The Bully

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Rocket_Ronny

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #40 on: 23 Oct 2023, 01:36 am »
Quote
Wilson Alexia, among other things.  They're cool... but they don't teleport.

If pulled out like you says he does, they should be magical and teleport I would think.


Rocket Ronny

jmimac351

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #41 on: 23 Oct 2023, 03:30 am »
If pulled out like you says he does, they should be magical and teleport I would think.


Rocket Ronny

That was not my experience... they sound laid back and don't offend.  Below is how JA summed up this $50,000 pair of speakers.

I share this not for the purpose of creating a debate about that speaker, but as it relates to "what does this compare to for money spent" angle.  It seems to me for $50k, some may conclude the performance is wanting.  Unfortunately, it also appears it's a mistake to presume $50k checks any particular box.




Presb4

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #42 on: 26 Oct 2023, 05:53 am »
The problem is, your question is very difficult to answer - by design.  For most any speaker manufacturer (and audio, in general), the answer to your question is dealt with via hyperbole and fairy dust words.  They play into a lack of technical knowledge among consumers and take advantage of the passion most of us have for finding "rightness"... and so the search goes on. 

And then... some speaker manufacturers post response measurements, spectral decay plots, and videos of how the speaker is actually designed, why it's good / bad... how it compares to other things.   

My Wilson Duette have outboard crossovers that are potted... encased in epoxy.  I think all of the Wilson crossovers are treated in that same fashion.  I couldn't look at / improve upon quality of the crossover parts if I tried.  Based on what I hear with them, they need work.  I don't know how to do it. 

However... "I gotta guy..."

 :popcorn:

Perhaps another question to ask is "Why is XYZ speaker better than The Bully?"  Just based on specs, they are going to be tough to beat.  How does that baffle image?  Well, the proof will be in the pudding. 

Below is a pic of my buddy's setup.  Wilson Alexia, among other things.  They're cool... but they don't teleport.  They are ScanSpeak drivers that some dudes put in a box and made a crossover for... and they absolutely will not tell you how they did it.  They are cool... but they aren't "Magic".  I'd LOVE to roll a Bully into his room, right next to the Alexia, and let 'em GET IT ON! He'd enjoy it too!

As Sarah McLachlan says, they're "Building a Mystery"... and that sells.









If you haven't listened to the Occasional Podcast with the Andrew Jones interview, you should.
https://theoccasionalpodcast.libsyn.com/speaker-cabinets-everything-you-ever-wanted-to-know-with-andrew-jones-of-mofikefelacpioneer

It was enlightening when he goes into the costs associated with producing a speaker for the mass market and the first place they cut the quality is in the cabinet... :cuss:

If i remember correctly, he stated that in a good speaker design. That 80 - 90 % of the speakers cost comes from the cabinet materials the labor and shipping of that completed part. He said that there is always a push to skimp on the weight, size, and just make it look good, cuz thats what sells. He adds further that there are a number of ways to make a good cabinet, but the tried and true best way is to make it thick, brace it, and dampen it. This reminds me of what Danny is always preaching in his designs.

So what price point do you have to hit to get as much speaker as the GR Brute, GR Bully or any other GR design??? I dont know, but Mr. Jones does name drop some component prices that MoFi paid for the new sourcepoint 10 drivers and it was a few hundred in parts and and a couple hundred for the cabinets. So their mark up is 600%'ish. Using this same logic, and if we took the Brute cost of, 2k x 6 = 12k value in the big box stores. Even if I had paid that for my Brutes I wouldn't feel cheated.... unless they showed up to my door still disassembled, lol.
« Last Edit: 29 Oct 2023, 04:35 am by Presb4 »

Tyson

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #43 on: 26 Oct 2023, 06:38 am »
From what I've seen, smaller speakers markup is between 6x and 8x.  Larger speaker systems it's often 10x or more.

Early B.

Re: The Bully
« Reply #44 on: 26 Oct 2023, 12:16 pm »
From what I've seen, smaller speakers markup is between 6x and 8x.  Larger speaker systems it's often 10x or more.

