. Solid red oak with stain and gloss finish.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=55678)
Next step is to install the copper mesh. Hopefully it will be warm enough tomorrow for the epoxy to set.
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Very nice. :D
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Any news from owners how the MS-1 is working now that there is time on the server? Does the server benefit from more memory?
Thank you for your comments.
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Hi Rich,
I've been following this thread with great interest. I have my entire music and movie collection on an old PC with LOTS of terabytes running unRAID (a very cool linux based server). I've been using a SB touch to get at the music and a little HTPC for the movies (similar to yours, Atom 330/ION, power supply outside, windows 7). But now you have me thinking about using the PC as the music server too. Have you tried accessing the media over ethernet or wifi on your system, and if so, how does it compare to usb/esata? I'm using wifi with the touch right now and it's been surprisingly solid and sounds pretty good, but I have nothing to compare it to.
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I have used the MS-1 to stream to my SB Touch with very good results. I do not have that in my main audio setup, so have not compared the audio quality.
The main setup is MS-1, eSATA drive and USB2 DAC. That setup has excellent audio quality.
I would say that as long as the RAID is available as shared data on your network, it should sound very good with the HTPC running an external DAC.
My best results so far are with asynchronous USB DAC's or USB to S/PDIF converters like the Musiland Monitor 01USD or M2Tech hiFace or hiFace Evo. Both do 24bit/192KHz with their special drivers and Windows 7 HP x64 OS. I like the hiFace Evo more, but the hiFace and Musiland are very good.
What really sounds excellent is a DAC's running with USB to I2S Bus input from the MS-1. :D
Hope this helps.
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It hit 61 degrees today so was able to finish the tops.
Once the epoxy sets, will be able to take a picture and then get them packed for shipment!
Happy New Year to everyone!
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With the new year comes batch #1 of completed MS-1 tops!
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=55762)
Will be packing them for shipment shortly and going out Tuesday to the owners.
:D
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Have packed the MS-1 tops for Priority Mail shipment on Tuesday!
Hand delivered and installed two tops today. :D
One more top hand delivery and all MS-1's are complete! :thumb:
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Four tops installed and three in transit to their owners.
Complete MS-1's are in stock if anyone is interested. :D
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Four tops installed and three in transit to their owners.
Complete MS-1's are in stock if anyone is interested. :D
...and anyone looking for a server SHOULD be interested. These are top flight units. :thumb:
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Thanks Scott! :D
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I installed my wooden top today. and it looks great! Now the sound has a nice "woody" tone to it. Just kidding. Not that there is anything wrong with a nice "woody". :lol:
Mark
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I did the same. Looks good, sounds great. Thanks, Rich.
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Mark and Scott,
Glad you like the wood top for the MS-1.
It is old world wood art and new world electronics at the same time. Glad you like the goal! :D
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Here is the MS-1 dressed up with oak and copper screening. Looking good.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=56262)
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In 2012 there are some interesting things happening with the MS-1.
One owner is going to try having a demo with his local audio club.
There is one more thing that might happen, but will have to wait on it to occur before I can talk about it.
Better living through Audio Nirvana! :D
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Hi everyone! Glad to be back! Looks like some fun is about to happen.
Will be demoing the MS-1 and M2Tech hiFace EVO at PhilA's place on 8 Sept. Will try and post some pictures from the event.
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Hi everyone! Glad to be back! Looks like some fun is about to happen.
Will be demoing the MS-1 and M2Tech hiFace EVO at PhilA's place on 8 Sept. Will try and post some pictures from the event.
Yes - can't wait to hear the server (as my next upgrade will be of that category at some point in the near future as soon as I have more music, including hi-rez digitized). Make sure you don't take pictures of me so the camera does not break :lol:
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Demo'd the MS-1 for Nick today at HAL central as part of a checkout session for his Perpetual Technologies P-1A and P-3A combo. His P-1A was having problems. Turns out his battery supply for the P-1A was having issues not holding charge. Replaced his 12V-5AH AGM battery and it's back up and making music.
Used the MS-1 and M2Tech Evo via coaxial S/PDIF connection to drive the P-T gear. His P-1A has SOCS for his REF3 speakers, so he has that back working as well.
Always fun to get good old equipement back up and running!
Told him about Phil A's MAAC gathering next weekend, so he is going to look into it.
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The WASAPI component for Foobar2000 now has WASAPI Event driven I/O. This is the same interface as JRiver MC17 has for WASAPI. Have installed it and working correctly. Will give it some play time and make sure everything is stable. Sound quality so far is very good.
With the MS-1 connected to the internet, open the Library->Configure->Components tab in Foobar2000. Click the Get Updates tab at the bottom right of the window. A list of updates will appear. You only want to update the WASAPI component. Uncheck all but the WASAPI 3.0 update box that appears in the next screen. Now click on Apply. Foobar2000 will then ask to restart. Say Yes. The updated WASAPI 3.0 version should now be in the Components box and ready to use.
Next go into Library->Configure->Outputs tab and select the WASAPI (event) M2Tech hiFace output device from the Device pull down menu. This is the new output style. The old style WASAPI (push) style interface is there as well for comparison. You should be ready to try it out at this point with the DAC.
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Have updated the MS-1 going to Phil A's place for the demo on 8 September with the new WASAPI Event driven output for the M2Tech Evo USB interface.
This should be a fun time! :)
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This morning I downloaded wasapi-event using Rich's instructions, then I spent a few hours listening and comparing it to the original wasapi. I found the wasapi-event to be a nice improvement to the sound quality of my MS-1 server. The sound had more clarity and detail without being harsh at all. I would recommend that anyone using Foobar should download the wasapi-event upgrade and try it in their system. It is worth the effort for sure.
Mark
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Mark,
Glad you are liking the upgrade to the software. It is really working nicely here as well.
A reminder for folks in the MAAC area about Phil A's gathering this Saturday. Hope to see folks there!
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two quick questions hal. the ion specs seem to say it will support full hd (1080p) but you list it as only 1080i? and any problems storing/playback of music from a NAS?
