[Hobbsmeerkat]

Ok - Not sure what is going on here, but all of my pictures have disappeared from my thread here.  They seem to be in my gallery, but all of the links are gone or something like that has happened....

I found a “request for site help” thread and posted my finding there, along with many others:
https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=174648.new#new

That seems like a good place to post issues like this.  Hope someone comes up with a fix as this is a mess...
If anyone knows what is going on, post it there and let us all know...

Yeah, it's happened to all threads and posts. Right now. Not sure what happened, but hopefully it wont permanently affect the forum for all current and past posts

[jonsk2514]

I saw that other threads across AudioCircle were affected.  It would truly not be good if this can’t be recovered...  And I have heard nothing from my post on the AC help thread.

As that goes, I finished the bases for these speakers.  These have adjustable feed so I can level the speakers in the old and warped house I live in...    And they are an out rigger style so they support the speakers from tipping over.

I can now declare them to be done.   
Pictures to come when the site problems are fixed... 

[jonsk2514]

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[jonsk2514]

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[jonsk2514]

I AM DONE!
THE X-MTMs ARE FINISHED!

At least as much as I plan to do.  I may do some sort of covering for the drivers and ports.  But not thinking of that now.

The last thing I had to do was to make a base for these.  They are top heavy and on carpet they are tippy.  And my floors in my old house are less than perfectly level.

Here is what they look like


The stands are perfect, IMHO... 

The stands started out as a layout on my work bench.  It was the only place large enough to be able to make the radii that these used.



Have you ever seen one of these?



I picked them up from a used tool store that we used to have around here.

I add a pencil to one pointer using some Loctight blued gummy stuff.



I used this to layout the large radii for the sides of the bases.  Once I had the whole thing laid out on the workbench to my satisfaction I transferred it over to a plywood template.  The template also had holes drilled in it for where the mounting screws and the leveling knobs/screws are to go.

The outline of the template was traced onto some vernier finished 3/4” plywood and the holes were transferred to the plywood by drilling to just a shallow depth.  After the pieces were cut from the plywood, I finish the drilling on a drill press to ensure the holes were straight.



Sanding the radii presented a challenge.  I needed a curved sanding bloc.  I found that the backside of the rubber sanding blocks I have would work for this, as did the sticky back sandpaper I have.



I rounded the top corner with with a 1/2” round.  Then painted them with a primer (happened to be white) and then used a roller to put on the gloss black enamel latex.  This left an interesting texture and in places the white of the primer shows through, which gives them a bit of a marble look.



I used 1/4”x2” threaded knobs for the levelers and put nylon acorn nuts to keep the floors from being scratched.  At first I was going to use threaded inserts, then I found I could thread the 3/4” plywood with a 7/32” hole with a 1/4x20 threaded rod with some wax added to the rod.  I ran the rod in and out a few times with a drill to work the wax into the wood.  It makes for a tight fit and I don’t have to worry about the levelers backing out with any vibrations.

I added sheet of adhesive back black felt to them where the speaker will mount.  The thought for this is that the  bases won’t stick to the speakers and it will keep the interface from making any noises.



I used black button head screws with Allen wrench sockets, through the base, to attach the base to the speaker and threaded inserts in the bottom of the speakers.  The only thing I would have done differently would be to put the inserts into the speaker bottoms long before I put the drivers in...

Done!

[Peter J]

Cool, I bet you're happy to get to the finish line.
I know that compassy thing as a trammel, but that could be just my definition.  Kind of a cool looking old thing.

[Hobbsmeerkat]

Those look great! 

[jonsk2514]

Cool, I bet you're happy to get to the finish line.
I know that compassy thing as a trammel, but that could be just my definition.  Kind of a cool looking old thing.

Very happy.  This is one case where the destination is better than adventure to get there.  I am thrilled with the way the speakers sound.

You nailed on the name, trammel.  I looked it up and here is Starrett’s current web page for these:

https://www.starrett.com/category/111302#currentPage=1&displayMode=grid&itemsPerPage=12&sortBy=wp/asc

I love a lot of the old school tools.  So many of them were very well made, served a purpose with a bit of genius and simplicity, and they typically had a flare for artistry.  I am glad I picked it up when I saw it.

Those look great! 

Thanks!

I owe a great deal of this successful completion to everyone who offered advise, those who posted about their builds, which I read a lot of, and those who posted build videos.

And I appreciate everyone who followed this, made comments and carried on various discussion.  It help to shape my thinking about doing this build.  This might never have happened without this web site... 

And there is more to come...   

