[2gumby2]

I've been following the AVA 440H review here and I have some interest in the power cords Frank supplies with his amps. 

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=62866.msg568081;topicseen

The reviewer seems to be disappointed with the 16 gauge power cord that came on his 440H. I've always thought that Frank was probably a smart enough amp designer to choose an adequate power cord for his products. I own two Ultra 550s and an Ultra 350 and I've been very happy with them, but I have wondered if I ever decided to bridge the two 550s to power some big Magnepans (or whatever else I might need serious power for) if the "skinny" cords would be able to carry the current for that much power. I'm not an engineer so I'm probably showing my ignorance here, but I would like to know a little about the science of choosing the right gauge of power cord for the most extreme use of the product within its design parameters.

[Wayner]

A 16 awg cord is capable of 13 amps continuously. That would equate to a 1560 watt draw from a 120 volt outlet. This is why larger then necessary cords are simply not used. This is an amplifier, not a welder.

Wayner 

[martyo]

This is an amplifier, not a welder.

That's major funny Wayner.


Merry Christmas all, and get some xtra listening in over the break aa

[Big Red Machine]

You definitely need those larger PC's and you should request Frank make the upgrade to IEC outlets for you. 

[sueata1]

I use 2 Ultra 550's bridged Mono with a Fet Valve Phase Inverter driving a pair of
Maggie 1.6QR's
Awesome and No problems

Happy listening
Mel

[warnerwh]

The 1560 watts Wayner refers to is Continuous.  That's enough to melt the voice coils in your speakers, most likely within 30 secs is my guess. For short periods (musical peaks) the wattage capability of 16ga wire is even higher.  Someone with more knowledge may be able to give you a more detailed response.

[Wayner]

In a bolted direct short, 120 volts can deliver 50,000 amps of power in micro seconds. That would be an arc-flash explosion in a minor voltage (as compared to 480 volt  3-phase). The power of the force is incredible and enormous. This is also a time to tell our DIY'ers to always work on things unplugged. Verify and test before continuing (and remember, capacitors like to hold a charge). 

Wayner  aa

[Minn Mark]

For the last couple of years I have used 440H (Omega, and now Insight versions) with my Maggie 3.6R's. I have used the amp into the wall socket directly as well as going thru a Monster Home theatre power filter.    No problems whatsoever driving driving to levels well beyond what the wife can tolerate (LOUD).  I see no reason to consider further.

Mark

PS- just arrived the Insight pre, amp and DAC.  WIll publish more later on my impressions.

[gjs_cds]

PS- just arrived the Insight pre, amp and DAC.  WIll publish more later on my impressions.

Please do!  I've got the AvaHifi solid state gear w/ Acoustat 2+2's, but I've always been Maggie-curious.

And as for this "but the power cable isn't thick enough" nonsense, isn't there some animated icon where the little guy continues to bang his head against the wall...  Why yes, I think there is--

Perhaps better stated is with the picture below.  But instead of the flying saucer, insert a really thick looking and overpriced IEC detachable power cord.

"There's a sucker born every minute."  P.T. Barnum

[satfrat]

I've been following the AVA 440H review here and I have some interest in the power cords Frank supplies with his amps. 

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=62866.msg568081;topicseen

The reviewer seems to be disappointed with the 16 gauge power cord that came on his 440H. I've always thought that Frank was probably a smart enough amp designer to choose an adequate power cord for his products. I own two Ultra 550s and an Ultra 350 and I've been very happy with them, but I have wondered if I ever decided to bridge the two 550s to power some big Magnepans (or whatever else I might need serious power for) if the "skinny" cords would be able to carry the current for that much power. I'm not an engineer so I'm probably showing my ignorance here, but I would like to know a little about the science of choosing the right gauge of power cord for the most extreme use of the product within its design parameters.

You need only do a search of power cords in this Circle to have gotten all the answers you seek. This subject has been hashed out for 5 years now on AudioCircle and there's plenty of info on the subject if you are really that interested.

