AudioCircle
Other Stuff => Archived Manufacturer Circles => AV123 => Topic started by: KCI-JohnP on 22 Feb 2007, 06:09 pm
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I just put my name on the list the other day and was curious as to how things are progressing. Any links to some good photos of finished product? Thanks for the help.
J
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Go to www.av123.com (http://www.av123.com) and do a search. You should find some info in their forums, including pictures of the cabinets. As of now, there are no any finished products, so you won't find any pictures of them.
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I just got in the second set of LS-6 cabinets two days ago for me to approve. They look great! There are a couple of minor details that I picked them on that will be easy to implement, but they got a "GO" from me on these. Production will begin shortly.
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Hopefully the same situation on the LS9's :thumb:
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They're next. :thumb:
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Any updates on the LS6 Danny? I think you replied to Joker about a month ago saying they were going into production soon. I'd love to make a pre-order, but my wife is very picky about aeshetics (she's an art director), so I'm hoping to see a picture of the finished (or near finished) product soon?
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Kits are in stock and ready to ship, and several already have.
AV123 will have finished production units available soon. I think they are just now receiving drivers and are awaiting crossovers and ports. I don't know a date that they will be landing in the US.
The last pair of enclosures that arrived here looked really good. I'll try to get them finished out as soon as I can and get pictures up on them.
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Thanks Danny. Can't wait to see 'em!
In terms of sound quality, how would you say these (the LS6, in particular) compare to some of your other designs, such as the OM-7? I was also interested in the Strat Mini, but my wife shot that down instantly for aesthetic reasons. But I'd appreciate any thoughts and/or comparisons.
I'm also pondering various VMPS models such as the RM30, and would appreciate any comparison thoughts you'd have in regards to these models as well.
I highly respect your work, so any insights are greatly appreciated!
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In terms of sound quality, how would you say these (the LS6, in particular) compare to some of your other designs, such as the OM-7?
See this thread: http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=34105.0
I'm also pondering various VMPS models such as the RM30, and would appreciate any comparison thoughts you'd have in regards to these models as well.
I don't think there is much to compare. No comments on those.
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Oh, NOW you've piqued my interest!
Is that a "not much to compare" as in: "I'd rather not comment on another designer's work," or is it more like, "they're in a totally different league." :green:
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I meant that I would rather not make those comparisons, but you can take it any way you like.
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Ok, that's fair... kind of. :green:
I'll look forward to seeing the final cabinet shots.
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Hey Danny... just thought of another question about the LS-6 that you would be the best one to ask. What kinds of components did you go with for the crossovers in these units? Are the ones in your kits any different than the ones AV123 will be offering? I'm guessing in the AV123 units they won't be able to access once the speaker is built, so I'm hoping it's high quality stuff... just haven't seen much posted about that yet (though I may have missed it).
Thanks again!
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What kinds of components did you go with for the crossovers in these units?
Alpha Core foil inductors, Sonicaps, and Mills resistors.
Are the ones in your kits any different than the ones AV123 will be offering?
From AV123 you get air core, wire wound, OFC inductors, Erse poly caps, some Sonicaps, and Mills resistors.
I'm guessing in the AV123 units they won't be able to access once the speaker is built,
They will actually be very easy to get to as they have a bass management system that can be accessed easily and adjusted.
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...ask and ye shall receive (LS9 good news)
http://av123forum.com/showthread.php?t=20004 (http://av123forum.com/showthread.php?t=20004)
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won't be too long now..... :rock: :rock: :rock: :hyper: :hyper: :hyper: :drums: :drums: :drums:
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Nice!
The "looks like a whole tree hollowed out" comment was so true... can't say I've got the space for that one, but LS-6s... :drool:
And thanks for the reply Danny. Sounds like decent quality components all-around (not that I'd expect any less from you guys!) :thumb:
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What kinds of components did you go with for the crossovers in these units?
Alpha Core foil inductors, Sonicaps, and Mills resistors.
Are the ones in your kits any different than the ones AV123 will be offering?
From AV123 you get air core, wire wound, OFC inductors, Erse poly caps, some Sonicaps, and Mills resistors.