[jonsk2514]

I have already started a new set of builds.  This time it is an X-CS that will be a center channel to go with these X-MTMs and a pair of X-LS that will be a birthday present for on of my daughters.  The builds are coming along nicely and if you would like to follow along, I have started a new thread here - https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=174915

[jonsk2514]

A friend saw my X-MTMs and thought he would try them as the sound system for his classic Mini:

[jonsk2514]

Now that I have had a chance to listen to the X-MTMs, here are some thoughts...

I have read more than one post where the person expressed what I took to be surprise as to the quality of the sound, the transparency, the range, etc that the X-MTMs are capable of.

I will admit to being one of those people.  The hype is almost overwhelming.  People are almost overboard.  Before one has a chance to hear them it is easy to believe the reviews are, maybe, a bit overblown.

Any doubt as to how good the X-MTMs really are melted away when I first powered them up.  It took me about 30 seconds of listening to them to understand that I had put together and just fired up something special.  The next realization as to how great they sound came from my wife’s reaction to them. She has sat down with me for hours of music listening, which she has never done before.  She knows nothing of being an audiophile.  She just knows what sounds good to her.  And what she can tolerate as to sound quality.

These are speakers you can listen to for hours.  Jazz, Rock, Blues, Classical - it doesn’t matter.

And they will shake the floor with the sound track of many movies and TV shows.  In the room I have them in I can find no faults with them.  The bass respond is superb without the need for a subwoofer.  It doesn’t take much volume these to produce base that can be felt in one’s chest.  And it goes without saying that the mid and high ranges are there to entertain.

I mentioned “transparency”... Voices come out of the center of the TV.  I have actually looked over at a side wall of the room at times because it seem that was where the sound was coming from.  How does that happen with 2 channel sound?  Amazing!

I have found a number of post on YouTube that showcase the qualities and range of the X-MTMs.  Here are a few that I greatly appreciate:

Hiromi Uehara - Voice - Vienna 2011 live https://youtu.be/nIYIAuwzsGQ
She plays a unique form of jazz.  The recordings are excellent and the 6 string base is amazing.  I like the drummer she has in this timeframe.  The later dummer is overdone.

Ahmad Jamal - Poinciana - Olympia Paris - live https://youtu.be/cytUz9KkK9M
This is just an amazing piano jazz recording.  Again the mixing did full justice to the bass playing as with everything else.

Eric Clapton & Peter Frampton - “While My Guitar Gently Weeps” https://youtu.be/K1ijcpo1Ep8
The expression on Peter Frampton’s face at the end of this is worth it alone to watch this.  He is clearly in awe of having just played beside Eric Clapton.

Cream (Royal Albert Hall 2005) https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL72C23EF77CEADE68
Anyone can appreciate this play list, not just those of my generation.  Eric, Jack and Ginger are still amazing and that is complimented by a recording worthy of their performance.

There are many others that should be listed here, I’m sure.  But that is beyond the point of this thread.

It is sufficient to say I will continue to enjoy everything I play through these.  And I hope anyone thinking about building a set of these dives in and does it.  They are worth well beyond any effort you will put into them.

[Hobbsmeerkat]

Had I not already bought a pair of X-Statiks currently in the middle of repairs/upgrades to them, along with my NX-Studio build the X-MTMs are probably the next of my list of speakers to build.. (along with the smaller, old N-3s if my deep cup mod proved to be a viable option, or maybe even a hybrid of the two... lol)

But I'm glad they've lived up to the hype! And eveb impressed the wife!

Speaking of the Clapton & Framton performance, I was lucky enough to be there for that concert! Crossroads 2019 was an amazing weekend, with a ton of amazing music, and the Frampton performance was absolutely incredible, even better than when I saw him in Tampa a couple weeks prior! 

Cheers! 

[JWCoffman]

This is great.  The track list is good and I'll be sure to check those out.  I found particular joy in revisiting some old standbys like anything off Kind of Blue (Miles Davis, as if I need to say it), Pink Floyd, even ELO had some additional fun that we had never heard before.
Conversely, we discovered that some of our favorite songs are not actually produced very well (either recording or mixing or both), which made them less enjoyable .  Audiophiles often get rightfully roasted for listening to the gear rather than the music, but these experiences start to illustrate why they (we? am I an audiophile now?) start to favor music that gains texture and depth with better equipment.
Your experience with the bass mirrors mine.  Not only is it deep, but it has some punch and life to it.  I'm so used to only flabby subwoofers providing those frequencies that things like stand up basses really come alive with these in a way I've not heard out of speakers before.