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At the time it was listed for the ION processor, they only stated 1080i. I have used it for Blu-Ray playback with Cyberlink PoweDVD12 Ultra at home and do 1080p via HDMI.
I do not store video, but no problems with sites like YouTube for 1080p HD streaming playback.
Does that help?
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yep! and NAS connectivity, no problems i would assume? it's an interesting box for sure, i just recently got a mac mini that i use as a HTPC but i find mac's overall to be quite a PITA for various reasons. i have just spent weeks converting thousands of flac's to apple lossless for instance.
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I have only used the MS-1 with 3GB eSATA attached external storage. Usually a 1TB 2.5" in an eSATA/USB2 chassis with external supply. It is part of the home network via WiFi, so should be able to remote access the audio data from it if shared.
It also has remote access to Foobar2000 via the network for remote operation from a web browser like IE9 on another PC.
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Had a great time at the MAAC gathering at Phil A's place yesterday! Always fun listening to other folks systems and talking about audio and music.
woodsyi has a MS-1 for audition with his USB DAC. Looking forward to his comments!
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This thread is now over a year old! Time flies when you are having fun! :)
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Looking forward to reading Phil's and Rim's comments about the MS-1. Those guys have been around a while and have a bit of credibility.
I've also got a new cable coming. I'm eager to compare to what I'm using.
Scott
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Looking forward to reading Phil's and Rim's comments about the MS-1. Those guys have been around a while and have a bit of credibility.
I've also got a new cable coming. I'm eager to compare to what I'm using.
Scott
The server is really nice, compact, easy to use and sounds great. It's HAL's fault I have a big project of digitizing my music faster than expected. That's to be expected as remember HAL9000 from 2001 - always causing some additional work to do with a computer. :green:
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Another fellow AC'er is picking up an MS-1, drive and M2Tech Evo setup this weekend for evaluation. All packed and ready to go! :D
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This thread is now over a year old! Time flies when you are having fun! :)
Rich,
Thanks for the demo on the MS-1 and related gear.
I can re-read some of this thread with a much greater appreciation now that I have seen and heard this great, musical package.
Look forward to seeing you again.
James
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James,
Good to see you as well!
Hopefully Rich will be having a gathering at his place in the future as he discussed. Another chance for MAAC to have some audio fun!
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Here is another possible color combination for the MS-1 Music Server PC.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=67719)
Looking for feedback to see if there is any interest.
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James,
Good to see you as well!
Hopefully Rich will be having a gathering at his place in the future as he discussed. Another chance for MAAC to have some audio fun!
I'm going there tomorrow afternoon to analyze his room (just call me the audiophile shrink :green:) and he has a Rel sub he has not been able to dial in. Since I've sent up many and have several prototypes of upgrades Rel cables that I don't need I'm bringing those over. I say him last night at Woodsyi's. He's shoot for the end of October (after RMAF) and he indicated he would post on the mid-Atlantic Audio Circle giving a choice of two weekends.
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Sounds like a fun time!
Hopefully woodsyi is having fun with his MS-1 setup. Last I talked to him, he had it playing music with his DAC.
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Just gave Nick his MS-1/M2Tech Evo setup for his system.
Looking forward to his listening impressions. :D
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Here is a picture of Forest Dweller's audio setup with the MS-1 installed.
He did the WASAPI Event Driven update and is enjoying the improved sound quality.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=67896)
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Thanks to Dusty, I will shortly have a Channel Islands Audio Transient MKII USB DAC on the way. This has both the Audio Alchemy and PS Audio style I2S Bus outputs.
Will be trying this with the MS-1 to my DIY DAC and the Perpetual Technologies P-1A/P-3A and Monolithic Sound P-3b power supply. Will compare it to the M2Tech Evo USB to I2S Bus interface once I get a special cable built.
Looking forward to some listening time! :)
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Greetings to all!
Rich, the word, “installed” you used pretty much cracked me up. To be clear, the MS-1 is not something that is merely installed; but when combined with the HAL –symbiotically implemented DAC and interface system, changed the way I ever felt digital audio could be reproduced.
Yikes. I can’t believe it’s been a year since my review of the MS-1 (post 53) and here we are, headed back to Denver for another great time. Looking so very much forward to seeing the great folks I had the privilege and pleasure from last year’s fun (as well as every RMAF before that!), as well as meeting-up with many more I haven’t had the pleasure to meet yet.
The MS-1 still blows me away every time I fire it up (which is when I’m not at my 60+ hr/wk day gig or working on 24 acres of forestland). As I shared with Rich, the new Foobar WASAPI Event Driven update absolutely made a noticeable audible difference. I was previously using Kernal Streaming to the M2Tech Evo. I’m still running my entire library from an eSATA drive, and am constantly burning new material to it in .wav format. This system has run flawlessly since Day One.
Incidentally, those 4 diffusion panels in the pic are designed by Dave Elledge and built by Greg Rael @ PI Audio. They are the AQD1's. A good friend and awesome “build anything” contractor, Butch Blier, built the frames based on Dave’s recommendations and specs for proper sizing for the room and placement. Each framed panel unit is made up of about 1.5 standard 4'x2' panels. They came out very nicely indeed; and are extremely effective. My current project in motion is major room acoustic treatment (finally). In addition to the diffusers, there are 4 GIK Soffit Traps in the corners and much more absorption treatments from Bryan and diffusion from Dave and Greg to come. No small investment, to say the least; but worth every penny. Will post pics here, PI Audio and GIK’s sites when done. -like “done” is a real concept in this “hobby” :P
See all of you there; and yes, Scott- I’m bringing the Red Savina Habanero and Bhut Jolokia mix. Maybe even a bit hotter dose than last year (for Danny 8) )
Chris
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Chris,
How the heck are you?
Time flies, doesn't it? :)
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Chris,
Thanks again for the great write-up!
Hugh was essential to Chris getting his LS-9's. They look great! :drool:
Waiting to hear from woodsyi how his MS-1 listening trials are going.
The PI Audio Group Discreet USB cable arrived today to try with the M2Tech Evo USB interface.
