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Industry Circles => Daedalus Audio => Topic started by: mca on 9 Feb 2015, 04:17 pm

Title: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: mca on 9 Feb 2015, 04:17 pm
I just bought a used pair of Ulysses, they are at the factory getting some upgrades from Lou and I hope to pick them up in about a month. With that being said, I hope to get some ideas and opinions on amplifiers  :D

Right now I have a Butler 5 channel amp and pair of Will Vincent Dynaco monoblocks. I'm thinking they deserve something a little better to drive them.

What are you using and what do you like about the combo?
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Berto on 9 Feb 2015, 05:51 pm
I've tried many amp and this was my favorite.  Sounds huge, dynamic, and intoxicating!  Tube Research Labs ST100 with Kt150s
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=81648)

Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: shahed on 9 Feb 2015, 06:57 pm
I also use the Tube Research Lab ST100 amplifier with KT150 tubes (with Lampi level 7 and volume control) albeit with Daedalus Athena V.2. This is by far the best sounding amp I have ever used. However, I previously owned Daedalus Ulysses and used ModWright KWA100SE. The ModWright is a great value for money and is a great choice if you are on a budget. There's a well known synergy between ModWright and Daedalus.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: mca on 9 Feb 2015, 07:38 pm
There is a great deal right now on Agon for a KWA100SE. I know Lou likes the KWA150, but I don't know the differences between the two amps.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: sunnydaze on 9 Feb 2015, 08:44 pm
Power output is likely the main diff.......100 vs 150 wpc.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: aldcoll on 9 Feb 2015, 09:01 pm
I believe the 100 is Mosfet powered.  Could be wrong :scratch:

From the Modwright manual.
KWA 100SE Upgrades:

·   Upgraded signal path capacitors – MWI Custom Oil-impregnated poly types.
·   Upgraded signal path resistors – Takman Carbon Film.
·   Total output power supply capacitance increased 100%
·   Total number of output devices (MOSFET Pairs) increased from 3 pairs to 5 pairs.
·   Sonic differences between KWA 100 and KWA 100SE:
o   Greater overall current available to output stage, translating to increased speed, bass response, resolution and micro-detail/dynamics.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: roboss38 on 9 Feb 2015, 10:27 pm
I'm currently demoing a Pass Labs XA30.8 with my Argos, and it is a fantastic combo.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: aldcoll on 9 Feb 2015, 11:02 pm
Any body have any comments on the Wells out of Campbell CA and Modwright?   I noticed a couple Daedalus Owners have posted they are moving to Wells Innamorata I believe.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: jonbee on 9 Feb 2015, 11:41 pm
I just bought a used pair of Ulysses, they are at the factory getting some upgrades from Lou and I hope to pick them up in about a month. With that being said, I hope to get some ideas and opinions on amplifiers  :D
Congratulations! Getting a pair used and upgrading offers tremendous value and killer sound. It is what I did with my DA-RMas.
I use my upgraded Hypex NC-400 NCore amp. It is lightning fast, very transparent and very powerful.
The Daedalus transparently display every little upstream change, so dialing them in over time is pretty easy, but everything counts, so expect to have a lot of fun fiddling with changes!
I've gone to Wywires Platinum speaker cables, a match made in heaven (Lou uses a wywires harness inside V2s).
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: fwinston on 10 Feb 2015, 01:01 am
I own a pair of Ulysses with all-poly crossover and V2 upgrade.  About a month ago I took delivery of a Wells Audio Innamorata Signature amp.  It's an excellent match to the Ulysses.  The Wells amp is as smooth, textured, and dimensional sounding as a tube amp along with the frequency extension, clarity, and control of a solid state amp.  I'm very impressed with its sound.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: aldcoll on 10 Feb 2015, 01:09 am
Might I ask what the Wells replaced?
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: fwinston on 10 Feb 2015, 01:13 am
The Wells amp replaced Manley tube amps.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: jriggy on 10 Feb 2015, 01:18 am
Congrats mca!!!

Our audio paths have been similar a couple times and have crossed, gear wise and selling/buying wise, before. I am happy to hear of your purchase.


I owned the KWA-100SE with my past Ulysses. I liked it a lot! Im sure others can comment on how much better the KWA-150SE is. We know it is a better amp but I still loved the 100SE.

For a few reasons, I ended up moving to an integrated (well before Dan had his KWI-200 available, or I likely would of been there).
For room issues and other reasons not related, I have since moved to a pair of Argos V2's and was happy with my Accuphase E-560...then a friend brought down the Wells Audio Innamorata he was demoing. I got to keep it for a week or so and was...well, enamored.
I am currently breaking in a Wells amp.  Im sure one of us will report at some point after break-in and getting to know the amp, Nonexistent noise-floor and everything else in its place, its just sounds so right. and so smooth.
[looks like my friend mentioned here has posted while I was typing :thumb:]


aldcoll,

 I promis I will return your PM soon!

~J
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 10 Feb 2015, 04:12 am
Congratulations! Getting a pair used and upgrading offers tremendous value and killer sound. It is what I did with my DA-RMas.
I use my upgraded Hypex NC-400 NCore amp. It is lightning fast, very transparent and very powerful.
The Daedalus transparently display every little upstream change, so dialing them in over time is pretty easy, but everything counts, so expect to have a lot of fun fiddling with changes!
I've gone to Wywires Platinum speaker cables, a match made in heaven (Lou uses a wywires harness inside V2s).

Just to clarify, we do NOT use any Wywires wire in our speakers. We may or may not do that in the future as the Wywires products are excellent, but at this time we source our own wires for our harnesses. Also while the Wywires platinum speaker cables are very good we highly recommend our own proprietary speaker cables (which Wywires builds to our spec), these are based on our internal speaker wiring.

As for interconnects I am a huge fan of the Wywires Platinum IC's!!! :thumb:

thanks,
lou


btw Jon, thanks for all the kind words and support, glad you like your DA-RMa's!!!
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: jtwrace on 10 Feb 2015, 04:24 am
Do you still use DH Labs as listed on their site (http://silversonic.com/docs/partners.html)? 
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Quiet Earth on 10 Feb 2015, 04:30 am
I'm kind of curious why people are using such powerful solid state amplifiers for such efficient speakers. Do the speakers need to play at a minimum loudness level to sound good? I was thinking (from memory) that these speakers were something like 96dB efficient and an easy 8 ohms. Maybe I remember that wrong. The website doesn't work on my iPad so I can't check it out. I'm sure someone can straighten me out on the facts.

I'm only asking because I thought that these would be great speakers for single ended triode amps, say 300B or 211 amps of 8 to 17 watts.  Or maybe a small and simple pentode amp, like El84 or El34. Anyone using anything like that?
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 10 Feb 2015, 05:01 am
Do you still use DH Labs as listed on their site (http://silversonic.com/docs/partners.html)?
absolutely NOT. We only briefly used DH Labs, it has been almost ten years since.

We use several different wires from a few sources, all very very good.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 10 Feb 2015, 05:31 am
I'm kind of curious why people are using such powerful solid state amplifiers for such efficient speakers. Do the speakers need to play at a minimum loudness level to sound good? I was thinking (from memory) that these speakers were something like 96dB efficient and an easy 8 ohms. Maybe I remember that wrong. The website doesn't work on my iPad so I can't check it out. I'm sure someone can straighten me out on the facts.

I'm only asking because I thought that these would be great speakers for single ended triode amps, say 300B or 211 amps of 8 to 17 watts.  Or maybe a small and simple pentode amp, like El84 or El34. Anyone using anything like that?

This is a very good question.  Just as there are many reasons for using efficient speakers beyond matching with low power amps, there are also many reasons for using high power solid state amps beyond needing power to drive the chosen speakers.
One is that usually there is more extension and control in the bass with powerful solid state than with tubes, (please note I said "usually" as in everything in audio there are always exceptions). Of course a primary reason is dynamics. Even with a fairly efficient speaker, having amplifier headroom can open up the dynamic range. I have a link on the site to a PDF from Musical Fidelity about amplifiers and dynamic range. Imagine you are listening on my speakers (95db-98db 1w/1m) and the amplifier is running at about 5 watts when there is a sharp hit on the snare drum and you need more. In a really well recorded piece with little compression the attack on that snare may be ten to fifteen db higher than the ambient level. That means for that moment you need not 5 watts but 50-200 watts. Granted a really good tube amp will give you a LOT more than rated power for those split second dynamics but if your taste runs to well recorded music with percussion and you like to turn it up then there is a reason for all that headroom. 
There are of course many reasons for each type of amplifier and it really revolves around personal taste but having efficient speakers just opens up the possibilities for all kinds of amplifiers.

To answer the question, the speakers are very consistent in their sound at any volume level... they do not NEED to be played loud.
I have people using these with flea power SET and with huge Class A, the speakers work very well with both.

