AudioCircle
Audio/Video Gear and Systems => The Acoustics Circle => Topic started by: soulforged on 18 Jun 2018, 02:59 pm
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Hello,
Any recommendation on the kind of drapes (material, brand, thickness...anything) that I could use to minimize the effects of glass windows?
My system is in the living room so lot of windows :( and high priority on WAF
Thanks!
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When I was married the significant other liked drapes, so I took the opportunity to muffle the room that had a very lively sound and put on double curtains. The external curtain should be thin and white, the internal should be a heavy, dark and opaque fabric.
For lively rooms this is the recipe.
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Hi FullRangeMan,
Did you find any drapery sources that had a better selection of product that was especially well suited as sound treatment for a large room with an excess of reflective surfaces and numerous large picture windows?
Thanks,
Robert
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There are different degrees of drapes that block out sunlight....you want the one that blocks out the most sunlight.
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Of course no, I dont tell nothing to the salesman or to my wife, the internal cloth was called juta, the external I dont remember as I let she choose. The result looks like this image below.
https://www.google.com.br/search?q=juta+para+cortinas&dcr=0&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiq5duIo97bAhULgZAKHe7ZCV4QsAQIMg&biw=1024&bih=678
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/dd/2b/d3/dd2bd3df17cf11a765dfb1d750549a4b.jpg)
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Drapes are minimally effective as absorbers, period. It's been awhile since I looked this up, but as I recall some studio drapes did the best (still very poor). What frequencies do you have compliants about?
My mom had 'insulating drapes' that had a rubber backing that were probably relatively good absorbers. Shears or anything that lets light through is probably going to be extremely ineffective.
FRM - in english it's called 'jute'.
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I have drapes. The window is very wide, and the drapes always opened. They are lined and pretty heavy.
With them open, and the nearby walls with shelving nearly to ceiling, the corners are sort of acoustically treated.
Sort of.
My Magnepan 20.7 are rather far apart (60"all space) in front of the window. And out 42" to 59" being tilted in, tweeter 'in' rather than out.
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This site (http://soundblackout.com/) looks interesting.
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From Floyd Toole's Sound Reproduction:
As shown in Figure 21.4, drapes can also be effective sound absorbers if they are of the right kind, and that is simply described as “heavy.” Heavy velour, the heavier the better, is probably the most popular choice because in its draped form it constitutes a resistive absorber of signifi cant thickness. Other heavy fabrics with the right porosity/fl ow resistance also work well, but lightweight, open-weave fabrics (easy to blow air through) are useful only for decorative purposes.
FIGURE 21.4 A fuzzy curve showing approximate absorption properties of heavy velour drapes, draped to one-half of their fl at area. The drapes should be hung on a track located 4–6 in. (10–15 cm) from the wall to ensure good low-frequency absorption.
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My wife & I moved last year and we have some beautiful Restoration Hardware drapes we will be selling .
Ask your wife if these would have the WAF . Really a nice quality lined drape to say the least. They are in a beige/camel color if
that is what you might be looking for.
We are just looking to get a little something out of them, not trying to make a killing.
Let me me know in PM if possible interest, I can send photos.
RH.com
If you go here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?reload=9&v=mu3BTqJANPQ you can see drapes at the 37 second mark ,1:13 mark( Pewter Grey in color ) & 1:30 mark on the video if your wife wants to check it out.
Regards,
Bill
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At a Price/Performance consideration THESE (https://www.wayfair.com/window-treatments/pdp/sun-zero-baxter-home-theater-grade-extreme-solid-max-blackout-thermal-grommet-single-curtain-panel-sunz1272.html) worked out well for me
(https://secure.img1-ag.wfcdn.com/im/90739703/resize-h800%5Ecompr-r85/4448/44484585/Baxter+Home+Theater+Grade+Extreme+Solid+Max+Blackout+Thermal+Grommet+Single+Curtain+Panel.jpg)
The BLACK also served well for significant Light Reduction.
They are THICK, HEAVY, OPAQUE, and QUIET.
Price is not bad either for a functional drape that also reduces reflected sound.
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https://www.bedbathandbeyond.com/1/1/904503-sun-zero-baxter-95-inch-rod-pocket-extreme-blackout-window-curtain-panel-grey.html
Like I said before the curtain that blocks out the most sunlight.
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Incredible low price, cant believe.