Letting everyone know that I have parts in-house to build three more MS-1 Music Servers before long lead parts would need to be ordered. The delay can be up to 2 months, so I have to see if there is enough interest to make more parts. One is fully built. The other two can be built up in two weeks and shipped.
Please post in the thread or PM me if you are interested in a unit.
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Hey Hugh my Friend,
Busier with some stuff I’d rather not be! :)
We’re dead-smack in the middle of yet another acquisition (5 more locations this year- so far). Getting everything in motion as much as possible, so I can get on the plane and forget about it all when I’m wheels-down in DEN.
Still keeping-up on the Emergency Communications Support role for the County Sheriff’s Search and Rescue Team which continues to be very rewarding.
I’m looking so forward to hanging-out and catching-up with my brother and sister audioholics! And yeah- can’t believe it’s been a year. Sheesh!
The drop-dead gorgeous LS-9’s are sounding even more phenomenal as the room is better acoustically treated. As Rich mentioned and I will reiterate, my sincerest thanks to you for turning a nightmare into an aural (and visual) pleasure which has exceeded my listening experiences with LS-9’s I’ve heard previously elsewhere. These are just perfect. Also my thanks to Sean Ries; the Skiing Ninja himself, for the Ninja Master X-Overs and loading the -9’s up. WOW.
See ya in a few days; and we can talk about what you’ve been up to.
In keeping with this thread though, if HAL has the ability to build-out 3 more MS-1’s… If anyone out there is even halfway considering one; seriously, GO FOR IT. You will not be disappointed. The updated dead-quiet fan and the beautiful custom wood top just add the final touch to a great performer in a small and elegant package. Perfect if WAF is an issue 8) With USB and eSATA ports, you can do a LOT with the MS-1. Rich can guide you in the direction of interfaces and DACs if you’re not already set for that. If you have a DAC with an I2S bus, you’ll be even more thrilled.
That’s really been the joy of beta testing the MS-1: trying different tweaks, after hours of listening, so I could really get as close to an a/b test as possible. Going from S/PDIF to I2S, using the WASAPI drivers, using a battery powered interface and DAC, and now the WASAPI Event Driven update ALL make a difference. It just keeps getting better.
…which also means I’m getting far less stuff done around the house since I’m glued to the sweet-spot with the added luxury of a wireless remote application for Foobar which works on my laptop and Samsung Galaxy SIII :thumb:
Chris
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I'm curious. Chris and I are using LS9's, Rich is using the Super V's (lots of GR stuff here) What are the rest of the MS-1 owners using for speakers?
Scott
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Here is the list of speakers that I know:
You, Chris and stu have LS-9's.
ChrisS has some I sold him, but don't remember :scratch:
LarryB has horn loaded speakers.
HAL has Super-V's.
woodsyi has VMPS RM40's.
I do not know what Nick has for speakers.
One MS-1 is being used as a HTPC tied directly to an HDTV with built in speakers.
One MS-1 is being used as an LP ripping computer with an M-Audio Audiophile UBS digital audio interface, unknown system.
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HAL - believe these are Woodsyi's speakers - http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_12_1/vmps-ribbon-monitor-40-speakers-2-2005.html
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HAL - believe these are Woodsyi's speakers - http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_12_1/vmps-ribbon-monitor-40-speakers-2-2005.html
Phil,
Thanks, updated the post with woodsyi's VMPS RM40's.
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Here is a picture of Forest Dweller's audio setup with the MS-1 installed.
He did the WASAPI Event Driven update and is enjoying the improved sound quality.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=67896)
Great looking rig, Chris. The diffusers came out great! I hope to be able to hear the system when we head up that way to visit the kids in Portland.
Awesome, my friend.
Dave
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Hey Dave, they do look pretty darn cool, don’t they? 8)
Thing is: they work even better than they look. “Awesome” is the word.
I’m already working on a post for your circle; where pics will be included. What’s interesting is listening to digital from the MS-1 and analog from the Studer A-810. Both sources have been enhanced greatly, in similar and different ways, with the few AQD1’s I have so far. Now that Butch and I have the process down; we’ll be ready to knock out more… I’ve got some ideas for the “leftover remnants” as well.
I ran the HAL MS-1 System til the batteries died (many hours) and then went to analog master tape.
Would love to have you and Gayle up to my little piece of Heaven on Earth. We will work that out!
See you and the Gang next week!
Safe travel, Brother D,
Chris
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Hey Dave, they do look pretty darn cool, don’t they? 8)
Thing is: they work even better than they look. “Awesome” is the word.
I’m already working on a post for your circle; where pics will be included. What’s interesting is listening to digital from the MS-1 and analog from the Studer A-810. Both sources have been enhanced greatly, in similar and different ways, with the few AQD1’s I have so far. Now that Butch and I have the process down; we’ll be ready to knock out more… I’ve got some ideas for the “leftover remnants” as well.
I ran the HAL MS-1 System til the batteries died (many hours) and then went to analog master tape.
Would love to have you and Gayle up to my little piece of Heaven on Earth. We will work that out!
See you and the Gang next week!
Safe travel, Brother D,
Chris
Gonna be a good time. Gayle can't come this year. She will be the only one in HR at the credit union those days, so...... She sends her best. :thumb:
Dave
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For the MS-1 users that are interested in Sony DSD file playback, the installation of Foobar2000 on the machine includes the component to playback *.DFF files. These files are available at websites like 2L and Blue Coast Records for trials. Foobar2000 downsamples the 2.882MHz master DSD files to 24bit PCM files. The output rate is selectable by the user in the Input->DSDIFF tab. Staying with the 44.1KHz family of sample rates (44.1KHz, 88.2KHz and 176.4KHz rates) makes them straight downsamples. If your DAC does not support those rates, try the 48KHz family instead (48KHz, 96KHz and 192KHz rates).
Foobar2000 only supports the two channel DSD files, not the multichannel. Other players like HQPlayer do support the multichannel format, but have to work with a compatible DAC or HDMI interface to HT receiver or processor. Usually the two channel format is available.
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HAL
Will one of these units be at RMAF? If so, where?
