AudioCircle

Industry Circles => Tortuga Audio => Topic started by: tortugaranger on 15 May 2017, 02:58 pm

Title: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 15 May 2017, 02:58 pm
Hi All,

Organizing a tour for the updated LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with the new V25 preamp controller.

Tour rules:
1) You don't currently own a Tortuga Audio preamp
2) You promise to ship the unit forward within 7 days of receiving it
3) You promise to post your impressions on this thread
4) You promise to insure the unit for $1200 when shipping onwards
5) You promise to ship with USPS Priority, UPS or FedEX which all offer tracking info
6) US domestic participants only
7) 10 participants plus a backup list of 3 standbys in case one of the 10 drop out
8) Final tour list will be sorted to minimize shipping distance/cost/time per participant

If you're interested either post here or send me an IM.

Cheers,
Morten  :thumb:

(http://www.tortugaaudio.com/images/BlackFront_IMG_2046_TASEditorsChoiceAwards.jpg)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: Tubeburner on 15 May 2017, 03:43 pm
Count me in. Thank you. :thumb:
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: audiogurujax on 15 May 2017, 03:45 pm
Super interested I am in!
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 15 May 2017, 03:48 pm
Getting started on the tour group list (see rules in post #1)

1) tubeburner
2) audiogurujax
3) rklein
4)
5)
6)
7)
8 )
9)
10)

Standby folks in case someone drops out:
1)
2)
3)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: rklein on 15 May 2017, 05:27 pm
Hi Morten

Was hoping this would happen.

Please include me on the tour list.

Regards,

Randy
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: WC on 15 May 2017, 07:27 pm
I am interested in trying it out.
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 15 May 2017, 07:46 pm
Updated tour list. (see 1st post for Tour rules)

1) tubeburner
2) audiogurujax
3) rklein
4) WC
5) mrvco
6)
7)
8 )
9)
10)

Standby folks in case someone drops out:
1)
2)
3)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: mrvco on 15 May 2017, 08:02 pm
Count me in please!
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 16 May 2017, 02:29 pm
5 spots open on the tour. (see 1st post for Tour rules)

1) tubeburner
2) audiogurujax
3) rklein
4) WC
5) mrvco
6)
7)
8 )
9)
10)

Standby folks in case someone drops out:
1)
2)
3)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: Tubeburner on 20 May 2017, 07:43 pm
I am recovering from my back surgery and each day is better, so I am looking forward to what the new V25 controller will do. This is an awesome offering by a designer and manufacturer. I am surprised the list is not overflowing. :o So, get on the list for a week of enjoyment demoing an award winning preamp with the latest improvements for a minimal cost. I'm in Seattle area.
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 20 May 2017, 10:24 pm
I am recovering from my back surgery and each day is better, so I am looking forward to what the new V25 controller will do. This is an awesome offering by a designer and manufacturer. I am surprised the list is not overflowing. :o So, get on the list for a week of enjoyment demoing an award winning preamp with the latest improvements for a minimal cost. I'm in Seattle area.

Well, do as the man says and get on it folks!  :green:
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: srclose on 20 May 2017, 10:34 pm
Hello,

I'm interested!

Stephen
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 20 May 2017, 11:05 pm
Done! 4 more slots available.  (see 1st post for tour rules).

1) tubeburner
2) audiogurujax
3) rklein
4) WC
5) mrvco
6) srclose
7)
8 )
9)
10)

Standby folks in case someone drops out:
1)
2)
3)

Hello,

I'm interested!

Stephen
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: mlundy57 on 21 May 2017, 07:10 am
count me in also

Mike
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 21 May 2017, 12:18 pm
Done! 3 more slots available.  (see 1st post for tour rules).

1) tubeburner
2) audiogurujax
3) rklein
4) WC
5) mrvco
6) srclose
7) mlundy57
8 )
9)
10)

Standby folks in case someone drops out:
1)
2)
3)

count me in also

Mike
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: Tubeburner on 21 May 2017, 09:44 pm
We need 3 more.....Let's get this party started! :D
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: mlundy57 on 21 May 2017, 10:09 pm
I'll take more than one turn if it will help  :jester:
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: OzarkTom on 22 May 2017, 11:57 am
I finally got caught up with work. My buddy Rex bought one of these, so I would like to hear what he is hearing my system. Rex loves his.
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 22 May 2017, 01:43 pm
2 more to go. Almost there.  (see 1st post for tour rules).

1) tubeburner
2) audiogurujax
3) rklein
4) WC
5) mrvco
6) srclose
7) mlundy57
8 ) ozarktom
9)
10)

Standby folks in case someone drops out:
1)
2)
3)

I finally got caught up with work. My buddy Rex bought one of these, so I would like to hear what he is hearing my system. Rex loves his.
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 24 May 2017, 04:50 pm
I just sent everyone a PM asking for contact info.
I plan on kicking off the tour towards the end of next week.
The final sequence  of the tour will be according to your location so we can all minimize shipping distances/cost/time.

