AudioCircle
Audio/Video Gear and Systems => The Starting Block / Introductions => Topic started by: sleepkyng on 29 Sep 2004, 03:05 am
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ok guys, i need help spendin money.
my setup is in the database
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?action=systems;system=400
i'm thinking of either getting:
a dac with toslink to go from my airport express (which is bitperfect)
a phono preamp for my TT (thinking parasound zphono) and a toshiba 3690 cdp
a new pair of speakers
max amount i can spend is 300, minimum is around 200
thanks in advanced
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How about diy some speakers?
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i don't have the time or tools (i'm in a dorm) to diy, but maybe someone else's assembled stuffs?
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Hm, you could consider posting a wanted post on madisound's forum. That's an interesting approach, could make for some good bargains.
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Try a single pair of single strand, plenum rated CAT5 for speaker cables. Nearly free and beats most sub $200 cables. It's recommended to keep the runs under 10 feet, no connectors necessary, just strip the ends and go. Twist additional pairs together to gain bass as you like.
Clean your connections to make huge improvements (see threads else where around here).
Add Panda Feet or vibrapods/vibracones under your components.
Hang stadium blankets or such up (soften the typical dorm block/plaster walls). Best place is on the wall behind the speakers, then anyway on the speaker end of the room.
Make sure your stuff is insured from theft, etc.
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I would think that Convergent Response Audio Phono (C.R.A.P) would be limiting your TT, so I'd go with the better phono. This assumes you're really interested in vinyl and have some way of getting enough LP's to make it worthwhile. You can borrow CD's from other students or the library, but chances are they won't be lending vinyl.
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Hey Sleepy
I agree with those who suggest taking a look at what you have. Build out from where you are. the Teac is about to become a legend of ValueKing audio components. Take a good look at "optimizing" that one in the future, she's a keeper.
The best and cheapest route to student sonic nirvana would be to think about power conditioning, ESPECIALLY with Tripath amps which absolutely demand it. These things require isolation, insulation, and power filtering. The cheapest best remedy would be to go onto Ebay and find a OneAC filter with transformer. This is the industrial version of the PS Audio Ultimate Outlet. This will scrub the crap out of the line that is, in your dorm, an electrical sewer that your stereo is drinking out of, with all those little fridges full of beer, electric bongs, and vibrators going off. It also has EMI and RFI filtering, both of which are produced by, and absorbed by Tripath chips. The overall quality of sound will jack up impressively with this little white box. Cost, about $20-40. Equivalent to a major component upgrade, with Tripath chips...
Next, like JLM said, throw up some blankets to kill those deadly reflections in that cell of yours.
I think the Panda Feet and Cat 5 cabling are stunningly wise suggestions. Start with this stuff and see how you like it. Total outlay: $50, with change left over for a quarter ounce, and a pony keg :lol:
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ok guys, i need help spendin money.
my setup is in the database
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?action=systems;system=400
i'm thinking of either getting:
a dac with toslink to go from my airport express (which is bitperfect)
a phono preamp for my TT (thinking parasound zphono) and a toshiba 3690 cdp
a new pair of speakers
max amount i can spend is 300, minimum is around 200
thanks in advanced
get the acurus p10 fono stage adwertized on a-gon
http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?preaphon&1101657837
oops - sold in less than 24 hours - there's a reason for that! :wink: i'd look for something like that.
or, if there's good fm in your area, find a good vintage tuner - for <$300, you can get one that will rival the best digital & analog sources. check out this site:
http://www.fmtunerinfo.com/index.html
re: dac; keep the mensa di/o, & get one of these for use w/toslink - they work great; <200ps jitter. awailable from joel (x1116) at http://fullcompass.com/
he also has others, likely as good, for less $$$
(http://www.radiodesignlabs.com/Images/fp-spr1.jpg)
http://www.rdlnet.com/fp-spr1.htm
doug s.
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$200-$300 won't make that much difference in an audio system.
Learn as much about the stock market as you possibly can, then save up a bit more and invest in options.
If you are good, in a relatively short while you will be able to buy any audio system you would want....nice houses and cars too.
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Ahh, Mr Sleepkyng, the age old question of how to invest limited $$ - I live this, though I am lucky enough to do it a couple of times per year - now, if I could ONLY save up that money each time, and drop a K on some gear once a year...
In any case, to your question.
The smART DIO is good, but the Mensa is better, and about a $150 upgrade. A good thought.
A used Monarchy DIP might also prove a good way to translate Toslink to SPDIF, and reduce jitter also.
I second the Cat5e speaker cable idea also.