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For the MS-1 users that are interested in Sony DSD file playback, the installation of Foobar2000 on the machine includes the component to playback *.DFF files. These files are available at websites like 2L and Blue Coast Records for trials. Foobar2000 downsamples the 2.882MHz master DSD files to 24bit PCM files. The output rate is selectable by the user in the Input->DSDIFF tab. Staying with the 44.1KHz family of sample rates (44.1KHz, 88.2KHz and 176.4KHz rates) makes them straight downsamples. If your DAC does not support those rates, try the 48KHz family instead (48KHz, 96KHz and 192KHz rates).
Foobar2000 only supports the two channel DSD files, not the multichannel. Other players like HQPlayer do support the multichannel format, but have to work with a compatible DAC or HDMI interface to HT receiver or processor. Usually the two channel format is available.
Go native my friends... go native. :eyebrows:
Dave
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Jason,
I brought a MS-1 last year at RMAF for demos. Was not planning on it this year, unless someone was interested.
Dave,
Working on native DSD playback as we speak. Will see what happens!
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Jason,
I brought a MS-1 last year at RMAF for demos. Was not planning on it this year, unless someone was interested.
Dave,
Working on native DSD playback as we speak. Will see what happens!
Seems silly to not bring it then.
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Working on native DSD playback as we speak. Will see what happens!
That's excellent. Going to be a killer product.
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Jason,
I can demo the capability with my PC netbook. It is setup as an MS-1, but a lot more portable.
Will see if it all works and bring it for after hours trials.
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Hi Chris,
Wow, you are still alive! Seems like forever since we have talked. I have been meaning to give you a call, but have not had a chance. Good to see you are enjoying your LS-9's. Your 9's and your room look great! I still get amazed sometimes at the sound that I get from mine. And I am enjoying the MS-1 too. I did the WASAPI Event upgrade a few weeks ago, and thought it made a nice bump up in performance.
I am jealous of you guys going to RMAF. Seems it happens every year when I have to work. One of these years I am going to call in sick, and go to RMAF instead. ( I did not really say that, did I? ). Tell Rich and Danny I said hello, and hope you all have a great time out there.
Take care,
Mark
uote author=Forest Dweller link=topic=98467.msg1138129#msg1138129 date=1349140203]
Hey Hugh my Friend,
Busier with some stuff I’d rather not be! :)
We’re dead-smack in the middle of yet another acquisition (5 more locations this year- so far). Getting everything in motion as much as possible, so I can get on the plane and forget about it all when I’m wheels-down in DEN.
Still keeping-up on the Emergency Communications Support role for the County Sheriff’s Search and Rescue Team which continues to be very rewarding.
I’m looking so forward to hanging-out and catching-up with my brother and sister audioholics! And yeah- can’t believe it’s been a year. Sheesh!
The drop-dead gorgeous LS-9’s are sounding even more phenomenal as the room is better acoustically treated. As Rich mentioned and I will reiterate, my sincerest thanks to you for turning a nightmare into an aural (and visual) pleasure which has exceeded my listening experiences with LS-9’s I’ve heard previously elsewhere. These are just perfect. Also my thanks to Sean Ries; the Skiing Ninja himself, for the Ninja Master X-Overs and loading the -9’s up. WOW.
See ya in a few days; and we can talk about what you’ve been up to.
In keeping with this thread though, if HAL has the ability to build-out 3 more MS-1’s… If anyone out there is even halfway considering one; seriously, GO FOR IT. You will not be disappointed. The updated dead-quiet fan and the beautiful custom wood top just add the final touch to a great performer in a small and elegant package. Perfect if WAF is an issue 8) With USB and eSATA ports, you can do a LOT with the MS-1. Rich can guide you in the direction of interfaces and DACs if you’re not already set for that. If you have a DAC with an I2S bus, you’ll be even more thrilled.
That’s really been the joy of beta testing the MS-1: trying different tweaks, after hours of listening, so I could really get as close to an a/b test as possible. Going from S/PDIF to I2S, using the WASAPI drivers, using a battery powered interface and DAC, and now the WASAPI Event Driven update ALL make a difference. It just keeps getting better.
…which also means I’m getting far less stuff done around the house since I’m glued to the sweet-spot with the added luxury of a wireless remote application for Foobar which works on my laptop and Samsung Galaxy SIII :thumb:
Chris
[/quote]
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Here is the Dagogo.com review of the MS-1 Music Server.
Thanks goes to Dr. Laurence Borden and Constantine Soo for all the time and effort to do the wonderful write-up.
http://www.dagogo.com/View-Article.asp?hArticle=1100 (http://www.dagogo.com/View-Article.asp?hArticle=1100)
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Here is the Dagogo.com review of the MS-1 Music Server.
Thanks goes to Dr. Laurence Borden and Constantine Soo for all the time and effort to do the wonderful write-up.
http://www.dagogo.com/View-Article.asp?hArticle=1100 (http://www.dagogo.com/View-Article.asp?hArticle=1100)
Very cool, Rich. Good for you. See you next week.
Dave
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Dave,
Thanks!
See you next week in Denver!
Rich
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Finishing a build of an MS-1 to take to RMAF. Will bring a 1TB eSATA drive and USB wireless keyboard. Maybe someone will let me use a display to demo it after hours.
Bringing lots of music anyway to listen in other rooms!
See everyone there on Friday!
-
You can use ours. :-)
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Hugh,
Ok will bring the MS-1 around for listening trials in your room when you have time. I am there starting Wednesday through Monday. Plenty of time for some listening fun! :)
-
We should arrive late Wednesday night and start moving in Thursday morning early.
Want to hook up Wednesday evening sometime?
Hugh,
Ok will bring the MS-1 around for listening trials in your room when you have time. I am there starting Wednesday through Monday. Plenty of time for some listening fun! :)
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Hugh,
Sounds good! Should be back from visiting with my niece and her family that afternoon. Will find you and bring the MS-1 by for setup listening trials.
Best,
Rich
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Nice comparison in review Hal
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Thanks!
Larry did a wonderful job with the MS-1 write-up and his experiences along the way!
