AudioCircle

Industry Circles => GR Research => Topic started by: skeeter99 on 17 Jan 2019, 10:28 pm

Title: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 17 Jan 2019, 10:28 pm
Guys,

I'm kicking around the idea and have been talking to Danny about having a custom set of X-Statik's and an X-Voce built for me. I can build a box just fine but I've never veneered before and quite frankly, don't have the patience to learn  :lol: I know my limitations and that is one of them! Haha! This will be for our living room which, for now, is the only "room" I have as I've given the space I've used for our theater to my kids to use  :duh:

Usage is primarily TV and Movies and occasional music. I rarely just sit down and listen to music anymore so dialog clarity and imaging for movies are more important to me at this point. I've had X-Statik's before and currently have an X-Voce for Center and it does excellent for TV's and Movies. We typically use our 4th Gen Apple TV or a Blu-Ray player for content and I have a pretty good quality Marantz SR-7008 receiver. It's a bit older at this point but it really gives us very little to the newer versions.

So I asked Danny if he'd be ok with me reaching out to Salk Sound as they do custom built speakers and he was cool with it. I reached out to Jim today and have started the conversation. He's never built these before so I sent him the drawings and links and is going to get back to me.

I plan on doing the Sonicap and Mills Resistor upgrade but am thinking it might be better to either (A) get all new parts for the crossovers and do a full point to point crossover or (B) do the upgraded parts AND de-solder all the old parts and point to point wire. Given my above usage, though, this might be an exercise in futility and the increased clarity from point to point may be negligible for what I'll be primarily using the setup for.

Regarding finishes, and this is one of the key reasons I'm thinking of having Salk build these, there are SO MANY options that it's almost mind boggling! A few of the finishes I'm thinking of are as follows:

S3e with Silver Gray over Maple Veneer
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=189222)

S3 with Gray Burst over Maple Veneer
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=189223)

Song Towers with Silver Gray over Maple
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=189224)

Song Towers in Zebra Wood with black accents
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=189225)

S3 with Rose Red over Maple Veneer
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=189226)


These would be going in this room (I'll see if I can get a better picture tonight of the space)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=189227)


What do you all think of these finishes? Which one is tops?

We have brownish stained bamboo flooring with Gray Walls and White Trim, Gray Couches with Blue and Red/White accent cushions. I've got an MFW-15 now but might replace it, we'll see how much this ends up costing ... lol!

Saving me some time trying to search through the archives, what have those of you that have built these yourselves done?? Show me the pictures  :popcorn:

I'm not in any hurry to do this, I haven't gotten myself anything new for a while (besides the PR X-LS' I just bought yesterday but those hardly count  :lol:) so I'd like to do this right and get what I'm going to be happy with.

And ... go. Ready for comments/questions/etc! Haha!

Thanks all!

Scott
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 18 Jan 2019, 12:37 am
Pics of the room

(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=189238)

(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=189239)

(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=189240)

(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=189241)
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: Captainhemo on 18 Jan 2019, 02:10 am
As I mentioned, I'll let  a  Dodge "tequilla Sunrise"  pair of  Oticas go for a good price and , you could drive up  and hear them . Upgraded with  Platinum/Jupiter bypass caps,  gortz Alpha Core inductor on  mid range, and   M165x wofers

(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=145217)

I love these  and  am actually scareed to let them go , but,  I need to hear the  Super7's for a  while.... can always  go back  and build another  set of these if  miss them too much

jay
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 18 Jan 2019, 02:33 am
Oh is that what you were talking about Jay?? Haha! I don't frequent the forums enough so I didn't know what you were talking about. It was one of those smile and nod moments  :lol:

Let me know what the price would be, I could possibly be interested. I don't think I have the space for them in my room would be the biggest problem and I have no way to pull them out into the room very far.
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: HT cOz on 18 Jan 2019, 03:36 am
Oh is that what you were talking about Jay?? Haha! I don't frequent the forums enough so I didn't know what you were talking about. It was one of those smile and nod moments  :lol:

Let me know what the price would be, I could possibly be interested. I don't think I have the space for them in my room would be the biggest problem and I have no way to pull them out into the room very far.

