DIY Power Conditioner

ludavico · « **Reply #40 on:** 10 Dec 2004, 02:56 pm »

pjc - eBay. Mine was used, but looks brand new.

No hum, but noticeable vibration.

Different ONEACs are rated for different amp outputs.

I never did figure out the difference between different model prefixes...I have a CP1105 which I think is an older model judging from the ONEAC website.

Ta,
John

JoshK · « **Reply #41 on:** 10 Dec 2004, 03:14 pm »

Quote from: pjchappy

Where's a good place to get those OneACs? E-bay?

Josh, don't you have 2 different models of OneACs? If so, what's the difference?

p

I have one 5 amp (for digital) and one 7 amp model (for analog). I like beign way over rated for the load because I will then worry less about oversaturation, limiting dynamics, etc.

mcgsxr · « **Reply #42 on:** 10 Dec 2004, 03:22 pm »

I picked my 2 amp Oneac up on eBay for around $10, $15 shipped to Canada. I like it for my front end, but now that I have digital amps, I am hoping to find an affordable way to condition those too - perhaps a second one for those will have to happen.

Either that, or one of the more affordable power conditioning solutions emerging here...

Kevin P · « **Reply #43 on:** 10 Dec 2004, 03:38 pm »

Quote from: Occam

Kevin,

As you're a businessman with the associated legal (and moral) responsibilities, I certainly agree with your insistance on X2 rated caps. But as facilitator on this board, I'm well aware that folks are going to go ahead and use them anyway. Hence my insistance that they not be buried in a wall, and that they be mounted after a fuse.... To do otherwise on my part would be like insisting on abstinence rather than using a condom

Have you evaluated the Wima MP3 X2 caps? I know that you use the Jon Risch reccomended Mallorys, but, IMO, find the Wimas prefferable. I've only found them at Mouser in minimum order quanties of 100+, and would love to find a retail source. (I always bypass these with a .1uf 15mm LS value MP3, if I'm using >0.1uf)

...

I'm not sharp-shooting you Paul.

I'm just clarifying why I offer the parts that I offer and not others.

I have not tried the Wima's. They look interesting and according to the Wima dimensions should pop right into the PCB. Since they are line rated I wouldn't have any problems with using them.

pjchappy · « **Reply #44 on:** 10 Dec 2004, 03:51 pm »

Did you guys buy from random guys on E-Bay, or is there someone selling a bunch of these?

Would this one be good?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=86724&item=5737027483&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

Besides amp ratings, what is the difference b/w all those EBay ones?

p

mcgsxr · « **Reply #45 on:** 10 Dec 2004, 06:22 pm »

I just bought one that I watched, that few others were into, and took the chance on it - turned out fine.

The one you link to seems good to me, and with a 16 amp rating, you can run plenty of gear off it.

It does weigh a ton though, so shipping could be nasty...

sys1 · « **Reply #46 on:** 13 Dec 2004, 06:29 am »

Josh- thanks for sharing all this great info. do you have your DIY unit on line yet, and what's the sonic results?

JoshK · « **Reply #47 on:** 13 Dec 2004, 01:56 pm »

Quote from: sys1

Josh- thanks for sharing all this great info. do you have your DIY unit on line yet, and what's the sonic results?

Yes I have had it online for over a year now. I was recapping my project because of all the renewed interest in DIY PCs. I am completely willing to answer even the most trivial question about what I did so I was hoping to pique interest in DIY from some of you.

I start to abhor using all the audiophile cliches but I would definitely say there is more of a seperation in sounds, more detail in imaging due larger in part, I believe, to a blacker background and the filters doing their job of filtering out the junk that gets superimposed on the audio signal (blacker blacks).

ludavico · « **Reply #48 on:** 13 Dec 2004, 03:42 pm »

OCCAM,

You said in a previous post :

"The individual caps mounted on the outlets will not isolate the outlets from each other, they are in paralell. For isolation between outlets, you will need an additional inductive component to isolate the transformers output (where you should have a cap, also), and the outlets where you can place an additional cap....
Nevertheless, the outlets do provide a convenient place to mount caps. "

I am a little unclear: do recommed putting a single cap across each receptacle on the output side of the transfomer? If so, should these caps be upstream of the inductive components?

For example:

-->(2x0.47uF)-->ISO Tranny--> (0.47uF) ---->(JR Filter)----> DigiAmp
.......input side...........................output side

Thanks,
John

JoshK · « **Reply #49 on:** 13 Dec 2004, 04:07 pm »

I am not Occam but I think what he was saying was that you need a transformer on each outlet after the IT if you wish to isolate them from eachother, the cap won't do this unfortunately. Said another way you would need a seperate IT for each component if you wished to isolate them from eachother as well as the main line. This is a valid critic but I think the IT works well as used currently although it can get better.

Occam · « **Reply #50 on:** 13 Dec 2004, 05:51 pm »

Ludavico,

Josh is correct, as usual. Multiiple components sharing the same outlet(s) without intervening inductive filtering are not isolated from each other. But I also assume? that your Teac amps have common mode chokes between their powercord and its switching PS, which certainly is inductive filtering.
Similarly, components connected to outlets fed by JR filter which have those iron core inductors are isolated from outlets not fed by those inductors or outlets fed by a different filter.

But this is germane only insofar as those components which are generating crap and putting it into the powerline as opposed to recieving it.