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Nice write up in Dagogo. I think he summed up in a sentence what took me about a page to write in the opening post... "the MS-1 bettering the modded Sony in virtually all sonic attributes". I don't have the Sony, but it left a well respected Virtue Piano in the dust.
RMAF in just a couple of days!!!! :banana piano:
Scott
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:banana piano: :beer:
See you soon!
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Have an MS-1 packed and departing for Denver.
See everyone soon! WOOHOO! Audio Time!
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Made it to the RMAF hotel. Will demo the MS-1 in the ACA room today and will see what happens.
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Made it to the RMAF hotel. Will demo the MS-1 in the ACA room today and will see what happens.
Best of Luck Rich. Have fun at RMAF.
-
Got in real late last night.
See you in a few R.
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Best of Luck Rich. Have fun at RMAF.
Deepak,
Thanks! No matter what, it is going to be a great time!
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Got in real late last night.
See you in a few R.
Hugh,
The room was ready for you when I just stopped by.
Will leave soon to go get Chris at the airport. Will stop by before I leave.
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For anyone interested there is HAL MS-1 setup as the front end with the new CIAudio Transient MKII DAC in the Angel City Audio room number 442. Was making some very nice music when left. There is also a MAC Mini in the room if folks want to listen to both.
Thanks goes to Hugh for letting me set it up and giving a try for the show!
Hope folks stop by and give the setup a listen. The Melody gear and ACA speakers were sounding very good with the front end.
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For anyone interested there is HAL MS-1 setup as the front end with the new CIAudio Transient MKII DAC in the Angel City Audio room number 442. Was making some very nice music when left. There is also a MAC Mini in the room if folks want to listen to both.
Yes, I look forward to hearing it and would like to hear both. Any show special on the MS-1? :D
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The HAL MS-1 and 1TB drive combo package is available for $800.00 at RMAF only! Collect it on Sunday afternoon after the show.
I have placed HAL business cards with the unit with contact info.
Only one is available at this price, so first come is first served. :D
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Another RMAF has come to a close and a wonderful time visiting with old and new friends.
Wanted to thank Hugh of Angel City Audio for the big opportunity to show the MS-1 in his room with all the help from Michael, Nhan and Tim. I think the setup was sounding better this year due to to many reasons!
Hope to see everyone again next year!
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Just received a very nice email from Gary Dodd of Dodd Audio. He took the MS-1 that I built for RMAF home to demo in his system. He is running it from battery power.
His only comment was "YOU ARE NOT GETTING IT BACK!" :thumb:
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Just received a very nice email from Gary Dodd of Dodd Audio. He took the MS-1 that I built for RMAF home to demo in his system. He is running it from battery power.
His only comment was "YOU ARE NOT GETTING IT BACK!" :thumb:
Wow, good job Rich! Glad it went well for you and the MS-1 at the show. Hate I missed it.
Mark
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Mark,
Thanks!
We need to get you there one year. Chris and I always have a blast with everyone!
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Just received a very nice email from Gary Dodd of Dodd Audio. He took the MS-1 that I built for RMAF home to demo in his system. He is running it from battery power.
His only comment was "YOU ARE NOT GETTING IT BACK!" :thumb:
I'm not surprised. I've told Gary several times how I've been impressed with the sound of mine- and since I'm running lots of Dodd gear in my system, I was sure that the results would transfer to his rig. It's a winner as far as sound quality and it's easy to use... a great combination.
Scott
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Delivered a MS-1 setup with an M2Tech Evo to pansixt at the MAAC meeting today at r.wasserstrom's place.
His setup with the original QUAD ESL57's and REL sub was a very nice system.
We also talked about connecting Rich's DAC via USB to his PC Music Server. He is going to give it a try once he gets his USB2 cable.
Looking forward to his comments on the setup with his DAC.
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pansixt has his MS-1 up and running. :D
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As I PM'd HAL, setup time was 50 minutes total including downloading the drivers for the M2Tech hi-Face EVO interface.
I needed this due to the lack of USB input on my AVA Vision EC DAC.
Foobar2000 immediately recognized the hi-Face and provided the option for WASAPI-Event with the hi-Face as output.
Rich also included his personal portable eSATA enclosure with 1TB HDD and mucho Hirez files for my preview.
Soon I hope to give more feedback on the MS1, including my thoughts on comparing it to my SB Touch as Phil A suggested.
Many Thanks HAL. :thumb:
James
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Gary Dodd has his MS-1 up and running after RMAF2012. He has the unit that was in the Angel City Audio room for RMAF.
Hopefully he will post his listening impressions with his setup.
Also shipped one to John for listening trials. He should have his Monday.
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Also shipped one to John for listening trials. He should have his Monday.
Who dat?
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Jason,
Not sure if John is on AC. Once he is up and running, will ask him if he wants to post in the thread about his impressions.
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Not sure if John is on AC. Once he is up and running, will ask him if he wants to post in the thread about his impressions.
Oh, I thought you were speaking of John like we knew him. :lol:
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Here is a picture of John's audio setup where the MS-1 is being installed. Nice setup!
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=70093)
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Hi HAL.
Hope you weathered the storm OK.
Out of curiosity, I did a search for the computer you are using for the M1 and it appears it has been discontinued. What are you now using in it's place?
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I bought a stock of the machines for the MS-1. Have a few MS-1's left that are available.
I have not made any decision as to building an MS-2. If I do, it will be awhile, as I have to ring out new hardware and Windows 8 OS at the same time. That is not a fast process.
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I bought a stock of the machines for the MS-1. Have a few MS-1's left that are available.
I have not made any decision as to building an MS-2. If I do, it will be awhile, as I have to ring out new hardware and Windows 8 OS at the same time. That is not a fast process.
Ah, I see.
Unfortunately, an M1 isn't in the budget right now ( I recently made an unplanned speaker purchase :oops: ), so I'll keep checking back to see if you decide to come up with an M2.
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For a very nice HiRez DAC to try, the new CIAudio Transient MKII USB DAC sounds very good with the MS-1 Music Server. Listened to it at RMAF in the Angel City Audio room with the MS-1 and now at home. I have just used USB power to run it, but CIAudio does have a nice external DC supply to use.
