AudioCircle
Audio/Video Gear and Systems => Cheap and Cheerful HiFi => Topic started by: Elizabeth on 26 Jan 2020, 12:45 am
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Sad to say I had spent about $40,000 in 18 months on audio....
Then I lost a connection I spent a good part of the day on, and wandering the internet FOUND something else.
Something else.
So yeah I spent $1600 on the new thing.. in 10 weeks.. But compared to audio? a super bargain.
I am actually listening to the stereo all the time WITHOUT THINKING OF CHANGING ANYTHING!!!
So you want to solve your audio dilemma? Find something else to do with your spare 'thinking'.
:popcorn:
(I have to say I really cheated.. Since I DID spend a lot to get the system to were it is much better. But I needed a way to drop the chasing, and found it. Good Luck finding your out.
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Audio is a bottomless hole.
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Elizabeth
What is the new $1600 thing that has interfered with your passionate quest for the ultimate musical satisfaction?
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Audio is a bottomless hole.
Especially if you buy into the audiophile cable crap.
Martin
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And in the vinyl era after a few listenings I had to throw away the discs :duh:
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I found that accepting that no audio system- no matter how expensive- delivers a perfect representation of live music was a revelation, and that once you start paying more attention to the music, and less to the system, music listening becomes a lot more enjoyable. I have found little correlation between price and musical enjoyability in systems I have heard at shows. Megabuck systems seem to be more about conspicuous consumption than musical enjoyment in my experience. I also rediscovered a strategy for experiencing the sound of live music: Go to live music events. Works like a charm.
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Sad to say I had spent about $40,000 in 18 months on audio....
Then I lost a connection I spent a good part of the day on, and wandering the internet FOUND something else.
Something else.
So yeah I spent $1600 on the new thing.. in 10 weeks.. But compared to audio? a super bargain.
I am actually listening to the stereo all the time WITHOUT THINKING OF CHANGING ANYTHING!!!
So you want to solve your audio dilemma? Find something else to do with your spare 'thinking'.
:popcorn:
(I have to say I really cheated.. Since I DID spend a lot to get the system to were it is much better. But I needed a way to drop the chasing, and found it. Good Luck finding your out.
Best way to save money on...boats
Best way to save money on... gambling
Best way to save money on... sports cars
Best way to save money on..._________________
And on and on, so happy to hear you found what you needed but I feel really bad for people with those SUPER expensive/compulsive hobbies
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Hey!
$40K in 18 months on audio? Wow! That's more than I've spent on my audio stuffs in the past 20 years! :o Well, my system haven't much at all the past 10 years though and that's good thing. 8)
So, what's your new addiction that cost $1600 in 10 weeks? Well, that's too rich for my blood still :icon_lol:
Buddy
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The best way to stop spending money on audio is to take a sabbatical from AC. Stay away, Liz.
The addiction isn't in the audio purchases, it's in the false belief that someone else's gear sounds better than what you already have. The AC is much like facebook where people post about how super exciting their lives are, but it's actually just as mediocre as everyone else's.
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The best way to stop spending money on audio is to take a sabbatical from AC. Stay away, Liz.
The addiction isn't in the audio purchases, it's in the false belief that someone else's gear sounds better than what you already have. The AC is much like facebook where people post about how super exciting their lives are, but it's actually just as mediocre as everyone else's.
+1. But, before she goes can she tell us what she spent $40K in 18 months on? I’m with SET Man in his comments...”WOW!”
Best,
Anand.
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IRS want to know.
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That's an awful lot of Shakti Stones.
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I am actually listening to the stereo all the time WITHOUT THINKING OF CHANGING ANYTHING!!!
This is where I've been for the past year (doing this since the mid-seventies). How'd I do it, you ask? Quit drinking the Kool-Aid. :wine:
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I try to keep my audio spending to zero sum. I try to sell something before I buy something. I'm not a flipper per se, I like to try different gear that may suit my chase but if I can't sell it for very close to or what I paid for it, I won't buy it. Brand new gear isn't even a consideration.
