Lil Audio 15 vs Audio Nirvana 15, need help choosing one

Creed · « **on:** 4 Sep 2021, 01:18 am »

On a whim I tried a pair of Betsy's, made a barrel shape baffle out of 1 inch Baltic birch and very impressed for what it is. I would like to try either the 15 inch Lil audio driver or the 15 inch Audio Nirvana.can someone advise me which direction and why. Which has better or more bass? Both seem like they are enjoyed by what I have read but not much on comparing between them. I would like to do open baffle but see audio nirvana can be put in a box. still have 6x4of Baltic birch so I'm good there, thanks for any help.

opnly bafld · « **Reply #1 on:** 4 Sep 2021, 04:03 pm »

The Audio Nirvana will not have as much bass since its qts is 0.322.

FullRangeMan · « **Reply #2 on:** 4 Sep 2021, 06:43 pm »

My choice is the Lii F15 in the Barrel OB panel or the factory rec Bass Reflex box or the superb F18 as OB.

Creed · « **Reply #3 on:** 4 Sep 2021, 09:11 pm »

Is there a reason other than bass that the lil Audio is better? More refined, musical, imaging. My only experience with open baffle is the Betsy for a couple weeks and they just broke in. Is the Lil Audio a big step up opposed to the Betsy? If so what will I notice, sorry for all the questions but I'm still surprised a $110 betsy mounted to a piece of plywood sound the way it does.

FullRangeMan · « **Reply #4 on:** 4 Sep 2021, 09:27 pm »

Quote from: Creed on 4 Sep 2021, 09:11 pm

Is there a reason other than bass that the lil Audio is better? More refined, musical, imaging. My only experience with open baffle is the Betsy for a couple weeks and they just broke in. Is the Lil Audio a big step up opposed to the Betsy? If so what will I notice, sorry for all the questions but I'm still surprised a $110 betsy mounted to a piece of plywood sound the way it does.

Is there a reason other than bass that the lil Audio is better?
The Lii F15 are all better than the Nirvana 15'' and much more cheap, you would search at the Decware forum for more opinions.
https://www.decware.com/newsite/ZMS.html
To my personal taste a bigger FR driver are always better than a smaller FR due the mid-bass (200-400Hz) and mainly the bigger soundstage, small cones have smaller sound stage too.

Russell Dawkins · « **Reply #5 on:** 4 Sep 2021, 09:53 pm »

This is worth a peak, too:
http://www.glowinthedarkaudio.com/lii-audio-f18.html

Creed · « **Reply #6 on:** 5 Sep 2021, 12:29 am »

Thanks, that's very worth a peak! It's only $100 more and is very intriguing, I may go that route. Don't know if I could go with that big folding baffle. I have floor standing, monitors 3 short racks and betsys's (Betsys can go in a closet)so room could be a problem.

Anyone use small betsy type baffles with the 18's? Do these 18's image bigger than it naturally should be or is a person standing 8 feet tall which would seem not real or unnatural.

I thought I had made up my mind on Lil 15's after reading this post but the 18's could be something special or could it be overkill?

I'm using a small dedicated treated 12x13 room. Is this to small for eithe of these speakers. My towers go down to 35 and it's still enjoyable in that small room but that room is the smallest I've ever used.

FullRangeMan · « **Reply #7 on:** 5 Sep 2021, 01:16 am »

Quote from: Creed on 5 Sep 2021, 12:29 am

Thanks, that's very worth a peak! It's only $100 more and is very intriguing, I may go that route. Don't know if I could go with that big folding baffle. I have floor standing, monitors 3 short racks and betsys's (Betsys can go in a closet)so room could be a problem.

Anyone use small betsy type baffles with the 18's? Do these 18's image bigger than it naturally should be or is a person standing 8 feet tall which would seem not real or unnatural.

I thought I had made up my mind on Lil 15's after reading this post but the 18's could be something special or could it be overkill?

I'm using a small dedicated treated 12x13 room. Is this to small for eithe of these speakers. My towers go down to 35 and it's still enjoyable in that small room but that room is the smallest I've ever used.

IMO the better baffle so far are the Barrel shape, if you feel you need a fold you could use a cap head(below), as GlowintheDark said the F18 image bigger than the F15 and the F15 have better detail, its all about personal taste, my choice could be the F18.

Anyone use small betsy type baffles with the 18's?

Do these 18's image bigger than it naturally should be or is a person standing 8 feet tall which would seem not real or unnatural.
Big sound stage is a bless not a prob to me, but there is some audiophiles that like small sound stage (

) in this case I rec a desktop speaker and wife will be happy.

Creed · « **Reply #8 on:** 5 Sep 2021, 02:07 am »

How big does the barrel shape baffle need to be for the 18? I see the 15 driver in 8 inch style Betsy baffle but the 18 is a different story. Does anyone have a template for 18 barrel baffle? I used my friends Betsy barrel baffle to draw out my template for my 8 inch driver. Good point on bigger soundstage. Why is 15 inch more popular than 18, you don't here much on the 18.

FullRangeMan · « **Reply #9 on:** 5 Sep 2021, 02:23 am »

Quote from: Creed on 5 Sep 2021, 02:07 am

How big does the barrel shape baffle need to be for the 18? I see the 15 driver in 8 inch style Betsy baffle but the 18 is a different story. Does anyone have a template for 18 barrel baffle? I used my friends Betsy barrel baffle to draw out my template for my 8 inch driver. Good point on bigger soundstage. Why is 15 inch more popular than 18, you don't here much on the 18.

