AudioCircle

Audio/Video Gear and Systems => Owner's Circles => Digital Amplifier Company Owners => Topic started by: AmpDesigner333 on 30 Oct 2015, 08:28 pm

Title: Skipping the preamp by using the Cherry DAC DAC (and related stuff)
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 30 Oct 2015, 08:28 pm
Introducing the Digital Amp Co Digital to Analog Converter!

Photos of our prototype board, more reactions to the unique sound of this DAC, and other info to follow.

Clement Perry heard it and says "Surprisingly liquid with some extra density/resolution. I'm pleasantly surprised. Very nice!!"

We have invented a way to simulate the tube effect in the output stage.  This gives a warmer, sweeter sound than other SS DACs, well deserving of the Cherry name....  Thanks for reading this, and have a great weekend.

-Tommy O
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: SteveMiller on 30 Oct 2015, 09:10 pm
I would like to add my voice to the many that have found Tommy O's Digital Amplifier Company products to be just the right antidote to the endless pursuit of high-end sound.

A few weeks ago I was fortunate enough to be offered a chance to hear Tommy's new DAC DAC.  Having been so taken with the sound, power, and unflappable prowess of the Marashinos, I was of course expecting good things. I know that Digital Amplifier Company knows how to do things right.  When I saw how simply the circuit was (prototype unit arrives in it's birthday suit :) and the tiny switching adapter power supply I thought ok, computer desktop dac......  Ive been fortunate in my pursuit of sound to have owned and longterm tested quality items from big name brands, $2500 dac's to $8500 cd players and many in between.  What I heard, from cold out of the package from the DAC DAC was astonishing.  I hoped simply for a sign of life, that the parcel arrived undamaged. What I heard was actually sounds of life.  As in the DAC DAC can playback regular music files in such a way that the breath of the performers sounds real. Not hyped, not exaggerated, but actually what real music sounds like.  2 other well know dac's that I have on hand, that have received glowing reviews in mainstream mags both suddenly sound a little grey, and little faded. 

The DAC DAC plays music from a simple iTunes file and not for one minute do you feel the need to reach for an expensive software player. You don't wish for more bass. You don't strain to hear more air. This dac breaths the music in such a way that going back to what I thought were great players now makes them sound a little off. they take a bit of effort to listen to. The DAC DAC just sounds right.
I professed to Tommy that I would be happy to buy this sample, as it is.  Its so good, it doesn't matter that its too new to even have a box yet. Its so good my other dacs are up for sale. Its so good that if you hear it you'll want it, so I want to secure my own.

All my remarks are made concerning a system consisting of a simple USB bridge feeding the DAC DAC, which in turn is wired directly to DAC Marashinos driving Zu Audio Speakers.  In all the years and all the expensive components.... I've never heard something so simple sound so good.  It's not good for the price.  Its just plain good.

Who will appreciate this product. 
1. If you are on a budget and want a simple, straightforward desktop dac that isn't fussy, sounds good and wont break the bank, youre on the right track.
2. If you want a minimalist system and have good amplification and speakers you like, buy it.  you'll be surprised how your music sounds better
3. If you have a big dollar budget, a transparent pre-amp, expensive interconnects, clean strong amps, and high resolution speakers... buy it.  and buy Tommy a beer for the money he just saved you.
4. If you like spending big money because stereophile says so, if you believe that good things don't come in small packages, if your system has to look better than it sounds, please look elsewhere. We don't need you. get out of the way and let people with real ears buy what really sounds good.

Thanks Tommy for building the great sounding products you have so far. And for the rest of you, if the DAC DAC doesn't make your jaw drop a little bit, then there's something wrong with your system.  ( infact, when I tried putting an expensive pre-amp between the DAC DAC and the Marashinos, it lost a little magic. ) This means that Tommy's DAC DAC may well be better than your current dac, and your expensive pre-amp.  Try it!  Let it run naked.  Its waaay more fun.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: SteveMiller on 30 Oct 2015, 09:24 pm
To all the listeners who might like to A-B the DAC DAC with their current system.....

Prior to DAC DAC I honestly was very happy with how my system sounded. I was running an expensive well reviewed sabre dac directly into mono Marashino amplifiers into high efficiency speakers.  Bliss.

BUT THEN......Every time I would try and A-B listen between the DAC DAC and any of the other dacs I own or could borrow.... I just kept wanting to put the DAC DAC back in circuit. 

I didn't care about the others anymore. So what they cost more, they just don't sound this good.  I'd switch back to DAC DAC and the sound would be more alive, more present, more REAL.  More right. Maybe its the extremely short circuit length from dac chip to output? Maybe its the bandwidth? Maybe its some other magic Tommy O has that most of us haven't experienced yet.  But its turned my expectations of my music inside out, and I'm not looking back.

It's a tried it, lived it, loved it kinda thing. 
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 30 Oct 2015, 10:02 pm
To all the listeners who might like to A-B the DAC DAC with their current system.....

Prior to DAC DAC I honestly was very happy with how my system sounded. I was running an expensive well reviewed sabre dac directly into mono Marashino amplifiers into high efficiency speakers.  Bliss.

BUT THEN......Every time I would try and A-B listen between the DAC DAC and any of the other dacs I own or could borrow.... I just kept wanting to put the DAC DAC back in circuit. 

I didn't care about the others anymore. So what they cost more, they just don't sound this good.  I'd switch back to DAC DAC and the sound would be more alive, more present, more REAL.  More right. Maybe its the extremely short circuit length from dac chip to output? Maybe its the bandwidth? Maybe its some other magic Tommy O has that most of us haven't experienced yet.  But its turned my expectations of my music inside out, and I'm not looking back.

It's a tried it, lived it, loved it kinda thing.
Thanks, Steve.

I'll mention more soon, but one key factor is the very short signal path.

Now on to handing out Halloween candy (trick-or-treating is the Friday before Halloween in our neighborhood)....

Enjoy!   8)
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: mfsoa on 31 Oct 2015, 12:41 am
C'mon man let's hear about it. Chip? Inputs? Outputs? Probably has variable out which I know you like. Size? Power supply? Discreet out or which opamp?  :scratch:

What about the magic tubamafier output thingy?

Personally I think it should have a USB input. I know your amps prefer XLRs but not everyone has DAC amps (tho they should) so I'd like to see RCAs too, maybe as an option.  DSD capable?

Thanks.  Can't wait to hear it in my system (wink wink nudge nudge)
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: JLM on 1 Nov 2015, 08:37 pm
Volume control?  Kickstarter offering?
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 1 Nov 2015, 08:53 pm
C'mon man let's hear about it. Chip? Inputs? Outputs? Probably has variable out which I know you like. Size? Power supply? Discreet out or which opamp?  :scratch:

What about the magic tubamafier output thingy?

Personally I think it should have a USB input. I know your amps prefer XLRs but not everyone has DAC amps (tho they should) so I'd like to see RCAs too, maybe as an option.  DSD capable?

Thanks.  Can't wait to hear it in my system (wink wink nudge nudge)
Simplicity is the key!  This enables us to offer amazing value.

Coax S/PDIF Input
XLR Outputs
PCM only (192k max)
Dual PCM1794As
Double Differential Output Circuits
External Power Supply (small)


Regarding the "tube like" output circuits, you just need to hear it to "get it".  We also have a version with "superior bench specs" for comparison.  Here's proof that lower THD+N doesn't necessarily sound better!

I'll post photos separately....

Thanks for your kind post.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 1 Nov 2015, 08:59 pm
Volume control?  Kickstarter offering?

No volume control.  We agonized over this one.  Too much of a compromise regarding signal path length.  Our circuit is the most direct.  We rely on digital volume control at the source for direct connection to amplifiers.  Max output level is tuned to take advantage of the Maraschino Cherry Amplifier's input range for maximum dynamic range and super-low noise floor.

Kickstarter?  We're thinking about it!

Listening tests will be going on this week comparing the high-spec version to the tube-like version....

Thanks.
Title: DAC DAC photos
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 1 Nov 2015, 10:29 pm
DAC DAC in a system with Desktop Maraschino Cherry amps and Zu Message speakers:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=130938)

DAC DAC Board and possible enclosure:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=130939)

60V Hanging Maraschinos driven by DAC DAC driven by Logitech Squeezebox Touch (yeah, I know):
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=130942)

DAC DAC driven by Windows 8.1 Pro Tablet and U192S Nuforce USB-to-SPDIF (yeah, I know about Nuforce too):
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=130940)
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: dognort on 1 Nov 2015, 10:32 pm
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=130956)
Tommy O was kind enough to send me a prototype of his new DAC DAC to have some fun with. My digital configuration consists of a nice CD player and a Raspberry PI running Volumio Linux and a HIFIberry Digi+. This DAC is great a revealing the differences between the various sampling rates of my FLAC files. I have several collections by the same artist in digital format. This allowed me to go back and forth at the swipe of a finger. I also utilized the DACS ability to over sample at the direction of the software at twice its native rate. Some digital recordings can become fatiguing depending on their volume. The DAC DAC did a great job not letting this happen. The lower the sampling rate the brighter things sounded the bass was noticeably more articulate and yet nicely placed within the soundstage overall. The higher sampled source was warm verses the somewhat raspy almost noise like high frequency sound common to many CD players and inexpensive phono cartridges. The image had real depth, and when the instruments were recorded in different locations within the sounds stage it was very obvious front to back and right to left. It was a fun afternoon, and I’m not looking forward to shipping it back. Even without the case! Thanks Tommy O.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: mfsoa on 2 Nov 2015, 12:40 am
For me, no volume control = good, as I need to use a pre for phono and source switching.

Unfortunately my pre has no balanced ins/outs as the designer feels that a properly executed RCA is superior.
It'd be nice if the DAC products could be custom-ordered w/ RCAs for troglodyte neanderthals like myself.

I already have to use RCA to XLR adapters to use my Maraschinos (and as you heard Tommy the quality of the adapter can make a significant difference in SQ, so it'd be best to not have to use them at all).. So just a vote for RCAs here to appeal to the unwashed masses.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Shear Bliss VMPS on 2 Nov 2015, 07:26 pm
Hello Tommy, I hope my email reached you ok regarding the Cherry Ultra rebuild, its totally stunning to listen to thru my VMPS ST/R speakers.

On the Dac Dac I hear there isn't going to be a USB port ??? Please offer it even as a added option, to use your Dac Dac from my Gateway PC I surely will need it!!

Thanks again for taking the time regarding my rebuild, its done to perfection!

DW
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: SteveMiller on 2 Nov 2015, 11:25 pm
Re USB.   I found a nice solution for USB into DAC DAC. 

Halide Bridge   

Sounds amazing and it's dead simple to use.   
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=129966)
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: mfsoa on 2 Nov 2015, 11:55 pm
The Halide Bridge is certainly a well known USB/Spdif converter - Good call Steve.

There are numerous choices, for example:

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f6-dac-digital-analog-conversion/15-universal-serial-bus-industry-standard-cables-connectors-and-communications-protocols-between-computers-and-electronic-devices-spdif-converters-shootout-15327/ (http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f6-dac-digital-analog-conversion/15-universal-serial-bus-industry-standard-cables-connectors-and-communications-protocols-between-computers-and-electronic-devices-spdif-converters-shootout-15327/)
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: OzarkTom on 3 Nov 2015, 05:30 am
 :duh:

sHeez! More money to save up, and I have been so happy with my system since the Marashino's have been hooked up.

I have always wondered why a DAC has so many parts in it.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Shear Bliss VMPS on 3 Nov 2015, 05:57 pm
Thanks Steve for easing my mind, had hoped there was something like the USB/sp bridge you show, very glad there is!
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 3 Nov 2015, 08:44 pm
Thanks Steve for easing my mind, had hoped there was something like the USB/sp bridge you show, very glad there is!
We are considering the Peachtree X1:
http://www.peachtreeaudio.com/x1-usb-spdif-converter.html

It's only $149, and supports up to 192k.  Amazon sells it, too.  We asked Peachtree about buying these in bulk for shipment with the DAC DAC.  We have one on order for testing/demos.

We were originally planning to recommend the Nuforce U192S, but there is no longer support (can't even find Windows drivers ANYWHERE!) for that device.  In fact, in case you haven't heard, there is no more Nuforce.  Luckily, I had drivers stashed, and it is currently in use.  We asked Nuprime, and they recommended a product that's over-featured, not out yet, and likely at a much higher price:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=137910.0

Thanks for your kind post.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: SteveMiller on 3 Nov 2015, 09:25 pm
Regarding the Halide, I think retail is 450.  I paid 225 USD for a gently used one. 