I'm not sure Xstatic is a good choice if you can't pull them out into the room.  Generally they would like ~3 feet behind them to not smear the sounds.  Maybe N3 or a boxed design would be better.
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 18 Jan 2019, 03:45 am
Hmm, I just measured and I can only get about 18" away from the back wall. I do have acoustic panels behind where they would go. Crud, would these not work well here?
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: Captainhemo on 18 Jan 2019, 03:55 am
Ideally you  want that   3'  minimum.
As  Coz  says,   the  N3tL's  would work well and they are a  wonderful lspeaker
The NX - Otica's  require about the same  space as the  Statiks, pretty much the same  size speaker   aside from the   10 degree wedge of the  Otica's.

jay
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: mlundy57 on 18 Jan 2019, 03:57 am
If you can get the back of the X-Statiks 18”’off the wall that would put the open baffle section pretty close to 3’ from the wall. Unlike the Oticas, the bottom section of the X-Statiks are not open baffle.

As for finish, the whole point of paying for a custom finish to to get what you and your wife like. You’re the ones that will be looking at them every day.

Mike
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 18 Jan 2019, 04:00 am
I can get the back of the TOP SECTION 18" off the back wall, I wish it was the back of the bass portion of the cabinet! This is a pretty shallow room from the sitting position.

And, yes, I know the point of the custom finish is for us, I'm just curious what others think as well :D
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: mlundy57 on 18 Jan 2019, 04:05 am
In that case the X-Statiks are not the best speaker for that situation.

The N3s are wonderful speakers and have the matching N3S center speaker. By reversing the transmission line and having the port open to the front the N3s can be placed fairly close to the wall.

Another option would be the Skinny 6s with the Flat 5 center speaker.

Mike
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 18 Jan 2019, 04:11 am
Well poops! I was getting all excited! I've heard the N3's are great speakers and I'm sure they sound really good but I dunno ...  :scratch:

And I'm sure I'm just being dumb, but there's something about large center channels that appeals to me. The N3S is just so little! Lol!
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: mlundy57 on 18 Jan 2019, 04:21 am
Well poops! I was getting all excited! I've heard the N3's are great speakers and I'm sure they sound really good but I dunno ...  :scratch:

And I'm sure I'm just being dumb, but there's something about large center channels that appeals to me. The N3S is just so little! Lol!

In that case, check out the Flat 5. While it is only 4-1/2” tall it is 32” wide and 13-3/4” deep.
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 18 Jan 2019, 04:33 am
Yeah, tall skinny speakers or wide and low speakers don't aesthetically appeal to me. Not for the living room at least.
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: HT cOz on 18 Jan 2019, 07:08 am
I built some M3 a few years back while the profile is not huge, nothing small about the sound. 
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=45739)

If you are going as far as getting custom cabinets you could, with Danny's help, wisely choose some drivers and Danny might design a custom speaker for you.  I think he only requires you to buy the crossover and pay for mock up etc.  There are lots of cool options available if you go that route. 
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: mlundy57 on 18 Jan 2019, 02:11 pm
Yeah, tall skinny speakers or wide and low speakers don't aesthetically appeal to me. Not for the living room at least.

Then go with the X-MTM Encore for the main speakers and the X-Voce for the center channel. The X-MTM Encore is the X-CS Encore in a ported floor standing cabinet.
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 18 Jan 2019, 02:16 pm
I built some M3 a few years back while the profile is not huge, nothing small about the sound. 
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=45739)

If you are going as far as getting custom cabinets you could, with Danny's help, wisely choose some drivers and Danny might design a custom speaker for you.  I think he only requires you to buy the crossover and pay for mock up etc.  There are lots of cool options available if you go that route. 


See, add two more drivers below the N3's pair and on the N3S flank them to each side for the center, now we're talking! I dunno, I'm a sucker for lots of drivers staring me in the face. Haha!

Have you heard the X-Statik's? How would you compare the bass response? On the center, do you notice any boxiness in the sound? Moving from an OB Center to an enclosed makes me nervous I'm going to be wanting that OB sound again ...
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 18 Jan 2019, 02:17 pm
Then go with the X-MTM Encore for the main speakers and the X-Voce for the center channel. The X-MTM Encore is the X-CS Encore in a ported floor standing cabinet.