Danny
The parts quality in the stock XO is pretty darn good...better than I anticipated (nicely done MLS!!! :thumb:). Have you assembled/heard a stock crossover? If you have, could you comment on the differences in SQ. Do you know how the cabinet will be stuffed/dampened?
Thanks
Liv
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Yeah, I'd be curious to know these details too...
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Have you assembled/heard a stock crossover? If you have, could you comment on the differences in SQ.
No, but I use these components all the time. How it will sound is no mystery. These are basically the same components that go out in our basic kits minus the foil inductors. It is good quality components and will sound great.
Do you know how the cabinet will be stuffed/dampened?
I do not know.
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WooHoo! Mark is trying to post new LS-9 pics on the AV123 Forum, but the hack problem is killing the pictures. I'm patiently :drool:
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Our digital amp shootout (14 of the suckers!) used LS6's as our reference speaker. We included a mini review by the owner of them, who is one of our writers.
There are also pics. Art also talks about the other "competing" speakers he has compared them to. Stereomojo.com.
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How does this look? LS-9 in Satin - Natural - Mojo veneer, unfinished at this point
(http://av123forum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=9568&stc=1&d=1175531159)
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Kits are in stock and ready to ship, and several already have.
AV123 will have finished production units available soon. I think they are just now receiving drivers and are awaiting crossovers and ports. I don't know a date that they will be landing in the US.
The last pair of enclosures that arrived here looked really good. I'll try to get them finished out as soon as I can and get pictures up on them.
Hey Danny, any update on these? Really curious to see what the finished product looks like.
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Kits are in stock and ready to ship, and several already have.
AV123 will have finished production units available soon. I think they are just now receiving drivers and are awaiting crossovers and ports. I don't know a date that they will be landing in the US.
The last pair of enclosures that arrived here looked really good. I'll try to get them finished out as soon as I can and get pictures up on them.
Hey Danny, any update on these? Really curious to see what the finished product looks like.
Most of the recent updates are on this AV123 thread http://av123forum.com/showthread.php?t=20203 (http://av123forum.com/showthread.php?t=20203)
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Kits are in stock and ready to ship, and several already have.
AV123 will have finished production units available soon. I think they are just now receiving drivers and are awaiting crossovers and ports. I don't know a date that they will be landing in the US.
The last pair of enclosures that arrived here looked really good. I'll try to get them finished out as soon as I can and get pictures up on them.
Hey Danny, any update on these? Really curious to see what the finished product looks like.
Most of the recent updates are on this AV123 thread http://av123forum.com/showthread.php?t=20203 (http://av123forum.com/showthread.php?t=20203)
Correct. But since Danny said he already has cabinet kits ready to go, I'm thinking we might see a finished version out of him before AV123. Granted, they might be slightly different, but I'm looking to see a finished product shot, so I'll take what I can get (Sean told me AV123 is still waiting on parts).
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Kits are in stock and ready to ship, and several already have.
AV123 will have finished production units available soon. I think they are just now receiving drivers and are awaiting crossovers and ports. I don't know a date that they will be landing in the US.
The last pair of enclosures that arrived here looked really good. I'll try to get them finished out as soon as I can and get pictures up on them.
Hey Danny, any update on these? Really curious to see what the finished product looks like.
Most of the recent updates are on this AV123 thread http://av123forum.com/showthread.php?t=20203 (http://av123forum.com/showthread.php?t=20203)
Correct. But since Danny said he already has cabinet kits ready to go, I'm thinking we might see a finished version out of him before AV123. Granted, they might be slightly different, but I'm looking to see a finished product shot, so I'll take what I can get (Sean told me AV123 is still waiting on parts).
Sorry, I assumed when you said "finished product"....
Hopefully one of the early adopter kit builders has something really cool to show us :thumb:
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Yeah, that's what I'm hoping for. :green:
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It's the LS-6 kits that are available.
I am still awaiting those LS-9 boxes to get here so that I can assemble them and design a crossover for them. I really don't have time to build test boxes for them. So I am hanging in there waiting on these to arrive.
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It's the LS-6 kits that are available.
I am still awaiting those LS-9 boxes to get here so that I can assemble them and design a crossover for them. I really don't have time to build test boxes for them. So I am hanging in there waiting on these to arrive.
