AudioCircle
Other Stuff => Archived Manufacturer Circles => Abbingdon Music Research / iFi => Topic started by: whell on 3 Nov 2021, 08:41 pm
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Now that the Stream has been "out in the wild" for a while, can anyone offer some real-world user feedback? Sound quality? Ease of use? Software interface (which sounds like it was, maybe still is a sore spot for some)? Any other strong attributes or nits to pick with the product?
Thanks!
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Although I look forward to impressions of others, this vid might be of help how ZEN Stream operates:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r7RMblioXuY
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Bumping this for visibility. Really interested in any real-world feedback on this product.
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From reading other forums, the software needs tweaking B4 it's ready for prime time.
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I picked one up in late November and I've had at least 3 firmware updates...so Ifi is definitely focused on this product.
Mine has been perfect. The only issues I've had I think are more related to Tidal than to the device itself.
Every now and then I have some momentary trouble between my phone, my wifi, tidal and tidal connect and the zen stream itself....but I really don't think it's been an issue with the streamer. I'm using the wifi connection for now...it's 99% great. I do plan on hard connecting it to my router at some point the future...and getting the better power supply for the streamer too.
I'm currently feeding an old tube buffered DAC from the late '90s. (CAL sigma ii). It sounds very good but it's got an audible relay in it, so it clicks when switching tracks when using Tidal Connect. I'm planning to replace it ...perhaps with an Ifi DAC with the same footprint as the Zen Stream
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i use my wired with ethernet in, not wifi, as a roon endpoint, it has been terrific, no issues
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I was having a very difficult time getting it set up, but then I realized the vendor sent me a used one that had already been set up by someone else. So after I did a factory reset and updated the firmware, its worked perfectly. I do think its ugly as hell, but the sound is very good. I dont like it as much as the BluOS software and app, but sonically its quite nice.
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I was having a very difficult time getting it set up, but then I realized the vendor sent me a used one that had already been set up by someone else. So after I did a factory reset and updated the firmware, its worked perfectly. I do think its ugly as hell, but the sound is very good. I dont like it as much as the BluOS software and app, but sonically its quite nice.
Yes, the way how our entire ZEN range looks like some folks love and others hate, but it's cool knowing that you like how ZEN Stream does where it matters the most. Thanks for sharing!
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Now that the Stream has been "out in the wild" for a while, can anyone offer some real-world user feedback? Sound quality? Ease of use? Software interface (which sounds like it was, maybe still is a sore spot for some)? Any other strong attributes or nits to pick with the product?
Thanks!
I like the concept of the Zen streamer but it can't be used with Amazon HD and Qobuz is accessed with additional software. *I* would like to see the Zen Stream have a software similar to Blue OS. The streaming industry is molded in jello and who knows which services will survive.
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I like the concept of the Zen streamer but it can't be used with Amazon HD and Qobuz is accessed with additional software. *I* would like to see the Zen Stream have a software similar to Blue OS. The streaming industry is molded in jello and who knows which services will survive.
I second this. I'm about to cancel Spotify and move to Amazon HD or, perhaps, Apple Music.
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My experience is comparing a tricked out Bluesound Node2i with an SBooster to a Zen Stream powered by a 15V iPower Elite.
Initially, the Zen sounded fuller and more 3D going into a Chord TT2, mscaler, or Dave compared to the Node2i. All tests of the Zen used a Curious Cables USB cable. After a few firmware updates, I noticed that songs started skipping or just stopping when fed from Roon. (Roon and AirPlay only activated).
At that point I switched back to my Node2i. I had originally given up on it since switching between AirPlay and Roon was slow or forced me to reboot the Node2i to accomplish a switch. I took the latest firmware update on the Node2i as I set it up again. Since then, switching between AirPlay and Roon has been pain free and quick. Similarly, Roon behaves correctly without skips and stops. Sound quality is fine.
Gist of this story: Functionality is more important than sound quality. It might pay off to have two different streamers as firmware development ebbs and flows between good and bad.
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Yes, the way how our entire ZEN range looks like some folks love and others hate, but it's cool knowing that you like how ZEN Stream does where it matters the most. Thanks for sharing!
Thanks David. And yes, I am definitely keeping it. The more I listen to it, the more I like it.
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More experience from me...Even when using the Zen Stream wirelessly, the difference between using it as the transport directly and , say..playing audio via Airplay 2 from a phone to the Zen Stream is a big difference.
The Zen Stream via Tidal Connect (and I assume Spotify Connect) has a weight and dimensionality that is instantly heard and felt compared to just using it as destination for Airplay 2. Also, I find that using it this way with a fixed volume output sounds better than variable.