One of the primary reasons for designing with efficient speakers is that they are FAST and effortless, that has always been the real beauty of horns and other efficient designs. An amplifier doesn't drive them, it unleashes them. With that speed and ease comes the subtle harmonics and trasients which to my mind are the life of the music.

I know I got a little windy here and I hope that wasn't at all pedantic?
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: aldcoll on 10 Feb 2015, 05:33 am
I'm kind of curious why people are using such powerful solid state amplifiers for such efficient speakers. Do the speakers need to play at a minimum loudness level to sound good? I was thinking (from memory) that these speakers were something like 96dB efficient and an easy 8 ohms. Maybe I remember that wrong. The website doesn't work on my iPad so I can't check it out. I'm sure someone can straighten me out on the facts.

I'm only asking because I thought that these would be great speakers for single ended triode amps, say 300B or 211 amps of 8 to 17 watts.  Or maybe a small and simple pentode amp, like El84 or El34. Anyone using anything like that?

I have a pair of Pans and they are the least efficant at 95 db if I remember.  And as for the high power on the SS side, as I am looking for a SS amp the real quality ones start at 100 watts.
When I was at Lou"s listening to speakers via a Modwright 150se he thought we were only using 15-20 watts at what I would call my  loud level.

I personally am avoiding tubes for several reason and looking for a great SS that will last many years as I don't swap.  Crap its hard enough to get the Pans past the wife :nono: 
But I have to say meeting Lou sure won her over on the deal.  She truly liked the way he treated us both times we visited.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: beaglebump on 11 Feb 2015, 04:08 pm
I've been extremely pleased with the synergy bet. my Athena v.2's and Simaudio Moon W-5/P-5 combo for much the same reasons as Lou describes above.  With the Athena being as efficient as they are, the high power from the W-5 provides tons of headroom for an absolutely beautiful presentation at low amplitudes, which is where we enjoy most of our listening.  Sure, speed, transients, and dynamic spectrum are crystal clean, but the organic nature of the Athena voicing keeps it real.  That's not to say I've not often been "tube curious" or what an even finer ss power plant might provide, but frankly, I'm hard pressed to imagine how the presentation I'm currently enjoying could improve. 
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: BobRex on 11 Feb 2015, 07:09 pm
Imagine you are listening on my speakers (95db-98db 1w/1m) and the amplifier is running at about 5 watts when there is a sharp hit on the snare drum and you need more. In a really well recorded piece with little compression the attack on that snare may be ten to fifteen db higher than the ambient level. That means for that moment you need not 5 watts but 50-200 watts. Granted a really good tube amp will give you a LOT more than rated power for those split second dynamics but if your taste runs to well recorded music with percussion and you like to turn it up then there is a reason for all that headroom. 

For some reason, these numbers always give me gas.  Let's look at it another way.  In a "typical" listening room, with the speaker to listener distance of 10-12 feet, how much volume (SPL) is lost due to distance?  I know the math, but what is reality vs. theory?  Lets use your scenario with a pair of Ulysses.  With 5 watts I'm going to assume an average listening level of 98dB to meet your wattage goals.  Now 98dB average is TOO DAMN LOUD - sorry I had to shout over the "noise", and 112dB is downright dangerous.  If the average listening level is closer to oh, I dunno, 85dB (which is still TDL, just ask OSHA :)) then the amplifier would be using .5 watts and you would need 5-20 watts to maintain the same headroom.  Drop the average level to 75dB (and now I won't have to shout, just raise my voice a little) you could get by with dynamic peaks of around 95dB and run with just 2 or 3 watts, maybe a nice little 2A3 amp. 

I would also think that thermal compression is going to occur in your example, so some chunk of that power is just dumped as heat, aka wasted power.

Now I realize that changing the room size will impact these numbers, as will the dynamics of the program, but how is your original scenario not TDL?
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: vortrex on 11 Feb 2015, 07:17 pm
I had 22 tube watts with my Pans in a 19' x 14' room and it was amazing.  I don't get the desire for all those watts either.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: aldcoll on 11 Feb 2015, 07:55 pm
I had 22 tube watts with my Pans in a 19' x 14' room and it was amazing.  I don't get the desire for all those watts either.

I don't desire the watts.  But I want the sound or the amp and it just happens to make the watts.  I don't need ALL of the watts but the 50-90 watt solid state line up is limited.

I have asked several folks their opinion and I will use Modwright as a example.  the 100SE is Mosfet and the 150 isn't.  diffrent Sounds.

And I will admit I am short on all the Science and digits (out side of the price tag) and I am looking for a sound.  Why does Boulder build their monsters?  Yes there might just be a need for MASSIVE wattage but my guess there is some Male envy?  :scratch:
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Audioclyde on 12 Feb 2015, 12:18 am
I've powered my DA-RMa's with a 100wpc Enlightened Audio Design solid state amp, the very good Thor Audio TPA30 monos (EL34 based tube amp), an inexpensive but darn good Class D amp, a 300B integrated,  3 wpc 45 based SET amp, currently an around 4 wpc 2A3 SET amp, and soon a pair of Audio Note Quest Silver 300B mono amps.

So while I haven't necessarily tried a great higher powered ss amp (although the little EAD I listed first is darn good), I very much prefer the sound I get with the 'flea powered SET amps I've had. 

Randy
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Quiet Earth on 12 Feb 2015, 12:33 am
Hey Randy,
Which Class D amp did you use? Kind of curious about those right now.....
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Audioclyde on 12 Feb 2015, 01:08 am
Hey Randy,
Which Class D amp did you use? Kind of curious about those right now.....

A modded/upgraded TBI Millenia MG3 (amp is topic of a long thread and a demo tour here on AC from a couple years ago). Surprisingly good for the low price--I've hung on to mine for 'emergency' duty-- it isn't going to tempt you to give up those Silver Signatures (I tried to add a smiley face!!)
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Quiet Earth on 12 Feb 2015, 02:44 am
Thanks man! Yes, I remember that thread now.  Just trying to stay current and keep an open mind. Here's that smiley for you:  :D

  8)
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 12 Feb 2015, 03:59 am
Here is that PDF

http://www.daedalusaudio.com/images/loudspeaker%20sensitivity.pdf (http://www.daedalusaudio.com/images/loudspeaker%20sensitivity.pdf)

The biggest variable here is what one listens to and at what volume level. That is why there is no 'correct' answer as to how much power is enough. That is one reason we design these to work with such a wide range of amplifiers and to have a consistent tonality at pretty much any volume. Even in this paper they are making assumptions as to what constitutes a "reasonable" listening volume.

thanks,
lou
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: nnck on 12 Feb 2015, 04:14 am
I have both a Modwright KWA100SE and a Music Reference RM200II amp which i use with my Daedalus DA1.1 speakers. Both work quite well and I'm pleased with them both.

Although I have never heard the KWA150SE, I have read some some reviews comparing it to the 100SE. It seemed that the 100SE was considered to have more of a 'tube sound' than the 150SE. As to how much more of a tube sound - I dont know. But I think this was mentioned in the 6 Moons reviews and I may have read it from another source as well. So depending what sound you want, that might help you.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: BobRex on 12 Feb 2015, 01:55 pm
Here is that PDF

http://www.daedalusaudio.com/images/loudspeaker%20sensitivity.pdf (http://www.daedalusaudio.com/images/loudspeaker%20sensitivity.pdf)

The biggest variable here is what one listens to and at what volume level. That is why there is no 'correct' answer as to how much power is enough. That is one reason we design these to work with such a wide range of amplifiers and to have a consistent tonality at pretty much any volume. Even in this paper they are making assumptions as to what constitutes a "reasonable" listening volume.

thanks,
lou

I'm familiar with the paper, I saw it many years ago when it was published / reviewed in HIFI+.  That issue even came with a little calculator to determine power needs. 

Yes, Michaelson made a number of liberal assumptions, but he covers himself well.  His basic premise is to determine the higherst SPL, subtract the speaker efficiency, then subtract looses due to distance.  The resulting figure is dB is what you need from an amplifier.  I've always had problems with the maximum SPL based on an orchestra.  What works in a performance hall where the sound is coming into a large audience space and from a largish wave launch, doesn't translate directly into a listening room that's smaller by a magnitude or 2, and being being produced by a couple of tiny transducers. Something's gotta give. Additionally, the loss due to distance figure is based upon a point source speaker - change that and the numbers change.

It was rather ironic that a manufacturer that had just come out with a 1KW amplifier, needed to justify the rationale for coming out with a 1KW amplifier in the first place.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 12 Feb 2015, 05:46 pm
I'm familiar with the paper, I saw it many years ago when it was published / reviewed in HIFI+.  That issue even came with a little calculator to determine power needs. 