The MTM Encore is an option, I haven't heard them but I've heard the CS Encore and it should just have more bass than the CS.
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: apstoltz on 18 Jan 2019, 09:41 pm
on your cabinet color I really like the salk work. I like the first pic with the silver gray over maple. I had a pair of his bookshelves that were a cherry burst with the darker edges and it looked killer. Jim does nice work.
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: Tyson on 18 Jan 2019, 10:18 pm
What about 5 of Danny's new Studio Monitor, it's semi-OB and uses the phenomenal Neo3 as the tweeter.  For immersion, you really can't do better than identical speakers, especially across the front. 
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 18 Jan 2019, 11:02 pm
on your cabinet color I really like the salk work. I like the first pic with the silver gray over maple. I had a pair of his bookshelves that were a cherry burst with the darker edges and it looked killer. Jim does nice work.

Yeah the "burst" ones look pretty cool I like the first one too, it was both me and Lisa's favorite :D
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 18 Jan 2019, 11:09 pm
What about 5 of Danny's new Studio Monitor, it's semi-OB and uses the phenomenal Neo3 as the tweeter.  For immersion, you really can't do better than identical speakers, especially across the front. 

I'm only doing the front (3), the surrounds are all in-ceiling Tannoy's I got from work. We use them a lot for installs and they work great for this application.

The center speaker wouldn't fit vertically below my TV and I think the OB going to the side would sound very off .... I'm sure they're gonna sound killer, but we'd really like to do towers for the fronts. My wife likes big speakers almost as much as I do!

So, back to the X-Statik's I have a question. My X-Voce has the drivers probably no more than 14-15" or so from the back wall and it works perfectly. It washes the TV with the backwave which bounces off the TV and gives a much more immersive sound than a traditional box. It's more like running a fantom center when sitting dead center where the sound comes more from the TV than the speakers.

Given that the X-Voce does excellently in this application and the X-Statik is essentially the same speaker just in a vertical array, why wouldn't the Statik's work for me?? I'm not questioning the knowledge of the smarter folks than me, just wanting to understand more :D
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: drewm on 18 Jan 2019, 11:47 pm
The x-statik will work for you, but won't truly shine in a 2ch setup until they are brought out from the wall, but if you aren't doing critical listening, it probably won't matter a lot. I waited around 2 years for some used x-statiks to show up locally, and luckily I managed to find 2 pairs, for about $500 a pair.

Getting Salk to custom design, cut and build the speaker I'm pretty sure will end up close to about $4k for a pair in which there are better options from GR at that price point.

Maybe some of the speakers from this page would give you what you need, especially the CST-1:
http://gr-research.com/completedspeakers.aspx

Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 19 Jan 2019, 12:10 am
The x-statik will work for you, but won't truly shine in a 2ch setup until they are brought out from the wall, but if you aren't doing critical listening, it probably won't matter a lot. I waited around 2 years for some used x-statiks to show up locally, and luckily I managed to find 2 pairs, for about $500 a pair.

Getting Salk to custom design, cut and build the speaker I'm pretty sure will end up close to about $4k for a pair in which there are better options from GR at that price point.

Maybe some of the speakers from this page would give you what you need, especially the CST-1:
http://gr-research.com/completedspeakers.aspx


See, I thought they would work they just won't be the mostest amazing where they'd be! Yes, I understand out in the room more helps, but if we go back to my original statement that most of the usage is TV/Movies and NOT 2-Channel I think I'd be ok which is why I was looking at these to begin with :D

I'm waiting for a response back from Jim on what it'd cost. I can't imagine it'd be $4k. He sells a full Song Tower for $2k and those are a transmission line speaker (if I remember right) so the cabinet is more complicated than a normal ported tower.

I agree, though, if they're $4k for just the cabinets then that is way too much, i'll just buy something else or slap together some cabinets myself or wait to find some X-Statik's that become available. Not worth that much to me.
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: HT cOz on 19 Jan 2019, 03:36 am
I think you should go for the X-Statiks if you are happy with the sound of your center then you likely will like the sound of the towers too.  End of the day if you are happy and enjoying your setup, MISSION Accomplished!   :thumb:  I'm not sure you can get them for that price, but keep us posted!
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 19 Jan 2019, 03:39 am
Cool, thanks! I thought they'd work well too given my experience with them in other rooms in the house and the center I have now then everyone said no they won't so it got me all questioning myself! Haha!