Thank you all for signing up.   :thumb:

1) tubeburner
2) audiogurujax
3) rklein
4) WC
5) mrvco
6) srclose
7) mlundy57
8 ) ozarktom
9)
10)

Standby folks in case someone drops out:
1)
2)
3)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: uncola on 25 May 2017, 12:46 pm
Good luck with the tour!  Always great to see these so we can get impressions.  The new 2.5 pcb sounds like a big upgrade
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: SFDude on 25 May 2017, 02:45 pm
Would love to get in on this tour (towards the tail end of it).

Preamp shopping right now. :)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: mamba315 on 25 May 2017, 02:50 pm
I'm interested in joining this tour.  I was on the last preamp tour which never quite made it.  I am near south Bay Area, CA.

Matt
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 25 May 2017, 03:01 pm
Would love to get in on this tour (towards the tail end of it).

Preamp shopping right now. :)

Will add you. Please PM me your name, address, phone & email.
Thanks for participating!
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 25 May 2017, 03:01 pm
I'm interested in joining this tour.  I was on the last preamp tour which never quite made it.  I am near south Bay Area, CA.

Matt

Will add you. Please PM me your name, address, phone & email.
Thanks for participating!
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 25 May 2017, 03:03 pm
We have a full tour!   
Thank you all for signing up.   :thumb:

1) tubeburner
2) audiogurujax
3) rklein
4) WC
5) mrvco
6) srclose
7) mlundy57
8 ) ozarktom
9) SFdude
10) mamba315

Standby folks in case someone drops out:
1)
2)
3)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 13 Jun 2017, 07:52 pm
Hi All,

I'm kicking off this tour and will ship out the tour unit tomorrow.

The tour unit is a brand new unit that uses the new V25 board internally and is in every way the updated LDR3.V25 model but for labeling on the rear panel since we are still in the process of fabricating new panels for the new V25 models.

The tour sequence is listed below and kicks off in Florida, then off to a few midwest states, then Oklahoma, Colorado, Washington, California, Louisiana and finally back home to Flordia.

Thank you all in advance for your participation and I look forward to your feedback and any questions.

Enjoy!  :thumb:
Morten

1) audiogurujax (FL)
2) rklein (OH)
3) WC (IL)
4) ozarktom (MO)
5) mlundy57 (OK)
6) srclose (OK)
7) mrvco (CO)
8 ) tubeburner (WA)
9) SFdude (WA)
10) mamba315 (CA)
11) SoundsGood (LA)

Standby folks in case someone drops out:
1)
2)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 13 Jun 2017, 08:15 pm
Have swapped WC and ozarktom slots to accommodate WC being on vacay.

1) audiogurujax (FL)
2) rklein (OH)
3) ozarktom (MO)
4) WC (IL)
5) mlundy57 (OK)
6) srclose (OK)
7) mrvco (CO)
8 ) tubeburner (WA)
9) SFdude (WA)
10) mamba315 (CA)
11) SoundsGood (LA)

Standby folks in case someone drops out:
1)
2)

Hi All,

I'm kicking off this tour and will ship out the tour unit tomorrow.

The tour unit is a brand new unit that uses the new V25 board internally and is in every way the updated LDR3.V25 model but for labeling on the rear panel since we are still in the process of fabricating new panels for the new V25 models.

The tour sequence is listed below and kicks off in Florida, then off to a few midwest states, then Oklahoma, Colorado, Washington, California, Louisiana and finally back home to Flordia.

Thank you all in advance for your participation and I look forward to your feedback and any questions.

Enjoy!  :thumb:
Morten

1) audiogurujax (FL)
2) rklein (OH)
3) WC (IL)
4) ozarktom (MO)
5) mlundy57 (OK)
6) srclose (OK)
7) mrvco (CO)
8 ) tubeburner (WA)
9) SFdude (WA)
10) mamba315 (CA)
11) SoundsGood (LA)

Standby folks in case someone drops out:
1)
2)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: OzarkTom on 13 Jun 2017, 10:45 pm
Have swapped WC and ozarktom slots to accommodate WC being on vacay.
:thumb:
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 24 Jun 2017, 04:43 pm
Next up on the tour is rklein in Ohio. Enjoy!

1) audiogurujax (FL)
2) rklein (OH)
3) ozarktom (MO)
4) WC (IL)
5) mlundy57 (OK)
6) srclose (OK)
7) mrvco (CO)
8 ) tubeburner (WA)
9) SFdude (WA)
10) mamba315 (CA)
11) SoundsGood (LA)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: SFDude on 24 Jun 2017, 06:46 pm
 :o

Tour is underway? Looking forward to hearing folks' impressions!

-dave
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 25 Jun 2017, 04:04 pm
:o

Tour is underway? Looking forward to hearing folks' impressions!