It installed without drivers on my iMac and sounds great. There are more affordable options out there, but I wanted to get this particular piece because of the dozen or so reviews and feedback a I could read, every one of them was positive. Like everything, the different bridge products probably are system dependant as far as how they sound. But this particular combo, the DAC DAC with Marashinos fed by Halide is the best I've heard so far.  And that's a long list.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 3 Nov 2015, 09:34 pm
DAC DAC "use cases" shown here:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=138437.0
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: OzarkTom on 3 Nov 2015, 09:53 pm
 :duh:

A computer dummy here, would this thing help on the dac dac? I love that name, dac dac.

http://uptoneaudio.com/products/usb-regen
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: SteveMiller on 3 Nov 2015, 10:33 pm
Hi OzarkTom,

Not sure if this helps, but I'll give it a go.   When using USB over a very well know and continually well reviewed Dac, I felt I had a very good system.  I did however yearn for a little more, and I wondered about these split USB cables, and alternate power sources etc.  My Dac was asynch and galvanically isolated with some type of extreme reclocking enabled to supposedly be the statement in USB audio.  It was pretty good but I always wondered "What if?"....  So i engineered my own split USB cable, after about 4 attempts and several hacked cables, I got it right... and it maybe sounded a little bit better.  but splitting hairs to a degree.  I then found an affordable "memory player" software for my iMac that did infact seem to let things flow better than Itunes.  So there I was, all tweaked out and happy with it. 

Along came DAC DAC.  and the usb to spdif bridge that I mentioned above.  no more spit cables, and iTunes sounds freakin fabulous.  The Halide uses some implementation of Gordon Rankins Streamlength tech I believe.  And Tommy may speak to the immunity of the DAC DAC input to jitter.  But honestly, I am no longer craving extra devices or tweaks. 

My suggestion would be to get your hands on DAC DAC and then some version of SPDIF delivery, and enjoy your music for the first time.

 Tommy O's ears work well, and he somehow manages to make great audio at affordable prices!

Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: gregfisk on 4 Nov 2015, 12:01 am
:duh:

A computer dummy here, would this thing help on the dac dac? I love that name, dac dac.

http://uptoneaudio.com/products/usb-regen

Tom, I put one in front of my M2tech Evo converter stack and it made a very nice improvement. Normally the Regen goes right before the dac input but it works wonders for me at the converter. Alex says to put it as close to the dac as possible which is where mine is, I tried taking it out of my system and that lasted about 2 minutes. I really like what it does to the sound.

Greg
 
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 4 Nov 2015, 01:07 am
:duh:

A computer dummy here, would this thing help on the dac dac? I love that name, dac dac.

http://uptoneaudio.com/products/usb-regen
The DAC DAC (thanks for the compliment) re-clocks the data internally with it's own ultra-accurate time base.  I'm not sure that reclocking devices would offer a significant improvement unless the USB source isn't working properly.  Measured performance is pretty impressive with just an inexpensive USB-to-S/PDIF converter, and the sound is confirmation of the DAC DAC's accuracy when USB is the source.

HOWEVER, I'm very skeptical of USB audio reliability.  I've heard one of my systems drop samples, and it's beyond annoying.  Reconstructing the USB with a dedicated port to drive the DAC can fix a lot of problems on the PC side.

Anything reasonable is worth a try, but I'd make sure you can return it if you're not hearing an improvement, as with any similar device.

The other thing is that the DAC DAC counts on proper S/PDIF (no errors, no missing samples, standard voltage), so we consider the USB part separate, and I'd suspect some USB-to-S/PDIF converters perform the same function internally as well, aside from what's necessary for the bare process.  Plus, many systems provide S/PDIF "raw", and it performs very reliably.  Thanks again.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: xsb7244 on 18 Nov 2015, 06:00 pm
How much is the DAC DAC?
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 18 Nov 2015, 07:28 pm
How much is the DAC DAC?
$600-900 range.  If we can build enough at once, closer to $600.  We made it simple to keep cost down, but no compromise in performance, plus it's DC coupled!  Thanks for your post.

-Tommy O
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: jseipp on 24 Nov 2015, 03:36 am
I'm looking very forward to matching the Maraschino's with a Dac Dac -- that price range makes it all the sweeter.... 
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Shear Bliss VMPS on 24 Nov 2015, 05:00 pm
When will the DAC DAC be shipping ???
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 24 Nov 2015, 06:03 pm
When will the DAC DAC be shipping ???
Early 2016, as in probably by February.  We need to spin the new board version which gets rid of the "daughter card" currently necessary for the HS (high-spec) version.  We also need to finalize the enclosure design, which is the same size/shape as the MINT and our 60V 1kW Maraschino power supply.  Thanks.

-Tommy O
Title: High-Spec version of DAC DAC (HS)
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 24 Nov 2015, 07:55 pm
Daughter Card for High-Spec (HS) version of Maraschino Cherry DAC DAC:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=132383)
Title: DAC DAC Kickstarter
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 25 Nov 2015, 03:30 pm
Yes, we're planning a Kickstarter.  The first few people to purchase a DAC DAC will get an amazing price!

We'll send the link only to those who committed to buying one on the first day, just prior to launch. We will delay advertising the link until the third day.

Interested?  If so, please email us at Support@DigitalAmp.com.

To those who already committed to first day support, no need to email.

Thanks.

-Tommy O
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 30 Nov 2015, 05:17 pm
Greg Voth, a Stereo Times contributor, was kind enough to take a listen to the DAC DAC board (TL configuration), and he said "I could only listen via CD and only single-ended, but I thought the board was quite dynamic and punchy. ....my first reaction to the board was ‘wow'.".

Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 1 Dec 2015, 02:56 am
Greg Voth, a Stereo Times contributor, was kind enough to take a listen to the DAC DAC board (TL configuration), and he said "I could only listen via CD and only single-ended, but I thought the board was quite dynamic and punchy. ....my first reaction to the board was ‘wow'.".
The system:
Marantz CD player as transport, Opera Consonance M100SE integrated amp, Synergistic Research Looking Glass X2 IC’s and solid silver IC’s, Tellurium Q Silver Diamond speaker cables and soundkaos Wave 40 speakers.

....hmmmmm.  I'm thinking Maraschino, maybe MINT....
Title: Re: DAC DAC Kickstarter
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 3 Dec 2015, 11:45 pm
Yes, we're planning a Kickstarter.  The first few people to purchase a DAC DAC will get an amazing price!

We'll send the link only to those who committed to buying one on the first day, just prior to launch. We will delay advertising the link until the third day.

Interested?  If so, please email us at Support@DigitalAmp.com.

To those who already committed to first day support, no need to email.

Thanks.

-Tommy O
Here's the deal.... We are planning a Kickstarter to launch DAC DAC. A select group has agreed to back the project ON DAY ONE to get a significant discount. We will delay public announcement of the launch so the less expensive rewards will likely be all taken by then. We will be sending out a newsletter (ours are very infrequent) to explain the details. There's still time to get on the list, but you need to be signed up for our newsletter to get this info:
http://bit.ly/1G8bsxZ
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Matthijs Broekman on 13 Dec 2015, 04:47 pm
Hi Tommy,

Very impressed with the numbers of the dac dac (HS). I was wondering if you would be offering different power supplies, and better connectors etc. basically the question is will there be a king version?
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: drmike on 14 Dec 2015, 01:51 pm
can one of the jacks be bnc instead of rca?
thanks,
drmike
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 14 Dec 2015, 05:00 pm
Hi Tommy,

Very impressed with the numbers of the dac dac (HS). I was wondering if you would be offering different power supplies, and better connectors etc. basically the question is will there be a king version?
Thanks.  The RCA connector will be gold.  The initial prototypes didn't have gold connectors due to a lead time issue.  The XLRs are Neutrik with gold contacts.  No king is version planned.  Some have suggested providing a USB-to-SPDIF adapter at least as an option.  However, we are seeing a pretty constant flow of new devices on the market, and like our other thread says, it's a "moving target".
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 14 Dec 2015, 05:05 pm
can one of the jacks be bnc instead of rca?
thanks,
drmike
We aren't planning to include a BNC jack, but adapters like this one are readily available (in gold, too):

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=133498)

Thanks for your post.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 3 Jan 2016, 01:35 pm
ONLY 10 DAYS LEFT!
Just a few of the outrageous deals on there:
- Desktop Maraschinos $1190/pr, reg $2500/pr
- Classic Cherry MONOs $1290/pr, reg $3000/pr
http://kck.st/1NWutrj
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Don_S on 3 Jan 2016, 04:03 pm
We aren't planning to include a BNC jack, but adapters like this one are readily available (in gold, too):

Thanks for your post.

Is there anything Amazon does not have?  :thumb:

Which way do you need to go?  Both with free shipping.

Monoprice on Amazon $4.53  BNC male to RCA Female
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51ldAMtT7OL._AA160_.jpg)

Monoprice on Amazon $3.79  BNC female to RCA male

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41BMcMwgqdL._AA160_.jpg)
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 3 Jan 2016, 07:27 pm
Is there anything Amazon does not have?  :thumb:

Which way do you need to go?  Both with free shipping.

Monoprice on Amazon $4.53  BNC male to RCA Female
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51ldAMtT7OL._AA160_.jpg)

Monoprice on Amazon $3.79  BNC female to RCA male

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41BMcMwgqdL._AA160_.jpg)
BNC female to RCA male works (connects right to DAC DAC input).  However, the BNC male to RCA Female adapter can be used on the source side if it has a BNC output, then you would use an RCA-to-RCA (m/m) wire.  Either way should be fine.  Thanks.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 13 Jan 2016, 12:36 pm
Less than 12 hours to go!
http://kck.st/1NWutrj
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 13 Jan 2016, 10:23 pm
Less than 12 hours to go!
http://kck.st/1NWutrj
Less than two hours left (:
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 13 Jan 2016, 10:54 pm
Countdown....  Less than 90 minutes to go (:
http://kck.st/1NWutrj
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 17 Jan 2016, 06:07 pm
First, the DAC DAC Kickstarter was a success!  So, this month we will be finishing the enclosure design and

Second, we would like to know if anyone else is using the Halide Bridge.  One reviewer is using it with great success:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=137912.msg1469568#msg1469568
http://www.halidedesign.com/bridge/

Third, we are going to try out a direct I2S mod.  The DAC DAC board has provisions for this, and we're looking into "standard" connectors/pinouts.  Any suggestions on an I2S source?

Fourth, we would like to know what reference tracks our DAC DAC backers will be using and what sample rates those tracks are in.  Even if you didn't participate in the Kickstarter, we'd like to know what low rate and high rate tracks you think are most revealing.  Thanks.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: cliffy on 18 Jan 2016, 12:07 am
Can you finish and deliver your previous Kickstarter before working on another?
Still awaiting the Mint...
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 18 Jan 2016, 03:56 am
Can you finish and deliver your previous Kickstarter before working on another?
Still awaiting the Mint...
We have great news regarding the MINT, which will be changing names due to a trademark conflict....
This will be disclosed during the week.  Thanks for your patience.

-Tommy O
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: jhm731 on 22 Jan 2016, 09:54 pm
First, the DAC DAC Kickstarter was a success!  So, this month we will be finishing the enclosure design and

Second, we would like to know if anyone else is using the Halide Bridge.  One reviewer is using it with great success:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=137912.msg1469568#msg1469568
http://www.halidedesign.com/bridge/

Third, we are going to try out a direct I2S mod.  The DAC DAC board has provisions for this, and we're looking into "standard" connectors/pinouts.  Any suggestions on an I2S source?

Fourth, we would like to know what reference tracks our DAC DAC backers will be using and what sample rates those tracks are in.  Even if you didn't participate in the Kickstarter, we'd like to know what low rate and high rate tracks you think are most revealing.  Thanks.

The PS Audio PWT has an I2S output via an HDMI connector.

There will be an updated PWT II later this year that will play SACDs and output raw DSD via the I2S output.

When can I order your DAC?
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 22 Jan 2016, 10:55 pm
The PS Audio PWT has an I2S output via an HDMI connector.

There will be an updated PWT II later this year that will play SACDs and output raw DSD via the I2S output.

When can I order your DAC?
Thanks for the info.  Do you happen to know where I can get their [proprietary?] pinout?  I'll search for it, but if you already know....

The DAC DAC should be in production early Spring.

Interested in the HS or TL version?  Thanks again, and have a great weekend.

-Tommy O
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: jhm731 on 23 Jan 2016, 01:05 am
Thanks for the info.  Do you happen to know where I can get their [proprietary?] pinout?  I'll search for it, but if you already know....

The DAC DAC should be in production early Spring.

Interested in the HS or TL version?  Thanks again, and have a great weekend.