And it's the LS-6 that I'd most like to see, as it's the only one that will fit in my living room! :green:
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I have a pair of LS-6's going to gether now. Pictures will be available soon and I'll get all the info up on the web site.
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I have a pair of LS-6's going to gether now. Pictures will be available soon and I'll get all the info up on the web site.
Are these DIY/kits or the MLS sourced cabinets?
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The cabinets that I have are from MLS, but I will not be offering cabinets nor will AV123.
I will be offering kits only.
AV123 will be offering them fully assembled only.
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Cool! So your's, the ones you are putting together now, should look just like the production ones from MLS. Can't wait to see it!
Gary
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I think the production units will have a better looking base than this pair has, but other than that they will look the same. Of coarse they may offer several different veneers and finish options.
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I think the production units will have a better looking base than this pair has, but other than that they will look the same. Of coarse they may offer several different veneers and finish options.
Yeah, the MLS/AV123 ones will have a new type of base that's just been posted on the AV123 forums. It's sort of an "X" shape. Pretty nice. But none of us have seen the cabinet in its new, slimmer front-baffel design with actual drivers in place, hence my curiosity. :D
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So do we have a release date yet?
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Whoa, forgot all about this thread and now it's four pages long! And still no release date. I emailed 123 but got a "If I told ya I'd have to kill ya" type response.:duh: Well I guess we'll all have to be patient, they'll be out someday and until then I'll just play with my new Cary SLP that should be here on Monday!!!
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Danny did say that he has the LS-9 cabinets from Cali and he is working on the XO's. :D
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I dunno, but I am getting frikin sick and tired of this wait :duh:
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I dunno, but I am getting frikin sick and tired of this wait :duh:
I'm actually enjoying it - it's kind of like anticipating opening a present or waiting for a meal at a fine restaurant. Then again, I'm still working on a place to put them...
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I can understand though if we did not tell you of their existance until one week before shipping you would not feel the 'wait' but it still would be there... :)
I dunno, but I am getting frikin sick and tired of this wait :duh:
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I'm pretty excited about them, can't wait to hear what some of the first to receive them have to say. I do wish they would be a little more upfront with the people whom have given them their credit card numbers though... :scratch: I just keep telling myself, to be patient Grasshopper!!
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Can you let me know exactly what you are looking for?
Thanks!
Sean
I do wish they would be a little more upfront with the people whom have given them their credit card numbers though... :scratch:
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Hi Sean,
I would like a little more information than I last got. This was the reply I received when I inquired(back in May) about a possible ship date or any news on the progress of the new LS9's:
Thanks for your message and concern. I can't reveal any new info at this time, but do know they are actively being worked on.
That's it. I think I, and many others would just like a little more information on how things are coming along but most importantly a general idea of when they can start expecting these babies. I feel that if your customers had a general idea of when they could expect these to start shipping some wouldn't feel so frustrated ie; I dunno, but I am getting frikin sick and tired of this wait
. Please don't misunderstand me, I'm not angry or any such thing, I just would like to have a general idea of when I can plan to pay for as well as try and convince my wife that "Honey, those 80 inch speakers have always been there"!! Thank you for your prompt reply.
Sincerely,
John
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Joker,
Certainly we would not keep the information to ourselves if we had something to report and it made sense...
One big problem with what you (I'm not picking on you, there are lots asking the same thing :)) are asking for is that things change. A release date is impossible to predict; think of all the things that go into a speaker...
Each pair of LS9's has 24 woofers, 18 tweeters, 24 ports assemblies (which consists of three separate parts each), four binding posts, two main networks with Sonicap bypass caps shipped to Erse to install on their boards, two daughter board networks for the bass management system, lots and lots of wood, two bases, eight spike/insert/floor protector combos, a whole lotta screws, gaskets, special fancy screws for the bass management system access door, special plaque for the back of the speaker, paint, veneer, stain and wiring. To build one or two pairs of speakers is easy but we need to be able to build hundreds of exact replicas of the gold sample.
