What turntable?

doug s. · « **Reply #20 on:** 17 Dec 2004, 08:08 pm »

Quote from: mcrespo71

If you can get a used Oracle Delphi and upgrade it to MKV specs for $1800, then that's a no brainer. I helped a friend set a new MK V up and it was a bitch IMO compared to setting up the turn key Rega's (15 minute set up) and Scout (30-45 minute set up). The Oracle literally took two guys about 3 hours to set up- had to mount the Graham tonearm as well. It's a very good table, but retail it's pretty spendy.

agreed the initial set-up of the oracle can be a bit time consuming. not wery difficult, really, yust a bit of time to get the springs properly set-up & adjusted... but, i have also found that once set-up, it rarely needs any further adjustments - not at all finicky.

re: pricing, i think *all* really nice decks are spendy - why i like to recommend buying a used turntable!

regards,

doug s.

mcrespo71 · « **Reply #21 on:** 17 Dec 2004, 09:48 pm »

The springs were annoying, but we had the most trouble getting the belt on. What a pain in the ass! It's nice the Oracle's spring suspension don't drift like the LP12's! Regardless, I'd still say the Oracle, or Linn for that matter, is not an easy set up TT for someone who has never dealt with analog before. Both sound great, but need a bit more TLC in set up.

Michael

Inscrutable · « **Reply #22 on:** 17 Dec 2004, 11:25 pm »

I just got done setting up an old Delphi, and it wasn't really a big deal (if you have the correct springs), just a bit of time - and it was my first suspended table. Maybe I got lucky, but I got the belt on in 3 tries. I certainly wouldn't be scared of it. Of course, a non-suspended deck is virtually a no-brainer.

doug s. · « **Reply #23 on:** 17 Dec 2004, 11:57 pm »

Quote from: mcrespo71

The springs were annoying, but we had the most trouble getting the belt on. What a pain in the ass! It's nice the Oracle's spring suspension don't drift like the LP12's! Regardless, I'd still say the Oracle, or Linn for that matter, is not an easy set up TT for someone who has never dealt with analog before. Both sound great, but need a bit more TLC in set up.

Michael

re: the belt, it's not really difficult - ya yust gotta know the trick.

w/the platter removed, ya pull the belt on the platter, then keep it tensioned w/the finger(s) of yer left hand on the platters' underside, while yer thumb's on top of the platter. then, when ya lower the platter as far into the bearing as ya can w/o scrunching yer fingers, ya can release the belt over the motor pulley.

what was somewhat difficult for me was adapting the o-l dc motor kit to work. it took most of a day, but most of the time was spent yust staring at everything, to figure out what misc parts i'd need, to get everything lined up properly. the only issue i had was i lost the oracle's light coming on, when the turntable powers up. i wanted to insure that the oracle's switch was what powered up the motor, not the o-l switch (which is "on" all the time). i was able to do this, but i couldn't figure out how to wire it so the light was in the circuit. not a big deal really....

the latest o-l kits are awreddy contained in a case - i had to fabricate mine - so it would likely take quite a bit less time to conwert an oracle w/the new o-l dc motor kits...

doug s.

Rocket · « **Reply #24 on:** 18 Dec 2004, 12:20 am »

Hi,

If i lived in the states or canada i would definitely consider buying a secondhand mint condition turntable. I'm amazed at how inexpensive good quality decks sell for on audiogon.

If you do consider the bix turntable have a look at the bluenote tonearms as brian sells them at ridiculously low prices in comparison to retail prices.

I would ditch the dealer as i indicated before and look after yourself.

Regards

Rod

mcrespo71 · « **Reply #25 on:** 18 Dec 2004, 01:16 am »

Quote

re: the belt, it's not really difficult - ya yust gotta know the trick. icon_wink.gif w/the platter removed, ya pull the belt on the platter, then keep it tensioned w/the finger(s) of yer left hand on the platters' underside, while yer thumb's on top of the platter. then, when ya lower the platter as far into the bearing as ya can w/o scrunching yer fingers, ya can release the belt over the motor pulley.

Where the hell were you when we needed this advice

No matter, the hour and a half we futzed with the belt put hair on our chests!