-dave


Yup! We be rolling.  :thumb:
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 1 Jul 2017, 03:01 pm
Due to some folks being away from home I'm shuffling the deck a little in order to keep the tour train rolling.

WC is up next and will be getting the unit from audiogurujax.

Have a nice 4th of July everyone!

1) audiogurujax (FL)
2) WC (IL)
3) rklein (OH)
4) ozarktom (MO)
5) mlundy57 (OK)
6) srclose (OK)
7) mrvco (CO)
8 ) tubeburner (WA)
9) SFdude (WA)
10) mamba315 (CA)
11) SoundsGood (LA)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: Tubeburner on 15 Jul 2017, 04:45 pm
How is the preamp tour progressing? Any comments on the sound?  :scratch:
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 15 Jul 2017, 04:54 pm
How is the preamp tour progressing? Any comments on the sound?  :scratch:


We got off to a glacial start where the 1st participant kept the unit a long time and then he and the next participant were out of town over the July 4th holiday so shipping was held up and then there was a car breakdown and so on and so forth. That's how you chew up a month. I'm told the unit is on it's way to participant #2. No posts yet from participant #1 although I heard via PM that he was very impressed.
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: SFDude on 16 Jul 2017, 03:32 am
I am actually hoping it gets delayed until arrival some time in September by the time it gets to me.  :green:

Will continue to check in and waiting to hear about people's feedback on this!

-dave
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 16 Jul 2017, 12:44 pm
I am actually hoping it gets delayed until arrival some time in September by the time it gets to me.  :green:

Will continue to check in and waiting to hear about people's feedback on this!

-dave


I'm sure we can juggle the order around to fit your timing preference.
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 26 Jul 2017, 04:03 pm
A quick update on the tour.
After a very slow start we are now rolling with the tour.
WC has had the unit since July 20 and will be sending it onwards to rklein by the end of this week.

1) audiogurujax (FL)
2) WC (IL)

3) rklein (OH)
4) ozarktom (MO)
5) mlundy57 (OK)
6) srclose (OK)
7) mrvco (CO)
8 ) tubeburner (WA)
9) SFdude (WA)
10) mamba315 (CA)
11) SoundsGood (LA)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: rklein on 28 Jul 2017, 12:28 am
 :thumb:
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: WC on 7 Aug 2017, 03:50 am
Well I had a week with the tour preamp before sending it off to rklein. I am currently running everything through a Marantz SR-6005 AVR which serves as a preamp. I am currently changing my whole system around. I hooked up the preamp out to my Pass ACA DIY amps. For inputs I used my Technics SR-1200 turntable through a Vista Phono1 preamp, a Schiit Modi DAC fed via USB from a Raspberry Pi running Volumio, and the Marantz AVR preamp outputs to check out Home Theater Operation. My speakers are Boston Acoustics HD-9s.

I listened to a varied selection of my music which is mainly rock and folk. For the albums I listened to just check out the What are you listening to? thread in the Music Circle.

I don't listen to my turntable all that often since it normally sounds like I am hearing the sound underwater when playing it through the Marantz. So I was planning some upgrades in that area (have a new arm and wiring on order). Playing it through the Tortuga preamp was a definite improvement. The sound was much clearer and more detailed.

Most of the time I listened to ALAC files streamed to the Raspberry Pi from iTunes on a PC. The sound was very clear and detailed, but without the air of sibilance that I experienced with the iTube2 I had in my system for awhile. Definitely made music listening enjoyable.

I tried running through the preamp with a signal from the Marantz preouts as a HT bypass application and set the volume to 99. It worked and sounded great.

I did have a few issues with the unit. If you have an appleTV like I do, you either have to change remote settings or unplug it like I did. The remote worked OK after that. It took me a little time and checking out the Tortuga website to figure out how to operate the controls. Once I got the hang of it, it seemed to work fine. I didn't delve to deeply. I just changed the volume and the switched inputs.

All in all I liked the preamp board and I am looking at picking one up as soon as Morten gets the Uart serial control all figured out and released. I intend to add it to DAC/DSP/streamer DIY build that I am currently working on. I am going to use an Arduino to control the preamp and DAC with an LCD screen and a pair of eductors.

Here is a picture of it in my system:


(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=166535)

Morten, thanks for the tour and the chance to hear this in my system.

Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: Randy on 7 Aug 2017, 05:57 am
"I did have a few issues with the unit. If you have an appleTV like I do, you either have to change remote settings or unplug it like I did. The remote worked OK after that. It took me a little time and checking out the Tortuga website to figure out how to operate the controls. Once I got the hang of it, it seemed to work fine. I didn't delve to deeply. I just changed the volume and the switched inputs."

Are you kidding me (us)?
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: SFDude on 7 Aug 2017, 06:32 am
Are you kidding me (us)?

I don't think so, since the Tortuga preamp uses an Apple Remote to control its functions. And anyone with an Apple TV will also have an Apple remote so that will be confusing for the units to figure out which device a remote is sending to it.

