Review on BPT`s BP2 & BP2.5 w/Bybee

satfrat · « **on:** 6 Jun 2003, 03:52 am »

Hi folks, it`s nice to read a review on BPT`s power conditioners that echoed my first post here on Audiocircle on the subject. My only regret is that the BP2.5 w/Bybee didn`t include the other upgrades that Chris Hoff offers for his conditioners. I think Francisco Duran would have really liked the high current noise filter with 70 db of noise attenuation. The review is at http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue7/bpt2.htm . Regards, Robin

ABEX · « **Reply #1 on:** 11 Jun 2003, 12:25 am »

I read the review this morning.I initially heard about the unit after inquiring about how to work around AC fluctuations.My area's AC vary's greatly I think ,but I have to check it to be sure.

Out of all the units I have seen it looks like the most affordable I think. Exact Power also has a unit that I'd like to try ,but the cost is to far out. Even at $1400 these babies are not cheap.but I need something that will clear this problem up.

The thing that happens is it sounds like the system is sterile at times.One time it was so bad I had to wait a few hours then come back and try to play it again.Initially I thought it was the weather,but that was not it.Some people have went so far aas to say it's the phases of the moon.

There are a few inexpensive AC Test units that Radioshack sells that I can try ,but have not bought yet and I no longer have a Volt\Ohm Meter or "O" scope to test it.

I have just decided to stay here for a few more years,so I might get a dedicated line put in plus change my outlets to Cryo treated Hubbles and that might also be of help.

Do not know enough about the Bybees to know weather they are of value,but I do know I need to clear up this AC problem whatever it is.

Jay S · « **Reply #2 on:** 11 Jun 2003, 01:56 am »

ABEX,

The BPT does seem like a great value. I was going to get one but then was told by Chris Hoff that they couldn't do a 230v version. Instead, I ended up getting a Blue Circle Music Ring 1200 balanced power supply(1200 watts, 4 pairs of hospital grade outlets), which I am very happy with. What especially surprised me is how big an impact it had on my eAR Two digital amp, which has a very good built in power filter (something like -80dB noise reduction in the switching frequencies of its power supply).

Another option is the Transcendent Sound balanced power supply (800 watts, $399 assembled). Sign up for their newsletter and you can get a coupon for an extra $10 off. Bruce Rozenblit has a great reputation as an engineer/designer, and has a patent for his OTL amp design. The only drawback to his product is that it has just 1 outlet in the back. He does supply a 6 outlet extension, though. Of course, for the price you can probably afford to buy a Bolder power bar with 3 pairs of Acme silver outlets and a hard-wired NITRO power cord!

ABEX · « **Reply #3 on:** 11 Jun 2003, 02:18 am »

Jay:
Is the PowerBar a unit which will regulate the incoming AC like a Mimature powerplant.

SOme who have written me have only found the ExactPower unit and the BPT to beable to adjust power for the fluctuations not only to filter.This is really a difficult thing to accomplish I think.

One guy even tried PS Audio's and Monsters units wich did not clearup the problem I have described.

I do remember you doing a shootout or something similar to one.I guess you'd call it a comparision.

Do want to get rid of the problem and just trying to find a working solution.

Another person stated I might need an inline Variac which I know even less about.

I would go with the PowerBar which would save me a bunch of $$ or any cost effective solution which would eliminate the problem.

BTW the person who writes for a tech mag who told me about the BPT unit initially aso stated that she could not believe how much the unit helped in playback also.

What makes this really hard is the most I have paid for a piece in my system is $1K US and that was recently for my speakers. Would be hard to pay $1k+ for a fix to this problem.

satfrat · « **Reply #4 on:** 11 Jun 2003, 02:55 am »

ABEX, the BPT is a balanced power conditioner and as such will NOT clear up a flucuating AC power problem, only a power regenerator such as an ExactPower or a PS Audio will cure that. Sorry to break this to ya as I`m sure you were looking to save some money

Regards, Robin

Jay S · « **Reply #5 on:** 11 Jun 2003, 03:03 am »

ABEX,

The BPT does not adjust the incoming power, it is simply a filter that uses common mode rejection (plus some smoothing capacitors) to filter out noise in the power line. If your incoming power is too high or low the BPT will not affect that.

The ExactPower sounds more like the PS Audio Power Plant power regenerators, which take in AC, convert it to DC, then reconvert it to an AC wave with a specific voltage and frequency.

The Bolder power bar can be ordered in different levels. The basic power bar has very high quality Acme silver plated outlets and a hardwired NITRO power cord. It does not filter/condition the power but gives you very high quality connections. Add a bybee filter (or two or three) and you start to reduce the noise in the power line.

http://www.boldercables.com/Store.asp?m=TheBolderCableCompany&n=10&k=107142&s=AC+Power

Tyson compared the Bolder power bar with bybees to a BPT and thought that they had similar impact (you may want to do a search). I have not done a comparison so I can't comment.

ABEX · « **Reply #6 on:** 11 Jun 2003, 06:32 am »

Jay:
Thanks for the shrt detailed or simple explaination of what these units are doing as it does get rather confusing.

I will copy it and saved it to file for reference.

What I think I shall do first is findout exactly what is going on with the incoming AC which I think I can do by getting an AC Meter and other cheap devices from Ratshack to analyze what exactly is happening at the outlet.Then I will see what I can use .

Thx!

ABEX · « **Reply #7 on:** 11 Jun 2003, 06:57 am »

SATFRAT;
I know it might take some $$ to find the fix .There is always the used market also!
First things first,I have to find exactly what is causing the abnormal situation happening then I can better find what the solution is as I stated.