I have also run this one from the PI Audio Group BatteryBUSS. Dave built this one with 5VDC outputs as well as 12VDC outputs. This worked very well indeed.
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John has his MS-1 up and running making music.
Gave him links and pictures to get him fully up and running.
He has the link to this thread, so hopefully he will post his impressions when he has time.
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An updated picture of John's setup with the MS-1 installed. He is using an April Music Stello DAC via USB.
He is running Foobar2000 with WASAPI Event Driven output and enjoying the sound quality increase over Windows Media Player and Direct Sound.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=70314)
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He is running Foobar2000 with WASAPI
Is this your choice or his? If yours, why not JRiver?
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Jason,
I preload Foobar2000 with the latest WASAPI Event Driven output drivers for the DAC the customer owns. When I have tried JRiver MC17 it sounded very close to Foobar2000 with WASAPI Event output to me. Did not see the need for the extra expense for the customers.
I have customers that have installed JRiver MC17 and MC18 on their MS-1's. They are very happy with it. The PC platform gives the user a lot of flexibility for media players if they want to experiment.
I actually prefer the simple Foobar2000 interface over JRiver. I like the folder organization view that it provides to access the music library.
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OK. I've never seen the Foobar interface. :(
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I can solve that! :)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=70315)
That is a screen capture of Foobar2000 in playback mode. Very simple user interface for creating play lists or simple file play.
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Very simple user interface for creating play lists or simple file play.
Yes, not much to it. :thumb:
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For an old guy like me, simple is is good! :thumb:
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Ok have a rare opportunity for someone if there is interest.
I received a MS-1 demo unit back from trials from woodsyi. It is fully checked out and ready to use. Anyone interested in giving an MS-1 a try, I will ship it to them for listening sessions. If you are local to DC, MD or VA, it might be within a few hour drive to pickup or drop off.
Let me know the DAC and interface you have available and will preload drivers for use if needed.
If the unit is returned, it is the user's responsibility for shipping and insurance charges.
This has to be in the USA. Anyone interested, please PM me.
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The MS-1 demo unit is going to NJ for the ACA gathering in December. There will be a CI Audio Transient MKII USB DAC and CI Audio power supply going as well for the setup.
Working with shadowlight now to get this to him for the demo.
Hope folks get to go and take a listen!
Happy Thanksgiving to everyone! :)
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One MS-1 on the way to NJ for the ACA gathering in December.
One MS-1 is being built up for my bother-in-law for his digital music collection. Will deliver that one tomorrow and install it. :D
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For people using USB powered DAC's, I talked to Dave Elledge and had him make me a DISCREET USB cable for my setup. This cable eliminates the 5V power line from the cable for use with powed USB devices like the M2Tech Evo. Helps to lower the noise floor of the MS-1 setup.
I also had Dave make me a DISCREET USB cable powered from my BatteryBUSS. Used this with a DAC that is USB powered and the noise floor droped a lot!
Have asked Dave to make me another DISCREET USB cable for the MS-1 that shipped to the ACA gathering in NJ. He will ship it to shadowlight once it is built for the listening session. This works very well with the MS-1, CI Audio Transient MKII USB DAC and the CI Audio external power supply. I tried it here with my setup. :thumb:
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Equipment list updated for ACA/Melody gathering in Princeton, NJ.
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=110327.new#new
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shadowlight has the MS-1 now for the ACA gathering on 15 Dec. Looking forward to the comments from the event.
That was the last MS-1 that I can build. As with all PC's getting the hardward is only for a limited time. Hopefully it will find a good home. :D
It has been fun building these and meeting new folks along the way. Always fun to help folks rediscover their music collection and having the chance to listen to the new HiRez formats as well.
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That was the last MS-1 that I can build. As with all PC's getting the hardward is only for a limited time.
Are you gonna build an MS-2?
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I would build an MS-2 if there is interest.
I will start another thread to discuss ideas for the next generation. Will see how much interest it has and gauge it that way.
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Hal, I would be interested in the next gen computer server ... I need something soon ... figuring out if I go via Mac/PC route or get a purpose built music server. There are too many choices and everyone has the "best" dog in the fight ;)
Sunil
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Hal, I would be interested in the next gen computer server
+1
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Hal, I would be interested in the next gen computer server ... I need something soon ... figuring out if I go via Mac/PC route or get a purpose built music server. There are too many choices and everyone has the "best" dog in the fight ;)
Sunil
Sunil,
Touch base with Rich (HAL), the one that is visiting Princeton is going to be sold and will be available on the 15th to take home with you along with the USB cable. If you want some time on your own without the crowd with MS-1 and the Transient come over early on the 15th.
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Sunil,
If you want to try the MS-1 that is going to shadowlight's for the ACA gathering, you are more than welcome to give it a demo.
PM me you contact information if you do decide to give it a try.
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The ACA gathering in NJ was last weekend.
Hope everyone enjoyed the MS-1 demo with the CI Audio Transient MKII DAC.
Happy Holiday's! :)
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The demo MS-1 was purchased and will have some updates done before shipping out.
The last of the production run it complete. Hope they like it.
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Found another interesting use for the MS-1.
I purchased on of the PrimeVibe units that is used for musical instrument break-in. It uses music as the signal source.
Hooking up the original prototype MS-1's motherboard DAC output to the PrimeVibe and letting it play for 100 hours. Putting the library on the SSD drive so no moving parts for the 100 hours. Put the transducers on the Gibson SG Special and once the library is copied will start the process.
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Here is the Dagogo.com review of the MS-1 Music Server.
Thanks goes to Dr. Laurence Borden and Constantine Soo for all the time and effort to do the wonderful write-up.
http://www.dagogo.com/View-Article.asp?hArticle=1100 (http://www.dagogo.com/View-Article.asp?hArticle=1100)
HAL, I might suggest that you put this dagogo link into your first post on this thread; it's really a great framework for the newbies like myself because it explains everything A to Z.
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Good suggestion!
Done. It is now in the second post in the thread.
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CONGRATS Rich. A fine product indeed.
charles
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Thanks Charles! Hopefully folks will enjoy the MS-2 as well as the MS-1.