-dave
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: ssglx on 7 Aug 2017, 09:45 am
I have two appletv's and a tortuga preamp. All of the remotes work independently with no confusion of signals between them.
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: WC on 7 Aug 2017, 12:23 pm
There are three different settings on the appleTV remotes so you can run multiple appleTVs in the same room. I would have changed it if the preamp wasn't just a visitor. The appleTV is a gen 2 version which is somewhat obsolete at this point and rarely used.
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 7 Aug 2017, 12:35 pm
I also have an Apple TV (little black hockey puck) which uses the same silver apple remote model. Personally I keep my TV off when playing music so any potential conflict is made moot.

That said, each Apple remote has an ID number between 0 and 255 which can be easily changed. When you pair an apple remote with a Tortuga preamp you're teaching the preamp the ID number of the remote. The preamp ignores input from apple remotes with a different ID. The Apple TV responds in a very limited fashion to the Tortuga Apple remote because the Tortuga remote is not paired with the Apple TV.

There's a 1 in 256 chance that both remotes might have the same ID which can be changed in a given remote by holding down its Menu and Center buttons for 5 seconds.

Cheers,
Morten
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: Randy on 7 Aug 2017, 09:52 pm
I don't think so, since the Tortuga preamp uses an Apple Remote to control its functions. And anyone with an Apple TV will also have an Apple remote so that will be confusing for the units to figure out which device a remote is sending to it.

-dave

No idea what I was talking about. It was late.
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 8 Aug 2017, 02:43 pm
No idea what I was talking about. It was late.


Glad I'm not the only one who does that.  :lol:
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 16 Aug 2017, 05:09 pm
A quick update on the tour.
ozarktom is up next.

1) audiogurujax (FL)
2) WC (IL)
3) rklein (OH)

4) ozarktom (MO)
5) mlundy57 (OK)
6) srclose (OK)
7) mrvco (CO)
8 ) tubeburner (WA)
9) SFdude (WA)
10) mamba315 (CA)
11) SoundsGood (LA)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: OzarkTom on 17 Aug 2017, 12:16 am
 :thumb:
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 31 Aug 2017, 04:51 pm
The tour train continues it slow journey across county.
Next stop is mlundy57 in  Oklahoma.

1) audiogurujax (FL)
2) WC (IL)
3) rklein (OH)
4) ozarktom (MO)

5) mlundy57 (OK)
6) srclose (OK)
7) mrvco (CO)
8 ) tubeburner (WA)
9) SFdude (WA)
10) mamba315 (CA)
11) SoundsGood (LA)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: mlundy57 on 31 Aug 2017, 05:21 pm
 :banana piano:
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: arcman67 on 2 Sep 2017, 06:47 pm
Hello, I'm really thinking of going Passive and the LDR3 looks like the perfect preamp. My goal is total noise free, black background. I just purchased a great deal (discontinued--stock still exists) on a new NuForce STA200 class a/b power amp. This amp blows me away on my system. Anyway, I am running ZU omen Defs (ii) which are quite sensitive (101db, plus super tweeter). I hear a slight hiss with sizzle noise (very faint) thru speakers. I took my Peachtree NOVA PRE out of the system and tried my Oppo direct to amp (switched volume to variable) and tried the Bluesound NODE 2 streamer direct (switched volume to variable) and everything was dead quite. On the Nova pre, I bypassed the "gimmicky" tube and the noise was still there. So it seems the noise is coming from the Peachtree. To be honest, the noise is so faint, i only hear up close. However, I know it's there now...so I might as well address as I continue to upgrade my system.

The Schiit Freya seems to have some noise issues as well for some users. Channel Islands preamp looks nice.

Just curious from Tortuga users, is the LDR3 dead quiet?

Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: glynnw on 2 Sep 2017, 09:21 pm
I think mine are 2. somethings and are DEAD quiet
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: kernelbob on 2 Sep 2017, 11:23 pm
I have an LDRxB and an LDR1B in a biamped system (with the LDR1B ahead of the bass amp for level matching).  The Tortuga preamps are DEAD quiet.  This is as one would expect since there are no active devices in the signal path.  One important point that frequently does not get enough attention is that there are also no switches, potentiometers, or capacitors in the signal path.

It isn't that the Tortuga's do a "good enough" job, they sound better than any active preamp or attenuator that I've heard.  That includes transformer-based and resistor array attenuators, both of which use switches in the signal path.  Switches and potentiometers are evil.

Best,
Robert
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: kernelbob on 2 Sep 2017, 11:54 pm
By the way, my Tortugas are both version 2, running off an Optima 12 volt 750 CCA marine battery.