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Any additional thoughts on this topic or thoughts about these? https://www.acousticalsurfaces.com/acoustical_drapery/acoustical_curtains.htm
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Curtains can work as long as they have some thickness and weight. Also blinds when titled up a bit makes for good defusion, so together they work pretty well. Bass traps are still helpful as well as side wall treatments of some sort. I wanted a decent room but also one that looked good and not like a studio.
He a few pictures of the same room with 3 different systems as I treated them.
The current one is the Spatial open baffle speakers, even when I added the lamp with the large shade added so tighter middle imaging.
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=251743)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=251744)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=251745)
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I was recently visiting someone in the hospital and took notice of how really effective the curtain between the beds was at blocking and absorbing sound.I could hear nothing coming from the hallway or the people chatting in the next bed.I think something like that would work very well in front of windows with a more decorative drape over it on the room side.Perhaps Google hospital acoustic curtains and see what you could find out ?
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One of my sidewalls is wide glass patio doors and windows. I'm assuming that regular heavy drapes won't be sufficiently effective, so I wonder if these would tame my nasty echo / reverb problem (NRC of .8 suggests they would) :
https://vocalboothtogo.com/product-category/acoustic-sound-blankets-sound-absorption-panels-producers-choice/
My first thought was to mount on a rod and use them like regular curtains. But the span is 15' wide and 8' tall, and I think it would be too weighty and bulky. I'd probably mount them on 2 or 3 rods or lengths of wood.....which I'd suspend from the ceiling using chain and hooks.....and simply detach the rod and drop them to the floor when not seriously listening.
I think I'm OK with that because they'd be hidden behind the couch (see photo). But my hesitation is all the work to hang / drop them each time.
Any thoughts / suggestions?
Thanks....John
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=251754)
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Darko posted this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QzEh_sfpD00&t=370s
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I had seen that. I seriously doubt they will do anything. Too light and flimsy. Darko himself says to his ear they do nothing, as do many of the comments below the video. And his measurements effectively show no change in the FR, with the reverb time actually getting worse in some areas of the FR.
Not based on anything scientific, just gut and logic, but I believe to be effective curtains need to be weighty with a substantial NRC. The professional sound studio curtains I linked have these properties.
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Acoustical treatments must be judged by the numbers, not appearance although if you can see through them they can't be acoustically effective.
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This may help
https://www.acoustic-supplies.com/absorption-coefficient-chart/
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Thanks! :thumb:
Interesting that at 4 kHz 3" fiberglass board is more absorbent than 4". :scratch:
Typo?
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I bought these:
https://www.acoustic-curtains.com
The people at the company were really great, but the curtains are thin and were a complete waste of money in regards to acoustic performance. You will need something heavy and substantial to do work at all.
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I bought these:
https://www.acoustic-curtains.com
The people at the company were really great, but the curtains are thin and were a complete waste of money in regards to acoustic performance. You will need something heavy and substantial to do work at all.
Hearing so many negative reports about flimsy "absorbing curtains" like this....despite their claims of effectiveness. No getting around science, you just gotta go for the heavy ugly ones that look like moving blankets.......and try to live with the ugliness. I linked the company previously. Recording studios use them.
This guy went all out:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jMs1Z_K8cR8
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Thanks! :thumb:
Interesting that at 4 kHz 3" fiberglass board is more absorbent than 4". :scratch:
Typo?
ChatGPT?
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ChatGPT?
Don't understand the question.....
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This guy went all out:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jMs1Z_K8cR8
[/quote]
That looks like a lot of work to reduce it 10db or less.........maybe I'm not getting the whole picture and I would have a different experience if I was there. It does illustrate, as you're saying, that you really have to go all out with curtains to make any difference. I bought mine to being more like sound treatment in the room. That guy is doing more of a "sound proofing" type thing which is a whole different level and takes a lot more. I was buying curtains as a compromise with my wife because when I showed her some acoustic tiles she said "we're not putting those in the living room."
I did have some success in my garage with these for speaker testing:
https://www.audimute.com/sound-absorption-sheets
But again, these are sound absorbers and just treat the room. They won't do much for lower frequencies going through the wall.
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Those look very similar to the VOCALBOOTHTOGO products that I linked, with the same aim at managing echo / reverb. Priced about the same too.
My lower frequencies are pretty good so I don't need bass control. And I don't need to control sound entering or leaving the room. I'm only interested in dealing with echo / reverb from that big wall of windows. If further reverb control is needed after treating windows, I'll build acoustic panels for walls.