And I don't know what they'll come to be. If it's ridiculous then I'll probably just hold out for a used set and do the full crossover and other upgrades.
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: Danny Richie on 19 Jan 2019, 03:42 pm
In your application the X-Statik's will work just fine. Yes, they will be more ideal if you drag them a little further out into the room, but for home theater duty it won't be as much of an issue. What you have on the walls behind them is going to help make it work as well.
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: drewm on 19 Jan 2019, 06:24 pm
See, I thought they would work they just won't be the mostest amazing where they'd be! Yes, I understand out in the room more helps, but if we go back to my original statement that most of the usage is TV/Movies and NOT 2-Channel I think I'd be ok which is why I was looking at these to begin with :D

I'm waiting for a response back from Jim on what it'd cost. I can't imagine it'd be $4k. He sells a full Song Tower for $2k and those are a transmission line speaker (if I remember right) so the cabinet is more complicated than a normal ported tower.

I agree, though, if they're $4k for just the cabinets then that is way too much, i'll just buy something else or slap together some cabinets myself or wait to find some X-Statik's that become available. Not worth that much to me.

The days of programming a computer to create all the cuts needed to build all the parts of the x-statik, plus all of the mistake test cuts is only being spread over a single unit in your case. The Song Tower is having all that cost spread over thousands of units and would be much cheaper.

One off custom speakers are always significantly more expensive.
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: corndog71 on 19 Jan 2019, 08:02 pm
When I moved into a smaller apartment last year I had to give up my home theater.  Just not enough space.  I went to 2.1 with the Statiks and my sealed servo sub.  Calibrating my Marantz 1403 was always tricky due to the OB sound.  I found calibrating at least 5 or 6 mic positions really helped a lot and the sound I'm getting from this set up is ridiculously good!  The back side of the main baffles are 32" from the front wall.  The ATS Acoustic panels help a lot too.

(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7867/46078830684_5de3c89a2b_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2dcQ411) (https://flic.kr/p/2dcQ411) (https://www.flickr.com/photos/79446895@N00/)
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 19 Jan 2019, 10:30 pm
The days of programming a computer to create all the cuts needed to build all the parts of the x-statik, plus all of the mistake test cuts is only being spread over a single unit in your case. The Song Tower is having all that cost spread over thousands of units and would be much cheaper.

One off custom speakers are always significantly more expensive.

That's true, well we'll just see how much it ends up being.
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 19 Jan 2019, 10:32 pm
In your application the X-Statik's will work just fine. Yes, they will be more ideal if you drag them a little further out into the room, but for home theater duty it won't be as much of an issue. What you have on the walls behind them is going to help make it work as well.

Thanks Danny, I figured as such and thought the acoustic panels would help also. They're ATS Acoustics that I bought for our theater but don't have that up now so I put them in the living room and I think they work pretty good and look nice too!

Glad to know the designer thinks they'll work well!
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 19 Jan 2019, 10:33 pm
When I moved into a smaller apartment last year I had to give up my home theater.  Just not enough space.  I went to 2.1 with the Statiks and my sealed servo sub.  Calibrating my Marantz 1403 was always tricky due to the OB sound.  I found calibrating at least 5 or 6 mic positions really helped a lot and the sound I'm getting from this set up is ridiculously good!  The back side of the main baffles are 32" from the front wall.  The ATS Acoustic panels help a lot too.

(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7867/46078830684_5de3c89a2b_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2dcQ411) (https://flic.kr/p/2dcQ411) (https://www.flickr.com/photos/79446895@N00/)

Good to know about the calibration, that's helpful! I'm glad they work well for you too even though they aren't way out into the room :D
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: Jmitchell3 on 31 Aug 2019, 02:45 am
How did your search end up??
Title: Re: Custom X-Statik and X-Voce Speakers
Post by: skeeter99 on 31 Aug 2019, 02:55 am
How did your search end up??

I wanted Salk to build me cabinets and Jim wrote but then never responded to me and a set of Rocket RS450's and an RSC200 came available locally so I picked those up. Would've rather the X-Statics and X-Voce but I'm not a good woodworker and it didn't work out with local people to build them for me, unfortunately.

Scott