[Tyson]

It’s true, none of Danny’s speakers are ‘entry level’.  All of them are true high end performers.  The ones that you built, they would go for at least $5k and probably closer to $8k if built by a traditional speaker manufacturer. 

Re: poorly recorded music, IME it still sounds better on a great system than it would sound on a poor system, but it’s always a bit disappointing that it doesn’t have that magic that good recordings have. 

[jonsk2514]

Had I not already bought a pair of X-Statiks currently in the middle of repairs/upgrades to them, along with my NX-Studio build the X-MTMs are probably the next of my list of speakers to build.. (along with the smaller, old N-3s if my deep cup mod proved to be a viable option, or maybe even a hybrid of the two... lol)

But I'm glad they've lived up to the hype! And eveb impressed the wife!

Speaking of the Clapton & Framton performance, I was lucky enough to be there for that concert! Crossroads 2019 was an amazing weekend, with a ton of amazing music, and the Frampton performance was absolutely incredible, even better than when I saw him in Tampa a couple weeks prior! 

Cheers! 

If you ever get to building a set of the X-MTMs and do a build thread, feel free to let me know here...    It seems that everyone does their builds a little bit different from others and I am curious to see how people come through the build of these kits.

That concert had to have been fantastic.  I have a DVD of one of the earlier Crossroads concerts and it is a wonderful showcase of talent.  I did have to look up Peter Frampton as he didn’t look physically well in the YouTube video.  This is a quote from his web page (http://www.frampton.com/bio/) “... Frampton, who was recently diagnosed with inclusion body myositis (IBM), an inflammatory disease that weakens and atrophies the muscles in the arms, hands, and legs. “I’ll always be able to sing, but at the moment I don’t know how much longer I’ll be able to play guitar. Fortunately, I have a bunch of friends who can play guitar and help me out. Some of them are pretty good, too!” ”.  I am glad to see that he had this opportunity and continues to play.

This is great.  The track list is good and I'll be sure to check those out.  I found particular joy in revisiting some old standbys like anything off Kind of Blue (Miles Davis, as if I need to say it), Pink Floyd, even ELO had some additional fun that we had never heard before.
Conversely, we discovered that some of our favorite songs are not actually produced very well (either recording or mixing or both), which made them less enjoyable .  Audiophiles often get rightfully roasted for listening to the gear rather than the music, but these experiences start to illustrate why they (we? am I an audiophile now?) start to favor music that gains texture and depth with better equipment.
Your experience with the bass mirrors mine.  Not only is it deep, but it has some punch and life to it.  I'm so used to only flabby subwoofers providing those frequencies that things like stand up basses really come alive with these in a way I've not heard out of speakers before.

Very will put.  All of it.  And I have listened to the King of Blues...  plus others.

I especially liked “ listening to the gear rather than the music “.  Nope, not here.  Music, voice - it is all about the sound. And your description of the base response is spot on.  When I was building these I wondered how would these be able to drive down to 40 Hz with these tiny drivers....  Hearing is believing, and there is punch and life to it...

It’s true, none of Danny’s speakers are ‘entry level’.  All of them are true high end performers.  The ones that you built, they would go for at least $5k and probably closer to $8k if built by a traditional speaker manufacturer. 

Re: poorly recorded music, IME it still sounds better on a great system than it would sound on a poor system, but it’s always a bit disappointing that it doesn’t have that magic that good recordings have.

So true!
That is what I have read in comments about Danny’s designs.  Their performance value is really high.  I saw a New Record Day review of the Q Acoustic Concept 500 speakers (https://youtu.be/V3YkZx7Cbyc), which look surprisingly a lot like Danny’s X-MTMs.  They are about 10x the price of Danny’s kit.  I would think these provide a benchmark of the value of Danny’s X-MTMs.   And I have the added satisfaction of having made these myself.   

[Hobbsmeerkat]

If you ever get to building a set of the X-MTMs and do a build thread, feel free to let me know here...    It seems that everyone does their builds a little bit different from others and I am curious to see how people come through the build of these kits.

That concert had to have been fantastic.  I have a DVD of one of the earlier Crossroads concerts and it is a wonderful showcase of talent.  I did have to look up Peter Frampton as he didn’t look physically well in the YouTube video.  This is a quote from his web page (http://www.frampton.com/bio/) “... Frampton, who was recently diagnosed with inclusion body myositis (IBM), an inflammatory disease that weakens and atrophies the muscles in the arms, hands, and legs. “I’ll always be able to sing, but at the moment I don’t know how much longer I’ll be able to play guitar. Fortunately, I have a bunch of friends who can play guitar and help me out. Some of them are pretty good, too!” ”.  I am glad to see that he had this opportunity and continues to play.