This is precisely why DIY makes so much sense. The value for your money is off the charts. A thousand dollars worth of parts can compete with $10K speakers.

jmimac351

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #45 on: 26 Oct 2023, 01:33 pm »
Bennic makes many speakers and crossovers in China for many big names, and some small names.  I am fairly certain Revel speakers come off the same line as many others... If I were to hazard a guess, I would guess that the AV123 ELT525T tower speakers I bought several weeks ago off FakeBook marketplace for $150 came from the same place (or a cousin).

As for me, I like my speakers to speak 'Merican.   :thumb:








« Last Edit: 26 Oct 2023, 03:16 pm by jmimac351 »

sb6

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #46 on: 26 Oct 2023, 01:51 pm »

So what price point do you have to hit to get as much speaker as the GR Brute, GR Bully or any other GR design??? I dont know, but Mr. Jones does name drop some component prices that MoFi paid for the new sourcepoint 10 drivers and it was a few hundred in parts and and a couple hundred for the cabinets. So their mark up is 600%'ish. Using this same logic, and if we took the Brute cost of, 2k x 6 = 12k value in the big box stores. Even if I had paid that for my Brutes I wouldn't feel cheated.... In less they showed up to my door still disassembled, lol.

You omitted everything that it costs to stay in business and keep the lights on as cost. Rent, utilities, insurance, then there's salaries, Marketing, Sales, distribution, warranty costs, etc. 

sb6

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #47 on: 26 Oct 2023, 01:52 pm »
Bennic makes many speakers and crossovers in China for many big names, and some small names.  I am fairly certain Revel speakers come off the same line as many others... If I were to hazard a guess, I would guess that the AV123 ELT525T tower speakers I bought several weeks ago off FakeBook marketplace for $150 came from the same place (or a cousin).

As for me, I like my speakers to speak 'Merican.   :thumb:






Pretty much nothing is 100% American now. We've been in a co - dependant global economy for decades. It is what it is.

jmimac351

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #48 on: 26 Oct 2023, 02:33 pm »
Pretty much nothing is 100% American now. We've been in a co - dependant global economy for decades. It is what it is.

Yes; however, that wasn't my point.

Re: "Assembly line / cost for what you get"

sb6

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #49 on: 27 Oct 2023, 01:31 am »
Yes; however, that wasn't my point.

Re: "Assembly line / cost for what you get"

Still applies..
We've been in a co - dependant global economy for decades. It is what it is.

Tyson

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #50 on: 27 Oct 2023, 01:42 am »
Still applies..
We've been in a co - dependant global economy for decades. It is what it is.

This is why I like DIY audio.  With DIY I can be 100% sure it was assembled in America.  ie, by me  :rock:

sb6

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #51 on: 27 Oct 2023, 01:46 am »
This is why I like DIY audio.  With DIY I can be 100% sure it was assembled in America.  ie, by me  :rock:

With parts from Europe and China :-)

jmimac351

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #52 on: 27 Oct 2023, 01:50 am »
With parts from Europe and China :-)

The point here isn't about where it was made... the conversation was touching on DIY cost / "value" relative to buying a retail speaker.

Your statement is correct - and moot.

Tyson

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #53 on: 27 Oct 2023, 01:51 am »
With parts from Europe and China :-)

Well, parts of me are from Europe!  Not sure about China.  I think my race is pretty much 'mongrel'.  So we end up with a mongrel speaker built by mongrel labor :P

Hobbsmeerkat

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #54 on: 29 Oct 2023, 12:59 am »
Bully's are up and playing  8)

jmimac351

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #55 on: 29 Oct 2023, 01:41 am »

mkrawcz

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #56 on: 31 Oct 2023, 09:12 pm »
Bully's are up and playing  8)
Ok they have some hours now, how are they?

Danny Richie

Re: The Bully
« Reply #57 on: 31 Oct 2023, 10:36 pm »
Ok they have some hours now, how are they?

 :green:

jmimac351

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #58 on: 31 Oct 2023, 11:05 pm »

jpm

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Re: The Bully
« Reply #59 on: 3 Nov 2023, 02:20 am »
Care to spill a bit more, to add to Hobbes comments in the Wilson thread?