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I’ve only had one a few days, but it works and sounds good. We’ll see how it sounds after a few days. Replaced an Allo USB Bridge with the Shanti Power Supply. I was having trouble dealing with Linux etc on the Allo and wanted something more plug and play. Using it wired with Roon and with the supplied power cube. I love the looks, would love to be able to dim the lights. Didn’t set up the wireless but it looks like I need that to update the software etc. Haven’t been able to access the Zen via web browser on my IPad. Will check my PC today.
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You can turn the lights off
Can’t remember if it’s one press of the left or right button but once it’s running, one press will turn off the big glowing circles
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Got my Zen Stream from Music Direct within the last week. It’s quite a bargain for the price and is a very nice improvement over the Auralic Mini I’ve been using. It has more detail, more air, a slightly deeper soundstage and a fuller, richer midrange. Instruments have better timbre. Decay of notes is improved. Was able to use the 15v Mojo Audio lps that I’d been using for the Auralic.
Setup is easier than with the Auralic Mini and it works flawlessly with Roon. There are paper and online instructions and it gets a bit confusing how to do things. But I’ve sorted thru things and bookmarked a number of webpages. One thing I can’t do is check for updates. The iFi app ota function just doesn’t connect and I don’t have a USB C connector/adapter to use with my iPad’s cable. If anyone has updated their firmware, pls tell me how you did it.
Nick
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if connected as a roon endpoint, roon will seek updates and apply them to this and other endpoints with available manufacturer firmware updates over the net
this is how i avoided going to the ifi direct software page at all (though it is not hard to do so)
i agree this is a very very high performance value for $ item... really outstanding in this respect, albeit a little arcane to get started for some, and of course the looks are decidedly a lil goofy
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if connected as a roon endpoint, roon will seek updates and apply them to this and other endpoints with available manufacturer firmware updates over the net
this is how i avoided going to the ifi direct software page at all (though it is not hard to do so)
i agree this is a very very high performance value for $ item... really outstanding in this respect, albeit a little arcane to get started for some, and of course the looks are decidedly a lil goofy
Thank you! Just updated iFi firmware by going to the Roon core. Currently, I’m using the #1 All In One setting on the back. Have yet to try the dedicated #2 setting for Roon only. Do you have knowledge of or experience with the Roon setting?
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you can update the firmware from the Ifi Stream app...which you likely have from initially installing the device.
Open it, got to Settings, then go to System, then halfway down is a tab for System Updates. There's a "Check Updates" button right there and if there's a newer version of the software available, the app will auto install it after pressing that "Check Updates" button .
I've done it a few times since I purchased the unit in November 2021. Probably have run 6 software updates since then.
Jason
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you can update the firmware from the Ifi Stream app...which you likely have from initially installing the device.
Open it, got to Settings, then go to System, then halfway down is a tab for System Updates. There's a "Check Updates" button right there and if there's a newer version of the software available, the app will auto install it after pressing that "Check Updates" button .
I've done it a few times since I purchased the unit in November 2021. Probably have run 6 software updates since then.
Jason
Jason,
I have tried to update from the app a number of times, but I get a grey pop up box that says “please wait”…. It doesn’t appear to connect to the web and the app still shows the same last update of August 12. 2021. Looking at the Roon core again just now, it appears what I updated last night was the Roon bridge.
Nick
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Hmm. I’d your Ifi app up to date ?
Are you using apple or android ?
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Thank you! Just updated iFi firmware by going to the Roon core. Currently, I’m using the #1 All In One setting on the back. Have yet to try the dedicated #2 setting for Roon only. Do you have knowledge of or experience with the Roon setting?
i use my zs on 'roon only', as it is supposed to be quieter in operation not having other processes running to cover other sources... to me this makes imminent sense as i use roon as the gateway app for qbz, tidal, and stored files ...
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i use my zs on 'roon only', as it is supposed to be quieter in operation not having other processes running to cover other sources... to me this makes imminent sense as i use roon as the gateway app for qbz, tidal, and stored files ...
Does the zs need to be off to change it or can it be done “on the fly”… with the amp and pre on?
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Hmm. I’d your Ifi app up to date ?
Are you using apple or android ?
Am using Apple iOS… my iPad. A couple of things I should note. I believe the app previously showed what music I was playing on Roon. It doesn’t now. It also used to list iFi on the app network settings page with all the other detected wireless networks, but it is no longer shown.
Your thoughts, pls
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Does the zs need to be off to change it or can it be done “on the fly”… with the amp and pre on?
You can safely do this on the fly!
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You can safely do this on the fly!