Now I can take the date I expect all of those items to be in the factory (I can't stock a years supply of much of that stuff just waiting to be used, it has to arrive JIT (just in time) but what if even one vendor does not deliver when they say they will? Remember that most of the LS speaker components are custom built just for these speakers. Most vendors specify 30-45 days or 60-90 or 90-120 days for their particular component. If even one vendor does not deliver, that date I gave you is shot. What if two slip behind? I'm in real trouble now. I have hundreds of emails in my inbox asking why we are late. You can see the vicious cycle...
I tell you what you want to know but if I am wrong (and I will be; at least one vendor will be later than expected - we're humans and it happens), I get yelled at by throngs of customers. If I don't tell you, I get tons of emails asking for updates, why won't you tell me, etc. I definitely understand these emails and why I get them. I don't want anyone to think that we are not grateful for our loyal customers. We certainly are! There are just realities of manufacturing (and at this scale) that most people do not understand - any why would they? They don't run speaker companies and factories.
So, now one or two vendors are late... but wait... I had the factory time scheduled (as I build 200 other SKU's in the same factory I have to schedule out what machines will be used on what day for what item) and the containers lined up for this specific date. Now what...? I have to re-schedule everything to fit it in. That date just changed again.
You can see that in the end, a more ambiguous answer is all I can do...
On the other hand...
We as a company do recognize the position we have put ourselves in. We love to talk about the new stuff in the works. We get valuable customer feedback on designs in process and we are agile so we can and do make changes based on that feedback. But when we have to get quiet during the real working months of bringing a product to light...well, you know what happens :)
Because of this, we are looking at going to a subscription based information delivery model. Mark (pres of AV123) is still working out the details but in general, we will no longer post tons of info out in the public. We might announce that work has started on the Line Source Center speaker and will note no release date etc. but if you want updates on the progress, you have to sign up to the update service. It will be email based and free. Again, details are still being worked out...
Thanks Joker.
Sean
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BTW - I am on the list to get a pair of LS6's so I want those speakers done as badly as anyone else :)
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Hi Sean,
Thank you for your reply, much appreciated. I sure hope I didn't cause the new "subscription based information delivery model" to be implemented! I was just trying to get an idea as I don't even know if it's this year! Kind of hard to plan around that but I guess I'll just be patient and keep waiting. Hopefully the people that have commited to buy a pair will automaticaly be placed on that email list. Thanks again for your help Sean.
Regards,
John
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John,
It certainly was not you :)
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Hopefully the people that have commited to buy a pair will automaticaly be placed on that email list.
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They will not - as then we would be spammers ;) They will have the option of course...
Also, anyone that has paid for their speakers is entitled to cancel and get a refund... it's only fair...
Thanks,
Sean
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Thanks for the very informative post, Sean! Makes perfect sense when you explain it like that, and I had no idea just how new products come to be. We'll all just have to keep our eyes peeled. :)
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Sean,
Cool, glad I didn't cause a "problem". I'm really excited about the LS series of speakers and can't wait to see these beasts. So is the email list available to sign up for yet as I'm ready to sign up. :thumb: Thank you.
Regards,
John
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There are just realities of manufacturing (and at this scale) that most people do not understand - any why would they? They don't run speaker companies and factories.
Sean, I used to work in sales at Altec Lansing (back when they still made home loudspeakers), and I can verify every word of what you just said. We even had our own driver assembly plants in the far east, and we STILL ran into production issues! I used to handle some pretty big retail accounts, so you can imagine the "fun" of not just having to respond to individual consumers when things went wrong, but to big corporate types with sales and production schedules of their own!
Anyway brother, I feel your pain. Still can't wait for my LS-6s though! :lol:
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SEAN,
IN YOUR OPINION, WHICH SPEAKERS ARE BETTER, THE LS9, OR THE ARNIE NUDELL? EMAIL ME WITH YOUR OPINION, OR ANSWER HERE, I MAY WANNA CHANGE.
STEVE
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Sean,
Forgive me if this has been stated elsewhere but are there going to be upgrade options on types of wood finish on the LS-9's? Thanks for your time.
John
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SEAN,
IN YOUR OPINION, WHICH SPEAKERS ARE BETTER, THE LS9, OR THE ARNIE NUDELL? EMAIL ME WITH YOUR OPINION, OR ANSWER HERE, I MAY WANNA CHANGE.
STEVE
According to the posts over at the AV123 forum, Mark has said the two won't compare.