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Building one more MS-1 for the second ever owner as he wants to setup a second system. No wood top, but have the original metal top with standoff's like the original prototype to install. I found a chassis to build it.
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The MS-1 is complete and boxed up for shipping on Monday.
Still love building these little guys. The make a lot of music in a small size package.
Back to MS-2 fun.
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An MS-1 owner is buying an MS-2 as an upgrade. He maybe interested in selling the MS-1 if someone is interested.
If someone is interested, let me know and I will pass it on to him. I will post more after I talk with him on Friday.
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Just updated an MS-1 to do recording work like another that I sent to a friend in a band in Detroit. Setup Audacity to do the recording with an Echo Audio Echo2 ADA with balanced I/O.
Used it to transcribe 1/4" stereo tape to digital 24bit/192KHz WAV files to the SSD.
Had not done Microsoft updates in 4.5 years. That took awhile!
Will be working with his new dspMusik crossover once the unit arrives this week.
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Just found a basically new MS-1 chassis for sale and purchased it.
Need a chassis to run Windows XP for installing CLIO Standard 8.5 measurement system. Will see what happens.
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Rich,
I'm curious. It's been several years since I made the first post in this thread with one of the earliest units (still working fine, I might add) and I'm curious how the early MS-1's stack up sound wise to the latest and greatest. Are bits still bits, or are the newest super bits now more musical?
Scott
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Scott,
I found that with these chassis, the sound quality is more dependent on the OS.
Windows 10 and Windows 8.1 sound better to me than Windows 7. It is a free download until June for the new version to try. The latest upgrade works well with Windows 7, so you can try it on the MS-1. About ready to upgrade Chris MS-1 that he got just after yours.
Rich
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The MS-1 chassis arrived and wiping the Windows 7 Pro install and going to Windows 10 Home 64 bit OS for some trials before reloading with Windows XP Home 32bit SP3 for CLIO.
Will see how well Audio Weaver runs on the Atom 330 with Foobar2000. Might even give Math Audio a try with this one. Have the ultra quiet fan on order for converting it once it arrives.
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For MS-1 Music Server owners, Windows 10 64bit OS upgrade worked on my chassis here with improved sound results. The only thing I have noticed is that my BluRay player for ripping CD's is no longer talking to the OS. That maybe a registry issue I am working on, but will most likely not effect the original DVD drives most folks probably have.
Since the free upgrade from Windows 7 to Windows 10 64bit OS expires in June 2016, you should decide soon if you are going to try it. You can go back to Windows 7 with tools Microsoft install. The upgrade process takes about 4 hours on the MS-1 chassis.
My suggestion is to backup anything you have added to your MS-1 along the way and then do the upgrade. It will keep your files and programs, but certain default settings like Power Management get reset. That is an OS level change that I make to turn off the sleep mode and not disable USB power ports for low power operation. Easily corrected by the user under Control Panel, that is now a right click on the Start Icon.
For one MS-1 I am upgrading, I will be adding Math Audio Room EQ to Foobar2000 for the customers trials with his ACA LS-9 speakers being modified for a dspMusik digital crossover. I am installing all the software along with the Windows 10 OS upgrade once it arrives.
Good luck and let me know if you have any questions.
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The customers HAL MS-1 for running Windows 10 64bit OS, Audio Weaver for the dspMusik digital crossover and MathAudio Room EQ is complete. Did find that Windows 10 is finiky about BluRay players, as my ASUS USB one would not work after the upgrade. The Lite-On USB DVD drive will work and no problems. Calibrated EAC with the Lite-On and ripping is fine.
Will be installing a 120GB SSD in the CLIO MS-1 when it comes back from it's measurement task.
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Rich,
When the Windows 10 upgrade is no longer free (after June), will this affect the purchase price of your server? If so, what will the new price be?
Thanks
Martin
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Martin,
The price for the MS-3 will remain the same. The MS-1 chassis is long out of production, so those can be upgraded until June. After that the os is $100 for the upgrade + shipping.
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Martin,
The price for the MS-3 will remain the same. The MS-1 chassis is long out of production, so those can be upgraded until June. After that the os is $100 for the upgrade + shipping.
Sounds good thanks!
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Updating Avoosl's MS-1 with Windows 10 before the deadline of 29 July. Only 2 weeks to go before the 1 year free upgrade is over.
If you have Windows 7 on the MS-1, I really recommend the upgrade as it sounds better in my system running Windows 10.
Microsoft has added extra programs with the upgrade, but it is easy to remove them by right clicking the tiles and say uninstall. Clean up only takes a few minutes.
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The upgrade process takes about 4 hours on the MS-1 chassis.
The upgrade took about 1 hour on my old CAPS server using the Atom D525 (1.8GHz) processor but there are some tricks involved:
Make sure Windows 7 has all the Windows Updates installed (without errors). I left the server on for a week and let Win 7 automatically download updates because manually updating was a failure.
Download and run the Windows 10 Media Creation Tool - use it to install or reinstall Windows 10 using a USB or DVD.
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows10/ (https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows10/)
Type CMD into the Start search window to get a command prompt, in the new window type "cleanmgr" without the quotes. Clean your "C" drive.
Use the free CC cleaner to clean the registry only, the other parts clean way too aggressive for me, I want my cookies and other stuff.
https://www.piriform.com/
Download the free Paragon Backup and Recovery and image your C drive to a separate backup drive, don't forget to make a boot disk.
https://www.paragon-software.com/home/br-free/
Do a reboot
Put in the Windows 10 disk you made and upgrade
Uncheck everything in the 3 setup pages when asked, you can enable them later if you want
Turn off all the Windows 10 phone home programs - http://bgr.com/2015/07/31/windows-10-upgrade-download-install-tips-tricks/ (http://bgr.com/2015/07/31/windows-10-upgrade-download-install-tips-tricks/)
Once you have Windows 10 installed and registered you can roll back to Win 7 or use the disk or USB you made to do a clean install of Windows 10.
Since your computer was registered with Windows 10, you can now format the C drive, install Windows 10 from scratch and it will be re-registered. For now, this is the only way to do a clean install with the free upgrade.