-Tommy O


(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=135696)

If you want to build a prototype with an HDMI input, I'll be happy to test it for you.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: mfsoa on 23 Jan 2016, 03:03 am
Isn't it easy to pull I2S from a Raspberry Pi?
That'd be super cheap n' cheerful  :thumb:
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: OzarkTom on 23 Jan 2016, 03:25 am
Isn't it easy to pull I2S from a Raspberry Pi?
That'd be super cheap n' cheerful  :thumb:

Would this one be better than a Rasberry? This one is 15 bucks.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/pine64/pine-a64-first-15-64-bit-single-board-super-comput?ref=jellopcrowdfunding.com&utm_source=jellop&utm_medium=ocpm&utm_term=rm&utm_campaign=jellop&utm_content=pinerm1
Title: Jitter tolerance
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 28 Jan 2016, 03:56 am
Some quick numbers....

10kHz sine jitter: no effect under 500nS
50kHz sine jitter: no effect under 100nS
200kHz (analyzer max) sine jitter: no effect under 30nS

Most decent sources are well under 1nS wideband, so nowhere near anything that would affect the DAC DAC.

Thanks.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Oscillate on 1 Feb 2016, 10:59 pm
Tommy... Does the DAC DAC have an opamp in the circut?
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 1 Feb 2016, 11:23 pm
Tommy... Does the DAC DAC have an opamp in the circut?
Yes.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: mfsoa on 2 Feb 2016, 01:02 am
Will you share which one(s)?  I had fun rolling opamps w/ my Eastern Electric Minimax dac - You could really achieve a wide range of sonic signatures with different chips.

I'd imagine i'ts too late in the design process but it would be super cool if users had the ability to swap em, or use the higher-end Burson etc. discreet opamps.

Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Oscillate on 2 Feb 2016, 01:25 am
"...if users had the ability to swap em, or use the higher-end Burson etc."

Yes, that is exactly what I am thinking. As stated, it really does change the
sonic signature. I notice that the DAC's circut board has very short signal
paths so this may not be practical. Would you consider /is it possible to have
Burson discreet opamps installed as an OEM option/mod for a premium?
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 2 Feb 2016, 01:51 am
Will you share which one(s)?  I had fun rolling opamps w/ my Eastern Electric Minimax dac - You could really achieve a wide range of sonic signatures with different chips.

I'd imagine i'ts too late in the design process but it would be super cool if users had the ability to swap em, or use the higher-end Burson etc. discreet opamps.
OPA1602, just like in the Maraschino monoblocks.  They're pretty much "perfect" up into the MHz range.  Swapping with almost anything else will result in lower performance, but it's an interesting idea....  Altering the board voids the warrantee and you lose the ability to participate in future upgrades.

If we were to socket components, it would add to the signal path, and we don't want to do that.  This is why we limited the features ---- to get the analog from the DAC chips to the output connectors through as little as possible.  The entire distance from the DAC chips to the output connectors is less than an inch!

We do entertain customization, so if you want different op-amps, we can probably accomodate you.

A note about demos....  All of our demos are inspected, cleaned, and re-tested, by the way.  They are mostly from upgrades or shows, but we have bought back gear outright as well.  This assures QUALITY.  With performance at this level, we want everything to be just right. Thanks.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 2 Feb 2016, 01:58 am
"...if users had the ability to swap em, or use the higher-end Burson etc."

Yes, that is exactly what I am thinking. As stated, it really does change the
sonic signature. I notice that the DAC's circut board has very short signal
paths so this may not be practical. Would you consider /is it possible to have
Burson discreet opamps installed as an OEM option/mod for a premium?
My previous reply was practically simultaneous with yours!  The time is different because I'm modifying my post slightly....

I forgot to mention that the TL version's output goes through a single gain stage and retains true double differential output (in less than an inch).  The HS version is the same physical distance line-of-sight, but through more parts.

If you want something custom, talk to us.  If it physically fits, and you have the means to fund the labor, we're all ears.

Thanks again.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: mfsoa on 2 Feb 2016, 04:00 am
IIRC the OPAs were my faves in the minimax. I think I tried the 827 and the 627. Full-bodied, w/ the 827 (again IIRC) faster and more modern, the 627 nice n' creamy.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: vonnie123 on 2 Feb 2016, 08:44 am
First, the DAC DAC Kickstarter was a success!  So, this month we will be finishing the enclosure design and

Second, we would like to know if anyone else is using the Halide Bridge.  One reviewer is using it with great success:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=137912.msg1469568#msg1469568
http://www.halidedesign.com/bridge/

Third, we are going to try out a direct I2S mod.  The DAC DAC board has provisions for this, and we're looking into "standard" connectors/pinouts.  Any suggestions on an I2S source?

Fourth, we would like to know what reference tracks our DAC DAC backers will be using and what sample rates those tracks are in.  Even if you didn't participate in the Kickstarter, we'd like to know what low rate and high rate tracks you think are most revealing.  Thanks.

In addition to the PS Audio PWD/PWT, Wyred4Sound uses a I2S over HDMI connection. They use I2S in their music servers and DACs.  They modified a Sonos Connect for me for use with their DAC 2 Converter.

Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: orchardaudio on 3 Feb 2016, 11:06 pm
Will you share which one(s)?  I had fun rolling opamps w/ my Eastern Electric Minimax dac - You could really achieve a wide range of sonic signatures with different chips.

I'd imagine i'ts too late in the design process but it would be super cool if users had the ability to swap em, or use the higher-end Burson etc. discreet opamps.

For anybody who is interested I would be able to swap out the amplifier ICs to ones of your choice as long as they are footprint compatible. This will cost $150 plus cost of the parts.

Some options are:
OPA1642
OPA1612
LME49720
LME49723
LM4562
AD8620
AD8599
Etc.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 7 Apr 2016, 02:17 am
For anybody who is interested I would be able to swap out the amplifier ICs to ones of your choice as long as they are footprint compatible. This will cost $150 plus cost of the parts.

Some options are:
OPA1642
OPA1612
LME49720
LME49723
LM4562
AD8620
AD8599
Etc.
Just a head's up on such mods....  If we don't do them, it voids the warrantee.  We have measured favorable performance with OPA1612s, so if you're going to "go for it", and don't mind about the warrantee issue, there's your best bet.  Thanks.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Captainhemo on 29 Apr 2016, 05:30 pm
Tommy,
I'm looking into  a new DAC and after seeing it mentioned in a few threads,  the DAC DAC has caught my eye as a possible candidate.  I may have missed  the answers in the thread(s) but i've got a few questions

1) Is there an option for single ended outputs  ? 
2) I see the DAC will be available in  two version , the TL (tube like) and HS which I'm not clear on.
3) Have you done any tests powering the DAC via  a decntly sized  12V battery ?  My system is DC powered  now and  would love to  just  run the  DAC off the same system
4) Availability,  do you have an estimated public release ?

Has anyone who's had a chance to hear the DAC DAC  been able  to compare it with  either of the  Schiit MB (Gungnir/Yggdrasil) dacs or the Chord 2Cute ?

Thanks   

jay

Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 30 Apr 2016, 08:07 pm
Tommy,
I'm looking into  a new DAC and after seeing it mentioned in a few threads,  the DAC DAC has caught my eye as a possible candidate.  I may have missed  the answers in the thread(s) but i've got a few questions

1) Is there an option for single ended outputs  ? 
2) I see the DAC will be available in  two version , the TL (tube like) and HS which I'm not clear on.
3) Have you done any tests powering the DAC via  a decntly sized  12V battery ?  My system is DC powered  now and  would love to  just  run the  DAC off the same system
4) Availability,  do you have an estimated public release ?

Has anyone who's had a chance to hear the DAC DAC  been able  to compare it with  either of the  Schiit MB (Gungnir/Yggdrasil) dacs or the Chord 2Cute ?

Thanks   

jay
Jay,

The DAC DAC is designed to provide the highest fidelity possible at a reasonable price.  From the design itself, to the way we run our business; it's all to deliver the kind of sound you want.  Clean.  Clear.

1) Is there an option for single ended outputs?
    Single ended is done with high performance transformer adapters.  There is an added benefit to doing it this way - output ground isolation!
2) I see the DAC will be available in  two version , the TL (tube like) and HS which I'm not clear on.
    HS = High Spec, about 124dB SNR and 0.0004% THD
    Note the TL version has the shortest signal path possible, as in the number of components the signals go through to the connectors.
3) Have you done any tests powering the DAC via  a decntly sized  12V battery ?  My system is DC powered  now and  would love to  just  run the  DAC off the same system
    We haven't used a battery to power the DAC DAC yet.  Driving the DAC DAC from an alternate power supply creates a possible warrantee issue, but if you don't mind that, it should work well.  The plug is positive center, standard 2.1mm barrel type.  A 500mA capable power supply is more than enough.
4) Availability,  do you have an estimated public release ?
    Yes, next month.

Can you tell us more about your system?

Thanks for your kind post.

-Tommy O
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Captainhemo on 30 Apr 2016, 09:15 pm
Jay,

The DAC DAC is designed to provide the highest fidelity possible at a reasonable price.  From the design itself, to the way we run our business; it's all to deliver the kind of sound you want.  Clean.  Clear.

1) Is there an option for single ended outputs?
    Single ended is done with high performance transformer adapters.  There is an added benefit to doing it this way - output ground isolation!
2) I see the DAC will be available in  two version , the TL (tube like) and HS which I'm not clear on.
    HS = High Spec, about 124dB SNR and 0.0004% THD
    Note the TL version has the shortest signal path possible, as in the number of components the signals go through to the connectors.
3) Have you done any tests powering the DAC via  a decntly sized  12V battery ?  My system is DC powered  now and  would love to  just  run the  DAC off the same system
    We haven't used a battery to power the DAC DAC yet.  Driving the DAC DAC from an alternate power supply creates a possible warrantee issue, but if you don't mind that, it should work well.  The plug is positive center, standard 2.1mm barrel type.  A 500mA capable power supply is more than enough.
4) Availability,  do you have an estimated public release ?
    Yes, next month.

Can you tell us more about your system?

Thanks for your kind post.

-Tommy O

Hey Tommy, thanks for  the information.    I guess a follow up  ?  to the balanced -> single ended  solution is,   Are you  going to have specific adapters  that you  recommend ? I 've  seen  many " shades" of these that range significantly in  cost. I must admit, I haven't  looked into them to investigate the differences as it's never been something I've needed to worry about.

I'd think as long as a low amp fuse is used inline with the  12V DC battery,  there should be no   ill effects or any need  to  void warranty unless of course it was due tto a polarity issue  etc.

Breif  system specs
Dodd Audio  vairable gain premap SE  - battery
Dodd / Richie prototype   amp (chip bases)  SE  - battery
75 Ah 12V battery, CTEK charger
Grant Fidelity TD11   (to be replaced)
PC bases  source, flac/digital stream
GR Reaserach NX-Otica  speakers  93-94 db/w
OB servo subs

jay
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: SteveMiller on 8 Jun 2016, 10:29 pm

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=144535)

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=144536)

http://www.cherryamp.com/#!digital-source/c1rwc
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: OzarkTom on 9 Jun 2016, 01:49 am
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=144535)

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=144536)

http://www.cherryamp.com/#!digital-source/c1rwc

No remote?
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: G Georgopoulos on 9 Jun 2016, 02:23 am
Jay,

The DAC DAC is designed to provide the highest fidelity possible at a reasonable price.  From the design itself, to the way we run our business; it's all to deliver the kind of sound you want.  Clean.  Clear.


2) I see the DAC will be available in  two version , the TL (tube like) and HS which I'm not clear on.
    HS = High Spec, about 124dB SNR and 0.0004% THD
    Note the TL version has the shortest signal path possible, as in the number of components the signals go through to the connectors.


Can you tell us more about your system?

Thanks for your kind post.

-Tommy O

Tommy making claims like these is b.s. ,you take digital which is superior etc, and you make claims of your own gear which is average and the net result is b.s.,anyone can make digital sound good,what is the specs
of your gear with a vinyl source.please quote SNR and THD... :)
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: SteveMiller on 9 Jun 2016, 02:23 pm
Tommy making claims like these is b.s. ,you take digital which is superior etc, and you make claims of your own gear which is average and the net result is b.s.,anyone can make digital sound good,what is the specs
of your gear with a vinyl source.please quote SNR and THD... :)


Georgopoulos,

Seriously man, WTF are you talking about ??     :o

What exactly do you think is BS?     I heartily disagree with everything you just wrote.  :duh: You are entitled to your opinion but i cant make any sense of it.

What are the specs with vinyl source?????  Im lost.  Someone help me.......or George.     The specs of the equipment are the specs of the equipment regardless of source.  And why are you talking about a vinyl source into a DAC anyway?   