Robert
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: arcman67 on 3 Sep 2017, 07:48 pm
Any issues with loss of dynamics,major out mismatches from input to input, etc that all the naysayers point to? The longest non speaker cable in my system is 1 foot.
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: arcman67 on 3 Sep 2017, 07:54 pm
This also turns me off from the FREYA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nHMZlDsEeL8
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: glynnw on 3 Sep 2017, 08:47 pm
Over the years I have tried many passive and active pre's, using a TVC before the Tortuga. The Tortuga immediately sounded more crystal clear. Drum strokes were better and metal guitar strings were REALLY metal. I noticed no loss of any kind, but when I added a tube buffer, very similar to the one Tortuga now sells, it did flesh out everything a bit.  But now no hum at any time, any volume.  I also use a tube amp and it is still dead silent.  I have been thinking the last few days about how I now sense no stridency at all.  I highly recommend the Tortuga, and no, Morten doesn't bribe me or give me a discount to say these things.
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: kernelbob on 3 Sep 2017, 09:01 pm
Hi arcman67,

Dynamics is where my Tortugas excel.  When I finally decided to audition one, I expected to hear the same limitations that I had heard in other passives, both switched resistor arrays and transformer units.  With the Tortuga, I was amazed that it had an even better sense of dynamics than the active preamp that I was using at the time (an ARC REF3).

Other qualities:
1) very black backgrounds resulting from an absence of active devices
2) outstanding timbre of instruments as well as a sense of solidity of instruments
3) increase in L/R soundstage
4) deep soundstage with excellent positioning of instruments

Can you clarify what you mean by "major out mismatches from input to input".  Since each source device will have it's own set of attributes (output level, output impedance, etc.) the output level of that device will vary.  Assuming that there are differences between final system output from different sources, why would that matter?  Sound to me like grasping at straws to find some reason to throw stones at the Tortuga.

Everyone that I know who has tried one has reported similar results to mine.

Best,
Robert
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 3 Sep 2017, 09:53 pm
This also turns me off from the FREYA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nHMZlDsEeL8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nHMZlDsEeL8)

The volume stepping with all Tortuga LDR preamps is very smooth and quiet. Our most recent V25 controller has 99 steps + mute over a -60 to 0 dB range at ~0.5 dB per step. Even though the steps are discrete there's actually no discrete switching (no relays etc) going on as volume goes up/down. The step adjustments are done through small scheduled changes in the control voltage to each LDR. These analog control voltages come from DACs controlled by the processor. Unlike DACs used in music playback, the DACs used on our controller are not required to have wide dynamic bandwidth and instead provide essentially steady state voltage output except for small changes when volume is changed.
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 3 Sep 2017, 10:18 pm
Hello, I'm really thinking of going Passive and the LDR3 looks like the perfect preamp. My goal is total noise free, black background. I just purchased a great deal (discontinued--stock still exists) on a new NuForce STA200 class a/b power amp. This amp blows me away on my system. Anyway, I am running ZU omen Defs (ii) which are quite sensitive (101db, plus super tweeter). I hear a slight hiss with sizzle noise (very faint) thru speakers. I took my Peachtree NOVA PRE out of the system and tried my Oppo direct to amp (switched volume to variable) and tried the Bluesound NODE 2 streamer direct (switched volume to variable) and everything was dead quite. On the Nova pre, I bypassed the "gimmicky" tube and the noise was still there. So it seems the noise is coming from the Peachtree. To be honest, the noise is so faint, i only hear up close. However, I know it's there now...so I might as well address as I continue to upgrade my system.

The Schiit Freya seems to have some noise issues as well for some users. Channel Islands preamp looks nice.

Just curious from Tortuga users, is the LDR3 dead quiet?

As others have noted, there's no discernible noise introduced by the Tortuga LDR passive preamps. Of course if there's noise coming in from a source, that noise gets passed through only attenuated. There's no secret to why the LDR3 and our other passive models are dead quiet. Simply put there's no active direct contact between a power supply and the incoming audio signal as there is in all conventional active preamps. The noise you hear to varying degrees from many active preamps is actually the residual noise coming from the power supply. Better active preamps have better power supplies with better filtering and PSRR (power supply rejection ratio) and thus tend to be quieter. Still, when cranked up high, most active preamps produce some level of hiss that can usually be heard with the ear close to the speakers while no music is playing. In this respect passives are usually always quieter with blacker backgrounds and more space between the notes.

One possible exception to this is when mating a passive preamp to certain amplifiers that are DC (direct) coupled. Some direct coupled amps are sensitive to the presence of any DC offset in the signal coming from the amp. A passive preamp doesn't create a DC offset but it doesn't remove an either.  If there's a DC offset coming from a source, it gets passed through to the amp. With an active preamp, such offsets are most often blocked via either an input or output coupling capacitor - or both. That same DC coupled amp may also be fussy about connecting to a passive preamp if the preamp's output impedance is too high (too high for that specific amp, not too high for others). The net downside in these instances can be noticeable hum. While Tortuga passive preamps do have adjustable input impedance, the output impedance is inextricably linked with the input impedance and the resulting output impedance will never be flat/constant and may be too high for a particular DC amp.