Wayne
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Wayne,
Thanks for the tips!
Hopefully this is the last MS-1, MS-2 or MS-3 that need Windows 10 upgrade installed. Making the Win10 install DVD from the ISO as backup for future use.
Best,
Rich
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Avoosl's MS-1 is now running Windows 10 64bit OS.
Adding Audio Weaver for his dspMusik DSP crossover and HiRez DAC and MathAudio Room EQ for this version.
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When Avoosl has time, will take over my Dayton Audio UMM-6 calibrated mic and make measurements on his VMPS RM50's for MathAudio Room EQ. It has been working very well with The Megaliths on my MS-3.
Will see if the MS-1 has the capability to run the correction in realtime for digital file replay. My MS-1 for the CLIO measurement setup is back as well for some trials. Always fun to see if I can add new capabilities to the earlier systems for owners.
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Heading to Avoosls this evening for the MS-1 install and possibly some MathAudio Room EQ trials.
Have calibrated mic and mic stand, will travel! :)
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Heading to Avoosls this evening for the MS-1 install and possibly some MathAudio Room EQ trials.
Have calibrated mic and mic stand, will travel! :)
If you're in the mood to travel a bit further :lol: let me know :lol: Seriously, I have the mic and have not tried MathAudio but used Room EQ Wizard a couple of times on both my Windows 10 MS-2 and MS-3 (I do have an outboard one third octave RTA but probably over time one of the programs will be easier to use - just hanging on to old guy ways).
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Phil,
Already talked to my wife and the next trip south to FL, wanted to come to the east coast side. Been many years since we visited NASA, and one of my favorite places to go.
Will keep you posted. It will be a driving trip, so lots of things are possible.
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Phil,
Already talked to my wife and the next trip south to FL, wanted to come to the east coast side. Been many years since we visited NASA, and one of my favorite places to go.
Will keep you posted. It will be a driving trip, so lots of things are possible.
Rich, just let me know. Except if I go on a short vacation, I'm home and around most of the time (go to monthly Space Coast Audio Society meetings and getting some of the guys up on computer audio - starting slower with some like a hard drive attached to an Oppo - there are lots that still just use physical media). KSC (NASA) is about a half hour north of me and downtown Orlando about an hour. Miami is about 3 hours south down Rt. 95 (I'm less than 4 miles off 95). Using around mid-October thru April is citrus season and one of the biggest growers has their main store about 5 miles up the road (on Rt. 1) from me.
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Updated Avoosl's MS-1 from Windows 7 to Windows 10 OS with the Microsoft free upgrade until 7/29/2016. Same sound quality increase I experienced here as well with the MS-3 running Windows 10. His 2032 watch battery for BIOS settings died on startup, but he had a spare, so popped that in, changed the BIOS for the IDE interface to AHCI for the SSD and back up running. That is normal for after 3-5 years for those Lithium batteries.
I brought over the demo dspMusik and we tried the second minimum phase filter available in the dspMusik for his VMPS RM50 speakers and on listening, his preference last evening is for the new one with an increase in overall clarity.
Last step was doing a room measurement with MathAudio Room EQ from the MS-1 and dspMusik with the calibrated Dayton Audio UMM-6 mic. This did a nice job of balancing the frequency response of the system for digital file replay. Only parts of the system running are the MS-1, dspMusik, Parasound JC-1's and VMPS RM50's for the Music Server portion with the 8 channel digital volume control on the dspMusik Audio Weaver UI.
A very good evening of great food, beer and music listening ensued.
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"Updated Avoosl's MS-1 from Windows 7 to Windows 10 OS with the Microsoft free upgrade until 7/29/2016."
Gee. Just like that, huh? I've have been stuck at 99% complete for the last 10 hours. About to start over. Might have to wait a bit, however. My eyes are a bit blurry with tears of frustration. The internet suggests a different approach, so I guess I'll try that.
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Try this.
When you start over, if it asks do you want to go online for updates. Tell it No. This forces it to just use the install file.
If that does not work, you can download the full install ISO file and burn it to a DVD. Then when you run it inside Windows 7 or 8.1, you can disconnect from the web to force it to just load the original.
I think the problem is MS' servers are totally bogged with folks doing the upgrade to Win 10. The update process is probably very low priority until 29 July.
If that does not work, I can send a Win 10 DVD I made for the install to try. Only takes 2 days to CO.
Best,
Rich
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The latest news is that Microsoft revised the registration options for the Windows 10 Upgrade. Now you can do a clean install using the ISO file and register using your Windows 7 or 8 license on the back of your original CD. This revision lets you do a clean install without first having to do the upgrade over Win 7 or 8. Of course you should always have an backup image file before doing any operating system change.
Wayne
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Thanks, Rich and Wayne. I'm in the middle of another approach at the moment. If it works, I'll let you know. If it doesn't, you'll find my name in the obituaries.
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Whenever someone sends a MS-1, 2 or 3 in, I wipe it and start from scratch. Usually easier than trying to do upgrades.
I just make sure the user has a backup of his files before I start. Much cleaner and gets rid of added junk that can get installed, like Anti Virus or Anti Malware.
Good luck with the upgrade.
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Whew! It worked. I'm in Windows 10 now.
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Congratulation! :D
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The Windows 10 Creators upgrade came out today. Updating my MS-1 with everything needed to do the install, as it has been awhile since it has been online.
Will see what happens over the next few days.
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One customers HAL MS-1 would not boot Win10. Problem is the original SSD is dying.
Came back and installed a new 120GB SSD and Win 10 64bit OS CU1809 installed and software loaded. System running and all updates are completed.
Packing it up Monday and back to the owner this week. Hopefully back making music very soon.
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The HAL MS-1 is back with its owner and making music again.
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I can't believe it's been nearly 8 years since I started this thread! My MS-1 had gotten a bit buggy, but a close friend that is also an audiophile/computer nerd got it running again. One day I'll send back to Rich just for a check up. Still makes music, still sounds great. :thumb:
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Yes, I looked at the date code on the repaired chassis and it is 8 years old.
Glad your MS-1 is back making music as well! :D