Maybe you've just had to many man-pops tonight.  But please, calling bullshit on something that you either havent experienced in person or just dont understand or appreciate is inappropriate. I own both the TL and HS versions of Tommy's DAC DAC and they are freakin stellar.   Best i've had in my system, and that included dac's from $3000 to $8000 flagships.  So, there's no bullshit there.  Tommy's amps will measure the same regardless of source.  And I have purchased enough equipment from other vendors to know that when I landed on Digital Amplifier Company I had finally found the real deal.  High End Sonics at Real World Pricing

If you really think that what Tommy builds is just average then what you are experiencing is simply some strange system incompatibility. Or, your preferences run to an affinity for a particular flavor such as tipped up treble, or bloated bass.  You will find Digital Amplifier Co devices to be exceedingly neutral, clean, clear, and lifelike sounding with proper playmates. But again, in a forum where people want data, information, specs, pictures, experiences and impression...Simply calling BS on something and not making any sense of it just isn't helpful.

The TubeLike moniker that Tommy adopted for the first version of the DAC DAC may have confused you early on. I noticed you asked what tubes were employed. For the interested parties, the TL is meant to infer that the DAC DAC is not clinical or cold sounding.  Its descriptive of its mission, not its components.  TubeLike means that this version emulates the very best tube equipment which is natural, spacious, and organic sounding. LifeLike could also apply.  Its lowest parts count means that the fewer the parts that are employed, the less gets in the way of your music.  And, the parts that are chosen for the circuit are carefully spec'd to ensure the best matching and custom intent such as high bandwidth and ultra low distortion.

THe HighSpec version is how Tommy refers to the all out pursuit of specs and measures.  It is a very fast, incisive sounding device. Truly clean, harmonious and colorful.  The absolute best implementation of BurrBrown chipset ive heard.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion but please keep posts to the spirit of this forum, which is to inform potential listeners of your experience and observations, maybe even your wish list. Tommy reads all the posts and you never know what might show up in future products.  Useless harassment of the designer who in now way helpful to users who may want more information to make a purchase decision.

If Mr Georopoulos you would like more information please feel free to contact me, as I have both units that I have purchased for myself, as well as the new STM integrated amplifier, and the 60V Maraschino Monoblocks.  I can speak to whatever questions you may have if you are interested in owning Digital Amplifier Products.

Kind Regards,

Steve Miller
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 9 Jun 2016, 03:40 pm
Steve,

You made some very good points!

When it comes to those who are habitually negative....  Some are simply mean spirited. Some are "not the sharpest tack in the box". Some are victims of a terrible past and take it out on everyone. Some are just fakes, operating under an alias.  Whatever the root cause, their impact is insignificant long term.

Looking forward to hearing more about your TL vs HS results.

Thanks for your kind post.

-Tommy O
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 9 Jun 2016, 03:45 pm
No remote?
Many of our customers use their media player for remote control. For example, an app on my iPhone controls the SBox Touch in one system.  Thanks.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: SteveMiller on 9 Jun 2016, 05:28 pm
Initially i was concerned about the lack of remote. But then, since the design brief called for the purist of purist circuits, and anything that added component was bound to affect the sound quality, I personally ended up embracing the simplicity of the device.  There's no remote because the unit isnt doing anything that needs external control. 

Its kind of like worrying about trunk space in a Ferrari, or tire life on a sport bike.  You dont buy performance vehicles for their creature comforts. You buy them because they are focused deployments made to do one thing well. THats how I view DAC DAC.  Focused at doing one thing well.  It turns spdif into a balanced analog and sends it to your amplifier.  Thats it.  so, why not make it the best it can be at that task, and forget adding the fluff. 

I dont miss having another remote. Maybe thats because now, instead of fiddling with the controls, I just listen and appreciate the performance. It's really that good.  The preamp that you follow DAC DAC with needs to be ultra transparent. Or you'll soon find yourself going dac direct to amps and just using the digital attenuation in your favorite media player.  You'll also find, that due to the extreme tolerance DAC DAC has concerning source delivery, that you dont need crazy expensive media players either.  Lots of RAM, and simple Itunes keeps me quite content.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: G Georgopoulos on 9 Jun 2016, 11:06 pm

Georgopoulos,

Seriously man, WTF are you talking about ??     :o

What exactly do you think is BS?     I heartily disagree with everything you just wrote.  :duh: You are entitled to your opinion but i cant make any sense of it.

What are the specs with vinyl source?????  Im lost.  Someone help me.......or George.     The specs of the equipment are the specs of the equipment regardless of source.  And why are you talking about a vinyl source into a DAC anyway?   

Maybe you've just had to many man-pops tonight.  But please, calling bullshit on something that you either havent experienced in person or just dont understand or appreciate is inappropriate. I own both the TL and HS versions of Tommy's DAC DAC and they are freakin stellar.   Best i've had in my system, and that included dac's from $3000 to $8000 flagships.  So, there's no bullshit there.  Tommy's amps will measure the same regardless of source.  And I have purchased enough equipment from other vendors to know that when I landed on Digital Amplifier Company I had finally found the real deal.  High End Sonics at Real World Pricing

If you really think that what Tommy builds is just average then what you are experiencing is simply some strange system incompatibility. Or, your preferences run to an affinity for a particular flavor such as tipped up treble, or bloated bass.  You will find Digital Amplifier Co devices to be exceedingly neutral, clean, clear, and lifelike sounding with proper playmates. But again, in a forum where people want data, information, specs, pictures, experiences and impression...Simply calling BS on something and not making any sense of it just isn't helpful.

The TubeLike moniker that Tommy adopted for the first version of the DAC DAC may have confused you early on. I noticed you asked what tubes were employed. For the interested parties, the TL is meant to infer that the DAC DAC is not clinical or cold sounding.  Its descriptive of its mission, not its components.  TubeLike means that this version emulates the very best tube equipment which is natural, spacious, and organic sounding. LifeLike could also apply.  Its lowest parts count means that the fewer the parts that are employed, the less gets in the way of your music.  And, the parts that are chosen for the circuit are carefully spec'd to ensure the best matching and custom intent such as high bandwidth and ultra low distortion.

THe HighSpec version is how Tommy refers to the all out pursuit of specs and measures.  It is a very fast, incisive sounding device. Truly clean, harmonious and colorful.  The absolute best implementation of BurrBrown chipset ive heard.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion but please keep posts to the spirit of this forum, which is to inform potential listeners of your experience and observations, maybe even your wish list. Tommy reads all the posts and you never know what might show up in future products.  Useless harassment of the designer who in now way helpful to users who may want more information to make a purchase decision.

If Mr Georopoulos you would like more information please feel free to contact me, as I have both units that I have purchased for myself, as well as the new STM integrated amplifier, and the 60V Maraschino Monoblocks.  I can speak to whatever questions you may have if you are interested in owning Digital Amplifier Products.

Kind Regards,

Steve Miller

Hi Steve,i'm only trying to help him!,all good mate!,thanks for the offer to enlighten me (very kind of you)
what more can i say?,may be he doesn't want/need any help,i'll try not to get in his way in the future

kind regards
George
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: dwaleke on 24 Jun 2016, 02:53 pm

1) How much is the Dac Dac?
2) When is it available for purchase?

Can't seem to order it through the website.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: jseipp on 25 Jun 2016, 05:02 am
The MSRP of either version of the DAC DAC is $1290 according to the Kickstarter Campaign, but I would wait for the official price to be announced on the website to be certain.  The DAC DAC has just rolled out to the Kickstarter backers; I would contact Tommy through the onsite form for further details, if you haven't already.


I hope that helps!

John
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Shear Bliss VMPS on 25 Jun 2016, 11:54 am
To SteveMiller,

Hi Steve, I see you run iTunes with your DAC DAC TL like I am doing. I also own a Cherry Ultra. I'm wondering what USB to SPDIF interface unit you are using ?? I have a Phiree or a Peachtree X-1 to use into my TL.

My question is are your 96mHz or 192mHz LEDs lighting up ?? Mine are not, even though my ears tell me this DAC DAC TL is working and sounds utterly outstanding!! Stomps my Cambridge DAC Plus by a very wide margin, not even close period! I just want to make sure there isn't a hiccup going on with my TL. My iTunes through a Windows PC and have the Peachtree v2 driver installed.
Thanks, DW
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: srb on 25 Jun 2016, 04:06 pm
My question is are your 96mHz or 192mHz LEDs lighting up ?? Mine are not, even though my ears tell me this DAC DAC TL is working and sounds utterly outstanding!!

The problem is iTunes.  Even with Windows Audio Session selected in Edit > Preferences > Playback, the selected bits and sampling rate will determine the output.  If changed, iTunes needs to be restarted for the new resolution to take effect.

You would have to do this on playback of each song where the resolution changes.  The problem also exists in iTunes for Mac which is why many on that platform buy the Amarra, Pure Music or other playback engine add-in for iTunes which then allows resolution change on the fly.

For Windows, JRiver Media Center, foobar, Media Monkey, Music Bee and others allow you to select a specific WASAPI or ASIO driver within the program to allow automatic bit perfect output.

Steve
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Shear Bliss VMPS on 26 Jun 2016, 06:38 am
Thanks Steve,

I went with J River with the wasabi add on, still the same situation with the LEDs ... also have a problem with the power LED going out which I find strange. Waited 6 plus months on delivery and expect more ..... hopefully Tommy can swap this TL out for another unit. On the J River trial now. The performance of this DAC DAC is off the charts otherwise.

Thanks again
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 29 Jun 2016, 05:16 pm
1) How much is the Dac Dac?
2) When is it available for purchase?

Can't seem to order it through the website.
Please send a PM.  The DAC DAC part of the website isn't done yet.  Thanks.

-Tommy O
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 1 Jul 2016, 10:40 pm
:duh:

A computer dummy here, would this thing help on the dac dac? I love that name, dac dac.

http://uptoneaudio.com/products/usb-regen
If you're experiencing drop outs or noticeable distortion, maybe.  In that case the data is probably getting corrupted. Be aware that reclocking devices add latency to the data and could cause audio/video sync problems (lips move ahead of the sound).  On a good (fast) machine driving a quality USB-to-SPDIF converter (we plan to offer one soon), you should get perfect data (carbon copy style) to the DAC DAC.  The DAC DAC reclocks the data internally with a low latency buffer, very low jitter, low noise, and precise time source.  Good wires don't need to cost a lot, but are necessary. We have measured the performance of the DAC DAC driven from in this style from even slow PCs (USB) with theoretically perfect performance.  Thanks.
Title: DAC DAC driving Golden Cherry Maraschino Amplifiers DIRECTLY
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 1 Jul 2016, 10:52 pm
We often get customer comments about how well the DAC DAC plays into the Maraschino.   Directly.  One common remark is that there is information hidden in recordings that wasn't resolved previous to this combination.  Add the mods to increase the Maraschino to Golden Cherry level, and there it is!  A NOTICEABLE increase in the frequency of these "moments"!

Jeremy Kipnis is currently reviewing this combination with the HS version of the DAC DAC.  I'll post when there is a review or pre-review, which Jeremy often does.

-Tommy O
Title: Why do we suggest DAC DAC direct into Maraschino?
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 3 Jul 2016, 12:39 am
Through numerous phone conversations and emails, we gather information on our customer's systems.  We frequently urge users of Maraschino Cherry Amplifiers to try driving them directly with a D/A converter.   Of course, we prefer they use the DAC DAC, but other D/A converters will also work better directly into the amplifiers as opposed to through a preamp.  Some issues we'd like to discuss in a new thread:
    1. Why "direct drive"?
    2. Digital Volume Control vs Analog
    3. System synergy
    4. What you may not know about preamps

Stay tuned for introduction of this thread !  Thanks for reading our board.

-Tommy O
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 3 Jul 2016, 04:44 pm
OK, I started a new thread for the "direct drive" topic:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=144082.0
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: mittg on 3 Jul 2016, 11:04 pm
I started using my DAC DAC today. The difference is very noticeable. Before this I used several different HD Bluetooth Dac's. There really is no comparison. The improved clarity and total blackness are over the top. Great Job Tommy O.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Shear Bliss VMPS on 4 Jul 2016, 12:39 am
Ditto here on my TL-DAC DAC running with J River. Dynamics and Clarity come to mind, a real jaw dropper over the DAC I have been using.
Title: DAC DAC pre-review
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 14 Jul 2016, 11:49 pm
W O W !
"On a cost vs. sound quality basis (alone), this [DAC DAC HS] may be THE BEST DAC (digital to analog converter) to come along in 3 decades [!!!!]; all the way back to the extremely costly & extraordinary $12,000 Stax DAC-X1t Vacuum Tube Output Reference DIA Processor (1989); which I used at Chesky Records (1990 - 1993) to audition many of the CDs l was lucky enough to have produced, recorded, and mastered!!!"
Jeremy Kipnis

https://www.facebook.com/jeremy.kipnis/posts/1226383484039169
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Shear Bliss VMPS on 15 Jul 2016, 01:03 am
Yes it certainly seems the DAC DAC is opening our audiophile ears to what has been there on our CDs all along! One listening session will easily confirm this, as it did to me. Simply quiet amazing but us Digital Amplifier Company owners should have known better from Tommy O"s first draft and thoughts on designing it. I am in Shear Bliss here!!
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: jseipp on 16 Jul 2016, 10:19 am
There are several DAC DAC related threads running, but I think this is probably the best one for expressing my humble comments.  This is a review of my own experience of discovery with the DAC DAC, written both in gratitude for the experience and in the hope that it will help some others discover an equally thrilling experience.  I'll note that, as Tommy recommends, I am running the DAC DAC directly into a pair of 30V Inline Maraschino amps, which have proven to be a wonderful match for the super resolving GR Research Wedgies and have themselves redefined for me what is within my reach for reproducing music.  What the DAC DAC has to offer the combination, however, has pretty much blown my mind.