How big does the barrel shape baffle need to be for the 18?
Who knows? F18 is a new driver just released.
Use the Golden Ratio.
Does anyone have a template for 18 barrel baffle?
The shape is the same than the F15 just larger.
Buy the F15 plans at Decware site.
Why is 15 inch more popular than 18, you don't here much on the 18.
The F15 are endorsed by Steve Decker, the F18 is new, was released few weeks ago.

Creed · « **Reply #10 on:** 5 Sep 2021, 09:01 pm »

About to place order with Lil Audio on 18's. I am a little concerned on ordering from China, never bought from China. Anyone have experience good or bad.with them. How do they pack drivers to make the journey from China! If there is damage are they easy to work with on replacement or am I screwed.

opnly bafld · « **Reply #11 on:** 5 Sep 2021, 09:06 pm »

I think they have a place in California.

FullRangeMan · « **Reply #12 on:** 5 Sep 2021, 10:06 pm »

Quote from: Creed on 5 Sep 2021, 09:01 pm

About to place order with Lil Audio on 18's. I am a little concerned on ordering from China, never bought from China. Anyone have experience good or bad.with them. How do they pack drivers to make the journey from China! If there is damage are they easy to work with on replacement or am I screwed.

On a dozen purchases of parts from China I never had a prob or DOA, also ship is cheap.

joessportster · « **Reply #13 on:** 27 Sep 2021, 11:05 pm »

Lii has warehouses in a couple places in the US and drivers typically ship from those first. If they are out of stock they will ship from China

I have owned both the F-18 and F-15, I still own the F-15. IMHO the F-15 has a fuller more rounded sound. I would imagine the F-18 might be better in a larger room My Listening space is 13 X 16 I never could get to a point where I preferred the F-18 over the F-15

FullRangeMan · « **Reply #14 on:** 27 Sep 2021, 11:24 pm »

I never could get to a point where I preferred the F-18 over the F-15
Do you think this should be because the F15 is fully break-in and the F18 is still new?

joessportster · « **Reply #15 on:** 28 Sep 2021, 12:51 pm »

Quote from: FullRangeMan on 27 Sep 2021, 11:24 pm

I never could get to a point where I preferred the F-18 over the F-15
Do you think this should be because the F15 is fully break-in and the F18 is still new?

I put over 100 hours on the F-18, So not sure what I might have expected further. However straight out of the box the F-15 was a superb driver with a full open sound. It just captivated me immediately. I was using the F-15 before I even knew Steve (Decware) was building the ZF15's I bought his plans and built a pair. His design is great. I have only 1 issue with it thats size in my small room it makes it hard for the speakers to disappear. The baffle essentially becomes part of the speaker cone (if I am understanding Steves description correctly) That puts a huge soundwave coming at you and only having approx 6 feet between me and the speakers. Its obvious where they are. I built a CLONE of the Spatial X2 using the F-15 up top and the W-15 on bottom, The baffles are 19 X 19 for each of the 4 drivers stacked 2 per side. Soundstage is massively wide, great height and depth

I am currently experimenting with Emerald Physics 4.8 Rosewood, all carbon drivers and poly tweeter, They are also VERY Good.

joessportster · « **Reply #16 on:** 28 Sep 2021, 12:59 pm »

Link to X-2 thread https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=156502.0

Mine still in progress:

joessportster · « **Reply #17 on:** 28 Sep 2021, 01:03 pm »

For mine I glued up 3 sheets of MDF Cut 6 same size panels at 19 X 19, Routed the holes. Cut 2 of the panels in half. Put the half panels on the back as a t shape for rear support worked like a charm. I was able to make a 2nd set of the top baffles and put the F-18 in those so all I had to do to compare the F-15 and F-18 was swap the top section's out

FullRangeMan · « **Reply #18 on:** 28 Sep 2021, 04:35 pm »

Thanks Joe for your detailed report I appreciated.
In the end it all depend on the construction small details, I always liked big sound stage, the F15/18 looks both great drivers, I think 100 hours are small break-in for the F18 you would use it untll 400/500 hours to a definitive opinion also Glow in the Dark informed the F18 needs around 20W tube watts to open.

joessportster · « **Reply #19 on:** 28 Sep 2021, 05:34 pm »

Quote from: FullRangeMan on 28 Sep 2021, 04:35 pm

Thanks Joe for your detailed report I appreciated.
In the end it all depend on the construction small details, I always liked big sound stage, the F15/18 looks both great drivers, I think 100 hours are small break-in for the F18 you would use it untll 400/500 hours to a definitive opinion also Glow in the Dark informed the F18 needs around 20W tube watts to open.

Yes I know Kevin well, In fact I turned him on to Lii F-15's originally. He in turn convinced me to try the F-18......We both agree that Lii F-15 and F-18 do very well with PP tube amps........... I just sent SupraVox 215 2000 EXC Feild Coils to Kevin last week. He and I have traded several times. I love his site, Kevin is quite insightful, and a talented photographer. I often link his site as he is a much better writer / photographer than I could ever hope to be at this stage.