Thanks, David :thumb:
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Thanks, David :thumb:
Sure thing :)
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Still loving this little unit which seems to keep getting better as ifi improves it.
Looking forward to getting accustomed to Roon in the coming weeks with the Zen Stream.
I’m wanting to ensure I’m squeezing the most out if this device before sending to my Dac.
Is anyone using an external LPS with it and have you had good results?
My zen stream came with the basic power supply . I could buy the ipower x supply but am leaning towards a 12 or 15 v lps. Any reason not to do that?
Also….
Assuming one has an adequate Wi-Fi network … would that be preferable to physically connecting it to my router and all its associated noises?
Thank you
JS
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Still loving this little unit which seems to keep getting better as ifi improves it.
Looking forward to getting accustomed to Roon in the coming weeks with the Zen Stream.
I’m wanting to ensure I’m squeezing the most out if this device before sending to my Dac.
Is anyone using an external LPS with it and have you had good results?
My zen stream came with the basic power supply . I could buy the ipower x supply but am leaning towards a 12 or 15 v lps. Any reason not to do that?
Also….
Assuming one has an adequate Wi-Fi network … would that be preferable to physically connecting it to my router and all its associated noises?
Thank you
JS
a good lps definitely improves the sound - i use a 12v keces lps but any good quality true lps in the 9-12v dc output range will work - evidently ifi used to package the zs with their own filtered power supply but they stopped doing that some time ago - a real lps, as opposed to a filtered switched mode unit, is better still
also, there have been reports of instability with wifi feed with the unit but maybe new firmware has sorted that out... i run it as a roon endpoint with well filtered ethernet in (via uptone ether regen), and its usb or rca spdif out is excellent
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Thank you
I’ve been using it on wifi with great results but have been fully intending to hard wire it to the network ..
It’s just a bit of a chore given where the router is.
But Ive recently been reading about some high end streamers that encourage wifi connection for just that reason… to skip over some of the network equipment noise.
Maybe it’s a different implementation of wifi in those expensive units.
I’ll likely get into some network filtering if I do tie it in to my router , but given that uptone is out of stock for awhile , I’m not sure where to look for a filter setup without spending more than my budget .
I intend to go out of the Zen Stream spdif into a border patrol dac which feeds an Van Alstine tube pre / power amp combo.
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I’ve had the Zen streamer for a few months now and continue to be very happy with it. I am running a dedicated lps and in wireless mode using the #2 Roon only setting. There are a few blips occasionally, but this is much more convenient than trying to have access to a wired connection. The Zen feeds the Border Patrol SEi dac to a Supratek Chardonnay pre to the AVA SET 120 amp.
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An LPS will definitely make an improvement and I'm just using the Terradak LPS I bought for the Aries Mini off Ebay six years ago. Jays Audio also makes and sells three different LPS units in addition to his CD transports. The smallest one at $168 should easily do the trick. If your Zen Stream is working without dropouts on WiFi like mine is just leave it alone. Then you don't have to worry about "filtering" units and an LPS for a noisy router.
https://www.beatechnik.com/product-page/lps25va
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JackD, thanks for this recommendation
Any thoughts on which voltage to get? the Z.S. accepts 9v to 15v. I believe 1.8 amps to .8 amps in that range
The current rating on the Beatechnik power supplies are higher, could that be in issue?
Nick B, I'll similarly be feeding into an Se-i BP dac and an RB10 tube pre from AVA followed by their SET 120
Also, any suggestions re: network filtering beyond the uptone regen
I've read a bit about the ENO from network acoustics...seems to be a very different device from the uptone. Any other options?
Lastly , I'm keeping my Stream on the AIO setting since I like to airplay from my laptop sometimes. I normally listen to Tidal connect when actually listening to music.
I will be trying Roon out soon with a free trial but I don't have a core yet. Working on that. Are you noticing differencing when switching the dial in the back to Tidal only or Roon only?
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I'm using an LPS for an Auralic Aries which is 16 volts 1 amp that David from iFi told Nick was o.k. so I don't think you would have any problem with the smallest one. But if you have concerns reach out to Victor at Beatecknik the distributor and see what he thinks.
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JackD, thanks for this recommendation
Any thoughts on which voltage to get? the Z.S. accepts 9v to 15v. I believe 1.8 amps to .8 amps in that range
The current rating on the Beatechnik power supplies are higher, could that be in issue?
Nick B, I'll similarly be feeding into an Se-i BP dac and an RB10 tube pre from AVA followed by their SET 120
Also, any suggestions re: network filtering beyond the uptone regen
I've read a bit about the ENO from network acoustics...seems to be a very different device from the uptone. Any other options? :thumb:
Lastly , I'm keeping my Stream on the AIO setting since I like to airplay from my laptop sometimes. I normally listen to Tidal connect when actually listening to music.