When the DAC DAC Kickstarter kicked off, I took the opportunity to fund the combination of both the original TL (tube like) and the HS (high spec) versions.  The HS arrived first and, without a proper adapter for my source, I ran it in for awhile with a secondary source through a preamp I have had around for some time, not listening closely, but noticing in passing that it sounded really good, punchy and clear. 

When the necessary adapter for my main source arrived, I was able to run the DAC DAC directly to the Maraschinos.  The first thing that hit me was that the soundstage became downright huge -- not out of scale, just extending in every direction, through the back wall, through the side walls straight into the neighbors' yards.  I have heard many accounts of soundstaging extending well beyond the bounds of speaker setups, and have enjoyed the spaciousness of the Wedgies since I first set them up, but this was completely new territory for me.  Wide and deep, clear, clean and dynamic are all equally applicable descriptions for what I heard, and what I heard definitely outclassed what I had heard before.

When the TL DAC DAC arrived, I had the advantage of all the adapters in place, ready drop the DAC in and make music.  I was curious at what the difference would prove to be between the two "flavors," not expecting anything too extreme.  And in a way my expectations were correct: the same huge soundstage was there, the same clarity and dynamics.  But... there was now something magical going on in the mix.

When I wrote Tommy about what I heard comparing the two versions, I first emphasized that I am hugely impressed by the HS -- it's the best DAC I'd heard, doing everything I thought a great DAC should and could do.  But, the TL goes beyond what I thought a great DAC should and could do.  I simply no longer feel that I am listening to great audio, but that I am instead fully experiencing music, hearing through my ears, feeling through my skin....  It's as though the TL DAC DAC injects the vibrancy back into music that has gone through the indignity of being turned into zeroes and ones, a piece that represents the art of bringing music back to life.   

With the TL DAC DAC there's a sense of music as whole-cloth blend of sound, but one in which each sound, each instrument has its own sonic space, bringing the very best mix possible out of everything it is fed.  More than anything, where the HS does a great job of "they are here" with the music, the TL is entirely an "I am there" experience.  My skin prickles, and closing my eyes I have a sense of moving through the music even as the music moves through me.  I've had the great pleasure of being a musician, of being in countless rooms and halls surrounded by a vast range of instruments and instrumentalists.  I've never before at home been able to reproduce that experience, the subtleties that communicate the living, breathing sense of music until I slipped the TL DAC DAC into place.

Digital Amplifier Company is currently having a substantial sale, including the DAC DAC.  For me, each piece of D.A.C. equipment has moved me along the path to the sound that has ended up beyond my highest expectations.  This is a great opportunity for anyone who is even the least bit curious about what these pieces have to offer to give them a try.  Tommy has gone above and beyond in helping me find the fit for my system and my preferences.  Your own may be very different from mine, but I strongly suspect that, communicating your desires to Tommy, you will find your own magical combination among his offerings.  And in Tommy you will find a music lover whose true passion is bringing music to life for as many people as possible.  Every interaction has been a pleasure, and I feel extremely fortunate for having jumped into that first Kickstarter that introduced the Maraschinos to the world.  I never imagined then just how good it would get.



                     
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: OzarkTom on 17 Jul 2016, 02:50 am
And Tommy has a 30 day trial. I was one of Tommy's strong disbelievers, he proved me wrong. :duh:
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: kedoades on 17 Jul 2016, 02:21 pm
  Ok well now you guys have got me thinking about pulling the trigger on one of the TL version dac dac.  I have what I consider to be a pretty nice dac so it should be interesting. 
Title: Re: DAC DA
Post by: jseipp on 18 Jul 2016, 02:26 am
I would certainly recommend that you give one a try.  As OzarkTom pointed out, there's a 30 day trial.  It's a pure sound, no frills piece of gear and I think you will quickly determine if it's a fit for your own tastes.  Tommy is great to deal with, if you have any specific questions you'd like answered directly.  :thumb:
Title: Running out of DAC DACs
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 27 Jul 2016, 07:18 pm
We're almost out of DAC DACs!  Now's the time if you'd like to try one in your system.  This DAC has been called "the best in three decades"!
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Shear Bliss VMPS on 27 Jul 2016, 10:38 pm
Fantastic job Tommy!! I whole heartedly agree with the assessments owners of the HS and TL have given. Really into my TL version. Price vs Performance is off the charts. Anybody with a older DAC or who is on the fence needs to experience either of these DAC DACs in their own system to compare, the difference is like Lasik eye surgery for your ears. Totally amazing what it opens up on 1s and 0s. These two versions should easily make digital products of the year! ( And then some ) their that good.
Title: DAC DAC HS Review by Kipnis Studios in PFO
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 13 Aug 2016, 10:21 pm
Check it out!
http://positive-feedback.com/audio-discourse/digital-amplifier-company-dac-dac/

Comparisons with these:
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: olesno on 14 Aug 2016, 01:54 pm
Awesome!!!  I just read the review of DAC DAC and being an owner of the Golden Maraschinos I honestly didn't expect any less of a praise from Positive Feedback.  I still hope Tommy will find a way to incorporate volume control into the DAC DAC as this would make it a clear buying choice for many of us.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Shear Bliss VMPS on 14 Aug 2016, 03:19 pm
Congratulations Tommy!!!

A very through and captivating assessment on your DAC DAC HS by Mr. Kipnis via Positive Feedback. Getting such a positive review of your DAC DAC should make you feel very proud of your efforts designing and getting it to market, well done. To have a industry legend to take a look-see for review and come away quite impressed carries a lot of weight and must feel some sense of vindication on your goals and ideals. At its price point a absolute steal compared to the other very nice brands Mr. Kipnis used for comparison purposes, to which the DAC DAC HS he preferred. Now I cant wait for his comparison between the HS vs the TL ..... follow-up.

A very exciting review from someone on the recording side of things, somebody who has heard and used the finest gear available for many years in many studios and isn't jaded by it all, someone still able to discern the finest details and differences in gear used, a great read!

Title: Single Ended Adapters now available for DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 16 Aug 2016, 12:51 pm
Exciting NEWS!  We now offer custom single ended output adapters for the DAC DAC.  If you have a single ended preamp, here's a way to enjoy the benefits of the DAC DAC (such as black background, near-zero distortion, true DC coupling, 124dB, real musicality, ultra short signal path) in single ended systems!

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=148591)


(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=148592)


(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=148593)
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Armaegis on 16 Aug 2016, 10:51 pm
Exciting NEWS!  We now offer custom single ended output adapters for the DAC DAC.  If you have a single ended preamp, here's a way to enjoy the benefits of the DAC DAC (such as black background, near-zero distortion, true DC coupling, 124dB, real musicality, ultra short signal path) in single ended systems!

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=148591)

$150 a pair?

Are there transformers inside each one?
Is there any reduction from "pro" level to "consumer" level?
What is inside that warrants the price over a typical xlr/rca converter that I can buy off Amazon (most of which short pin1 and pin3 to ground)
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 17 Aug 2016, 04:44 am
$150 a pair?

Are there transformers inside each one?
Is there any reduction from "pro" level to "consumer" level?
What is inside that warrants the price over a typical xlr/rca converter that I can buy off Amazon (most of which short pin1 and pin3 to ground)
We have these custom made because the ones you buy off the shelf short the pins, as you have indicated.  No transformers inside.  We have used the transformer based adapters, but they add some distortion and you lose DC coupling that way.  Measurements have indicated that balanced is a few dB better in the SNR department, but THD+N is about the same.  Output voltage is 2.5VrmsFS using the adapters and 5VrmsFS without.  Thanks.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: paul79 on 17 Aug 2016, 05:07 am
 :scratch: 
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Armaegis on 17 Aug 2016, 09:20 pm
We have these custom made because the ones you buy off the shelf short the pins, as you have indicated.  No transformers inside.  We have used the transformer based adapters, but they add some distortion and you lose DC coupling that way.  Measurements have indicated that balanced is a few dB better in the SNR department, but THD+N is about the same.  Output voltage is 2.5VrmsFS using the adapters and 5VrmsFS without.  Thanks.

So if yours doesn't short the pins, I'm assuming it is a resistor based attenuation for the rca output then? Or is it a lift on one of the pins?
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 18 Aug 2016, 12:11 am
So if yours doesn't short the pins, I'm assuming it is a resistor based attenuation for the rca output then? Or is it a lift on one of the pins?
Just center to pin 2 and ring to pin 1.  You can build your own if you like.  Thanks.
Title: DAC DACs flying off the shelves !
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 18 Aug 2016, 11:56 pm
Pre-order with a thirty percent discount?   Not for long.

Hard to imagine how rapidly word got out.  It was only a few months ago that we started offering these, new boards, but no logo on the new enclosures.  Yes, the second round will have the Maraschino Cherry logo.

DAC DAC TL (tube-like) is almost allocated at one month out.  HS (high-spec) in stock.

These DACs sound amazing in any system, balanced or single ended.  That's according to pretty much everyone who's heard one.  New reviews out soon, so:
http://www.cherryamp.com/#!digital-source/c1rwc
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: mittg on 21 Aug 2016, 08:13 pm
I  built a Shelf unit for my Digital Amplifier Company equipment. The three shelves are 31 x 12 x 2 one piece Red Oak. I made the posts out of raw red oak that I split with tools. I am proud of this piece because it compliments the beautiful Digital Amplifier Components. On the first shelf are the Golden Cherry Monoblocks with an Audio Mirror t-61 tube preamp. On the second shelf are the Golden Cherry power units with the DAC DAC in between. I power a pair of Magnepan 3.6r'. The sound is smooth as silk and textured as Fondue Chocolate. The blackest background. The best instrument staging. So precise and beautiful. Tommy O' you do excellent work. Thank You!!! :thumb:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=148895)



(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=148895)
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: jseipp on 22 Aug 2016, 12:02 am
That is beautiful work, befitting your gear.  I can only imagine how refined must be the sound of the combination of the Digital Amplifier Company equipment with the Maggies -- a combination I'd love to hear one day.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 22 Aug 2016, 05:02 am
I  built a Shelf unit for my Digital Amplifier Company equipment. The three shelves are 31 x 12 x 2 one piece Red Oak. I made the posts out of raw red oak that I split with tools. I am proud of this piece because it compliments the beautiful Digital Amplifier Components. On the first shelf are the Golden Cherry Monoblocks with an Audio Mirror t-61 tube preamp. On the second shelf are the Golden Cherry power units with the DAC DAC in between. I power a pair of Magnepan 3.6r'. The sound is smooth as silk and textured as Fondue Chocolate. The blackest background. The best instrument staging. So precise and beautiful. Tommy O' you do excellent work. Thank You!!! :thumb:

Beautiful job on your shelf unit, and thanks for the compliments!

-Tommy O
Title: Comparing DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 24 Aug 2016, 05:50 am
Has anyone compared the DAC DAC (HS or TL) to any of these?

Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: kedoades on 24 Aug 2016, 02:54 pm
  I am interested in how it compares to the ps audio direct stream dac
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: groovybassist on 29 Aug 2016, 05:45 pm
I have a Mojo Audio Mystique v2.0 DAC and would be happy to do a comparo if I could get access to a DAC DAC.  It wouldn't be a completely apples-to-apples comparison as the Mystique is single-ended output and USB input.

I use an Auralic Aries, so I could stream coax to the DAC DAC and USB to the Mystique, and my amp has balanced and single-ended inputs, so I can accommodate having both plugged in simultaneously.  Again not an apples-to-apples comparison, but could give my subjective assessment of how the DAC DAC fits into my system and sounds with the rest of my gear vs. the Mystique.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 29 Aug 2016, 06:47 pm
I have a Mojo Audio Mystique v2.0 DAC and would be happy to do a comparo if I could get access to a DAC DAC.  It wouldn't be a completely apples-to-apples comparison as the Mystique is single-ended output and USB input.