Oh absolutely! It's a joy getting to share the process with everyone here, & get feedback and ideas from others! Not entirely sure to what level I'll end up building them, or if they'll even be for me (give them to family etc.)

That performance with Frampton was an absolute blast! I wish everyone could have experienced it first hand. And despite seeing 12ish concerts that year, it was definitely an experience that was more worth the cost of travel & admission.
Frampton honestly should have been the Friday headliner, there was just so much passion, fun and energy from the crowd, that it felt weird when Jeff Beck was the final act..

My dad recently got the 2 disc Blu-ray box for the 2019 Crossroads, as well as one or two older shows show that had about 3-4 hours of music, and it's super well done. I cant wait to see the full release that has closer to 8+ hours of content.. 

Glad to know I saw him twice within a month before his health and Covid became an issue.

But enough about me, enjoy those beautiful speakers, man!

[jonsk2514]

Years ago I took one of my Daughters to a concert she wanted to go to.  Green Day played and they were really good.  Their interaction with the audience was the best part.  Then the headliner got up and it was walk-out time...  Ugh!  I guess that happens all over the place where someone does so well they steal the show.

When I get this system all working... (new blu-ray player in the box waiting to be hooked up... ) I will need to invest in that box set of that concert.  I generally enjoy live concerts recordings more that studio recordings, so that should fit right into my collection.  Thanks for the heads up.   

And yes, back to listening to whatever strikes our fancy... 

[Panamarenko]

@jonsk2514
I'm considering building these speakers and took a lot of information from your posts. But I have still two questions:
- Probably difficult to answer, do you have any idea on the impact of placing the port holes in the front baffle on the basses?
- I whatched a lot of reviews about GR Research speakers. And some reviewers advise to add servo subs. Do you share the same opinion? Or are these speakers offering good basses?

Thanks

[Hobbsmeerkat]

Generally speaking, front porting allows them to be placed closer to the front walls, since rear porting would add bass reflection off the front walls when they're placed more closely, and would lead to them sounding boomy. Adding socks or port plugs would reduce bass extension a little but would allow for a clean front baffle, and closer wall placement.

[jonsk2514]

@jonsk2514
I'm considering building these speakers and took a lot of information from your posts. But I have still two questions:
- Probably difficult to answer, do you have any idea on the impact of placing the port holes in the front baffle on the basses?
- I whatched a lot of reviews about GR Research speakers. And some reviewers advise to add servo subs. Do you share the same opinion? Or are these speakers offering good basses?

Thanks

I had the same questions when I was looking to build these.  I corresponded with Danny about the placement of the port and I had read other posts about putting the port in the front.  Danny said putting the port in the front would be ok, but might cause some huffing.  My room is relatively small and I have these placed with the backs right up against the wall.  This would pretty much block the port if it was in the back.

My experience so far has been great.  I don’t have a side by side comparison to speakers with rear ports but these speakers far exceed my expectations.  I believe the reason for putting the port in the back and placing the speakers 3 to 4 feet from from the wall behind them is to give great ambiance to the sound.  This will be lost with the arrangement I have, but it is not something I notice.  Actually, I find that these speakers “disappear” when they are playing,  Maybe part of this is because I have rounded corners on the front baffle.  That is something Danny talks about in his video reviews of commercial speakers he gets in for upgrading.

Bass response on these also far exceeds my expectations.  Danny claims the design plays down to 40 Hz.  I believe it.  The bass is solid and full.  At times I feel the base in the floor, which is carpeted, and this is play at comfortable listening levels (TV shows for example).  They play down low enough to cover most music, even to catch the low notes Emerson, Lake and Palmer has been known to play.  Bass in a really good jazz recording comes through really nicely.  For that sort of listening I don’t feel the need to get a subwoofer.

Might I eventually get or make a subwoofer?  Maybe.  Right now I am just playing them in a 2 channel setup.  Eventually, I plan to have a full blown home theater setup.  Movie sound tracks have a channel that is specifically designed for a subwoofer and it might be worth it for that.  But, I will wait on that until I have the center and rear channel speakers done and see how it sounds without the subwoofer, before I decide.  Right now, my impression from having only listened to them in a 2 channel format is that they may be fine for home theater in my small room without a sub.  I could see a larger room needing a sub, though.

Hope this helps.