Yes, Michaelson made a number of liberal assumptions, but he covers himself well.  His basic premise is to determine the higherst SPL, subtract the speaker efficiency, then subtract looses due to distance.  The resulting figure is dB is what you need from an amplifier.  I've always had problems with the maximum SPL based on an orchestra.  What works in a performance hall where the sound is coming into a large audience space and from a largish wave launch, doesn't translate directly into a listening room that's smaller by a magnitude or 2, and being being produced by a couple of tiny transducers. Something's gotta give. Additionally, the loss due to distance figure is based upon a point source speaker - change that and the numbers change.

It was rather ironic that a manufacturer that had just come out with a 1KW amplifier, needed to justify the rationale for coming out with a 1KW amplifier in the first place.
Good points and a 1KW amplifier begs a speaker that can handle that,eh?
 
 As you say he covers himself well and I only keep this on the site because it shows the basic math well.  Dynamic range is a big part of music and limited by many factors in the recording and playback process.

Bottom line is what sounds right to you in your own home.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Scottdazzle on 12 Feb 2015, 09:11 pm
I use a Zesto Bia 120 and a ModWright KWA 150SE with my Athenas. Both work spectacularly well with them.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: easystreet on 13 Feb 2015, 02:30 am
I use a Crayon CFA 1.2 integrated amp with my Athena v.2. The Crayon puts out about 75 watts into the steady 6 ohm load of the Athenas. It is a solid state amp from Austria. See 6moons for a good review. It is the best pairing I've heard with my Athenas. Extremely good bang for the buck at $6k. Crayon just came out with a less powerful integrated that promises even better bang for the buck at about $3200.

Initially, I drove the Athenas with a 10-watt Shindo Cortese single-ended tube amp and a Shindo Monbrison preamp. This pairing produced some luscious, dense, immediate tone and was very musical. Together, these amps retail over $20k but did not prove as accurate, transparent, or ultimately satisfying as the Crayon. Still, there was absolutely no problem that I had with dynamics, headroom, or ability to play loud music loud.

I've also driven the speakers with a 15-watt Bakoon integrated solid state amp that was similar to the Crayon and is another good value.

I've heard the Ulysses with a 200 watt Modwright amp; this was another good pairing. And I've listened to jonbee's DA-RMAs with his very powerful N-Core amps and completely agree with him that the sound is transparent, fast, and conveys a sense of total ease, especially with complex music. Fantastic value.

Bottom line:  it is a testament to Lou's acumen as a designer that his speakers sound so damn good with so many disparate amps!
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: roboss38 on 13 Feb 2015, 04:43 am
For the last week, I've had my Argos v2 paired with a Pass Labs XA30.8. The XA30.8 is 30 watts of pure Class A power. The combination of the XA30.8, the Ref 5 SE, and the Argos is simply stunning. The XA30.8 will not be going back to Reno HiFi.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: david12 on 25 Feb 2015, 05:30 pm
 A very interesting discussion, which seems to suggest you can use pretty much what you like, 3 watt SETs to 300+ of SS power. I think the key is quality needs quality. Lou's speakers are undemanding as far as specific amps are concerned, but they are revealing. In general, power costs money, I mean high quality power here. So a high quality 30 watt amp will drive Lou's speakers admirably, as will a 200 watt high quality amp. The latter is going to cost you so much more.

 I happen to like tubes and find it difficult to understand why you would use a SS amp. I know Modwright are good, but they don't produce a sound I happen to like. My DA-RMAs sound just wonderful with the ARC Ref 75 power amp, even better re tubed with KT150s, instead of 120's. It is just an exceptional amplifier and makes a wonderful sound with my speakers. If you get the chance, try a loaner 75 from a local dealer, with your speakers. I suspect you won't send it back.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: roboss38 on 25 Feb 2015, 05:54 pm
A very interesting discussion, which seems to suggest you can use pretty much what you like, 3 watt SETs to 300+ of SS power. I think the key is quality needs quality. Lou's speakers are undemanding as far as specific amps are concerned, but they are revealing. In general, power costs money, I mean high quality power here. So a high quality 30 watt amp will drive Lou's speakers admirably, as will a 200 watt high quality amp. The latter is going to cost you so much more.

 I happen to like tubes and find it difficult to understand why you would use a SS amp. I know Modwright are good, but they don't produce a sound I happen to like. My DA-RMAs sound just wonderful with the ARC Ref 75 power amp, even better re tubed with KT150s, instead of 120's. It is just an exceptional amplifier and makes a wonderful sound with my speakers. If you get the chance, try a loaner 75 from a local dealer, with your speakers. I suspect you won't send it back.

In the end, I sent back the Pass Labs XA30.8 and put the Rogue Audio Stereo 100 back in the rack. I've got the Rogue running in triode mode, and it sounds wonderful with my Reference 5 SE and Argos. Maybe I'll demo a Ref 75, and see what that offers up. In the end, I've reaffirmed again that I'm a tube guy.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: fwinston on 25 Feb 2015, 08:58 pm
After auditioning at least half a dozen solid state and tube amps I chose the Wells Audio Innamorata Signature to drive my Daedalus Audio Ulysses V2 speakers. My prior amps were tube monoblocks so it was important to me to find an amp that excelled in the harmonic richness that tubes do so well along with having greater dynamics and bass weight and control that tube amps often struggle with doing well. The Signature amp does it all. The sound is as sweet and tonally fleshed out as my tube amps but with significantly better clarity, frequency extension, and bass control. I couldn't be happier.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: audiotom on 5 Apr 2015, 09:08 pm
I have tried three amps with my Daedalus Ulysses

Atmaphere MA1s mono blocks  Output TransformerLess. -100 watts scary black, decays on volume of various instruments, no grain.   Likes higher ohm loads

Audio by Van Alstine 300r.  Hybrid tube/ mosfet over design. 300 watts  (600 watts into 4 ohm). Strong bass, not as refined but good

A rare Doshi Jhor mono blocks showed up on audiogon while I was breaking in the V2 upgrade
80 watts of pull tube heaven

I have it paired with my Doshi Aalap preamp

Match made in Heaven
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: catastrofe on 6 Apr 2015, 02:26 am
I ran my Ulysses with Atma-Sphere MA-1 mono-blocks in conjunction with Speltz Autoformers.  Sounded fantastic.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: vinyl_lady on 6 Apr 2015, 03:28 am
ModWright KWA 150 SE -- a match made in heaven :thumb:
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: audiotom on 6 Apr 2015, 04:04 am
I ran my Ulysses with Atma-Sphere MA-1 mono-blocks in conjunction with Speltz Autoformers.  Sounded fantastic.

Catastrophe

I have the Speltz as well

Kept the Atmas - let everything settle in

Each amp has some very captivating sound qualities
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: catastrofe on 6 Apr 2015, 12:26 pm
Catastrophe

I have the Speltz as well

Kept the Atmas - let everything settle in

Each amp has some very captivating sound qualities

Oh, I've kept the MA-1s.  Had to sell the Ulysses as I don't have the room in my new home.  Luckily, they went to a local buyer. . .he's loving them (as he should).
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: jonbee on 16 Apr 2015, 11:26 pm
I use a Crayon CFA 1.2 integrated amp with my Athena v.2. The Crayon puts out about 75 watts into the steady 6 ohm load of the Athenas. It is a solid state amp from Austria. See 6moons for a good review. It is the best pairing I've heard with my Athenas. Extremely good bang for the buck at $6k. Crayon just came out with a less powerful integrated that promises even better bang for the buck at about $3200.

Initially, I drove the Athenas with a 10-watt Shindo Cortese single-ended tube amp and a Shindo Monbrison preamp. This pairing produced some luscious, dense, immediate tone and was very musical. Together, these amps retail over $20k but did not prove as accurate, transparent, or ultimately satisfying as the Crayon. Still, there was absolutely no problem that I had with dynamics, headroom, or ability to play loud music loud.

I've also driven the speakers with a 15-watt Bakoon integrated solid state amp that was similar to the Crayon and is another good value.

I've heard the Ulysses with a 200 watt Modwright amp; this was another good pairing. And I've listened to jonbee's DA-RMAs with his very powerful N-Core amps and completely agree with him that the sound is transparent, fast, and conveys a sense of total ease, especially with complex music. Fantastic value.