I use an Auralic Aries, so I could stream coax to the DAC DAC and USB to the Mystique, and my amp has balanced and single-ended inputs, so I can accommodate having both plugged in simultaneously.  Again not an apples-to-apples comparison, but could give my subjective assessment of how the DAC DAC fits into my system and sounds with the rest of my gear vs. the Mystique.
30% off web price available for the next few days (less than $900).  30-day trial, too.  So if you're not majorly strapped for cash....
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: groovybassist on 29 Aug 2016, 10:48 pm
I'm not in a rush to make a change, but will think about it.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: OzarkTom on 1 Sep 2016, 01:02 am
My buddy Rex ordered his Dac Dac today.  :thumb:

He has owned several of the $4-7K dacs in the past.
Title: Re: Comparing DAC DAC
Post by: OzarkTom on 1 Sep 2016, 01:59 am
Has anyone compared the DAC DAC (HS or TL) to any of these?



PS Audio Direct Stream


Rex owns the Sony Hap-Z1ES, an owner on Computer Audiophile  said his Sony and PS Audio was a dead heat.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: kedoades on 4 Sep 2016, 06:14 pm
  so I know from all the reviews that the dac dac is a perfect match with the maraschino amps but is it as good with the older cherry amps as well.  My search for a tube preamp is not working out like I had hoped and now I am considering trying the tube like dac dac.  Another thing for me to consider is that I will also have to get another balanced cable because my dac is connected by an i2s hdmi cable (which ps audio recommends as the best hookup).  I guess I need to make my mind because I don't want to miss out on the summer sale.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: jseipp on 4 Sep 2016, 09:21 pm
I'm one of those who have hooked the DAC DACs directly to Maraschinos, so I am afraid that I can't speak directly to your situation, but considering how tube-like the Maraschinos themselves sound to me, I think that the DAC Tommy specifically calls tube-like should live up to its name in your system.

Yes, the DAC DAC input is S/PDIF coax.  One of the things that I found with it is that it plays great with almost anything upstream.  I've had mine connected directly to both a player and, now, to a source that is connected through a 25' optical cable with a converter at the end.  That source now sounds better than I thought possible.  The one place I have found the DAC DAC to be sensitive to cables is at its output, but I easily found some reasonably-priced balanced cables that do the trick.

The sale is a great opportunity to give it a try! :thumb:
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 6 Sep 2016, 04:46 am
The sale will be ending this week.  Only a few TLs left in our next lot.  Thanks, all, for the kind words.

-Tommy O
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 28 Apr 2017, 03:51 pm
Get a DAC DAC High-Spec or Tube-Like Demo Unit while you can for more than 60% (!) off list price.  We only have a few of these....

2-Day special starts 8AM EST Friday and concludes 8AM Sunday:
http://kck.st/2p77yos
Title: Notes on the differences between Tube-Like and High-Spec versions
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 30 Apr 2017, 07:22 pm
I recently received these questions and answered them.  It occurred to me that these answers may be helpful to anyone considering a DAC DAC that is unsure if they'd like the TL or the HS version better....

Is there a significant difference between HS and TL?  Would most wives notice a difference?

Depends on the wife.  Women do have better hearing than men in many cases, but they are not as likely to have "trained" ears enough to spot specific differences.  I have women listen to systems occasionally, mostly to get a better/not-better reaction or just a flat out "how do you like THIS?".  Almost every woman I know has heard a demo on my system at least once!  I haven't done any DAC comparisons with female listeners for that purpose alone, so let's put it another way....

HS sounds very precise and just as clean at any level.  That's why it's particularly good for systems that skip the preamp.  TL sounds rounded when the music's loud but pretty much like the HS when it's not. The HS is a touch quieter (blacker background), too.  By turning the volume down that feeds the DAC ("media player" volume), and turning the preamp gain up, a TL can sound nearly identical to the HS version, but not as quiet.  The ratio between "digital gain" and preamp gain determines the amount of tube effect.  Full scale digital data (0dB digital attenuation) results in maximum tube effect, and if feeding the amplifiers directly, has the tendency to make the system sound like you're using tube amps which also sound cleaner at low levels, but "smoother" at high levels.  The DAC DAC TL output level is tuned to produce just the right amount of tube effect per level when used with Maraschino amplifiers.  The new MEGAschino has higher gain ---- in line with the increased output power, so it sounds like you're using a higher power tube amp when coupled with the DAC DAC TL.

Which do you prefer and why?  Which one sells the best?

I personally use the HS nearly all the time.  It's just that it's as close to perfect as I've experienced with any DAC (mine and others).  Beyond quiet, and so very clean.  The TL version sells better, probably because it's unlike any other DAC on the market.

At RMAF, we had a demo going on the second day after switching DACs to the TL.  A few people commented that the system sounded better on day one.  We switched back to the HS and agreed the sound was better.  Note that this was with the DACs driving the amps directly, so the tube effect was effectively at "maximum".  With a preamp, we could have tuned down the tube effect by attenuating the digital stream and amplifying the analog to the amps.

Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: RCduck7 on 2 May 2017, 06:34 pm
I was going to choose the TL versions once the kickstarter project ended. but i'm not planning to use a preamp, just volume control. i'm using LDR based volume control and i'm thinking to go for the HS version right now. I tried a tube buffer in my system and while it had a positive effect on voices and midrange it had a negative effect on dynamics. Highs were rolled of a bit and bass impact not so impressive. Not sure there is any truth in that with the TL version dac. It's just something i suppose i can expect.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 2 May 2017, 07:59 pm
I was going to choose the TL versions once the kickstarter project ended. but i'm not planning to use a preamp, just volume control. i'm using LDR based volume control and i'm thinking to go for the HS version right now. I tried a tube buffer in my system and while it had a positive effect on voices and midrange it had a negative effect on dynamics. Highs were rolled of a bit and bass impact not so impressive. Not sure there is any truth in that with the TL version dac. It's just something i suppose i can expect.
The TL effect is not frequency dependent, so there's no roll off issue.  Thanks for your kind post.
-Tommy O
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: RCduck7 on 3 May 2017, 07:24 pm
I read the DAC DAC HS review on positive feedback and for part II the TL version will be reviewed. It's a while ago since the HS review. I wonder if the TL review is still going for a green light?
Jseipp on the forum prefered the the TL DAC, it was more vibrant, organic,... But i don't know what equipment he is using. But i like a black background without using a mains conditioner. And while most people prefered the HS DAC at RMAF on day one, i would go for that without a review.
You received more positive reactions on the HS versions it seems.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 12 May 2017, 04:58 pm
I read the DAC DAC HS review on positive feedback and for part II the TL version will be reviewed. It's a while ago since the HS review. I wonder if the TL review is still going for a green light?
Jseipp on the forum prefered the the TL DAC, it was more vibrant, organic,... But i don't know what equipment he is using. But i like a black background without using a mains conditioner. And while most people prefered the HS DAC at RMAF on day one, i would go for that without a review.
You received more positive reactions on the HS versions it seems.
We heard from Jeremy (the reviewer) that the TL review will be out in June.  Thanks.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 12 May 2017, 04:58 pm
We'll soon be down to 24 hours left....

As rewards, we have amazing deals on:
    - Linear Power Supplies for Maraschino amps (new product)
    - DAC DAC (TL or HS)
    - KING Stereo Maraschino
    - MEGAschino and Classic-to-MEGAschino upgrades (new product)
    - Golden Cherry (top of the line Maraschino) and Golden Cherry Upgrade (for KING Maraschino owners)
    - Maraschino Module Development Kit (new product for OEMs and DIY)
    - USB to SPDIF Converter (new product)
    - Dual 60V 1kW Maraschino power supply upgrade
    - INSIDER White Paper (only $4)
    - In-Line Maraschino ("hanging" Cherry)
    - KING In-Line Maraschino ("hanging" Cherry)

Here's the link again:
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/378044010/maraschino-video-series

DON'T MISS THIS OPPORTUNITY !  Thanks for your support.

-Tommy O
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: jseipp on 13 May 2017, 12:53 am
Hey RCduck7,

I'm sorry that it's taken me awhile to notice your post and reply.  The equipment I've used the DAC DACs with are a pair of inline Maraschinos with the 30V power supplies on a pair of GR Research Wedgies, and with the 60V supplies on a pair of Legacy Classics.

I suspect that I am a little odd in really desiring a palpable source of each sound in the soundstage.  The best way for me to describe it is that I like there to be size and density to each sound.  That may not even make sense to many listeners and so may not even enter their estimation of gear.

I will say that the HS DAC DAC blew me away in every sense, and then when the TL DAC DAC arrived it just additionally fulfilled that quality I tried to describe above in a way that I find to be especially personally satisfying.  Maybe a bit more "round and full" than "lean and clean."  The two editions are certainly cut from the same cloth soundwise, with just that little tweak in the sound that I feel is far more a personal preference than anything like an objective measure of their performance.  Matching the Maraschino power supplies to the respective speakers made a considerably bigger difference in my systems than swapping between the HS and the TL has.

For what it's worth, I've kept them both!  I hope that's a little helpful. :)

   
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: RCduck7 on 16 May 2017, 07:22 pm
I think i can imagine what your preferences are. There are so many various parameters that play a role to each individual system also. I once had a cd player with a tube output stage and a solid state output stage. I remember i was switching a lot between the two leaving me confused. Some types of music i liked more with the tube output and others types with the solid state output. At the end i settled for the solid state output. The TL DAC DAC has no real tube output stage of course. But there is always something that has a benefit over the other and the other way around also something else i guess.
Thanks Jseipp.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: RCduck7 on 14 Jul 2017, 03:07 pm
I'm having both the TL-DAC and HS-DAC in my setup rightnow. I wasn't planning to have these both at my home but it turned out that way by some silly circumstances. But I'm glad now that i have the 2 DAC's though. Let me explain...

At first when the kickstarter project was running i mailed Tommy that i would like the TL version of the DAC DAC. In the following weeks i changed my mind and wanted to have the HS version. What i did not know is that the TL-DAC was allready sent to me not long after the kickstarter project ended. Tommy was very helpfull and wanted to send me the HS version to so i could compare both. I could keep the DAC DAC i liked  the most and sent the other one back. Since i also made a pledge for the Golden Cherry Upgrade he would let me sent my amps to do the upgrade to him together with the DAC DAC I'm not keeping. That way shipping costs would be more acceptable as i ship it together in one package. Thanks again to Tommy to put that kind of trust in me.
More about the differences of both versions of the DAC DAC  in my setup is going to follow.  :wink:
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 14 Jul 2017, 08:38 pm
I'm having both the TL-DAC and HS-DAC in my setup rightnow. I wasn't planning to have these both at my home but it turned out that way by some silly circumstances. But I'm glad now that i have the 2 DAC's though. Let me explain...

At first when the kickstarter project was running i mailed Tommy that i would like the TL version of the DAC DAC. In the following weeks i changed my mind and wanted to have the HS version. What i did not know is that the TL-DAC was allready sent to me not long after the kickstarter project ended. Tommy was very helpfull and wanted to send me the HS version to so i could compare both. I could keep the DAC DAC i liked  the most and sent the other one back. Since i also made a pledge for the Golden Cherry Upgrade he would let me sent my amps to do the upgrade to him together with the DAC DAC I'm not keeping. That way shipping costs would be more acceptable as i ship it together in one package. Thanks again to Tommy to put that kind of trust in me.
More about the differences of both versions of the DAC DAC  in my setup is going to follow.  :wink:
I'm looking forward to your take on the two Cherry DAC "flavors"!  Please be sure to use quality wires (good shielding, good connectors) and AC power strips, if you use them.  Thanks for your kind post.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: dburna on 14 Jul 2017, 09:05 pm
I'm looking forward to your take on the two Cherry DAC "flavors"!  Please be sure to use quality wires (good shielding, good connectors) and AC power strips, if you use them.  Thanks for your kind post.

I am curious -- why do you recommend using AC power strips?

-dB
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 15 Jul 2017, 04:37 am
I am curious -- why do you recommend using AC power strips?

-dB
I'm not necessarily recommending power strips, but I'm saying if you chose to use one, make sure it's a quality product. Power strips are sometimes handy with our 48V systems since that makes it easier to turn the amps off when leaving for vacation, for example.  Also handy for hooking the amps up and turning them on after everything else is up and running.  Auto sleep works well if the source is always on, but if not, it's recommended to turn the amps off instead of possibly subjecting them to preamp turn-on thumps and the like.  So, maybe I do recommend power strips for some setups.

Regarding AC power in general....  Current surges based on the audio need a good, solid AC connection.  I'm also a fan of quality power cords, but not the outrageously priced ones.  I guess quality over "fanciness" is another way to sum it up.  Thanks for your question.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: RCduck7 on 15 Jul 2017, 10:00 pm
I'm looking forward to your take on the two Cherry DAC "flavors"!  Please be sure to use quality wires (good shielding, good connectors) and AC power strips, if you use them.  Thanks for your kind post.