The vast majority of amps are AC coupled and not DC coupled. Thus, the above exception has proven to be quite rare in practice. Plus with our 30 day in-home buy-try-decide audition policy you'll KNOW after putting one in your system if yours is an exceptional case or more typical. We don't hang people out to dry if our preamp isn't a good fit for your system. Just return it within the 30 day audition window for full refund less your cost for return shipping.

Best,
Morten
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: arcman67 on 4 Sep 2017, 12:16 am
Hi arcman67,

Sound to me like grasping at straws to find some reason to throw stones at the Tortuga.



Not trying to sound snarky, I don't think anything I read (or said myself) was throwing stones at the Tortuga. I'm new to passive and like anybody with some sense, I do research. The questions I asked were results of repeated "possible cons of going passive" that I saw in regards to passives in general. So I am asking owners who have used the Tortuga specifically about the common issues with passives I have heard about.

As for input mismatch, I was just curious if, with most modern components, would it be less likely to switch from let's say input one at a comfortable volume, then switch to input two and be almost muted and I would have to jack volume knob quite a bit. Not really a Tortuga issue, its all about the actual components. But, is that a major concerned if using modern (non vintage) components.

Morton did a great job answering my questions plus 30 days is a great way to see for myself


Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: arcman67 on 4 Sep 2017, 12:19 am
As others have noted, there's no discernible noise introduced by the Tortuga LDR passive preamps. Of course if there's noise coming in from a source, that noise gets passed through only attenuated. There's no secret to why the LDR3 and our other passive models are dead quiet. Simply put there's no active direct contact between a power supply and the incoming audio signal as there is in all conventional active preamps. The noise you hear to varying degrees from many active preamps is actually the residual noise coming from the power supply. Better active preamps have better power supplies with better filtering and PSRR (power supply rejection ratio) and thus tend to be quieter. Still, when cranked up high, most active preamps produce some level of hiss that can usually be heard with the ear close to the speakers while no music is playing. In this respect passives are usually always quieter with blacker backgrounds and more space between the notes.

One possible exception to this is when mating a passive preamp to certain amplifiers that are DC (direct) coupled. Some direct coupled amps are sensitive to the presence of any DC offset in the signal coming from the amp. A passive preamp doesn't create a DC offset but it doesn't remove an either.  If there's a DC offset coming from a source, it gets passed through to the amp. With an active preamp, such offsets are most often blocked via either an input or output coupling capacitor - or both. That same DC coupled amp may also be fussy about connecting to a passive preamp if the preamp's output impedance is too high (too high for that specific amp, not too high for others). The net downside in these instances can be noticeable hum. While Tortuga passive preamps do have adjustable input impedance, the output impedance is inextricably linked with the input impedance and the resulting output impedance will never be flat/constant and may be too high for a particular DC amp.

The vast majority of amps are AC coupled and not DC coupled. Thus, the above exception has proven to be quite rare in practice. Plus with our 30 day in-home buy-try-decide audition policy you'll KNOW after putting one in your system if yours is an exceptional case or more typical. We don't hang people out to dry if our preamp isn't a good fit for your system. Just return it within the 30 day audition window for full refund less your cost for return shipping.

Best,
Morten


Thanks Morten for the time you have taken to answer my questions. Really, it does not look like I am "out anything" by trying the Tortuga. Plus, the wife wants me to move toward minimal designed stereo gear. She was glad I got rid of my old B&K amp with large rack handles on the front. The Tortuga matches well with the appearance of my new Nuforce amp

http://www.audioadvisor.com/prodinfo.asp?number=NUSTA200

Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: kernelbob on 4 Sep 2017, 04:11 am
Not trying to sound snarky, I don't think anything I read (or said myself) was throwing stones at the Tortuga. I'm new to passive and like anybody with some sense, I do research. The questions I asked were results of repeated "possible cons of going passive" that I saw in regards to passives in general. So I am asking owners who have used the Tortuga specifically about the common issues with passives I have heard about.

I didn't mean to imply that you were being "snarky".  The exact statement I was referencing was...
Any issues with loss of dynamics,major out mismatches from input to input, etc that all the naysayers point to?

My response was directed to "all the naysayers", not that this was your statement or opinion.  I know that your comments were in no sense an attack nor were they out of line.  Mine were certainly not intended to be such.

Based on my experiences with other passive controllers, I was also skeptical of another passive unit.  However, the Tortuga has actually improved the dynamics (macro and micro) in my system.  That was quite a surprise.

Best,
Robert
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 4 Sep 2017, 02:02 pm
...... would it be less likely to switch from let's say input one at a comfortable volume, then switch to input two and be almost muted and I would have to jack volume knob quite a bit. Not really a Tortuga issue, its all about the actual components. But, is that a major concerned if using modern (non vintage) components.