Bottom line:  it is a testament to Lou's acumen as a designer that his speakers sound so damn good with so many disparate amps!
Amen. I've heard several of easystreet's amps with his Athenas, and in every case the sound was utterly captivating, even startling, and hearing his Athenas with Shindos the first time is what convinced me that I needed to own Lou's speakers.  I'm very pleased with my NC-400s as well, although they sound very different than the Shindos. I've not yet heard a matchup that didn't sound very good to awe inspiring, but all the amps I've heard are good amps in varying degrees, and with different flavors.
Someday I'll try out my TBI Millenia with them.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: dodgealum on 23 Apr 2015, 03:50 pm
Just wondering if anyone has tried the new Quicksilver Silver 88's or V4's with Lou's speakers. They are now sporting the KT150 tubes and I have read a number of positive comments on these amps. I've always had a fascination with the Quicksilvers--back in the mid-80s I heard a pair driving some ProAc Studio 1's (with a Janis subwoofer) that was my first real exposure to high end sound--utterly captivating.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: LP1 on 28 Apr 2015, 05:10 pm
I'm going to shamelessly plug the Pure Sound 845 SETs I have posted for sale in the classifieds. I owned Lou's marvelous Ulysses for a few years and only sold them when I thought my custom horns would be ready (I was off by a couple of years!). I have no doubt that there would be a fantastic synergy between the Pure Sound and the Daedalus speakers. I am so confident in this, that I plan to bring my amps over to Mark's house so he can listen to them on his DA1.1 V2. I will let him post his opinion on this forum after he's had some time with them.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Audioclyde on 28 Apr 2015, 06:12 pm
As of the past 2 weeks, I'm driving my DA-RMas with a pair of Audio Note Quest Silver 300B low gain monos (with upgraded 2w Tantulums)--I'm in sonic bliss   :D!

Randy
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: roboss38 on 6 May 2015, 08:16 pm
I have an Accuphase e560 Class A integrated amp on the way for demo. The Pass Labs XA30.8 was scary good with my Argos, so would no less and even more from the Accuphase.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: jriggy on 6 May 2015, 10:51 pm
I have an Accuphase e560 Class A integrated amp on the way for demo. The Pass Labs XA30.8 was scary good with my Argos, so would no less and even more from the Accuphase.

Hi roboss38,

I have an Accuphase E-560 with Argos, too! I was coaxed away from an integrated with an am demo. Purchased the amp so I now using the E-560 as a preamp only, before finding a pre.

The Acc benefits greatly with good power. Like most gear does really.

Actually, I just went back to the Acc as a full integrated for a day and I was surprised how good it held up! VERY musical, with a interconnectedness of everything and a nice full sound. My current amp goes a lil deeper and more articulate in the bass, a lil better detail, more separation and more realism BUT the Accuphase was still very pleasing to listen to. I was surprised. With the right cables, this integrated can really stand up!

Drop me a PM, if you'd like. We can chat about it... I could go on and might have a question for you, too.

Jason


Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: mca on 25 Sep 2015, 03:45 pm
I wanted to give an update on my Ulysses speakers. I have been running them with my Modwright Oppo 105, Modwright LS 100 and a pair of Ncore monos. The setup sounds great, lots of power, detail and great tight bass. The amps are maybe a little to honest for my liking, so I set out to try something different.

I ended up with an Allnic 300b integrated amp. Unfortunately, the amp arrived DOA and it took me about a month to get it fixed. When I got it back and hooked it up, I really liked what I heard. Sure, it cant push the speakers like the Ncore amps do, but within it's limits, the sound is wonderful. Plenty of detail with a nice rounded bass and a midrange that is so real and warm that it's intoxicating.

This sound now has me wanting to take the next step and get a pair of mono blocks that I can use with the rest of my system. Right now there is a beautiful pair of Fi 300b monos for sale. I love the looks and reviews on Don's amps are always good. Now someone has tipped me off that the Zu guys are selling a pair of Melody 845-1 amps.

Now I have a conundrum, I know I like the 300b sound, but 8-9 watts only goes so far. I have not heard a 845 based amp before, but have read that it has the same qualities as a 300b, but with more than double the power. Does anyone have experience with a 845 based amp and Daedalus speakers?
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: sunnydaze on 25 Sep 2015, 03:50 pm
No experience with Daedalus speakers, but I have owned both 845 and 300B amps.  I much prefer 845, FWIW.  May be a function of the speaker used, and with a different speaker I may prefer differently.  I dunno.      :dunno:
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Hugh on 25 Sep 2015, 03:52 pm
Same here.

No experience with Daedalus speakers, but I have owned both 845 and 300B amps.  I much prefer 845, FWIW.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: mca on 25 Sep 2015, 03:54 pm
I also wanted to take a minute to thank Lou for his work on my speakers. They were an older pair of Ulysses and the seller shipped them directly to Lou to have a little work done on the finish. Lou ended up completely refinishing the speakers and they look fabulous. I also had them fully updated to current v2 specs. I also had him install his new woofers and trim rings and added the new outriggers to the bases.


(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=128610)
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Audioclyde on 25 Sep 2015, 03:54 pm
MCA,

My speakers are the original DA-RMa's (can't be without 'em to ship them back to Lou for upgrades  8)).  At one time I used the Mastersound Compact 845 amp with them and it sounded great.  That being said, although I liked the 845 better than most solid state options I've tried with them (admittedly I haven't put any real high end 2 channel SS amps in the system since I've owned the DA-RMas), I still much prefer the sound with my 300B SET amps (now running Audio Note Quest Silvers, and absolutely love the sound even though their only 8wpc or so).  My listening room is not large, so I'm able to easily listen at levels I prefer (and I'm not a headbanger by any stretch) with the AN 300B's.

So, in my experience, a good 845 will be a nice match with your speakers; that being said, I hear a more refined sound when using 300B SET amplication.

So, the above may not be helpful, but thought I should at least share my experience.

Best,

Randy
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Hugh on 25 Sep 2015, 03:56 pm
Those must be our M845 SET monos. :-)


...Now someone has tipped me off that the Zu guys are selling a pair of Melody 845-1 amps.

Now I have a conundrum, I know I like the 300b sound, but 8-9 watts only goes so far. I have not heard a 845 based amp before, but have read that it has the same qualities as a 300b, but with more than double the power. Does anyone have experience with a 845 based amp and Daedalus speakers?
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: sunnydaze on 25 Sep 2015, 03:57 pm
Wish I could afford a nice pair of 845 monos.  Heaven!     :thumb:
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Hugh on 25 Sep 2015, 04:00 pm
The AN series Integrated Amps (AN211, AN300B, & AN845) is a step above the standard Melody models.

MCA,

My speakers are the original DA-RMa's (can't be without 'em to ship them back to Lou for upgrades  8)).  At one time I used the Mastersound Compact 845 amp with them and it sounded great.  That being said, although I liked the 845 better than most solid state options I've tried with them (admittedly I haven't put any real high end 2 channel SS amps in the system since I've owned the DA-RMas), I still much prefer the sound with my 300B SET amps (now running Audio Note Quest Silvers, and absolutely love the sound even though their only 8wpc or so).  My listening room is not large, so I'm able to easily listen at levels I prefer (and I'm not a headbanger by any stretch) with the AN 300B's.

So, in my experience, a good 845 will be a nice match with your speakers; that being said, I hear a more refined sound when using 300B SET amplication.

So, the above may not be helpful, but thought I should at least share my experience.

Best,

Randy
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: roboss38 on 25 Sep 2015, 05:54 pm
This weekend I will demoing a buddies Line Magnetic 518IA with my Argos v2. I've always wanted to hear  an 845 based amp with Lou's speakers, so I figured Line Magnetic is a good place to start.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: vinyl_lady on 25 Sep 2015, 05:59 pm
Dan Wright is developing 845 mono blocks debuting at RMAF, http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=137224.0
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: roboss38 on 25 Sep 2015, 07:51 pm
Dan Wright is developing 845 mono blocks debuting at RMAF, http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=137224.0

I'm sure they will be outstanding as all of Dan's products are. I think I'm on my fourth or fifth Modwright disc spinner. Unfortunately, I'm looking for an 845 integrated amp, so Dan's mono's will not fit my agenda. Once I'm done with my Line Magnetic demo, I hope to be able to demo a Melody AN845 as well.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: mca on 25 Sep 2015, 08:26 pm
I believe Dan's 845 amps are going to be cost no object designs which will certainly put them out of my league.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Scottdazzle on 25 Sep 2015, 09:00 pm
ModWright's new SET amp, the Ambrose, did a stellar job with the Athenas at the Capital Audio Fest in the smaller hotel room.  The Poseidons in the large room needed more power than the 10-watt per channel Ambrose could provide.  It will be exciting to hear how the 845 amps match up at RMAF next weekend!
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: mick wolfe on 25 Sep 2015, 11:50 pm
This weekend I will demoing a buddies Line Magnetic 518IA with my Argos v2. I've always wanted to hear  an 845 based amp with Lou's speakers, so I figured Line Magnetic is a good place to start.