I'm using an Auricle Audio Design cable for the digital domain. Silver foil interconnects that i bough from a DIYer. A Bada LB-5600 power conditioner... but i want to replace that with a good power strip. I recently found out that when i use my EVA II LDR based volume control on the filter section i have some noise coming through the speakers. While when i connect the volume control on the bypass section on the power conditioner the noise is as good as gone. Now that i know that I'm connecting most of my key components on the bypass section or directly on a wall socket. But a friend that also has the EVA II volume controller told me once that it is very sensitive to noise coming from the wall socket. He recommended to power it with a battery.

For replacing the Bada power conditioner there are two power strips that caught my intrest...
One is a no nonsens Aluminium power strip with internally good quality wire that is star shaped connected. And it has a Lapp power cord attached with very thick copper wires. No conditioning here. Here's the link...
http://www.benl.ebay.be/itm/Ultra-ALU-6-fache-Steckdosenleiste-Netzleiste-mit-1-5m-Netzkabel-Sternverdrahtet-/181471091235?hash=item2a40851a23

I'm also considering the Oehlbach Powersocket 907. It has 4 unfiltered plugs and 4 that are digital filtered. I'm wondering if some of my components may benefit from the filtering. On my Bada conditioner it was worse with my volume controller. But it good be that the Bada has a fault or it is getting to old/wear and tear to do the job. It is also convenient it has 2 usb sockets to load multimedia devices. But I'm not sure it is internally star-shaped connected inside like the powerstrip on Ebay. Link...
http://www.oehlbach.com/en/power/powersocket-907

What would be recommended? Or are both good choices? And what are actually the benefits of a star-shaped connection?

Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: RCduck7 on 17 Jul 2017, 11:22 pm
I'm ready to share my experiences with the TL-DAC vs HS-DAC which i have been listening to for days now.

First i briefly compared the TL-DAC with my Metrum Quad DAC that i have been using for a few years now. Immediately i got the impression the TL-DAC opened up the music a bit more. When the HS-DAC arrived i decided not to compare it to the Metrum DAC as i liked the TL-DAC from the start.

At first i noticed the TL-DAC was that little bit more organic and slightly fuller sounding then the HS-DAC. To pinpoint the differences i listened to some tracks 2 times or more until i knew a track very well. I listened to Jazz, Piano, Voices, Pop and Rock… This revealed enough to make one of the DAC DAC’s my DAC of choice.

The HS-DAC does things in resolution and speed better. The highs on the TL-DAC seemed to have a bit roll off compared to the HS-DAC, which makes that the TL-DAC has a bit more upper midrange, while the HS-DAC a bit more in the highs.
But the thing that was remarkable and important for me in my setup, is that the HS-DAC has more definition in the lower regions. And the starting and stopping of a sound was better. That makes it better suited to complex music. For instance piano notes that rapidly follow each other were a bit more articulate on the HS-DAC. It also helps that the HS-DAC has a blacker background. True the TL-DAC sounds a bit more organic and vibrant and i easily could live with it. Since both DAC’s can draw you into the music and are involving it made my choice not very difficult.

The HS-DAC will be my DAC of choice. :)
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 18 Jul 2017, 04:51 pm
I'm using an Auricle Audio Design cable for the digital domain. Silver foil interconnects that i bough from a DIYer. A Bada LB-5600 power conditioner... but i want to replace that with a good power strip. I recently found out that when i use my EVA II LDR based volume control on the filter section i have some noise coming through the speakers. While when i connect the volume control on the bypass section on the power conditioner the noise is as good as gone. Now that i know that I'm connecting most of my key components on the bypass section or directly on a wall socket. But a friend that also has the EVA II volume controller told me once that it is very sensitive to noise coming from the wall socket. He recommended to power it with a battery.

For replacing the Bada power conditioner there are two power strips that caught my intrest...
One is a no nonsens Aluminium power strip with internally good quality wire that is star shaped connected. And it has a Lapp power cord attached with very thick copper wires. No conditioning here. Here's the link...
http://www.benl.ebay.be/itm/Ultra-ALU-6-fache-Steckdosenleiste-Netzleiste-mit-1-5m-Netzkabel-Sternverdrahtet-/181471091235?hash=item2a40851a23

I'm also considering the Oehlbach Powersocket 907. It has 4 unfiltered plugs and 4 that are digital filtered. I'm wondering if some of my components may benefit from the filtering. On my Bada conditioner it was worse with my volume controller. But it good be that the Bada has a fault or it is getting to old/wear and tear to do the job. It is also convenient it has 2 usb sockets to load multimedia devices. But I'm not sure it is internally star-shaped connected inside like the powerstrip on Ebay. Link...
http://www.oehlbach.com/en/power/powersocket-907

What would be recommended? Or are both good choices? And what are actually the benefits of a star-shaped connection?
Both of the ones you provided links for appear to be excellent quality.  We don't recommend specific power strips because offerings are constantly changing, and pretty much any high quality power strip should do the job.  It's nice to have an on/off switch, though!  Thanks for your kind post and review.
-Tommy O
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: RCduck7 on 2 Aug 2017, 08:20 pm
After my comparison to sum things up of my experience with the TL-DAC and HS-DAC...

The TL-DAC sounds amazing from the start, organic, vibrant and full sounding and a great mid to to upper midrange that makes tube fans happy without having actually a tube DAC. But still, resolution is good!

The HS-DAC has a solid black background, no noise and great resolution from top to bottom, sparkling highs to surprisingly very good definition in the lower registers. It offers speed that makes the starting and stopping of sounds of complex music easier to follow.

Either DAC, TL or HS are a very involving experience, you can't go wrong
Title: Audio Beatnik review of DAC DAC ---- HS vs TL
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 2 Aug 2017, 11:31 pm
DAC DAC review comparing HS vs TL versions in the Audio Beatnik.  Check it out!
http://theaudiobeatnik.com/index.php/2017/08/02/comparing-high-spec-version-tube-like-version-digital-amplifier-company-dac-dac/

"I think both the HS and TL versions of the DAC DAC are simply remarkable. These hot-rodded DACs don’t give you any frills, but they give you really great sound for a reasonable price. I know there are a lot of little DACs for under $300, but I haven’t heard one that can touch either of these two."
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: RCduck7 on 10 Aug 2017, 08:28 pm
This review describes it very good. I also experienced the good qualities of the TL-DAC when it comes to warmth, especially on guitar strings and violin. But overall i found the HS-DAC better suited to my needs.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: LarryD56 on 3 Sep 2017, 05:11 am
I had my reservations concerning the HS dac since I easily get fatigued if the upper midrange is overly accentuated (which is usually the case whenever someone says there is great detail heard in their product), but with the HS DAC DAC I have had no problems with it's sound. It gives me the fullness of the music and the detail I love, without the fatigue.
I'm a tube guy. Always loved their sound, but I'm very happy with the HS dac. I am curious about the TL dac, but not curious enough to buy one yet, so I can't give you a comparison. I just wanted to give a two thumbs up for the HS version from a guy with touchy ears.

Larry D.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 8 Dec 2017, 03:56 pm
USB Bundle Deal:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=154113.0

Ends today!
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Early B. on 13 Jan 2018, 05:11 am
I received my DAC DAC HS three days ago and I'm thoroughly impressed by this magical little box. Along with my Maraschino amps, the sound is resplendent. As most others have already mentioned, the key features are a blacker than black background, super detailed, and very dynamic. I had no plans to trade out most of my system, but you can't go wrong with Tommy's designs. It's a major upgrade for me, and prices are very reasonable. 

   
Title: DAC DAC HS wins 2017 Digital Product of the Year from 'the audio beatnik"
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 16 Jan 2018, 12:10 pm
We are honored to receive this award from the audio beatnik:
    Digital Product of the Year ---- DAC DAC High-Spec Version


(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=174632)

http://theaudiobeatnik.com/audio-beatniks-best-2017-awards/
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: KLH007 on 16 Jan 2018, 02:54 pm
Congratulations Tommy, I know Jeremy Kipnis (Positive Feedback), also loves his DAC DAC and Maraschino amps. I'll have to hear one or both versions of your DAC soon. I thought the Inline Maraschinos were the best Class D amps I ever auditioned in my system, superior bass definition and control, beautiful mids and vocals, and most importantly extended yet sweet top end that yielded gorgeous string tone and accurate delicate percussion.
Title: New DAC DAC Photos
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 17 Jan 2018, 06:20 pm
New DAC DAC photos just in!

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=174672)

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=174670)

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=174673)

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=174671)
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: Early B. on 17 Jan 2018, 07:26 pm
What are the 3rd and 4th LED lights on the front for?
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 17 Jan 2018, 07:40 pm
What are the 3rd and 4th LED lights on the front for?
DAC DAC LEDs, left to right....
Power, valid stream, Fs > 50kHz, Fs > 100kHz
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: rodge827 on 18 Jan 2018, 01:11 am
 I was very skeptical about how good a SS dac could sound having owned a highly modded ANK tube Dac in the past. I still have friends who have their highly modded AN and ANK tube dacs to listen to form time to time, but sadly had to unload mine when the economy crashed a while back. Since then its been an old one box player and a cheap NOS dac to suffer through. After reading many of the positive DAC DAC reviews on AC I gave one a try, fully with the intent of sending it back! There was no way this little lightweight SS dac could compare! Right?

 A couple of days later FEDEX dropped the HS DAC DAC at my door and that night I put it in my system. My set up is single ended and with the adapters installed I got sound from only one channel. What! After some diagnosis Tommy and I agreed that one of the XLR to RCA adapters must be faulty. No worries two days later there was one in my mailbox. I installed the adapter put my transport on continuous play, turned the volume way down, closed the door and went to bed. Later the following evening with about 24 hours run in time I sat down for a listen.

 Wait this can't be! :o Detail in spades with tone? No way! No no no way am I hearing this! For the next 6 hours or so, disc after disc went into the transport with disbelief turning into absolute belief in what I was hearing. Detail, tone, sound stage depth, height, and spot on imaging. I like to listen to live recordings when demoing a system. The HS DAC does a great job at bringing subtle nuances to light. Mic bumps, hall echo, crown noise, artists verbal cues to each other... I'm an emotional listener who likes to be engaged and moved by music. The HS DAC hits those marks for me as well as some of the best DAC I have listened to.

The HS DAC DAC has been in my system since August of 2017 and will be sticking around for a long time.

Great job Tommy! :thumb: 

Chris



             
Title: Looking for a DAC DAC TL ????
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 18 Jan 2018, 02:26 am
Super low price on DAC DAC TL:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=155100.new#new
Title: DAC DAC 2 !!!!
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 9 Feb 2018, 11:36 pm
Available soon through our next Kickstarter....

Check it out:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=155555.0
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: mresseguie on 10 Feb 2018, 05:06 am
Tommy,

Is this the same DAC that you sent me a couple years ago - that Aldcoll and I auditioned?

Regards,

Michael

Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 12 Feb 2018, 07:33 pm
Tommy,

Is this the same DAC that you sent me a couple years ago - that Aldcoll and I auditioned?

Regards,

Michael
I'm pretty sure that was the original TL (tube like, 121dB SNR) version. Since then, we have improved the board and made the HS (high spec, 125dB SNR) version.  We are planning to release the new DAC DAC during our next Kickstarter.  The DAC DAC 2 TL reaches 125dB and the DAC DAC 2 HS reaches 130dB.  Thanks.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 28 Feb 2018, 01:36 pm
DAC DAC demos on Kickstarter:
http://kck.st/2CH4sLB

PLUS NEW STUFF:
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 4 Mar 2018, 09:54 pm
We added two more rewards today:
    •   Digital Audio Bundle -- Cherry USB, DPA, DAC DAC 2 HS
    •   DAC DAC Upgrade -- convert your DAC DAC to the new 130dB+ DAC DAC 2 HS

The sound of the DAC DAC 2 HS is simply astounding!  We're running one through a MEGAschino in our primary demo system, and the result is even better imaging and smoothness.  Can't imagine a better sounding DAC....
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 27 Apr 2018, 02:50 pm
We will have some DAC DACs (original version, some Classic Cherry ULTRAs, too) available soon due to upgrades from the Kickstarter:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=157187.0
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 3 May 2018, 06:04 pm
We will have some DAC DACs (original version, some Classic Cherry ULTRAs, too) available soon due to upgrades from the Kickstarter:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=157187.0
Starting to run out of these demo DAC DACs....
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: rodge827 on 13 Oct 2018, 01:58 pm
Here's a good deal on a HS version: https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=160169.msg1709038#new
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 22 Oct 2018, 05:05 am
Newer photos.  130dB+ DAC DAC 2 HS and HSV (with volume)....