Michael

Inscrutable · « **Reply #26 on:** 18 Dec 2004, 10:26 am »

Doug/Michael,
That's exactly how I did the belt. Great minds think alike - and apparently ours too

Doug,
Good to know about the O-L motor. With Oracle's business history, I was concerned about being left out in the cold if mine gave up the ghost at an inopportune time, but I don't really want to spend the coin for the Mk V upgrade right now.

doug s. · « **Reply #27 on:** 18 Dec 2004, 04:00 pm »

Quote from: Inscrutable

Doug/Michael,
That's exactly how I did the belt. Great minds think alike - and apparently ours too
Doug,
Good to know about the O-L motor. With Oracle's business history, I was concerned about being left out in the cold if mine gave up the ghost at an inopportune time, but I don't really want to spend the coin for the Mk V upgrade right now.

when i bought my used oracle, it was from a dealer in quebec. so, it was wery economical to have it upgraded at time of purchase - the dealer yust had to drive it across town for me!

i'd strongly recommend getting the upgrade; if ya don't wanna send yer turntable parts out, buy the parts, & have the machine work done locally; it's really not that complicated & a local shop should be able to do it in a snap. skip the motor upgrade, tho - the o-l dc motor kit is great, imo, especially w/these killer lab-grade power supplies around, like lambda, hewlett-packard, etc, for penies on the dollar.

rocket, i'd still consider a used deck, if i were you - yust talk w/the seller to discuss bullet-proof packing.

that said, if i were in the market for a deck right now, that bix w/an o-l rb250 or o-l silver, sure looks tempting...

doug s.

woodsyi · « **Reply #28 on:** 18 Dec 2004, 06:52 pm »

I agree with Doug. If you take time to look around very good deals can be found, especially a package deal that may need some work. I got a Delphi MkIII, SME IV and Koetsu Rosewood Signature for just over 2k. I had to change the DIN phono cable and upgraded the Delphi to MKV as I needed a new motor and power supply. The cartridge needed some cosmetic cleaning but it works great. All in all, I got a great system (for me) for around 3.5k but it took about 4 months time to get everything squared away.

Rocket · « **Reply #29 on:** 19 Dec 2004, 01:31 am »

Hi Doug,

I bought my bluenote piccolo turntable late last year and it is good enough for me at this stage. However, if i had waited another couple of months i could have bought the bix turntable which i think is probably better and come be fitted with better quality tonearms.

What i really need to do is upgrade my hagtech bugle phonostage and i'm looking at building a cornet shortly.

The problem i have with buying from the states is the voltage, in oz we use 220-240 voltage.

Best wishes

Rod

mcrespo71 · « **Reply #30 on:** 19 Dec 2004, 05:54 am »

It's interesting that many are recommending the Bix? As far as I can tell, it is new, has very few users that have touted it on the net, is really big and seems to appeal to the big=better value crowd. Has anyone actually listened to one of these, or does everyone just think it is a killer table in theory? It looks like a lot of table for the $, but I would never recommend a table unless I have actually listened to it first. Just curious if those that are recommending it have actually heard it or own it?

Michael

meilankev · « **Reply #31 on:** 19 Dec 2004, 01:10 pm »

Michael,

While I agree with your sentiment, to me recommending an item you have never "put through the wringer" is just slightly removed from what usually happens: people simply recommending what they own. Whan this occurs, there is no real advice, it's just a popularity contest.

Why do people do this? Are they really analyzing the poster's situation? Have they ever sat in the poster's listening room? Most importantly, have they listened to every possible contender in that price range?

To me, it is foolish to advise/encourage someone to buy a specific piece of gear in almost any situation. A couple of years ago when I was putting my system together, my price range was the exact same as Songforyou. I spent over a year researching components prior to purchase. But even then, I heard fewer than half of all contenders. How can I say that "Turntable X" is the best choice if I never got to hear the Kuzma, or the Bluenote? How do I know that those decks would not be a better choice for Songforyou?

The bottom line is "I don't". I've never been in his listening room. I don't know the way his other component synergise together. I don't know the breadth of artists he prefers. Most importantly, I don't know his personal preferences. How important is the warranty in his list of criteria?

This why I resist giving advice such as "Buy 'X'. I own it, and it's great!!!" The furtherest I like to go is to whittle out possibilities that either I k now won't fit (or those that have capabilities that are unneccesary and therefore overly expensive). For example, on the VMPS sub-forum, a gentleman was looking for advice on which VMPS speakers to buy. He said he owned a pair of SVS subs. My "advice" was that if he was going to use the subs to augment his 2-channel enjoyment, there was no reason to spend the extra cash to get full-range speakers that can play to the lowest levels. The subwoofers will take care of that.

Audio enjoyment is not an "objective science". It is much more about personal preferences. What is "best" for me most certainly will not be "best" for everyone.