Mark feels that the RSL II (Arnie speaker) will be a statement type speaker.
George
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I sincerely appreciate your support! :D
Sean
Sean, I used to work in sales at Altec Lansing (back when they still made home loudspeakers), and I can verify every word of what you just said. We even had our own driver assembly plants in the far east, and we STILL ran into production issues! I used to handle some pretty big retail accounts, so you can imagine the "fun" of not just having to respond to individual consumers when things went wrong, but to big corporate types with sales and production schedules of their own!
Anyway brother, I feel your pain. Still can't wait for my LS-6s though! :lol:
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Steve,
I've only seen the mules for the RSLII; not heard anything yet.
That said, the RSLII's are ~3-4x the price of the LS6 :)
Sean
SEAN,
IN YOUR OPINION, WHICH SPEAKERS ARE BETTER, THE LS9, OR THE ARNIE NUDELL? EMAIL ME WITH YOUR OPINION, OR ANSWER HERE, I MAY WANNA CHANGE.
STEVE
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John,
No upgrade options; just stellar stuff for the base price :)
Here is what has been agreed upon as of this writing. Please note we may alter this as Mark is working on some new finishes right now (as in today)...
Palisander Natural Satin (think Rosewood without a stain so it's not red but browner)
Palisander Rosa Satin (same as above but with a red tinted stain; closest match to the rosewood as seen on our Rocket line)
Mojo de Rosa (new finish, lighter in color. I don't have any good photos to show you of this yet)
Piano Black - special edition; limited run only; all speakers that are planned to be produced are already sold; could build more in the future but no plans yet)
Piano Rosewood - special edition; limited run only; all speakers that are planned to be produced are already sold; could build more in the future but no plans yet)
Thanks!
Sean
Sean,
Forgive me if this has been stated elsewhere but are there going to be upgrade options on types of wood finish on the LS-9's? Thanks for your time.
John
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John,
No upgrade options; just stellar stuff for the base price :)
Here is what has been agreed upon as of this writing. Please note we may alter this as Mark is working on some new finishes right now (as in today)...
Palisander Natural Satin (think Rosewood without a stain so it's not red but browner)
Palisander Rosa Satin (same as above but with a red tinted stain; closest match to the rosewood as seen on our Rocket line)
Mojo de Rosa (new finish, lighter in color. I don't have any good photos to show you of this yet)
Piano Black - special edition; limited run only; all speakers that are planned to be produced are already sold; could build more in the future but no plans yet)
Piano Rosewood - special edition; limited run only; all speakers that are planned to be produced are already sold; could build more in the future but no plans yet)
Thanks!
Sean
Hey Sean,
Are we going to get a royalty on the "Mojo de rosa" finish??? hehe
And how is my order on those piano black LS6's coming? Just kidding. I know I have to wait in line like everyone else. Can't wait!
James Darby
Publisher - Stereomojo.com
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Joker,
Certainly we would not keep the information to ourselves if we had something to report and it made sense...
One big problem with what you (I'm not picking on you, there are lots asking the same thing :)) are asking for is that things change. A release date is impossible to predict; think of all the things that go into a speaker...
Each pair of LS9's has 24 woofers, 18 tweeters, 24 ports assemblies (which consists of three separate parts each), four binding posts, two main networks with Sonicap bypass caps shipped to Erse to install on their boards, two daughter board networks for the bass management system, lots and lots of wood, two bases, eight spike/insert/floor protector combos, a whole lotta screws, gaskets, special fancy screws for the bass management system access door, special plaque for the back of the speaker, paint, veneer, stain and wiring. To build one or two pairs of speakers is easy but we need to be able to build hundreds of exact replicas of the gold sample.
Now I can take the date I expect all of those items to be in the factory (I can't stock a years supply of much of that stuff just waiting to be used, it has to arrive JIT (just in time) but what if even one vendor does not deliver when they say they will? Remember that most of the LS speaker components are custom built just for these speakers. Most vendors specify 30-45 days or 60-90 or 90-120 days for their particular component. If even one vendor does not deliver, that date I gave you is shot. What if two slip behind? I'm in real trouble now. I have hundreds of emails in my inbox asking why we are late. You can see the vicious cycle...
