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Indeed, that would be most interesting. Again, the result of comparing the error reports must be withheld until all of the listening reports have been collected. We have to be patient. It will be very interesting to see how the listening evaluations compare to the computer's assessment. ----Rollo,The thing about perception is that our brains are actively involved in the process. Ears are quite passive, but our brains are creative. In fact, in a very real sense (pun intended), our perceptions are our creations. What we know about what we are perceiving influences how we perceive it. It's a young and fascinating field of study. Science may be applied at many different levels. Something which rests so heavily on perception as our audio hobby cannot be properly understood without the application neurology and psychology. (please don't read anything into the above)
Rip them to WAV and do a CRC compare on the files. Would be more effective.
Moving along a continuum, I prefer the sound of a CD ripped to WAV file and played back via computer to any form of CD or CD-R playback. Bits is bits???Scotty
I would expect the CRC to match regardless when ripping a new CD as most modern rippers will make multiple passes if the first one doesn't come back clean, and then compare to the Accurate Rip database to make sure. Thus my suggestion to compare the actual error reports or logs when ripping the same CD pre and post cryo. That may show you how easily the ripper was able to extract the files.
Sounds like fun. I'd like to participate
When we audition a component or tweak in our familiar system are we listening to its affect or how it was designed ? In our hobby the sound is the only factor to be considered. The final product of all the science, research and implementation of such. If one hears a difference wether perceived or or actual it only matters to the eye of the beholder. Our ears as flawed as they are the only true avenue for evaluating any tweak. I'll leave the science to the engineers and the listening to me.
This is precisely what I like about this whole enterprise. It will demonstrate something. We who participate have the opportunity to make a blind evaluation. I am skeptical, but not closed minded. I care not how I align with the other participants, at least, not beyond simple curiosity. I do look forward to the exercise and I'll include my daughter (she has quite developed 'ears'). For obvious reasons, we'll all have to wait a while for the results - at least, I would recommend against posting a running tally of any sort during the acquisition of the data.The original post title included the term, 'decorum'. Let's have fun with this. Let's not be petty about it. We can argue about the interpretation of the data, but let's do it in a civil manner - via rational discussion. Until then, let's concentrate on devising experiments that aren't completely untenable. That should prove quite a challenge.
I haven't had a spinner in my system for several years, but an interesting adjunct to this experiment might be to take a CD, rip it and save the report, then cryo it and repeat the rip. See of the error report or confidence rating changes. No (fallible) human perception involved...
Tommy Deluxe Edition, The Who SACD.Since there are absolutely *no errors* in reading as-is; I can't wait to hear how better-than-perfect reading of pits and lands will sound.
I'll be in for the CD.It doesn't matter to me which way the results go.
Here is my hypothesis about what may be happening to the CD when we cryofry it, make of it what you will. I think the cryo process changes the reflectivity of the pits and lands on the CD. As a result the transport reads them differently. I prefer the sound of cryo treated CDs to non-treated CDs. That being said, I prefer the sound of CDs cloned to a Black Memorex CD-R over the original whether it was cryoed or not. Once again, if the information is the same on the CD-R as it is on the original CD, then something is occurring during the reading of the disc to affect the sound. Moving along a continuum, I prefer the sound of a CD ripped to WAV file and played back via computer to any form of CD or CD-R playback. Bits is bits???Scotty
Audio CD transports also use multi-sampling and have for some time. But yes, a peek at error rates would tell you if there was some significant impact on readability. Since we are entirely in the digital domain here: changes should be simple to quantify.
Dave, I would like to get in on this experiment, both cd and cables. Thanks, Mike
Ok, Dave, I was wracking my brain trying to think of an appropriate CD. How about some Pink Floyd? I never heard Division Bell.
I didn't understand that