Yes, a very good place to start. My friend uses a LM 518ia with his DA-RMa's and it's a superb match.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: cheech on 23 Oct 2015, 08:09 pm
Just recived my Argos v2s this week; using Modwright KWA 100SE; good synergy to my ears
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: aldcoll on 24 Oct 2015, 12:33 am
Just recived my Argos v2s this week; using Modwright KWA 100SE; good synergy to my ears

If you get a chance to try the M W 150 SE there should be a improvement.  I ran a couple lesser amps before I buckled to Lou's pressure and added the SE to my Pan's.   I hope tof get toLou's shop tissue winter and listen to his new speakers.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Audioclyde on 18 Nov 2015, 12:44 am
So, as stated earlier in this thread, I'm happily powering my DA-RMas with a pair of Audio Note Quest Silver 300B SETs.  We recently moved into a new home and I now have a dedicated music room/man cave.  Since the room was already wired with in wall surrounds, etc., I dug out all my old HT equipment and essentially have two setups by swapping a pair of interconnects and spkr cables. 

Not wanting to run my 300B's for TV, etc., I started looking around for a ss amp.....I've never owned any McIntosh equipment other than car audio, but I recently heard a pair of newer model monos and was mightily impressed.  Looked around and saw their new smaller form MC152 stereo amp.  Ended up purchasing it and although it only has about 120 hours or so on it, I'm really, really happy with it.

No, I won't be giving up the 3 times more expensive Quest Silvers, but the MC152 sounds fantastic to my ears/tastes and just nails the mid bass and mids, which is what I love.  So, although I never thought I'd spend the bucks for McIntosh, I'm really happy I did.  For my tastes it comes about as close to the sweet fabulous mids of the 300B SETs as I've heard.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: beaglebump on 19 Nov 2015, 07:37 pm
Having run my Athenas for several years now with a Simaudio W-5/P-5 power plant, I'm very interested in moving in another direction and auditioning the 300B SET sound.  Specifically, an A/B of the AN Conquest Silver Sigs w/ Coincident Frankensteins MKII.  Have any Daedalus owners had a similar comparative experience? 
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: cheech on 24 Dec 2015, 04:45 pm
About to add a Line Magnetic 518ia (845 SET based integrated) into my system, should be here early next week. Will be keeping Modwright LS100/KWA100SE combo as thoroughly enjoy them with my Argos V2s, trying the 518 as I have never had a SET amp and want to give it "listen". Will comment further once it's in and have given it a listen for a bit
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: cheech on 31 Dec 2015, 08:18 pm
Received Line Magnetic 518ia (845 SET 22wpc intergrated) Tuesday night. I didn't have an opportunity to audition it beforehand, but that is no different than the rest of my purchases.  Amp is a hefty 80lbs and very nicely finished. Has 4, 8 & 16 ohm taps.  According to the website it is hardwired and uses premium parts. Amp is tubed with Line Magnetic tubes that the distributor states are made by Psvane. Tube compliment 2 845s, 2 6L6s, 2 12ax7s, 1 5AR4 rectifier. I only have about 10 hours on the amp and ran it for the first 8 with the stock tubes; pretty engaging sound and the amp easily drives the ArgoV2s without pushing the volume control. I have swapped out the stock 5AR4 and 12ax7s with NOS Mullard 5AR4 and GE 12ax7s and feel that there is added definition, presense and transparency. I will likely swap in NOS GE 6L6GC to see their effect. Amp does not seem partial to particular music genres. I'm using the 8ohm taps. Based upon my initial experience I'd highly recommend this amp.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: roboss38 on 5 Jan 2016, 05:25 pm
I have a LM 518ia on the way as we speak. I've auditioned 10 integrated amps in the last year with my Argos, and the LM 518ia was the winner for me. I loved the Pass Labs INT-60, but I couldn't get the sound of the LM 518ia and the 845's out of my head.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: genjamon on 5 Jan 2016, 06:00 pm
I'm Mick's friend who has the LM 518ia with Jonbee's old DA-RMa's.  In my opinion, the stock LM tubes don't get you anywhere close to the performance of the amp.  I run Psvane 845T's, Foton NOS 6L6's as driver tubes, and an expensive metal base GZ34 rectifier, and bypass the preamp stage instead using a Tortuga-based passive preamp.  In comparison, the internal tube preamp has a bit greater focus and drive, but the soundstage completely collapses and there's a bit less detail.  And that's with vintage Telefunken smooth plates as 12ax7's.

I also found Lou's DID's to work wonders with the 518ia.  And it also responds very well to power cable upgrades, outlets, and conditioning (the right kind, non current limiting).  It's a very transparent amp to system changes.  This can be infuriating at times, but is a tweaker's dream. 

This is my first real tube amp, though, so I'm not in a position to compare to other SET or other tube amps.  And I'm also not able to compare to any other amps really on the DA-RMa's - I had settled on the 518ia with my previous speakers before the DA-RMa's arrived. 
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: cheech on 5 Jan 2016, 06:08 pm
Can you describe the sound of the FOTON 6L6s?
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: genjamon on 5 Jan 2016, 07:55 pm
I like them better than Mick does, I think.  He's who recommended them to me - a recommendation from one of his friends.  I find them better than new production Gold Lion KT-88's.  Mick says he likes the Gold Lions better than the Fotons overall.  Instruments are more cleanly delineated, and have more body.  But I do acknowledge I think the Gold Lions have an overall very easy and balanced sound, maybe even more balanced-natural tone than the Fotons. 

I'd really like to hear some old stock Genalex KT-66's in the driver slots, but those would be $$$.  Maybe eventually.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: cheech on 5 Jan 2016, 08:46 pm
Thanks for the perspective. BTW don't know if you and Mick know but the 218 was recently changed to a 211 tube , doesn't come 845 any more
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: cheech on 8 Jan 2016, 10:34 pm
Re: the 518ia, I did swap in some NOS GE 6L6GCs. At first they seemed too bright and in your face, but after about 10 hours or so have become balanced across the spectrum with good definition and separation
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: HiFidFan on 24 Jan 2016, 11:03 pm
Hello everyone, new here but have been a DA-RMa owner for about 5 years, all original save for some recently added trim rings.

I've happily been driving them with a Luxman 505u integrated and haven't felt the need for more (100w x2).  Very good sounding iindeed
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: JP78 on 22 Feb 2016, 04:44 am
I think it's also worth noting that higher power amplifiers are more expensive and therefore may be able to have additional improvements in the circuit, power supply, etc versus lower power amplifiers by the same manufacturer.

In this case it's not the number of watts but the increase in the manufacturing budget to improve the design that leads better results.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: jazdoc on 24 Aug 2016, 01:59 am
I am using the Found-Music amplifiers with my Ulysses' and am finding the combination superb.  You can tailor the sound by rolling the 6SN7 driver and EL34/6AC7/KT77 power tubes.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: arthurs on 24 Aug 2016, 02:48 am
Which Found Music amps?
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: jazdoc on 24 Aug 2016, 06:19 pm
Arthur,

These are Scott's newest model "The Blade".
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: jazdoc on 1 Apr 2017, 05:07 pm
Here are some pics of the Found-Music "Blade Amp".  This is a killer combo with the Daedalus Ulysses, especially when combined with the Found-Music E+ Cables.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=160220)



(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=160221)
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: advanced101 on 1 Apr 2017, 11:09 pm
Line Magnetic 219IA with a pair of Orpheus.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: cheech on 19 Sep 2017, 01:01 am
I just added a third amp into my system, a Finale Audio 7189 (2), 7189/El84 based tube push pull integrated amp- 20 wpc. Amp still needs additional hours of break-in but it easily drives my Argos V2s. Amp comes with NOS Russian 6N14N -EBs (7189a) , and new production JJ 5AR4 rectifier and 12ax7s. Once the amp breaks-in 75-100 hours (per Frank @ Finale) I will swap out the JJs with NOS 5AR4 & either NOS 12ax7's or 5751s.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: rbbert on 19 Sep 2017, 01:43 pm
Pass INT-60 with Ulysses, as noted recently in another thread here.  Still trying to keep the audio system simple  8)
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: cheech on 16 Oct 2017, 07:51 pm
Following up to my Sept 19 post. I have about 75 hours on the Finale Audio  F7189 MK2 integrated amp  I went ahead at roughly 30 hours and swapped out the new production JJ 12ax7s and 5AR4 (sounded fine in the amp) with NOS GE 12ax7s and RCA 5AR4 ( I am partial to NOS tubes)  .  To my ears this amp sounds wonderful with the Argos V2s, it retrieves musical details and nuances from every track played, and it's imaging, soundstage, dynamics are very good. As I noted earlier the ,amp is stated at 20 wpc, though according to Frank at Finale mine measured at 22wpc with the substitution of a Hashimoto output transformer vs the standard Hammond.  If you like an EL84 based amp I highly recommend checking out the Finale.