Some comments on your proposed schema -

When I see those .47uf caps, I assume you intend to use those Auricaps....
While I'm not disputing their aural efficacy, wiring them accross the line without a fuse/circuitbreaker between it and the AC input is a risk you've absolutely no reason to expose yourself to. According to Josh, the OneAC's switch is actually a circuit breaker, therefore, wire those non X2 rated caps onto the Hot wire after that switch/fuse, or better yet, wait until someone comments on how the OneAc's extant caps are wired. (and here is the good side of the paralell nature of caps, all of the components plugged into the same outlets/line as the OneAC will benefit from that cap.)

[As a side note on this Auricap tweek. The Auricaps are not X2 rated, nor are they specified as far as I can discern for AC, and their rating of 600V or 1200V DC gives me minimal reassurance. They are not 'self healing' as X2 caps typically are. As an example, the Mallory 158X self healing X2 rated caps as reccomended by Jon Risch and used by Kevin P, are rated for 2700V DC! Nevertheless, I'll probably try them myself. But speaking as someone who has been blown accross rooms multiple times by AC, I will put them AFTER a fuse/breaker. To do otherwise is simply proof that Darwinism is still a powerful force in our modern society.]

I would not put a JR filter after an IT, because the JR filter has caps wired in Y configuration (Line to ground, Neutral to ground) as this can potentially cause grould loop problems if components are connected to the same outlets/AC line as the IT. Any Y caps should be at the AC line 'root'.

No one has posted how and which capacitors are wired into the OneAC, but from Josh's picture I can see that they are there, I really can't comment any further...... before you go about adding/swapping additional caps, I need to know what is already theOónow_playing=

JoshK · « **Reply #51 on:** 13 Dec 2004, 06:00 pm »

sorry I forgot to check. I will and get back to you. IIRC there is a large cap hot to ground, bypassed with a smaller cap and there is a resistor there but I cannot remember how/where it is wired.

ludavico · « **Reply #52 on:** 13 Dec 2004, 06:48 pm »

"... therefore, wire those non X2 rated caps onto the Hot wire after that switch/fuse..." -Occam

Yes, that's the plan after reading your post from a couple of days ago.

My diagram does not reflect that, but that is the plan.

Let me re-phrase last my question; even though caps across the receptacles on the output of the isolation transformer will NOT isolate components plugged into those receptacles, do you still recommed installing them for other filtering benefits?

Occam · « **Reply #53 on:** 13 Dec 2004, 07:33 pm »

Yes, as it is convenient. If there is an easier was to to this like existing solder tags, then do it that way. But screw connections are straightforward and easily reversed, especially if the outlets on that are on the OneAC, or that you plan to use, are side&back connection, which would allow you to connect the caps via different screws than the ones used to connect the power leads.

EProvenzano · « **Reply #54 on:** 19 Dec 2004, 05:14 pm »

I'm thinking of trying one of the transformer based units like a OneAC on my CDP.

What formula do you use to know how many amps are necessary to drive a certain component? I know I will need to find out how many peak watts the CDP uses, but how does that correlate to amps?

Thanks for helping a novice out

mgalusha · « **Reply #55 on:** 20 Dec 2004, 04:06 am »

Great thread. I did a little more poking around on Mouser and they have the 1.0uF Wima MP3 X2 caps in stock with a minimum quantity of 5 but they are pretty pricey at $8.46ea. Mouser

ludavico · « **Reply #56 on:** 20 Dec 2004, 03:31 pm »

I had a chance to play around with AC conditioning last weekend. This included hot-rodding the ONEAC poboy, playing with ERS cloth inside the TEAC A-L700P "mono-blocks" and hot-rodding a Wiremold power strip.

The famous Auricap mod (2x0.47 600V) was installed in the ONEAC (downstream of the circuit breaker

) and in the Wiremold.

Since it is a work in progress I won't go into all the details yet. Suffice it to say, though, that the results are pretty noticeable. Everything sounds more organic, there is significant extension in both HF and LF and the resolution now is just plain scary. (We were watching a couple of documentaries last night on the DaVinci Code and the Shroud of Turin on the National Geographic channel, and the ambient stuff (e.g. floor boards creaking, echos in some of the old churches, etc) was incredible.

Do these tweaks make the system magical? Well no, but they moved everything a big step closer.

I mean everything. I found that all that extra resolution and extension boost the fun factor big-time. I was listening to some blues right after I powered back up, and shazaam...

But here are two mysteries I uncovered along the way:

1). Input to the ONEAC (i.e. house mains) is 122.4 V, but output from the ONEAC is 126.7 V

2.) When I plug the CD player, cable box and the preamp into the ONEAC the sound goes to crap. When I just plug in just the CDplayer and cable box it is all sweetness and light again.

Can this boost in voltage from the ONEAC screw up components? Is it safe?

John

JoshK · « **Reply #57 on:** 20 Dec 2004, 04:07 pm »

Occam mentioned before that the transformers are designed in this way because when presented with a load the voltage drops a bit. So I have to ask whether you measured the voltage with or without a load?

ludavico · « **Reply #58 on:** 20 Dec 2004, 06:17 pm »

Ah...I measured that with no load.

Here are the readings with load (cable box + CD player only):

120.0V at the wall outlet, 125.4 at outlet of the ONEAC.

John

JoshK · « **Reply #59 on:** 20 Dec 2004, 06:23 pm »

Still fairly high...I have no idea.