All Tortuga preamps remember the volume level setting last used with each input. When you switch back to given input the volume is automatically set to the volume last associated with that input. There's a global override to this which limits the maximum initial volume when switching inputs. That global override is set at 50%  volume by default but can be adjusted up/down by the user. This override prevents the user from switching to an input that may have used with home theater gear with the Tortuga volume set at 100% for home theater bypass.

Cheers,
Morten
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: kernelbob on 4 Sep 2017, 03:47 pm
Thanks Morten.  I forgot that the volume setting of each input is retained.  For anyone interested in the all the features, there's in-depth documentation on the Tortuga website.

Robert
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: mlundy57 on 9 Sep 2017, 02:37 am
I got the unit and just finished putting it my system and turning it on. That's as far as I can go since there are not any instructions with it and the UI is not intuitive. I'm on my way over to the Tortuga web site to see if I can find some instructions.

Mike
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: WC on 9 Sep 2017, 02:42 am
Mike,

Look for the controller instructions under preamp controls. I was able to figure it out, but it did take looking at the instructions.
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 9 Sep 2017, 02:50 am
I got the unit and just finished putting it my system and turning it on. That's as far as I can go since there are not any instructions with it and the UI is not intuitive. I'm on my way over to the Tortuga web site to see if I can find some instructions.

Mike

Been a bit preoccupied with hurricane Irma preparations but forgot to mention that the last participant discovered one of the two outputs was bad so heads up on that if you get no output just use the other pair. No doubt all the traveling has rattled a connection loose.

The V25 controls are explained in detail in the product documentation under Support in main menu. Select Preamp Controls - Apple Control Versions - V25 Apple Remote Guide
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: mlundy57 on 9 Sep 2017, 03:05 am
OK I found the guide. Just printed it out so back upstairs I go.

If one of the pairs of outputs doesn't work I may have a problem. My speakers are 2 part units so I use 2 outputs off the preamp. One output is connected to the bass modules' plate amps while the other output passes through an in-line filter to roll off the bottom octave on it's way to the power amp for the midrange/tweeter unit. 

If one of the outputs is bad I'll have to rig up a way to split the signal off the output that does work. What effect would this have on the performance of the unit?

Mike
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 9 Sep 2017, 03:08 am
If one of the outputs is bad I'll have to rig up a way to split the signal off the output that does work. What effect would this have on the performance of the unit?

Mike


With decent hardware I'd expect no downside. This is essentially what's done internally anyway.
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: mlundy57 on 9 Sep 2017, 03:12 am

With decent hardware I'd expect no downside. This is essentially what's done internally anyway.

OK if one pair doesn't work I'll get ahold of a couple Y splitters. Thanks

Good luck with Irma. Take care and be safe.

Mike
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: mlundy57 on 9 Sep 2017, 03:49 am
It's up and running. When I first started playing music the volume control didn't have any effect. The numbers would go up and down but the volume didn't change unless I ran it all the way down to 0. Then it almost totally muted. 0 would be mute, 1 would be very loud and didn't change regardless of where I set the volume.

I ran the auto calibration and that fixed the issue. Volume control is working properly now

Mike
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 9 Sep 2017, 12:39 pm
It's up and running. When I first started playing music the volume control didn't have any effect. The numbers would go up and down but the volume didn't change unless I ran it all the way down to 0. Then it almost totally muted. 0 would be mute, 1 would be very loud and didn't change regardless of where I set the volume.

I ran the auto calibration and that fixed the issue. Volume control is working properly now

Mike

Hi Mike,

The challenge with sending a unit on a tour is there are opportunities for someone to change the configuration of the preamp to render it inoperable until corrected. One of the downsides of the adjustable impedance feature is a casual user can easily change the impedance setting/level incorrectly. This is the equivalent to giving the preamp an undefined/empty attenuation schedule so volume control does not respond normally. By rerunning autocal you initialized the attenuation table for whatever impedance setting the unit was set at.

The solution to this is a revision to the firmware around the adjustable impedance feature to make it impossible to set the impedance incorrectly to an undefined setting. "Undefined" is another way of saying an impedance setting has not been initialized through an autocal cycle. Once the firmware is revised, the preamp will simply revert to a previous known setting if the user puts it in an undefined/uninitialized state.

Enjoy,
Morten
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 18 Sep 2017, 04:48 pm
Next stop on the tour is srclose in Oklahoma.

1) audiogurujax (FL)
2) WC (IL)
3) rklein (OH)
4) ozarktom (MO)
5) mlundy57 (OK)

6) srclose (OK)
7) mrvco (CO)
8 ) tubeburner (WA)
9) SFdude (WA)
10) mamba315 (CA)
11) SoundsGood (LA)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: rklein on 18 Sep 2017, 05:25 pm
Hi Mike,

The challenge with sending a unit on a tour is there are opportunities for someone to change the configuration of the preamp to render it inoperable until corrected. One of the downsides of the adjustable impedance feature is a casual user can easily change the impedance setting/level incorrectly. This is the equivalent to giving the preamp an undefined/empty attenuation schedule so volume control does not respond normally. By rerunning autocal you initialized the attenuation table for whatever impedance setting the unit was set at.