Cheers,
Robin

[satfrat]

PS- just arrived the Insight pre, amp and DAC.  WIll publish more later on my impressions.

Please do!  I've got the AvaHifi solid state gear w/ Acoustat 2+2's, but I've always been Maggie-curious.

And as for this "but the power cable isn't thick enough" nonsense, isn't there some animated icon where the little guy continues to bang his head against the wall...  Why yes, I think there is--

Perhaps better stated is with the picture below.  But instead of the flying saucer, insert a really thick looking and overpriced IEC detachable power cord.

"There's a sucker born every minute."  P.T. Barnum

And your opinion works both ways also so back atsha.

Cheers,
Robin

[2gumby2]

Thanks guys! 1560 Watts and 13 amps out of 120 Volt outlet for 16 gauge is good enough for me.

[sueata1]

Anytime,,,thanx for starting  'The Bridge to Nowhere'

Happy listening,,,Mel

[Wind Chaser]

Having owned a Pass Labs Aleph 3, I recall reading something in the owners manual that due to its design, aftermarket power cords would not yield any affect.  I found on that amp Nelson Pass was correct, as an NBS Dragon Fly made no audible difference on the Aleph 3.  So I put the cord on my DAC where I could hear a difference.

So given the controversy of the subject, perhaps there is something to be said that maybe the whole issue depends on the component...

[Wind Chaser]

Please do!  I've got the AvaHifi solid state gear w/ Acoustat 2+2's, but I've always been Maggie-curious.

Keep your Acoustats.  There isn't a Maggie - nor will there ever be a Maggie - that can equal your stats.  I made that mistake... big stupid mistake!

Acoustats are freak'n fabulous if you get them set up right.  I can't think of a speaker, not even Quads,  that can equal the strengths of the Acoustats I've heard and owned.

[Zheeeem]

So given the controversy of the subject, perhaps there is something to be said that maybe the whole issue depends on the component...

On the component... or on the listener.

I'm damned by an education and 30+ year career in science.  I have great trouble understanding how or why one properly designed power cord could possibly "sound" any different than another properly designed power cord.  I do recognize that, in the case of poorly engineered power supplies, rubbish can get into the system through the power cord.  But, in this case, the entire power grid (not just the last 6 ft) would be the source of the problem - and the solution would probably need to be more robust than just swapping cords (e.g., getting new electronics).

One of the nice things about AVA electronics is that Frank builds a very nice, and very robust, power supply.  I

[Wind Chaser]

I'm damned by an education and 30+ year career in science.  I have great trouble understanding how or why one properly designed power cord could possibly "sound" any different than another properly designed power cord.

What qualifies as properly designed?  Like so many mysteries, the notion that a PC can have any affect on sound quality is above my head, yet having owned and sampled a variety of cords, even up in to the thouands of dollar range, my ears definitely perceived a difference in sound.

[geezer]

So given the controversy of the subject, perhaps there is something to be said that maybe the whole issue depends on the component...

On the component... or on the listener.

I'm damned by an education and 30+ year career in science.  I have great trouble understanding how or why one properly designed power cord could possibly "sound" any different than another properly designed power cord.  I do recognize that, in the case of poorly engineered power supplies, rubbish can get into the system through the power cord.  But, in this case, the entire power grid (not just the last 6 ft) would be the source of the problem - and the solution would probably need to be more robust than just swapping cords (e.g., getting new electronics).

One of the nice things about AVA electronics is that Frank builds a very nice, and very robust, power supply.  I

Yes, but remember that many believe that UFOs are piloted by ETs, or that a few molecules of a certain substance in a glass of water can cure illness.

[satfrat]

Yes, but remember that many believe that UFOs are piloted by ETs, or that a few molecules of a certain substance in a glass of water can cure illness.

Thanks for those great words of wisdom to remember Geezer,,,, I' ll definitely learn more from you than I ever could my using my ears and forming my own opinion on such subjects,,,, NOT.

Cheers,
Robin

[charmerci]

Here we go again. Keep it up boys and this whole thread will be deleted -

AGAIN!