[BobC]

Got my TS Premium interconnects this week and only got around to hooking them up just now.  One end has a red wire sticking past the shrink wrap and soldered to the WBT.  The other does not.

Originally had the end with the wire at the amp and the end w/o at the pre.  Then I switched it around because I could get a tighter grip on the end without the wire.  (my 2 year old can reach these and don't want him pulling these off!  ) 

To my surprise I noticed an improvement.      So are these directional or am I just imagining things over here.   

Bob

[djbnh]

Yes, they are directional. There is some discussion about which way to go, Andreas Groneberg has his way of thinking, and Klaus has his. Try perusing this thread.

Groneberg's site is here. Also, the image of how Andreas Groneberg recommends components be connected is accessed here.

edit: added site / image links.

[BobC]

Thanks! 

I knew they had to be when I heard the difference.  At first I was thinking "oh man, what a disappointment / waste of money".     Then flipped them around and I'm a happy camper.   

So, memo to all you Premium owners out there, check to make sure you have these things running the right direction!

Bob

[slow_down]

Wow, I had no idea!  Checked the Groneneberg website and looks like their series 3 is also directional.  I'm gonna have to reconnect my IC's and speaker cables now.  Would be great to get an improvement in sound from this tweak!

[Eduardo AAVM]

All Groneberg cables are directional. Because of shielding and where shielding ends is what defines the directionality.

I wonder, some say every cable is directional just because of the  direction copper was extruded but I do not know if this is also a situation considered by Groneberg.

I strongly recommend to take special care with digital interconnects, if they are connected inversly you can get really really strange behavior from your CD if happend to be a very sensible unit.

Cables from Groneberg specially Quattro and TS Premium are very interesting and intriguing about their development and performance, and they sound great.

[BobC]

The Groneberg diagram recommends running an interconnect between the pre and amp "G to Y".  Wierd  , mine is "Y to G" and it sounds better on my system....to my ears.  I guess the message is that people should try both ways and do what sounds best to them.
 

[yooper]

Interesting Bob. 

Are you also using TS cables from the pre to your transport or CD player?  How about speaker cables?   If not, I wonder if not having a TS "loop" causes the reason behind you experience?  Just thinking out loud here..

I do have TS cables for the entire "loop" for two channel listening, and have only connected them the way Gronbergs' website recommends, I may have to experiment a bit on my end too.

Mark

[BobC]

Yes, I'm now running TS Premiums through the entire chain: from CDP > Pre > Amps > Speakers.

You may experience something completely different.  Who knows?  Different set up, different ears.

From the other posts it looks like Klaus has had different experiences as well.

[Eduardo AAVM]

Shield, from preamp to CD goes on the preamp side.

Letters and text on cable jacket are no real part of the issue, just serve as identifiers, the important thing is at which end soldered shielding braid is.

[BobC]

Eduardo,

What about from the pre to the amp?

I currently have the end with the soldered shield wire at the pre side.

Thanks, Bob

[yooper]

Ok, I'm not smart enough to recognize which end is shielded.      Both ends of all the cables have the heat shrink attached, so I can't see anything.  Both ends (TS) look the same to me, what exactly am I looking for?

Thanks,

Mark

[Eduardo AAVM]

Ok, I'm not smart enough to recognize which end is shielded.      Both ends of all the cables have the heat shrink attached, so I can't see anything.  Both ends (TS) look the same to me, what exactly am I looking for?

Thanks,

Mark

Well for TS I think they come directly from Germany so better follow Groneberg's guidelines.

[Eduardo AAVM]

Eduardo,

What about from the pre to the amp?

I currently have the end with the soldered shield wire at the pre side.

Thanks, Bob

I think it is fine, it is the same way I have my cables connected.


For Groneberg it seems like the pre is the core of the system from where everything radiates. (amybe a impedance thing or electrical reason, I told you this is quite an interesting cable design)

Anyway these are my conclusiones but if you wish better ask Klaus, the man is the chief.


By the way do you know, if I understtod correctly, that distance is not a factor for Groneberg cables as to other brands, I have one 6 outlet power bar, nothing inside just well and heavy connectors and Groneberg QR cable, but there is one dedicated outlet to where you must plug your pre, just electrical/wave cable distance calculation, it is said the cable kind of optimises some electrical wave annomalies.

I do not know but I have friends/customers who have sold or beaten others' Kimbers (silver, hero, and other moedls), Audioquests, AudioTruths, Cardas, Monters, Oyaides, Straightwires, and a long etc. at a fraction of the price.

If you wish to know more about Groneberg here is a Groneberg section in my info center forum:

http://www.armonia-avm.com/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=13


Sorry, mainly in spanish, some german translated to english, but in the end you may get a good idea.

[djbnh]

Eduardo,

What about from the pre to the amp?

I currently have the end with the soldered shield wire at the pre side.

Thanks, Bob

See the Groneberg diagram, in my first post to this thread, or just go here.

[Sonny]

Hi there...
i think all these diagrams may be fine and informational based on the factory termination of the cables, HOWEVER ( ) I would recommend that you look at the termination of each of the cables to determine with end has the shield (the tin shield and copper center line connected), whichever end is connected should be inserted into the out (Source component) and whichever end of the IC that the tin is not connected to, should be connected to the in (Preamp)...

I only know because I have had them...and to be consistent, that's what I did...
As for speaker cables, I don't think they are directional because last time I took apart one my my groneberg cables, the tin (shield) surround was not connected to either end, only the red and black wires were connected.

Lastly, I think someone mentioned that the direction is the direction of "the way the copper was extruded", IMHO, it doesn't matter which way the copper was extruded, the signal will flow either way...I would not buy the hype of the cable only transfer signal from one end to the other and not the otherway...

my two cents
T

[BobC]

Hi there...
i think all these diagrams may be fine and informational based on the factory termination of the cables, HOWEVER ( ) I would recommend that you look at the termination of each of the cables to determine with end has the shield (the tin shield and copper center line connected), whichever end is connected should be inserted into the out (Source component) and whichever end of the IC that the tin is not connected to, should be connected to the in (Preamp)...

Or in the case of pre to amp....the tin shield end should be at the pre and the not tin shielded end should be at the amps.  Correct?

Bob

[Sonny]

Hi there...
i think all these diagrams may be fine and informational based on the factory termination of the cables, HOWEVER ( ) I would recommend that you look at the termination of each of the cables to determine with end has the shield (the tin shield and copper center line connected), whichever end is connected should be inserted into the out (Source component) and whichever end of the IC that the tin is not connected to, should be connected to the in (Preamp)...

Or in the case of pre to amp....the tin shield end should be at the pre and the not tin shielded end should be at the amps.  Correct?

Bob

Bob, that is correct, the shield should always be connected at the source end...meaning the output...
Tuan

[klaus@odyssey]

The beginning of Groneberg is always grounded on the Quattro and the TS.
This first G  in Groneberg has to be read away from the preamp.  Essentially,  you take the preamp as the primary grounding  source from which all cables reading Groneberg run to either the source, the amps, or the speakers.

Late,

Klaus

[Cactus Bob]

If floating ground, the shielding should be grounded at the source end.

[lazydays]

I've had Klaus build me a few sets of cables in the past, and he always asked me if I still want WBT connectors? But of course! I think the cable ends are more important than the basic cable itself. I've only found two or three ends that I really like; WBT, Kimber, and ZU. Would like to try Eichmans sometime.
gary