In any case, Marbles is on the right track, IF you can save up the dough, you can move forward faster, but if not, there are things that you can incrementally improve along the way.
Good luck, keep us posted!
mark in Canada
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If I had 2-300, I'd buy music... specifically good vinyl.
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I would only add to this that CAT6 is built to better tolerances for signal transmission. It's insulation is teflon and conductors are solid core 24 ga. copper and there is a spacer to keep the bundles in a correct twist for EMI/RFI interference...it's better than the CAT3, CAT5 and even CAT5e's out there.
It's truly a poor man's Kimber 4TC.
I have to thank Mark Hampton of ZCable for turning me on to the stuff.
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Outside of the spacer, the Cat5e that I have is the physical equivalent to the listed Cat6, but perhaps that spacer is important.
If I can find a supply of it, I will give it a run.
mark :mrgreen:
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Mark,
I have been told, specifically, Mohawk brand of CAT6 is best. That's what I have. Not that I have heard any other CAT6's.
I just looked on the jacket and it didn't indicate country of manufacture...I know you get some different brands than we do here in the states.
It does say 'Mohawk / CDT Gigalan (TM) CAT.6 4PR. 24 AWG' on the jacket.
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I would agree with the OneAC isolation transformer - then I would look at the speakers. I have recommended the Wharfedales to others as a speaker you can get for sub $100 that really isn't too offensive, but you would certainly hear more of the Teac's virtues if you upgrade your speakers. Here is something available on ebay from a diy'er who has been a frequent contributor on the Madisound and Parts Express boards.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=14991&item=5723307944&rd=1
If you would prefer something more traditional looking, you might consider the Polk Rti-28. It sounds okay as is, and the cabinet quality is sufficient to be worth tweaking the crossover later - if you ever get into that. Dennis Murphy (www.murphyblaster.com) has posted a crossover revision.
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in terms of speakers, what about axiom speakers?
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A nice Canadian company, located in Cottage country, north of Toronto.
Very well reviewed speakers, in particular the M22ti, and smaller M3ti. Metal dome, aluminum woofers, bookshelf, shielded, decent little speakers that might grow into HT with you, if that is a direction that interests you.
BUT, for the $$, if you can find a set of Totem Rokk (yes, I have a set, but am not selling...) in your price range, I would jump at those too.
mark in Canada
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i have a pair of michaura m55's close to the m22 axiom(m55's are made by axiom) they are a nice sounding speaker
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but mark, isn't it time for another speaker upgrade for you? :D
i heard the michaura's were no longer being made?
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I would only add to this that CAT6 is built to better tolerances for signal transmission. It's insulation is teflon and conductors are solid core 24 ga. copper and there is a spacer to keep the bundles in a correct twist for EMI/RFI interference.
ChairGuy, do you have a link to a recipe you have used? Solid vs. stranded? Plenum vs. non-plenum? Braiding? etc.
Thanks!
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Ahh, the cheeky Mr Kyng, trying to prod me into a speaker upgrade - back, back swine!
Actually, I am on the hunt for a pair of the Fostex FX200 drivers for a DIY project I am DYING to get going, BUT they are discontinued - arghh!
I am slated to lend an ear to the Horn Shoppe Horns in the next 6 weeks or so, when my Teac returns from Bolder, since a guy local to me has a set of the horns... We will see.
Now, back to Sleepkyng, and his speakers.
What would you like more of, or less of, that has you considering speakers?
mark in Canada
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well, i just feel like the wharfedales can't really handle the teac. they can't go that loud, the presentation is decent at best, the soundstage is really bad. i want detail and lots of it. i want it to handle highs and really shine with classical music.
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OK, a good, honest description of what you have, and what you want - always a good starting point.
Now, I HATE to be THAT guy, but I have to wonder - how much of the soundstaging concern comes from the dorm room... in my days (yes, a few years ago - OK 14 years ago...) dorm rooms were concrete walls, plain painted, empty rooms - not exactly the kind of room conductive to soundstaging - all that reflective surface crushing the individual placement of instruments etc.
If that is off base, then what you describe might be well suited to metal dome tweeters - reknowned for being bright (but will communicate all detail) and yes I am generalizing here, so the Axiom fits the bill there too.
Now, that said, perhaps you will yield more pleasure from a more significant upgrade, having waited a little longer... maybe you can hang on for a couple of months, and spend some Christmas $$, along with your funds now, and get a better speaker at that point?
I can say that the Teac has plenty of potential, and in my system really came on song at around the 130 hour mark, with treble smoothing out, and detail supremely evident.