Radioshack sells an AC-Outlet Analyzer fro $5.99 that might tell me what is going on

Hopefully it will not cost alot.I will make certain I will change the outlets I have out.That should help somewhat!

Thanks for breaking the news easy to me,been a rough week already!

satfrat · « **Reply #8 on:** 11 Jun 2003, 07:16 am »

I truely do sympathize with you guy, there`s nothing worse than a fluctuating power supply, by all means check it out. I`ve been blessed myself with good power, living in rural Vermont with very little industry to screw it up. But I have heard Chris Hoff say that his balanced power conditioners will handle a certain fluctuation level with no problems. Depending on how bad it really is (or isn`t), BPT could still be your cheapest bet for what your looking for. Good luck! Regards, Robin

Jay S · « **Reply #9 on:** 11 Jun 2003, 07:22 am »

Ah, I may have an idea of what Chris is getting at. I think I read that transformers do store some energy (capacitance). Hence, the stored energy in the gtranformer of the balanced power supply can make up to some extent for drops in voltage coming in through the power grid. Anyone more knowledgeble want to chime in?

ABEX · « **Reply #10 on:** 11 Jun 2003, 07:33 am »

It really is a pain especially for dealers that have the problem.It can make a system sound BLAND for lack of a better term.

I remembert years ago I went to listen to a Counterpoint amp and the same sort of sound happened .I really do not know weather they were aware of what it was.

It can be advantageous to people buying things also.The guy that sold me my OTA Cable I think was experienceing it,but he thought it was the cable.So I got it for below half the price.It happened before I got the OTA and the OTA really makes it more apparent when the condition shows up.

As I stated once it was so bad I had to turn the system down then come back a few hours later.The soundstaging was flat and congested like there was no life and sterile.

Alot has been written about it and there have been theories all the way from the phases of the Moon to Solar flares which in some respects are valid I think.

Thanks for the responses!Have to get some shut-eye!

3:30AM on this side of the globe JAY

satfrat · « **Reply #11 on:** 11 Jun 2003, 07:39 am »

Ok, I found a thread from Chris`s forum at Discord where he says that he would only recommend a voltage regulator if the voltage was fluctuating from 125 to 110. Now that`s a pretty big spread wouldn`t you say? Regards, Robin

ABEX · « **Reply #12 on:** 11 Jun 2003, 04:24 pm »

Well I will check to see what is making this occur first and make a dicision on what might be a fix after that.

Thx!

ABEX · « **Reply #13 on:** 11 Jun 2003, 11:29 pm »

Went to Radioshack and bought an AC Voltage Monitor and an AC Outlet Analyzer.

I first pluged in the Analyzer to make certain the ground was working normally .That instrament really does not help or tell much I really did not already know,but the AC Voltage monitor was intresting becasue it will show weather the Voltage is varying and how much it is varying by.

Upon pluging the unit in I could tel the AC was not stable. That right there tells me that it is not going to give a good source for providing constant 120vAC.

Weather or not it is within the normal operating range is secondary to the importance as if it is going to be stable continuance supply of 120v.

The needle gage went to say 122v then down to 118v and varied between those points continuously.

Now that I know that I know I will need something that can work to give me a steady stream of 120Volts. If it goes up or down I want a unit that will continuously make the adjustment.

What units out there will do that is the question now?What is the Best and what is the most economical.

I also have to look at how many outlets I use and which ar ethe most important to plug into the unit.I would think that my Amps,DAC and CDP Transport would be the most critical. I use a Passive Pre-Amp so that is taken cared of.

ALot of work to do I guess!

Just thought I'd let you know what the testing units reveled.

Later,ABEX

satfrat · « **Reply #14 on:** 12 Jun 2003, 03:35 am »

ABEX, a variance of 4 volts seems like a very minor swing to me, although I really don`t know that much about it. It would seem by Chris Hoff`s past post onDiscord that his balanced pwer conditioner would handle that swing and it wouldn`t be of any concern to your equipment. As a suggestion tho, why don`t you post the problem over at the BPT forum at HarmonicDiscord and get his opinion. Couldn`t hurt. Regards, Robin

ABEX · « **Reply #15 on:** 12 Jun 2003, 03:38 am »

That was just the first indication meaning there is something going on.When the sound really gets intoleratble then I will check to see what is really happening.

The variance is not crucial ,I do realize that.

satfrat · « **Reply #16 on:** 12 Jun 2003, 03:59 am »

Just trying to be helpful, ain`t much, am I! Regards, Robin

ABEX · « **Reply #17 on:** 12 Jun 2003, 04:13 am »

You've been helpful,thx!
Anytime someone can talk about a problem it's helpful!

Have you ever begun talking to someone and because you were talking you came up with an idea or a solution to a problem ,but did not have it before you started to talk?

Speaking and talking can be therapeutic although there are times when I can or should put a sign up saying "Insert foot in mouth before openning again!"

bubba966 · « **Reply #18 on:** 12 Jun 2003, 04:22 am »

This would take care of your voltage swing.

MP AVS 2000

ABEX · « **Reply #19 on:** 12 Jun 2003, 04:54 am »

Bubba:
That looks like the ticket!Alittle pricey and I do believe I read a review somewhere about it,but that sounds like what I need.

Was just looking at the AC Volt Monitor and it is around 123v.I am waiting to see what is going on when the sound really gets bad.At the moment I can tell something is not right in the playback.

Just off hand,do you own one ?If so what are your impressions?

Thanks again!