Amp/DAC combos for HD800s

jawks · « **on:** 2 Oct 2019, 01:43 pm »

I've been researching recommended amp/DAC combos for the Sennheiser HD800s. There are plenty online, but I thought I would ask for this community's opinions. I'm looking for something that I will be able to enjoy for years without that itch to keep upgrading. Any thoughts about the following choices or are there some additional choices that you would also recommend considering?

Simaudio Moon NEO 430 HAD (with internal DAC)
Schiit Yggdrasil 2 + Ragnarok 2
Headamp GS-X mk2 - would need additional DAC

Thanks!

Tyson · « **Reply #1 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 02:32 pm »

I'm a big fan of the iFi iCan Pro. It's hugely flexible, gets the tone right (which is very rare), and has enough guts to drive the HD800s into submission

And it's a perfect match for the iDSD Pro from iFi which is a great DAC on it's own, but also has great synergy with the iCan Pro.

jawks · « **Reply #2 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 02:44 pm »

Quote from: Tyson on 2 Oct 2019, 02:32 pm

I'm a big fan of the iFi iCan Pro. It's hugely flexible, gets the tone right (which is very rare), and has enough guts to drive the HD800s into submission

And it's a perfect match for the iDSD Pro from iFi which is a great DAC on it's own, but also has great synergy with the iCan Pro.

Thanks for the suggestion! I hadn't seriously considered it before but have added it to my shortlist. Do you have both the iFi iCan Pro and iDSD Pro in your system?

Freo-1 · « **Reply #3 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 02:58 pm »

I would look at the Oppo headphone amp. It gets rave reviews, and should last a long time.

jawks · « **Reply #4 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 02:58 pm »

I see that the iDSD Pro DAC has its own headphone amp. Does anyone know if the amp of the iDSD Pro is comparable to the standalone amp iFi iCan Pro?

Tyson · « **Reply #5 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 03:00 pm »

I have the iDSD Pro in my main system downstairs but not the iCan. My friend Jason (Pez here on AC) has both.

Even in stock format, they are excellent sounding units. But performance on both of them can be boosted significantly by getting a linear power supply to drive them. I found an excellent R Core based linear power supply on Ebay that elevates both of these units from "good for the $$" to "among the best regardless of $$".

What I like most is their flexibility. If you want some tube warmth on some recordings, flip the tube switch. If you want Solid Stage clarity and slam, flip the solid state switch. Plus upsampling/filters/etc, the ability to fine tune the sound to your own preferences is incredible.

Tyson · « **Reply #6 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 03:27 pm »

Quote from: jawks on 2 Oct 2019, 02:58 pm

I see that the iDSD Pro DAC has its own headphone amp. Does anyone know if the amp of the iDSD Pro is comparable to the standalone amp iFi iCan Pro?

Headphone jack in the iDSD Pro is good, but the iCan Pro is great.

adydula · « **Reply #7 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 03:39 pm »

There is a very good pairing with most high impedance headphones with Bottlehead's Crack and Mainline.

I have both as well as 9 other SS amps.

I do not have the HD800's but do have the HD 600's which are similar in sound signature....except for the soundstage etc..

But the pairing with Bottleheads amps is legandary....

The Schitt stack you mention is good as well, but I would look at the Vahalla 2 as well for the HD's.

Most any modern day amp will drive these well, and we all have favorites for sure...

Good luck!
Alex

jawks · « **Reply #8 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 03:44 pm »

Thanks, Alex! I hadn't considered the Bottlehead amps - looks like those are DIY?

adydula · « **Reply #9 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 04:02 pm »

Yes they are....well designed and not that hard to build.

The other amps that do very well with the HD800's in tube format are:

WooAudio WA6-SE- 2nd Gen, Feliks Elise, Darkvoice 336SE, Schitt Vahalla 2, Schitt Mjolnir.

Good choice for SS IMO are: Schitt Ragnarok, Schitt Asgard, Burson FUN, Monoilth by Monoprice THX AAA or the Massdrop THX AAA 789.

With my 600's the pairing on the Bottlehead Crack with their constant current mod is nothing short of magical with Senn's.
But you have to build it or buy one.

I find the SS amps IMO prvide a very sharp crisp clean presenation....which may be a bit much with the 800's...but its about personal taste...

Its harder to find all these at a dealer to audition...

If I had a choice of a good tube amp for these AND didnt want DIY I would look at the Woo Audio or Felks...

Good Luck!
Alex

Note: With the Burson FUN you can easily swap out op amps! I am listening with the clears right now and have 4 different op amps I pop in and out depending on what cans I am using ATM.

jawks · « **Reply #10 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 04:07 pm »

I have a Decware CSP2 tube headphone amp that I bought at a good price about 4-5 years ago. It hasn't gotten as much use as I would've liked with my previous headphones (I use it mostly with my vinyl rig), but I will be interested to try the HD800s with this amp for starters. With this in mind, my next amp purchase will probably be a SS amp.

adydula · « **Reply #11 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 04:49 pm »

So what was your experience with the Decware CSP2 and headphones?

Alex

Note I found this: Sounds like an excellent headphone amp.

The CSP2 is a truly excellent headphone amp. In fact, of the tube headphone amps I had at the time of the review, the CSP2 is better than the WA3, the Ming Da 84-C 07, and the TNS Sweet 2. I felt the Darkvoice 337 and SP Extreme were a little more to my personal liking, but only VERY slightly, and the CSP2 is available from a USA maker who is very, very responsive to customers, so it deserves strong consideration in its price range. Color me impressed. In fact, I was so impressed, I bought the review sample, and have been using it happily ever since. I can enthusiastically recommend the CSP2.

jawks · « **Reply #12 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 05:18 pm »

Funny you should mention that ... I also just read that while looking into amp comparisons! Makes me think that I ought to really give the CSP2 a chance with the HD800S before deciding what to get next.