I tell you what you want to know but if I am wrong (and I will be; at least one vendor will be later than expected - we're humans and it happens), I get yelled at by throngs of customers. If I don't tell you, I get tons of emails asking for updates, why won't you tell me, etc. I definitely understand these emails and why I get them. I don't want anyone to think that we are not grateful for our loyal customers. We certainly are! There are just realities of manufacturing (and at this scale) that most people do not understand - any why would they? They don't run speaker companies and factories.
So, now one or two vendors are late... but wait... I had the factory time scheduled (as I build 200 other SKU's in the same factory I have to schedule out what machines will be used on what day for what item) and the containers lined up for this specific date. Now what...? I have to re-schedule everything to fit it in. That date just changed again.
You can see that in the end, a more ambiguous answer is all I can do...
On the other hand...
We as a company do recognize the position we have put ourselves in. We love to talk about the new stuff in the works. We get valuable customer feedback on designs in process and we are agile so we can and do make changes based on that feedback. But when we have to get quiet during the real working months of bringing a product to light...well, you know what happens :)
Because of this, we are looking at going to a subscription based information delivery model. Mark (pres of AV123) is still working out the details but in general, we will no longer post tons of info out in the public. We might announce that work has started on the Line Source Center speaker and will note no release date etc. but if you want updates on the progress, you have to sign up to the update service. It will be email based and free. Again, details are still being worked out...
Thanks Joker.
Sean
Guys,
I can easily verify what Sean has said about parts contractors and delays. It is actaully very seldom when a manufacturer somes through on initial projected dates. There are ALWAYS delays. I am on the list for a pair of LS6's, too. I am as anxious as anyone, but I surely understand the issues. I know Sean and Mark are doing their very best for ALL their customers. In fact, I know that I get kicked to the back of the line because their other customers come FIRST - no special jump aheads for press people. I think that says tons about AV123's integrity.
Just my 2 cents.
James Darby
Publisher _stereomojo.com
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Thanks for the post James! I appreciate all the support I'm getting here :D
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Sean,
I don't want you to feel like I was attacking you nor AV123 as that was not my intention at all, I'm just excited about these speakers(and who isn't!) and was just looking for a general idea of when they might be released. Though I have to admit the response I got from the sales person did irk me a little bit, no biggie though, I'll live.
As for the color choices, I feel like a fool as I don't remember which one I chose when I placed my order!! :oops: Anyway to find that info out? Thank you.
Best Regards,
John
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John,
I/we never felt attacked... no worries :)
Though I have to admit the response I got from the sales person did irk me a little bit, no biggie though, I'll live.
May I ask what we should have said (knowing what you do from my previous posts in this thread)?
As for the color choices, I feel like a fool as I don't remember which one I chose when I placed my order!! Anyway to find that info out?
I can only guess as to who you are but if I am right, you ordered Rosewood... :)
Thanks!
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You have a pm Sean. Thank you!
John
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LS 6/9 waiters ,
Looks like Adire Audio has gone out of business . No wonder the huge delay in these LS6/9 speakers . I've waited all this time for discontinued drivers ? Or should I say discontinued company ??
"Adire Audio is closing its doors, now that the owners, employees, and management have decided to go their separate ways."
http://www.adireaudio.com/
Tberd
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Tberd,
Adire has nothing to do with the LS-6 or LS-9 production.
The woofers do use the XBL^ motor structure designed by Dan Wiggins but Adire does not produce the drivers.
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Looks like Adire Audio has gone out of business . No wonder the huge delay in these LS6/9 speakers . I've waited all this time for discontinued drivers ? Or should I say discontinued company ??
Tberd,
Easy there Big Fella, I don't believe that Adire has anything to do with the LS6/9's at all and I'd bet my shorts that AV123 is not a "discontinued company". I'm as impatient as the next guy but hang in there, if your on the list you will get your speakers.
John
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Pictures of the LS-9 prototype at Danny's on the AV123 Forum.
http://av123forum.com/showthread.php?t=22486&page=3 (http://av123forum.com/showthread.php?t=22486&page=3)
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BUMP
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Kits for both the LS-6 and LS-9 are now available and have been shipping.
Completed LS-6's from AV123 will be available shortly. LS-9's might be another month behind.