The solution to this is a revision to the firmware around the adjustable impedance feature to make it impossible to set the impedance incorrectly to an undefined setting. "Undefined" is another way of saying an impedance setting has not been initialized through an autocal cycle. Once the firmware is revised, the preamp will simply revert to a previous known setting if the user puts it in an undefined/uninitialized state.

Enjoy,
Morten

This is what happened to me...  I apologize for my tardiness in reporting back on my time with the Tortuga pre.

The only way I got to an appropriate volume was to run the volume control all the way up to 75+.  I should have called Morten to get the unit back to the correct configuration or go on his website.  I was in between business trips and had a limited time with the unit.  Unfortunately, I most likely did not hear what this preamp could really do.

Regards,

Randy
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: Tubeburner on 28 Sep 2017, 02:45 am
Hi Morten,

You can take me off the Tour list since I ordered a LDR3v25 and I don't plan on sending it back. I have one in house and this will be my second for a bi-amp setup.

Everyone, please read the on line control and settings as it makes a world of difference on the sound.

Thank you Kernelbob for your help and recommendations.  :D

Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 28 Sep 2017, 02:39 pm
Next stop on the tour is mrvco in Colorado.
I've taken tubeburner off the list since he's is now a Tortuga Audio customer twice over.  :thumb:

1) audiogurujax (FL)
2) WC (IL)
3) rklein (OH)
4) ozarktom (MO)
5) mlundy57 (OK)
6) srclose (OK)

7) mrvco (CO)
8 ) tubeburner (WA)
9) SFdude (WA)
10) mamba315 (CA)
11) SoundsGood (LA)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: mlundy57 on 28 Sep 2017, 03:36 pm
I was impressed enough with the tour unit I'm going to build a 6 input version.

Mike
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: WC on 28 Sep 2017, 03:48 pm
I have a 4 input version on order. Someday it will show up.  :D
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: mlundy57 on 28 Sep 2017, 03:54 pm
I plan on building it. It won't be as easy as the 3 input kit though since I will have to source at least the chassis and mounting board.

Getting a chassis with the back plate drilled and labeled is going to be the fun part. I can drill round holes but squares or rectangles is a different issue, then will come the labeling.

Would a wood back plate work or would that cause issues?
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 28 Sep 2017, 04:17 pm
I plan on building it. It won't be as easy as the 3 input kit though since I will have to source at least the chassis and mounting board.

Getting a chassis with the back plate drilled and labeled is going to be the fun part. I can drill round holes but squares or rectangles is a different issue, then will come the labeling.

Would a wood back plate work or would that cause issues?


You can certainly use wood. I would limit this to max 1/8" thickness since any thicker and the power/trigger jacks run out of thread. No problem with the longer RCA jacks especially the Cardas which are long to start with.
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 13 Oct 2017, 04:25 pm
Next stop on the tour is SFDude in Seattle.

1) audiogurujax (FL)
2) WC (IL)
3) rklein (OH)
4) ozarktom (MO)
5) mlundy57 (OK)
6) srclose (OK)
7) mrvco (CO)
8 ) tubeburner (WA)

9) SFdude (WA)
10) mamba315 (CA)
11) SoundsGood (LA)

Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: mamba315 on 9 Nov 2017, 08:59 am
Just a note to say that the tour preamp has been shipped from SFDude to myself, and arrived safely today.  I hooked it up and got it passing tunes, and am now reading the online documentation so I can explore all the features.  Next update will probably occur once I have shipped it off to the next person.  Have a lot of listening to do in the meantime..
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 9 Nov 2017, 03:07 pm
Just a note to say that the tour preamp has been shipped from SFDude to myself, and arrived safely today.  I hooked it up and got it passing tunes, and am now reading the online documentation so I can explore all the features.  Next update will probably occur once I have shipped it off to the next person.  Have a lot of listening to do in the meantime..


Thanks.
Enjoy!
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 9 Nov 2017, 03:09 pm
Tour is almost done with preamp currently chill'n in LA with mamba315.  :thumb:

1) audiogurujax (FL)
2) WC (IL)
3) rklein (OH)
4) ozarktom (MO)
5) mlundy57 (OK)
6) srclose (OK)
7) mrvco (CO)
8 ) tubeburner (WA)
9) SFdude (WA)
10) mamba315 (CA)

11) SoundsGood (LA)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: plakey on 28 Nov 2017, 01:45 am
Looks like I'm late to this party!  :cry:

Any plans for another tour...?  8)
Title: Re: TOUR of LDR3.V25 Passive Preamp with new V25 LDR preamp controller
Post by: tortugaranger on 28 Nov 2017, 02:46 pm
Looks like I'm late to this party!  :cry:

Any plans for another tour...?  8)


No, the tour is over and I've no plans at the moment for another round with our current model.