As an aside I enjoy periodically switching between the Finale, the Line Magnetic 518IA, and my Modwright LSs100 & KWA100SE  - each offer a little something different but are all wonderful with the  Argos V2s
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: advanced101 on 10 Feb 2018, 04:47 pm
I ordered a pair of EAR 509 monoblocks to replace my LM 219IA.  I thought the LM was a very good amp for the money.  But, in my system, I preferred moving away from a SET amp, perhaps too much of a good thing.  I also noticed that the amp was showing 50w at peaks when listening loudly.  Although I believe the amp could handle 50 watt peaks (22 watt nominal) the extra headroom will be appreciated.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: mresseguie on 10 Feb 2018, 10:00 pm
Hello. I own a pair of Apollos which I am delighted with. I'm powering them with my Don Sachs Model 2 6SN7 preamp and D Sachs KT88 Kootenay 120 amp.

The amp has approximately 110 hours on it, so it's still burning in. However, so far I am very much enjoying this combination.

I'll soon have a new IceEdge1200as amp built by Mike at Mivera audio. I'm eager to hear it in my system.

Michael
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: A_shah on 11 Feb 2018, 08:27 pm
Hello. I own a pair of Apollos which I am delighted with. I'm powering them with my Don Sachs Model 2 6SN7 preamp and D Sachs KT88 Kootenay 120 amp.

The amp has approximately 110 hours on it, so it's still burning in. However, so far I am very much enjoying this combination.

I'll soon have a new IceEdge1200as amp built by Mike at Mivera audio. I'm eager to hear it in my system.

Michael



that would be interesting to see how "Class D "amp sounds with the Apollo's I had a Peachtree Nova 150 for over a year running my desktop system which consisted of Kef LS 50 , I also tried them with my magnepan 1.7i to my surprise the Nova drove them very well  except I found the sound to be 2D.
I will be using my custom made  Odyssey Kismet  , with Don Sachs DS-2 and Directstream DAC to power the Poseidon's.
Odyssey Kismet has 850 VA transformer with  huge German made  Symphonic line 35K hyper Caps (350,000uf memory) A/AB amp with >68 amp current delivery and top of the line WBT  RC/LS connectors I believe it does not leave Class A for the 1st 10 -20 Watts of power before switching into
Class A/B mode  the unit is "very very quite" rarely gets warm , also own a Parasound Halo Integrated. (GR8 for the money), although I am open to another amp , have used and heard some  good ones in the past
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=175961)
 and recently the Modwright KWA 150 SE

Asghar
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: dodgealum on 12 Feb 2018, 02:46 pm
Fans of Lou's speakers may be interested in checking out the soon-to-be released "Ultralinear" amp from Linear Tube Audio. I was fortunate to run a pre-production version for several weeks with my DA-1.1 AP/V2's and it is EXCEPTIONAL. Like all LTA electronics, this is a David Berning design using his patented ZOTL technology and radically sophisticated switching power supply. I wrote a "review" of the amp which I posted on the Audiogon recently. Here is the link for those who might be interested:

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/review-linear-tube-audio-lta-ultralinear-amplifier

I understand Lou is going to be showing with LTA at AXPONA in April, featuring the "Ultralinear" paired with the Apollo 11, which I heard at Lou's shop in October (sounding incredible driven by the KWA-150SE). The Apollo 11 with the LTA "Ultralinear" should be frighteningly good. Hope some of you get to check it out!

 :thumb:
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: rbbert on 12 Feb 2018, 04:31 pm
I would be surprised if the Viva 845 amps did not sound superb with Daedalus, but I think they all cost more than any of Lou’s speakers.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: ArthurDent on 12 Feb 2018, 06:01 pm
At this point depending on the weather I run my Muse with either a VanAlstine Ultravalve 35 wpc tube unit, or a VA FetValve Ultra 550 hybrid. Both sound great, simply different flavors, and the hybrid is probably a little tighter with the bass. So many options, so little time & $. Would like to try some of Dan's gear at some point, as well as Don's. A friend is waiting for his amp from Don end of the month, so should get to hear that option first hand at some point.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: A_shah on 11 Mar 2018, 10:30 pm
Jeff Wells stopped by and Dropped his Wells Innamorata amplifier & Looking Glass power conditioner,  So far the Amplifier sounds very sweet , I have it for a week so well see how it works out

 
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: kingdeezie on 11 Mar 2018, 11:38 pm
Right now I’m running a pair of Muse Studios with Dueland upgrade with a Pass XP-22/XA30.8 combo. Sitting very near field, like 5 feet. Synergy is excellent.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: cheech on 11 Mar 2018, 11:43 pm
Which version of the Looking Glass;? Have you been using another power conditioner; if so  you able to contrast the sound of the Wells amp with the Looking Glass vs your current power conditioner ?
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: A_shah on 12 Mar 2018, 06:01 am
Which version of the Looking Glass;? Have you been using another power conditioner; if so  you able to contrast the sound of the Wells amp with the Looking Glass vs your current power conditioner ?


That would be like comparing Apple's and Oranges , Although I can tell you this,  looking glass power conditioner  is very good with the Wells unit as well as  with the other accessories I have plugged into it , it certainly does what it is supposed to do !
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: A_shah on 27 Mar 2018, 05:11 am

Today I had a chat with Mike Sanders of QuickSilver Audio, and as a courtesy a dealer friend of his stopped by and Delivered a pair of his 40 Watt Audio Mid Mono-Amplifier tube amp this is a brand new unit hardly broken in .
First impressions WOW ! :rock: Crisp, clean , clear  , Linear sound , absolutely, no distortion or woolliness ! I am using two genesis power chord that were also dropped by the dealer friend , These are very inexpensive pair of amplifiers point to point wiring , no integrated Circuit . the Daedalus Poseidon sound tonally totally open Well I have these for a week and  will see how they work out !  i tried it with  both Schiit Gungnir & the Ps Audio directstream DAC and Oppo 203 UHD as transport plus Hirez streaming


(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=177986)
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: cheech on 27 Mar 2018, 08:10 pm
Do you still have the Wells? Conclusions drawn?
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: vinyl_lady on 27 Mar 2018, 10:39 pm
In November, I purchased a pair of Ambrose A-30 mono blocks from ModWright after hearing them at RMAF. Incredibly musical, tonally accurate and detailed. Solid performer from top to bottom of the frequency range. They replaced a ModWright KWA 150SE which is an incredible amp in its own right. I found I liked the tube sound of the A-30s a little better than the solid state amp.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: dodgealum on 28 Mar 2018, 12:17 am
I just recently took delivery on a LTA Ultralinear Power Amplifier--I had used a pre-production version in my system for a few weeks and found it intoxicating. The amp is extraordinary--clean, spacious, detailed, tonally pure. For those going to Axpona you can hear it yourself with the Apollo 11s--should be exceptional. I absolutely loved my KWA-150SE until I heard the LTA--it is that good.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: beaglebump on 28 Mar 2018, 01:12 am
I've been following this thread with great interest since its inception.  Finding a suitable power plant to my Athena was both easy & frustrating in that many auditionees of various designs had exceptional synergy (Dan's Ambrose A30's (early prototypes), Pass xa60.8, BorderPatrol se300B to name a few).  Ultimately became intoxicated with the mix of Class D Veritas monos from Merrill Audio w/ our VAC Signature SE pre.  Simply breathtaking mix with the Athena.   
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: A_shah on 28 Mar 2018, 04:08 am
Do you still have the Wells? Conclusions drawn?

Good Amp, big sound stage, but very similar signature to my SS Odyssey Kismet amp I am looking for a 2nd amp standby amp basically a tube amplifier or 2  mono amps , I have had  a couple of Class D amps in the past Peachtree Nova 150 ( very dark background Very quite and Wyred 4 for Sound , GR8 amps but class D  do not appeal to me , I guess personnel taste
for the money  these QS silver mono tubes are amazing "very wide band width tonally accurate  correct  the Bass on these at 40 watts match's both my Odyssey kismet and the wells at 1/3 the price ! very stable Possibly I may end up with  a DS Kooteney to match with my DS-2 pre-amp. But these QS mono have got me enamored and they are 1/2 the cost !  Mark Sanders also have a new 50 watt mono amps with a different sound signature I may get a chance to try that one out also !

@dodgealum 
 read your review on the LTA Ultralinear in Audiogon and did talk to mark , got some pictures of inside guts from him I may get a unit from  him to try it out under the 14 day trial period , but it has SMS switching power supply makes it a hybrid , I prefer Toroidal transformer or the output Transformers based on known and tested designs of the past  after all it is really the power and power transformers that we are listening  too, Paul Macgown in one of his video blogs said so much recently that they have tried Switching power supplies in PS audio products but they do not match the sound quality regular transformers and my 'ears" agree with that !
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=178055)
point to point "short signal path wiring " no circuit board " low noise tested Transformers ) at the end it is the SQ ! that matters I guess
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: maxboy00 on 28 Mar 2018, 08:35 am
I'm still a big fan of Modwright  gear, but I wanted to try something completely different. After a long search, I decided on a Viva Solistino intergrated 845 SET amp with 18Wpc. I have had this amp for a couple of months and very impressed with the sound and performance of this amp.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: rbbert on 28 Mar 2018, 12:33 pm
I'm still a big fan of Modwright  gear, but I wanted to try something completely different. After a long search, I decided on a Viva Solistino intergrated 845 SET amp with 18Wpc. I have had this amp for a couple of months and very impressed with the sound and performance of this amp.