Not sure if I have helped or hindered...
Mark in Canada
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here's what i'm to do:
oneac (which model number?)
and hold off on speaker upgrade till i got more dough
cheers and thanks!
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Hmmm. From heaphones, the output is purely from the Melos, and you have good headphones, so unless you are upset with that output, that means leave the source, alone, leave the Melos alone, and leave the cans alone.
Which would leave....the speakers. First point has already been mentioned, but not confirmed -- standard dorm room? If so, that means horrible acoustics, odd placement, and a small room. If this is what you are after, I would look to small drivers, single drivers, or ideally....waiting until after school to even bother upgrading. Spend the rest on women.
If you aren't happy with output from headphones, I'd second the recommendation to try a OneAC unit. Not the "Buy-it-Now' eBay prices, but keep your eye out, and you'll find a true steal, and one that if you're unhappy with it, can easily resell. If that doesn't tide you over, then _possibily_ consider the DAC route.
In a small room, and most likely a highly reflective room, I'd think forgiving speakers, and single driver speakers. Highly accurate treble is the last thing you need, and same goes for ideas like driver integration. My first thought here would be the Jordan's...then maybe vintage speakers....then maybe Fostex. Heck, you're best back for the buck might actually be to pick up a (gasp!)....equalizer....but then again, you cold do that from your computer.
If you listen to a lot of vinyl, the preamp would probably be your best bang for buck....if not, one intriguing option might be one of the Lite units (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=3843541633&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT) Honestly though, I'd stick to simplicity while still in the dorms....
If you're in a 13x13 room though, you may not be hitting high SPL, and I don't know the speaker's characteristics. If that's the case, than the little TriPath may be happier with a higher impedance load much more so than finding yourself the greatest sensitivity you can find....
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ok, i'm set on the oneac purchase and holding off for now on everything else.
which oneac unit should i get and how much should i max pay for it?
cheers and thanks alot for all the help! you guys are great!
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ok, i'm set on the oneac purchase and holding off for now on everything else.
which oneac unit should i get and how much should i max pay for it?
cheers and thanks alot for all the help! you guys are great!
brand doesn't have to be oneac, there's lots of others out there. go to ebay & do a search on "isolation transformer". i found this after a quick search:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=4665&item=3843298077&rd=1
(http://i15.ebayimg.com/03/i/00/ab/e3/19_1.JPG)
this isn't a *bad* price, but ya can do even better, if you're patient. and that size, at 4.3a, should be enuff for your entire set-up. personally, i'd get three - one each for your cdp, dac, the rest of the system.
here's a bigger one:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=73173&item=3843804752
or go nuts, & get one of these:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=71391&item=3844059862&rd=1
(http://i3.ebayimg.com/01/i/01/e6/77/c9_1_b.JPG)
these *can* be found cheaper, tho - i got a 2.5kva unit for less than that, & it included shipping, a not-insubstantial amount; these are heavy. also, the mondo units like that are likely to hum, so don't get a mondo isolation x-former if this is an issue that you are not prepared to address or live with.
doug s.
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http://search.ebay.com/oneac-cp_W0QQsojsZ1QQfromZR40QQsatitleZoneacQ20cp*
http://www.oneac-powercom.com/60HzPowerConditioners.html#cond1cp
CP1107 is what I have.
All of the current ads show $15-20 fixed shipping, which really isn't bad considering how much they weigh.
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http://search.ebay.com/oneac-cp_W0QQsojsZ1QQfromZR40QQsatitleZoneacQ20cp*
http://www.oneac-powercom.com/60HzPowerConditioners.html#cond1cp
CP1107 is what I have.
All of the current ads show $15-20 fixed shipping, which really isn't bad considering how much they weigh.
those also look wery nice. tho i think the cp1107, for starting bid of $59, buy-it-now of $69, is a bit high. i'm not sure which model, but i got a 12.5a oneac for <$50, & that included shipping.
doug s.
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Same -- can't recall exactly what I paid, but was certainly less. Keep an eye out for the non-Buy-it-Now auctions. If you see that any of the BIN sellers continually sell these units week after week, and thus have a ton of stock, at auction end it couldn't hurt to throw them an offer either for a quick sale....
As mentioned previously, there are tons of different makes and models, and searches for power conditioner, or isolation transformer, or anything related will yield you all sorts of results. Regarding brand and age, search through AA and other message boards -- a few brands and models seem to have great reputation for hum....
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http://www5.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=88368
Thought you might like the look of these - exactly like mine...
Mark in Canada