I will be trying Roon out soon with a free trial but I don't have a core yet. Working on that. Are you noticing differencing when switching the dial in the back to Tidal only or Roon only?
I’ve only used the number one and number two settings in the back. I guess I could try both and then monitor for dropouts which I do get on occasion. I don’t know what I would do without Roon. I run the core on my Mac desktop and it functions very well. You must be getting great sound just as I am using the border patrol dac and AVA gear :thumb:
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I’ve got one of the nice Auralic mini linear power supplies that I’m going to try with my ZS.
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Has anyone here used the Topping p50 lps with their Zen Stream?
It has a 15V tap as welll as a 5V, and I believe they can both be used simultaneously albeit with lower current.
Price is right at 120.
Not the most powerful unit but for the ZS, seems like it would be just fine
https://amp.apos.audio/products/topping-p50-linear-power-supply
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Has anyone here used the Topping p50 lps with their Zen Stream?
It has a 15V tap as welll as a 5V, and I believe they can both be used simultaneously albeit with lower current.
Price is right at 120.
Not the most powerful unit but for the ZS, seems like it would be just fine
https://amp.apos.audio/products/topping-p50-linear-power-supply
Wow, it's been a while since the last time I was here! As for PSUs for ZEN Stream, it operates within the 9-15V DC range, but some folks say that it sounds better if powered by 15V chargers/LPSUs than their lower voltage versions. Hope this helps, thanks!
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Wow, it's been a while since the last time I was here! As for PSUs for ZEN Stream, it operates within the 9-15V DC range, but some folks say that it sounds better if powered by 15V chargers/LPSUs than their lower voltage versions. Hope this helps, thanks!
Yes, it’s been a while. Would be good to make guest appearances a bit more frequently! My Zen Stream operates just fine with the 15v lps I used to use for the Auralic Mini.
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I'll do my best!
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I am eagerly awaiting my Zen stream coming in January. Is there any truth that if you upgrade to latest firmware Spotify connect won't work? Let's see if Stream can defeat my my long time trusted companion Bluesound node N130 usb out!
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When using Todal Connect with ZS - do you still need to control the volume via software slider in the Stream Ifi app or can you change and controlvolume in the Tidal app?
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The Zen Stream is the most unreliable and poorly performing piece of equipment that I own, and iFi tech support is useless. The software is atrocious. For example, the Zen Stream is advertised as having a Roon exclusive mode. This was the reason I bought it. I knew from experience that using an operating system dedicated to Roon sounds better, and the Stream has, supposedly, quiet USB outputs. I even got an upgraded iFi power supply to optimize this.
What iFi doesn't tell you is that the USB output is disabled when you use Roon exclusive mode. It is nowhere in their long, detailed web page or manual. It also makes no sense since even the free Ropieee software on a Raspberry Pi fully supports USB digital output. After multiple attempts, iFi confirmed the undocumented bug. In March 2022 they said a future software update would fix it. More than a year and a half later, none of the software updates have fixed it, and they no longer respond to questions about it.
And good luck getting it to run via ethernet. WiFi anywhere near digital sources destroys sound quality and introduces instability and dropouts, so the second reason I bought the Zen Stream was that it supported direct ethernet connection. However, getting the Zen Stream to shut off the WiFi transceiver is extremely difficult. If you shut off the WiFi and save the setting, it still displays the list of available networks, meaning that the WiFi is still on. So you have to restart the Zen Stream. But the Zen Stream automatically turns on WiFi when it's restarted. After about half an hour and for no good reason, I got the Zen Stream to turn on with WiFi off and using only ethernet. This was with the currently most recent firmware. I wrote to iFi about this and have had no response in the month since I contacted them.
So, I decided to try it in the general-purpose mode, where Roon works via USB but the system is also running other services and running a web server that interferes with the audio stream. I connected the $300 iFi power supply to lower the noise as much as possible, and it was running my headphone setup. However, I was getting dropouts at the beginning of tracks. I went into Roon and tried all of the settings for buffering and delay time when switching sampling rates. Even giving it the maximum buffer and delay between switching sample rates, there were still clicks about 1/4 of the time at the beginning of a track.
Finally, I took the Zen Stream out of the system altogether. I ran a USB cable from my USB hub directly to my DAC. Everything sounded better, and I have not had a single click or dropout.
In short, the Zen Stream degraded the sound quality, does not work as advertised, and has terrible customer support.