(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=185796)


(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=185797)


(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=185798)


(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=185799)
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 5 Nov 2018, 06:15 pm
November Special on DAC DAC 1 TL and HS located here, prices just posted:
https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=160513.msg1712563#msg1712563

We also explain the lowered list price to accommodate the new DAC DAC 2....
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 22 Dec 2018, 05:26 pm
November Special on DAC DAC 1 TL and HS located here, prices just posted:
https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=160513.msg1712563#msg1712563

We also explain the lowered list price to accommodate the new DAC DAC 2....
Our November Sale has resulted in more DAC DAC 1s available from upgrades!  Email Support@DigitalAmp.com if interested in a demo at very low cost.  Some have no silkscreen, and some have minor scratches, but all are in pretty good condition and sound AMAZING.  You won't know how very affordable these demos are without asking.  Thanks.
Title: 130dB+ DAC DAC 2 HS reviewed by the audio beatnik
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 9 Jan 2019, 10:05 pm
Cherry 130dB+ DAC DAC 2 HS reviewed:
https://theaudiobeatnik.com/something-sweet-from-the-digital-amplifier-company-reviewing-the-dac-dac-2-hs/

(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=188801)
Title: Re: 130dB+ DAC DAC 2 HS reviewed by the audio beatnik
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 15 Jan 2019, 04:31 pm
Cherry 130dB+ DAC DAC 2 HS reviewed:
https://theaudiobeatnik.com/something-sweet-from-the-digital-amplifier-company-reviewing-the-dac-dac-2-hs/

The audio beatnik is now combining the 130dB+ DAC DAC 2 HS with the Cherry USB in a reference digital audio system and will provide a follow-up review of this combination!
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 8 Feb 2019, 06:33 pm
$490 DAC DAC this weekend only:
https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=162272.0
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: DEP14 on 10 Feb 2019, 10:28 pm
$490 DAC DAC this weekend only:
https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=162272.0

Will these incorporate any changes, outer case etc? 

Or will they be simply checked over for working condition (which is fine) simply wondering what the refurb encompasses.  Thanks!
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: sumoking on 10 Feb 2019, 10:46 pm
$490 DAC DAC this weekend only:
https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=162272.0

I have this DAC... It absolutely blew away my $3,000 Exogal Comet.
Just saying.

This DAC with my Cherry Mono Block amps is an amazing combination. My Spatial M3 Turbo S Speakers which are amazing rounds out my system.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 11 Feb 2019, 04:02 am
Will these incorporate any changes, outer case etc? 

Or will they be simply checked over for working condition (which is fine) simply wondering what the refurb encompasses.  Thanks!
New enclosures and power supplies.  Other than that, cleaned up, fully retested and repackaged.  Thanks.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: DEP14 on 12 Feb 2019, 12:30 am
New enclosures and power supplies.  Other than that, cleaned up, fully retested and repackaged.  Thanks.

Too late?
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 12 Feb 2019, 01:54 am
Too late?
Three hours left !!!!  Email me at Support@DigitalAmp.com if you see this after that.  Thanks (:
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: andrewinukm on 13 Feb 2019, 08:50 am
I have this DAC... It absolutely blew away my $3,000 Exogal Comet.
Just saying.

This DAC with my Cherry Mono Block amps is an amazing combination. My Spatial M3 Turbo S Speakers rounds out my system.
This is high praise, could you say a little more to compare DAC DAC vs Exogal Comet?
BTW, which DAC DAC version are you using?

Three hours left !!!!  Email me at Support@DigitalAmp.com if you see this after that.  Thanks (:
Can DAC DAC HS be upgraded by myself instead of sending it to you?
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 15 Feb 2019, 04:45 am
Can DAC DAC HS be upgraded by myself instead of sending it to you?
Cherry DAC DAC upgrades are fully retested and repackaged, but they travel light (3 lb total) and secure in their very well padded (soft foam) 12” x 12” x 4” double taped shipping container.  Thanks for the question.
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: andrewinukm on 5 Apr 2019, 06:31 am

I have a problem every time I hit play on Foobar.

Here's my current setup:
Laptop (Foobar)  >  ISO Regen (USB filter with isolation)  >  WaveIO (USB to SPDIF)  >  DAC DAC HS  > Nuforce STA200 amp > speakers

There is this loud hash/distorted blast of sound (that lasts for half a second) when I boot the PC with DAC plugged in, or when I first hit play after stopping the music for some time.

The amp is DC coupled.

When I switch to another DAC, I don't have such problem.

Is it because DAC DAC HS is DC coupled as well, and some static or whatever is being passed on to the amp? Or is it Foobar or something else?

How can I prevent this? (I don't want to blow my speakers, it has happened before).
Title: Re: DAC DAC
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 8 Apr 2019, 02:04 pm
I have a problem every time I hit play on Foobar.

Here's my current setup:
Laptop (Foobar)  >  ISO Regen (USB filter with isolation)  >  WaveIO (USB to SPDIF)  >  DAC DAC HS  > Nuforce STA200 amp > speakers

There is this loud hash/distorted blast of sound (that lasts for half a second) when I boot the PC with DAC plugged in, or when I first hit play after stopping the music for some time.

The amp is DC coupled.

When I switch to another DAC, I don't have such problem.

Is it because DAC DAC HS is DC coupled as well, and some static or whatever is being passed on to the amp? Or is it Foobar or something else?

How can I prevent this? (I don't want to blow my speakers, it has happened before).
Try using Cherry USB instead of wave IO.   There no need to “doctor” the USB interface when using Cherry USB, so the “iso regen” isn’t necessary.  We even provide a gold plated USB wire.  It’s tested to show no data errors.  Clean start/stop with everything we’ve tested except Media Player when switching media mid-track and the volume cranked, and that’s only a brief DC step, inaudible most times.  We have confirmed this is Media Player’s fault, but we still use it for demos occasionally since it’s not a big deal.

Here’s the Cherry USB web page:
https://www.cherryamp.com/usb-to-spdif-converter

Cherry USB Features:
* Lossless USB to coax SPDIF conversion
* Gold Neutrik RCA output connector
* No driver installation necessary
* No power adapter needed
* Up to 384k/32b
* Slim case with standard Cherry Maraschino footprint and Anti-vibration feet
* Electrically Isolated Output to prevent gound loops
* USB 2.0 cable included

It’s also possible Foobar is sending junk data at first even though the interface is active. DAC DAC is designed to have fast start time after receiving valid data/clock.

(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=193029)

(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=193028)
Title: DAC DAC at unheard of price
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 21 May 2019, 02:03 pm
If you’ve ever wanted one, or maybe you’re just curious....   Here’s a way to hear a precision engineered super high performance DAC in your system....

124dB, Double Differential DC coupled true balanced outputs, 0.0004% THD, quadruple conditioned power supplies, jitter immunity, and a 1” end-to-end analog signal path!! Cherry DAC DAC 1 HS/TL “no silkscreen” Demos for less than half the original price. Email Support@DigitalAmp.com for more info.
Title: Re: DAC DAC related stuff
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 9 Jun 2019, 05:38 pm
New web page for Cherry DAC DAC:
https://www.cherryamp.com/dac-dac-d-to-a-convertor

Some comments about DAC DAC from a Facebook group (ANA)....

About pro-audio and high signal levels (voltage):
"....also note that in pro-audio, much higher signal levels are used, making it easy to achieve super high SNR. Why? Because every step in the process adds a little noise. Noise is the enemy of audio. Consumer audio “line level” is 0.45Vpk, and pro is 1.74Vpk. This is almost 12dB higher !!"
[note the DAC DAC full scale output is 4.9Vrms]

About DAC DAC features from the 30,000 foot level:
"....They sound nothing short of spectacular! Cherry 130dB+ DAC DAC 2 HS (and HSV version with analog controlled digital attenuation) IS commercially available, and it’s true balanced, DC coupled, double differential, and designed for sonics. They are designed to facilitate direct drive of amplifiers with precise clipping level control. The design has a 1” analog signal path."
"....You might know someone local who owns one as well. Cherry Amp customers tend to be friendly and knowledgeable. They are also proud of their good taste in equipment."

About reviews:
"....if you want to know what listeners think of the DAC DAC (any version), take a look at the reviews. Google it or look here:" [link below]
"It's hard to find reviewers that aren't playing the advertising game. This is why we reply on publications like audio beatnik, KSS (pos FB), AV Nirvana, and Home Theater Review for straightforward no-strings-attached reviews. They don't demand compensation as most other's have. There must be at least 20 DAC DAC customer reviews here, plus pro reviews, plus hundreds of amp reviews in there:"
https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=127654.0

About the TL version:
"We also have a tube like version that emulates tubes without the noise issues that tubes present"

About performance:
"124dB and <0.0004% THD+N is the DAC DAC 1 HS specified performance. The DAC DAC 2 HS goes to 130dB. The design is simple, not burdened with unnecessary features on a device that’s essentially what every DAC should be, digital in, super clean analog out 🙂"

About the nature of the design:
"The Cherry DAC DAC was created with SIMPLICITY and PERFORMANCE in mind. "No bells and whistles", as one might say."
"....I understand your concern with the price, but like I mentioned, we are selling DAC DAC 1 HS/TL demos for super low prices (email Support@DigitalAmp.com for info) due to the new DAC DAC 2 HS/HSV on the scene. We have upgraded MANY DAC DAC 1 units to DAC DAC 2 as a result. The DAC DAC 1 LIST PRICE has been below $1000 for something like a year now, and it competes with DACs costing 10x the price! Maybe you're happy with your built-in DAC, but until you've heard the difference (and yes, there is a NOTICEABLE one) the Cherry DAC can make, you're not aware of the sonic benefits offered. The great measurements only tell half the story. The audio beatnik guy even said this was the first DAC that improved on the one in the Oppo. This means that other attempts to improve on the Oppo's DAC (like the ones mentioned here) have NOT helped, but the Cherry DAC does! "

#Sound #Stereo #MEGAschino #DAC #DACDAC #CherryDACDAC #CherryAmp #CherryMaraschino #CherryMEGA #MaraschinoCherry #SurroundSound #Audio #HomeAudio #Amplifiers #DigitalAmpCo #HighEndAudio #miniCherry #Cherry5ch #cherry5 #5CHerry #4CHerry #3CHerry #2CHerry #HomeTheater #ExtremeAudio
Title: DAC DAC -- design philosophy related
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 9 Jun 2019, 09:15 pm
....more on philosophy with respect to development work:
"....if it doesn't affect music playback, it's not significant. The Cherry DAC DAC was designed to reproduce music, and it has been doing so for many customers over the last four years. Plus, I have compared ESS, Cirrus, ADI/LT, TI, and AKM DACs both on the bench and in the ear. There IS a difference in the sound of their reference designs. I'm not the type to claim that your system isn't resolving enough to tell. The fact remains that the difference between the reference designs is minimal. There's something going on in the highs with the ESS converters that obviously doesn't affect the way it reproduces sine waves on the bench (or full scale square waves, not that it matters). There ARE things you can't measure by conventional means, or that are neglected even when the data is there for the taking. As you might have figured out over the years, I'm a big fan of measurements, but I'm not so arrogant as to say that's all that matters! Anything Cherry is going to include my 30+ years experience designing audio electronics, and diverting from the copy-and-paste reference design of a DAC chip is no exception. Like in the movie Bugs Life, the old ant says "just like everybody else", because to him there's no reason to strive for more. There's refinement beyond the status quo.
The Cherry DAC DAC is made to sound good, and yes, better, than conventional cookie cutter DACs!"
Title: Re: Skipping the preamp the the Cherry DAC DAC (and related stuff)
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 13 Jun 2019, 07:30 pm
Skipping the preamp:
Every step the audio signal goes through adds noise and distortion.   More later....
Title: Re: Skipping the preamp by using the Cherry DAC DAC (and related stuff)
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 4 Sep 2020, 06:43 pm
Introducing the DAC DAC 3 !!

We are running a Kickstarter to fund development, which will be very fast, so we expect to be in full production by December.

Details here:
https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=172243.0

By the way, we were fully funded on DAY ONE of this project!
Title: Re: Skipping the preamp by using the Cherry DAC DAC (and related stuff)
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 15 Sep 2020, 04:21 am
Introducing the DAC DAC 3 !!

We are running a Kickstarter to fund development, which will be very fast, so we expect to be in full production by December.

Details here:
https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=172243.0

By the way, we were fully funded on DAY ONE of this project!
We added these rewards tonight:
  - DAC DAC 1 (HS or TL) Upgrade to DAC DAC 3 or 3S
  - DAC DAC 2 (HS or HSV) Upgrade to DAC DAC 3 or 3S