Spikes, Isolators, etc.

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. Read 485 times.

Zuman

Spikes, Isolators, etc.
« on: 15 Feb 2023, 05:22 pm »
I'm pretty sure that I don't properly understand spikes and other systems intended to maximize speaker performance by coming between a speaker and a stand or floor.
I'm building a pair of T-M-M floorstanders that are 8-1/2" wide, 11-3/4" deep, and 44" tall. They'll stand on a carpeted concrete floor in the lower level of our home, and my default position was to install spikes to penetrate the carpet and underlayment, primarily to increase the stability of this somewhat tall, narrow, top-heavy design.
Recently, though, I read that cabinet wall vibrations measure higher on spiked speakers than unspiked cabinets. I suppose that makes sense, as three or four spikes per speaker aren't likely to vibrate much themselves and aren't going to make my concrete floor start resonating significantly. On the other hand, wouldn't isolation pucks or feet (such as Isoacoustics' Oreas or Gaias) allow the entire speaker cabinet to move in response to Newton's Third Law?
My cabinets are ported and will be carefully crafted, well-lined with NoRez, appropriately stuffed, and heavily braced, and my goal is that the sound will be the product of the drivers, crossover, cabinet design, volume, construction, and ports, so I'm trying to make the boxes as inert as possible.  Does it seem to you that spikes will be the best solution, or do you recommend something else?
Thanks for your input!

rollo

  • Industry Participant
  • Posts: 5464
  • Rollo Audio Consulting -
Re: Spikes, Isolators, etc.
« Reply #1 on: 15 Feb 2023, 05:28 pm »
   Gaia is a well proven method. We use them in our Showrooms and not a dealer of them.

charles

jtcf

Re: Spikes, Isolators, etc.
« Reply #2 on: 15 Feb 2023, 07:41 pm »
There are lots of videos that show via an accelerator attached to a speaker how different footers,platforms, and spikes affect speaker vibrations. IsoAcoustics Gaias with the spike accessory (for carpet) would be worth a try. Under my bottom ported speakers Primacoustics recoil platforms are the winner.So much more clean and clear with much more articulate bass.

Mariusz Uszynski

Re: Spikes, Isolators, etc.
« Reply #3 on: 15 Feb 2023, 07:57 pm »
Hi Zuman, I use IsoAcoustics products on my gear, Gaia Series under speakers and Orea Series under cd player and amplifier.Unfortunately, you cannot place Gaia Series directly on the carpet, that's why you'll need to purchase carpet discs, or you can make wooden platform (with the spikes), place it on the floor, then place the speakers with Gaia on the platform (with the wooden platform, you won't need carpet spikes).You have to know the "THE WEIGHT OF THE SPEAKERS", in order to purchase the right product.On IsoAcoustics website, you'll find the "PRODUCT SELECTOR", which will help you choose the right size for your speakers, that's very important.I hope, I'm making sense here?



https://isoacoustics.com/


dpatters

Re: Spikes, Isolators, etc.
« Reply #4 on: 15 Feb 2023, 08:02 pm »



These worked well for me. TrackPoint Isolation Footers
My speakers weigh 250 pounds each.

Don P

jtcf

Re: Spikes, Isolators, etc.
« Reply #5 on: 15 Feb 2023, 10:58 pm »
250 lbs!! I was whining because mine are 100 lbs.Spikes couple the speakers to floor.Decoupling is addressed by different means. Which to choose depends what one wishes to achieve.

whydontumarryit

  • Restricted
  • Posts: 218
Re: Spikes, Isolators, etc.
« Reply #6 on: 15 Feb 2023, 11:18 pm »
You need outriggers to stabilize your speakers. Carpet and concrete is as much isolation as you can get.
Spikes, et al, are a waste of money in this case.

Elizabeth

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 2736
  • So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish
Re: Spikes, Isolators, etc.
« Reply #7 on: 16 Feb 2023, 02:11 am »
An alternative is find a plain wood product to use as footers that interacts synergistically with your cabinets.
Rather than going for the standard "let's do what everyone else is doing". Try various bits if exotic wood under your cabinets. and actually listen. rather than pretend theories you read about matter the most.
Naturally this is heresy. I understand it is road strewn with dangerous hazards to your Audiophile credentials. 
 :thumb:
I experimented with lots of various exotic wood bits as footers (for speakers, and equipment) and found they give me a far more musical and enjoyable experience.

Letitroll98

  • Facilitator
  • Posts: 5619
  • Too loud is just right
Re: Spikes, Isolators, etc.
« Reply #8 on: 16 Feb 2023, 12:26 pm »
The idea behind spikes for speakers is mass loading, that all that weight on tiny little points creates thousands of pounds per square inch at that point from, say, a 60lb speaker.  That supposedly acts as a vibration drain to the floor with various opinions on whether that works better with wooden or concrete floors.  A variation of this is the ball in cup designs. 

Another strategy is isolation using various spring loaded affairs or materials like sorbathane to directly absorb the cabinet vibrations.  The spring loaded products are all much, much more expensive than spikes or sorbathane pucks, several of which have been recommended on this thread.

The last type that I'm aware of is constrained layer damping which seems to be used more for electronic equipment and turntable isolation than damping speaker cabinet vibrations.  But I'm curious about this for speakers, perhaps in combination with spikes, because a platform seems a lot more stable than either spikes or pucks.  We have a rota of engineers here at AC who might be able to provide some mathematical theory on the various products.

jtcf

Re: Spikes, Isolators, etc.
« Reply #9 on: 16 Feb 2023, 04:05 pm »
No matter what we do to control vibrations it's always going to be a matter of personal preference. Different methods result in aurally pleasing and non pleasing results.Harbeth is one example where cabinet vibration is a deliberate part of the design.
 Last night I placed one of my subs on a platform that was delivered yesterday afternoon. It's very similar to the Primacoustics under the ZUs except wood/neoprene instead of metal. It was definitely not a good sound which was surprising. I was thinking it would either help tighten the bass or do nothing at all. There was an unpleasant glare.That one is coming out and today it will go under another in a different spot and see what happens.