Very pricey, though
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: dodgealum on 28 Mar 2018, 02:16 pm
A_shah I'll be interested in your impressions of the Ultralinear. There has always been a lot of talk about Berning's use of a switching power supply, with some skeptical voices who have had unsuccessful experiences with those used by other manufacturers. I'm not a technical person but my reading and conversation with Mark at LTA leads me to believe that David has found a technical solution that exploits the merits of a switching supply without any of the downsides. Only your ears will say whether it works for you and your system but I would encourage you to give the Ultralinear a try and see what happens.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: A_shah on 28 Mar 2018, 07:44 pm
A_shah I'll be interested in your impressions of the Ultralinear. There has always been a lot of talk about Berning's use of a switching power supply, with some skeptical voices who have had unsuccessful experiences with those used by other manufacturers. I'm not a technical person but my reading and conversation with Mark at LTA leads me to believe that David has found a technical solution that exploits the merits of a switching supply without any of the downsides. Only your ears will say whether it works for you and your system but I would encourage you to give the Ultralinear a try and see what happens.


Will do,
also a new found friend is bringing in his Viva Solista Integrated amplifier to try with the Poseidon Speakers , the Daedalus speakers have created a pretty good buzz with a lot of audiophiles in my area !  :thumb:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=178074)
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: vinyl_lady on 28 Mar 2018, 07:59 pm
A_shah,

if you don't mind me asking, what is your area? I'm in Spokane WA
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: A_shah on 29 Mar 2018, 12:53 am
East Bay / San Joaquin county Tracy , California, San Francisco and Sacramento are equi distance to me  :)
Asghar
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: A_shah on 30 Mar 2018, 01:02 am
I'm still a big fan of Modwright  gear, but I wanted to try something completely different. After a long search, I decided on a Viva Solistino intergrated 845 SET amp with 18Wpc. I have had this amp for a couple of months and very impressed with the sound and performance of this amp.


Here is a picture of Viva Solista Integrated 845 Set amp probably the best I have heard with Daedalus Speakers in my home environment so far , just a very outstanding amplifier but very pricey - Playing Todd Garfunkle's Sera Una Noche, in DSD , the recording
was  made   by Todd Garfinkle both in Hi-Rez and DSD WAV files
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=178154)
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: audiotom on 31 Mar 2018, 03:33 am
I added Uesugi UTY-5s in parallel to my Doshi system.

These are spare no expense Japanese amps from the mid 1980s.

Really even more natural body in spades from the Ulysses V2s.


Here is someone's link
Don't judge a book by it's cover

http://www.hifido.co.jp/KW/G0105/E/2650-50/C07-32310-97051-00/



Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: A_shah on 31 Mar 2018, 04:38 am
Here is a Picture of a New 60 Watt QuickSilver Mono amplifiers I got from Mr Sanders to try out ! not on his website yet ! with the Daedalus Speakers , they look very nice with Chrome plate and sound absolutely Superb ! :D
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=178280)

 they sound very linear, Very Quite , brings out horn like performance from the Daedalus Poseidon with very good mid-range
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: kapa11 on 1 Apr 2018, 05:53 am
Helio everyone, first time on AudioCircle and to Daedalus Audio Circle, I purchased the MUSE model back in 2014, May be the first ones to get out of Lou´s shop.

Since I live in Mexico, I didn't audition the speakers first. I was Setting a new system from scratch, I sold my previous Cello system and begun to purchase some equipment when I saw the opportunity of a good deal, such was the case for a Yamamoto Tube DAC and a Shindo integrated Amp.

I read a Lot of reviews saying that the Shindo-Devore speakers were a match made in heaven. But I also read a Lot of good reviews about the Daedalus speakers, and some Audiogon post that favour the Daedalus over the Devore, so I ended up Purchasinag the Muse for my Shindo amp.

I kept the combo for about 3 years. The sound was good but not what I expected. I always suspected that even as efficient as they are, the 12 watt Shindo was lacking the juice the Muse needed to sing best.

So I started borrowing amps from Friends, both Tube and SS, but more powerful.

My finding was that a 35W Redgum made them sing very very nice. And needless to say, most SS amps much better than the tubed ones.

Besides, Lou uses Modwright to Voice his speakers. So this two facts made me re-think any tube based amp with Daedalus .

So I sold the Shindo  and purchased a Pass Labs INT-30A pure class A integrated . I had some previous experience with Threshold and Nelson Pass Nakamichi designed amps, so for me it was the best bet.

I have had this set up for over a year now and its really good. I Believe the combo Pass-Daedalus works extremely well. Recommended


(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=178284)

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=178285)

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=178286)







Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: cheech on 1 Apr 2018, 02:55 pm
Nice setup
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: mca on 1 Apr 2018, 06:43 pm
Love those album displays.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: advanced101 on 1 Apr 2018, 10:10 pm
Awesome, nice 401.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: A_shah on 1 Apr 2018, 10:20 pm
@ Kapa 11,
Very nice
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 1 Apr 2018, 10:59 pm
Thanks for sharing all this!! Lots of great amps out there!
 :thumb:
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: advanced101 on 24 Apr 2018, 02:08 am

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=179279)

My EAR 509-II amps came in and I think they are just what I needed. More detail and bass compared to my LM 219IA. Rolled in aone different tubes and the mid-range is still beautiful. Going to continue experimenting with different tubes. Lots of muscle in these amps. Using the EAR 868PL Pre-amp.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: A_shah on 24 Apr 2018, 03:21 am
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=179279)

My EAR 509-II amps came in and I think they are just what I needed. More detail and bass compared to my LM 219IA. Rolled in aone different tubes and the mid-range is still beautiful. Going to continue experimenting with different tubes. Lots of muscle in these amps. Using the EAR 868PL Pre-amp.

Congratulations !
EAR 509-11 are GR8 amps from what i have read about them , although not heard them , but I know how you feel , My Quest for Amplifiers ended when I heard  the Quick Silver Mono 60 that were custom built  by Mike Sanders and very reasonable priced in fact I would call them cheaply priced compared to Ear 509-11
What compliment of tubes are you using with these ?
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=179280)
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: advanced101 on 24 Apr 2018, 02:16 pm
Shuguang Treasure LS 12AX7s (Will try Siemens or Teles next)
Phillips NOS ECC85
Valvo NOS PL519
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: A_shah on 24 Apr 2018, 02:44 pm
Shuguang Treasure LS 12AX7s (Will try Siemens or Teles next)
Phillips NOS ECC85
Valvo NOS PL519

Thanks.
  QS Mono  60's  Units came with Shugang KT-88-99 ( nice output tubes) But I switched and have
Shugung Black Treasures -Z x2 for output ( very smooth and liquid) KT-88
1 Philips 12FQ7 -Driver tube (NOS -very rare came with the unit)
1Yugo 12AU7 -Input tube, NOS ( also I believe made by Philips in Yugoslavia)

Have ordered Golden Voice KT-88 matched Quads from China , I hear they are very good sounding . :thumb:




Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: A_shah on 1 May 2018, 06:40 am
Got hold of a Brand new unit of QuickSilver Integrated Amplifier to try out with the Daedalus Poseidon"s , this is an all tube amp only 20 watts per channel The Integrated drove the Poseidon's without a Hiccup , but it really sings on my desktop system with Kef LS 50  :D
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=179520)
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: dminches on 19 Oct 2018, 12:31 am
I have both a Modwright KWA100SE and a Music Reference RM200II amp which i use with my Daedalus DA1.1 speakers. Both work quite well and I'm pleased with them both.

Although I have never heard the KWA150SE, I have read some some reviews comparing it to the 100SE. It seemed that the 100SE was considered to have more of a 'tube sound' than the 150SE. As to how much more of a tube sound - I dont know. But I think this was mentioned in the 6 Moons reviews and I may have read it from another source as well. So depending what sound you want, that might help you.

Does the 100SE have enough power for the DA1.1?  I have Athenas which are pretty similar.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Drew769 on 20 Oct 2018, 09:00 pm
The Daedalus are so efficient, you can get by with almost nothing and drive them.  I had the 100 SE before my 150 SE, and the difference in volume was negligible.  The 150SE kind of disappears without a sonic signature.  It just makes whatever you feed it louder.  Complete neutrality.   Both are great amps, though.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: nnck on 20 Oct 2018, 10:40 pm
Does the 100SE have enough power for the DA1.1?  I have Athenas which are pretty similar.

The 100SE easily powers the DA1.1. Drew769's comments regarding the power needed to handle the Daedalus speakers is correct, imo. You dont need much power at all.