As I mentioned, I've been almost exclusively using the CSP2 to listen to my vinyl setup, which is also all tube-based. It hasn't gotten as much use, mainly because 1) when I listen to vinyl, I typically listen via speakers, and 2) most of my headphone listening is with digital via m laptop or portable audio player. I haven't taken the time to mate the digital sources with the CSP2, but I will be doing so when the HD800S arrives. My impressions thus far of the CSP2 have been very positive. I have not done much tube rolling, to be honest.

adydula · « **Reply #13 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 05:33 pm »

If you want a really good SS amp just to try it out...you can get a Schitt Magni 3 for $99 new and $79 B-Stock!

I am sitting here waiting on Fedex to deliver one!! :>)

I have two SS amps, DIY that are about the best I have ever heard....the FUN amps come really close...

I will let u know how I like this Magni 3 compared to them..

Oh! What is your budget and I notice your looking for a dac as well??

Alex

Note: From a HD800s and Magni 3 owner.

I drive my HD800S with Magni 3 at 9 o'clock on low gain. Barely have to move the volume control off zero. Magni has plenty of power. If you read what Jason Stoddard said today in his forum there is a very subtle comment which is simply that Magni 3 and Vidar enjoy his new advanced circuitry and Jot does not. Think about that. Magni 3 has no sound signature as such. It's neutral. I don't hear it as warm as do some. I think that's the absence of noise, grit and unpleasant sounds that comes across as warm. It's smooth but detailed. Whatever the 2 cans sound like is what you will hear, Magni 3 won't get in the way. Some say the HD800S is abrasively bright. I'm 75 so I don't hear sibilance anyway anymore. Just love Magni 3 and the HD800S. Don't own the LCD .2.2 so no comment there.

jawks · « **Reply #14 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 06:07 pm »

Yes, please do let me know how you like the Magni! That's an amazing price. I know that Schiit is big on value. I owned a Lyr for a couple of months before I upgraded to the CSP2.

I am looking for both a DAC and SS amp. I'm not sure what the community feels on this issue, but I question whether it is better to get a separate DAC and headphone amp vs a combo unit. Part of me thinks that the units perform better as separates (ie, a standalone headphone amp sounds better than a headphone amp that happens to be included in a DAC), but I have no scientific basis for that argument. I know that there are combo units (like the Simaudio Moon 430HAD) that apparently do both very well.

I haven't quite decided on budget. I think I'm willing to put in the extra dough now to get something that will last at least 5 years or so, but the technology seems to evolve so rapidly that I wonder if I will already have the itch to upgrade in 1-2 years. I'll probably be on the lookout for used but near mint gear this time around unless I can get a new model for a reasonable price online or from a dealer.

adydula · « **Reply #15 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 09:07 pm »

Listening to the Magni 3 right now..

Its B-stock, looks brand new, clean no noticeable blemishs at all.

Its so dang cute!!

The best built head amp I have ever seen for $100 new...and in my case $79!

It really sounds GREAT.

Very neutral with a slight, very slight warmth to me, it measures FLAT as anything...

Makes me want to get the matching MODI 3 Multibit dac...and the LOKI equalizer.

Its very clean sounding...no tubey sound hear at all.

I will do a write up in a few days....so far HIGHLY RECOMMENDED.

Alex

Note: I have had several Schitt products as well, the original ASGARD, LYR, Vahalla 2 and their BIFROST MB Dac with a yet to be released Unison USB interface card. (Thanks to Schitt!).

jawks · « **Reply #16 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 09:21 pm »

Fantastic! Glad to hear that you are enjoying your Schiit Magni 3! I look forward to reading your review!

adydula · « **Reply #17 on:** 2 Oct 2019, 11:42 pm »

I havent heard these but have the Schitt Bifrost Multibit and swear by it.....but this IMO is a great stack for most any headphone:

From Jason Stoddard:

"And I live by my beliefs that our products sound different, as well. My "main stack" is Mjolnir 2/Gungnir Multibit, not Ragnarok/Yggdrasil. Mjolnir 2 is a warmer, wetter, "happier" amp than Ragnarok, and Gungnir Multibit is also a bit more euphonic than Yggy. The combo may not be the absolute ultimate word in resolution and transparency, but I like the way it sounds better than our top stack."

Read more at https://www.audiostream.com/content/subjectivistobjectivist-synthesis-jason-stoddard#J4OeFV4UX8OwhdO3.99

Alex

jawks · « **Reply #18 on:** 3 Oct 2019, 12:24 am »

Thanks for sharing that, Alex. What an interesting essay about subjectivity vs objectivity! I do find it very interesting that Stoddard prefers the sound of the Mjolnir 2/Gungnir Multibit rather than the Ragnarok/Yggdrasil! I wonder what headphones he uses with that setup.

adydula · « **Reply #19 on:** 3 Oct 2019, 10:57 am »

I can not stress this enough....just because it costs more or is a TOTL product will it mean that you as a human being with ears will enjoy it more than something "technically" lesser or lower in cost.

Our brains and the way we hear and likes and dislikes come into the picture...

I could take this $99 Schitt Magni 3 and put it into a solid 1/4 aluminum billet enclosure weighing 5 lbs and folks would oogle over the build and most likely its "sonic" qualitites!

...at least this is my opinion!!

Got up early and am listening with the little Magni 3 with 600 ohm T1's....wonderful pairing....the amp is a real surprise so far.

Good Morning!
Alex