Kevin

jcoat007 · « **Reply #32 on:** 19 Dec 2004, 02:51 pm »

Quote from: meilankev

Michael,

While I agree with your sentiment, to me recommending an item you have never "put through the wringer" is just slightly removed from what usually happens: people simply recommending what they own. Whan this occurs, there is no real advice, it's just a popularity contest.

Why do people do this? Are they really analyzing the poster's situation? Have they ever sat in the poster's listening room? Most importantly, have they listened to every possible contender in that price range?

To me, i ...

I totally agree with this, however, I think the point of this forum is to hear other's experience and use that to weed out things and find things that we might not otherwise know about.

I have only had two turntables, a Music Hall MMF-5 and a Nottingham Spacedeck. I think the Nottingham tables are great tables with no fuss setup and operation. You might want to check this out.

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?anlgtabl&1108249662

The main thing I like about buying used is that you shouldn't get burned when trying to resell, so you can try different things without to much cost/expense.

Just my 2 cents.

Steve

Tonto Yoder · « **Reply #33 on:** 19 Dec 2004, 03:07 pm »

Quote from: jcoat007

... You might want to check this out.

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?anlgtabl&1108249662
...

I have a Spacedeck also, but that Interspace looks attractive, especially since it appears to have the thick platter. Hollywood Sound (which sold some guys similar Interspaces) thought the Hyper-plattered Interspace was roughly equivalent to the Spacedeck.

mcrespo71 · « **Reply #34 on:** 19 Dec 2004, 08:16 pm »

Quote from: Tonto Yoder

Quote from: jcoat007
... You might want to check this out.

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?anlgtabl&1108249662
...

I have a Spacedeck also, but that Interspace looks attractive, especially since it appears to have the thick platter. Hollywood Sound (which sold some guys similar Interspaces) thought the Hyper-plattered Interspace was roughly equivalent to the Spacedeck.

That's interesting. I heard the thin plattered Space deck, which is the only one I've heard, is the best one. From what I've read, the thick plattered one completely killed the PRAT and made it sound really big. I guess it depends on your preferences.

Michael

Songforyou · « **Reply #35 on:** 23 Dec 2004, 03:59 am »

Thanks for the suggestions everybody.

I'm interested in the Nottingham tables too. Does anyone have any experience with the Horizon SE. I'm told they've done a better job at isolating the motor.

Anyone listen to this table? How does it compare to the Scout or Nott Interspace?

My wallet is a few bills shy of a Spacedeck (and will be for some time).

bluesky · « **Reply #36 on:** 31 Dec 2004, 08:43 am »

After reading all the posts I thought I would put in my two cents worth on what I got for myself and which I am very happy with.

I bought a new Michell Gyro SE and a second hand Origin Live Silver tonearm with a Dynavector 10X5 cartridge.

To my mind the Michell Gyro SE is just wonderful and Michell has a long history of providing back up and upgrades over time. Your turntable will not be left behind over time as the upgades are always retro fittable. A big plus in my mind.

There are some truly great mods availabe from people like Gert Pederson in Denmark who provide state of the art upgrades.

The arm and cartridge are by way of personal preference, as is the phono stage, but for me the Michell was the way to go. I will put some effort into building the Hagtech Cornet 2 and compare it to Rod Elliott's solid state phono stage when I am finished (plus the one I am already using).

Hope this helps,

Ian

Upstateaudio · « **Reply #37 on:** 3 Jan 2005, 04:48 am »

I thought the Interspace was discontinued and replaced by the Horizon SE. Correct me if I am wrong.

Songforyou · « **Reply #38 on:** 3 Jan 2005, 03:28 pm »

Quote

I thought the Interspace was discontinued and replaced by the Horizon SE. Correct me if I am wrong.

Upstateaudio,

It's my understanding that the Interspace is still available, but is no longer brought into the U.S. by the American distributor. The Canadian distributor (Bluebird Music) still makes the table available here. So I'm told, anyway. There is one dealer here who claims that the Interspace is so close to the Spacedeck that the $ difference is better spent on the Nott power supply. This dealer does not carry the Horizon (didn't like the original version).

Songforyou · « **Reply #39 on:** 7 Apr 2005, 01:06 am »

First of all, a belated thanks to everyone for the input.

Well, I ended up with a VPI Scout/Dynavector 20x combo. It has settled in very nicely and I am so damn happy with vinyl that my Meridian 507 will be going on the trading block. Yes, I have to do something for digital, but does it really matter what now that vinyl is back in action?

Sorry...couldn't help myself.