Since my initial comments, I have also used a Vinnie Rossi LIO integrated amp with 25wpc into 8ohms with these speakers,  and I dont hear any limitations from this lower powered amp either.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: dminches on 21 Oct 2018, 12:44 am
I picked up a 100SE and, as you guys said, it has more than enough power.

Thanks.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Bones13 on 26 Oct 2020, 12:38 am
Any new thoughts on amplifiers for these speakers?

Currently using some DIY FirstWatt M2x , but some day hope to finalize on a supported commercial amplifier.

I had my dad’s McIntosh MC60 amps re-done, but one is already shorted out.  The aging repair guy is an hour away, but not sure how many times I want to make that drive. I looked in the box today, a bunch of old looking wiring and sockets, with the new parts he put in last year. Pretty scary to be honest.

I have been considering the commercial Nelson Pass gear - XA-25, XA-30.5, F8, as well as AB gear - Bricasti, Boulder 1161. Modwright Ambrose.

I would like an amp with XLR balanced input, but not a requirement. Using RCA singled ended currently.

Lou likes the LTA Ultralinear.

Current thoughts?
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: GregC on 26 Oct 2020, 12:45 am
I am using a pair of Digital Amp Company Golden Cherry amps with 60W power supplies that Tommy converted into linear power supplies. 
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Bones13 on 26 Oct 2020, 10:30 am
I am using a pair of Digital Amp Company Golden Cherry amps with 60W power supplies that Tommy converted into linear power supplies.

Those do look interesting, and would not run as hot as most of my other choices. On my list now. Thanks for the suggestion!
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: rbbert on 26 Oct 2020, 12:17 pm
Pass XA30.8 or INT60 are worth a try.  If you don’t have a Pass dealer within 100 miles Reno HiFi can arrange a demo, although shipping these beasts is not cheap.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Jarbs on 28 Oct 2020, 02:41 am
So far I’ve owned the following amps for my Apollo 11’s, in this order.

Pass XA30.8
LTA Ultralinear (mono and stereo)
VAC 30/30 III Signature
LTA ZOTL40 Reference
Allnic M2500 PX25 mono’s

Some were owned concurrently. All worked well, each with its own strengths, to different effect. I’ve used the LTA Preamplifier with all and more recently moved to an Allnic L9000 OTL/OCL preamp. DAC is Lampizator Pacific. Antipodes CX+EX server.

The XA30.8 excelled at stage width, HF extension and dimensionality, low end control. Weakness was midrange resolution.

The Ultralinear excelled at blackness, mid range resolution, HF dimensionality, bass definition, low volume playback. Weakness was dynamics as the volume increased. No gush factor.

The VAC is a romantic sweetheart. Decent bass and leading edge resolution for a tube amp. Old school 3D sound. Self noise not the best. Not as black as the best. Not as resolved as modern amps. But a really enjoyable amp. Hot.

The ZOTL40 Ref. More power and midrange compared to the Ultralinear. Typical EL34. Not as resolved or black as the Ultralinear. HF and bass extension not as good as UL. Full mid bass. System probably has too many tubes for this amp to excel.

Allnic M2500. Resolved modern tube amp with excellent PX25 bass. Nicely resolved harmonics. Low self noise, but not in the league of the Ultralinear. More meat on bones than UL or any other except the VAC. Nice mid bass balance makes an excellent match for the Apollo magic 10” woofer. Nice gush factor when played loud. Swells dynamically. Only 20 watts but they are clean and consistent up to max. Output. Best match to the Daedalus so far, but $$$.

Note that all are rated between 20w/ch and 40w/ch. But the Pass is a cheater that drives much harder than 30w.

My subjective ranking is:

1. Allnic
2 Ultralinear
3. Pass
4. VAC
5. Zotl 40

That said, I wouldn’t mind picking up an XA30.8 or Ultralinear again to add back to the mix.

Cheers,
Greg
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: rbbert on 28 Oct 2020, 12:24 pm
Now I’m curious about the other 2 versions of the Allnic.  More power (KT150)?  300B sweetness?  Hmmm
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: advanced101 on 28 Oct 2020, 10:53 pm
Nice round up, thanks!  I'm looking into an end game type set of monos for my Daedalus, moving my EAR 509ii to my BOWs.  Considering a few options.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Jarbs on 29 Oct 2020, 03:54 am
I should emphasize the point that the preamp makes a significant contribution to the results. The LTA Microzotl Preamplifier sounds quite different from the L9000 and there is a 4x difference in price. YMMV with your preamp.

I went PX25 on the amps instead of 300b or KT150 because I wanted the sweet organic triode sound. My dac can run either PX25 or 300b, and I always preferred the PX25 here for the robust, full foundation with triode attributes intact. It still was a tough choice as there are way more 300b options than PX25. But again, results are the product of a system.

20 watts from the PX25 seems quite adequate in my 1100 sf listening room.

If in doubt @Ketcham at Kevalin Audio has the PX25 version for audition as well as the L9000 pre. That’s how I ended up with the Allnic pre and amps. No affiliation.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: rbbert on 29 Oct 2020, 12:01 pm
Lou and others were mightily impressed with VAC/Apollo at the Florida show.  No idea if lower line VAC amps would retain that magic.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: rbbert on 29 Oct 2020, 12:07 pm
20 watts into Apollo 11 in a 31’x36’ (x ceiling height?) room would not meet my loudness needs...
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Jarbs on 31 Oct 2020, 12:12 pm
In recent years, improvements in my system have lowered the noise floor while increasing resolution in the digital front end. Coupled with amplification which provides realistic dynamic swings at low levels, I don’t find a need for gross macro excursions which require high power ratings - most of the time. However, sometimes there is a need for a visceral performance (when the wife and kids have left the building) and John Bonham needs justice done. My 20 watts don’t do too bad with this, but someday I might pick up a head banger amp. Smooth amps fairly suck at this and most SS amps are lifeless. I’d look at a VAC Phi 200 or VAC 200iq. My old VAC PA 80/80 was actually a good rock n roller. Those KT88’s had some bite and swell.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: rbbert on 31 Oct 2020, 12:53 pm
I think there are some Class A SS amps that might be worth looking into.  The Pass XA60.8 monos at around $13k/pr appear attractive, and most listeners feel they are a BIG step up from the XA30.8.  The VAC 200 iQ is also appealing, as is the Phi 170 for an integrated.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Jarbs on 31 Oct 2020, 01:57 pm
Ironically it was the XA60.8 that lead me to the high sensitivity Daedalus solution. With an XA30.8 and low efficiency speakers I was unsatisfied, but didn’t have enough current available on this end of the house to run the XA60.8’s well. Such is the case with the XA30 with many speakers, but not the Daedalus.

My choice 6 months ago was between the 7.5watt (SET) and 20 watt (push-pull) Allnic amps. I went with the power house. This is like 160 watts into 87db speakers. I’d like to try some 2watt SET DHT 45’s some day. I’m certain most of my listening is fractional wattage.

rbbert, looks like you landed those beautiful baked maple Apollo 11’s. This is the pair I first heard and saw. Very nice.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: rbbert on 31 Oct 2020, 02:08 pm
Yes, I'm liking them more day by day.  I have occasionally pushed the volume levels very high and am pleased to note that the Apollo 11's retain their sonic character even then.  My room is about 3400 cubic feet, with a fair amount of dampening, and I can make the needle on my INT-60 move (although nobody is quite clear about how many watts that is, it is more than 30w/ch) with still enjoyable volume (for a minute or two).  Thus my interest in a little more power, even though it would be rarely if ever used.

FWIW, most people I know with 87 dB efficient speakers use a lot more than 160 watts; 350 or more is not unusual, and a big reason I now avoid the inefficient speaker paradigm.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: rbbert on 31 Oct 2020, 02:15 pm
It's interesting, with Daedalus being an AC sponsor, but the Apollo 11's are so good that the associated components that really benefit them are out of AC's usual arena, both price and manufacturers (with maybe a couple of exceptions)
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: Jarbs on 31 Oct 2020, 02:44 pm
Points taken. My entry into Daedalus was my current Apollo 11’s, so I can’t comment on earlier efforts really. There are very few if any competitors that offer this level of quality, efficiency, range, and build at near this price point. I’d venture to say that these speakers will do justice in systems up to $200k or beyond, to throw a number our there. At home with 5 watts or 200 watts as well. An excellent choice to build with. Some speakers, like  Magico’s, sound dreadful in a sub-par system. These Daedalus are just musical and natural so you don’t need big $ to sound good. They will deliver in big systems too, like the VAC 450iq, mentioned at the Florida show.
Title: Re: What amplifier do you use with your Daedalus speakers?
Post by: rbbert on 31 Oct 2020, 06:14 pm
...They will deliver in big systems too, like the VAC 450iq, mentioned at the Florida show.

And that was with the Apollo's, not even the Apollo 11's