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I have the TV on as I'm perusing AC and reading this thread, and a commercial comes on for Austin Martin. Their new car is on sale for only $1,799 a month on lease. Would I get more enjoyment from the Austin over my Honda, sure, I guess. Is it worth it? Not with the amount I drive these days. I actually got more enjoyment putting on new front brakes, something I haven't done in forty years. That's where I am in audio, I get more enjoyment restoring an old Pioneer turntable for my son than getting some shiny new audio toy.
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Sad to say I had spent about $40,000 in 18 months on audio....
Then I lost a connection I spent a good part of the day on, and wandering the internet FOUND something else.
Something else.
So yeah I spent $1600 on the new thing.. in 10 weeks.. But compared to audio? a super bargain.
I am actually listening to the stereo all the time WITHOUT THINKING OF CHANGING ANYTHING!!!
So you want to solve your audio dilemma? Find something else to do with your spare 'thinking'.
:popcorn:
(I have to say I really cheated.. Since I DID spend a lot to get the system to were it is much better. But I needed a way to drop the chasing, and found it. Good Luck finding your out.
The whole audio thing is a psychosis-- one example being a $40k system posted in the Cheap & Cheerful circle! (lol)
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Wow! Haven't spent $40k in the 40+ years at this even with my big splurge a year ago. Ways to save money on audio:
1.) Study audio fundamentals (knowledge will steer one away from constant flipping and chasing unproven claims).
2.) Focus on biggest bang for the buck concepts (like active speakers or having a decent/dedicated room).
3.) Ignore all the snake oil (boutique wires of all kinds, virtually every tweak, all the forms of eye candy).
4.) Go with a streaming service versus buying albums (will help discover new music and focus on music versus gear).
5.) Keep your system simple (better synergy, less wires, lower cost, less focus on gear).
6.) Find references (friends, reviewers, experts, manufacturers) you agree with and ignore the rest.
7.) Realize that 90% of the sound quality of a top of the line system can be had within the Cheap and Cheerful guidelines.
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I got back into audio so I'd stop spending money on wine.....
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I got back into audio so I'd stop spending money on wine.....
It’s an investment right until the moment you drink it!
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This is where I've been for the past year (doing this since the mid-seventies). How'd I do it, you ask? Quit drinking the Kool-Aid. :wine:
Think about it... To exist, the audio industry needs you to become dissatisfied with your system... regularly. (Or grow its audience, which it isn't doing).
While $40K sounds like a lot (and is, IMHO), at the last show I tallied the list prices for, the average system cost (excluding the now-obligatory boutique cabling) was >$58K. I don't know what that is, but I'm not sure it's a 'hobby'.
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Think about it... To exist, the audio industry needs you to become dissatisfied with your system... regularly. (Or grow its audience, which it isn't doing).
While $40K sounds like a lot (and is, IMHO), at the last show I tallied the list prices for, the average system cost (excluding the now-obligatory boutique cabling) was >$58K. I don't know what that is, but I'm not sure it's a 'hobby'.
Yes, absolutely. One could argue that much of audio has the same kind of planned obsolescence that the auto industry promoted in the 1950s, say. Constant new models with must-have features. But some of those features (DSD 256?) turn out to be tail fins.
I'm not sure of the automotive parallel to boutique cabling . . . maybe extra chrome trim or those vinyl roof coverings that were popular in the 1970 and 1980s.
There are real improvements in both areas (autos and audio), of course, though advertising does not often distinguish those from the fluff.
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Back in the day, when large numbers of people were building kits (Dynaco and Heath), there was less woo and more sense in high end audio.
IMO we really should get back to building kits again if we want a return of sanity. That's the only real way that consumers won't be vulnerable to the "Magic Black Box" syndrome, where the box does something wonderful and mysterious that's somehow worth $10k.
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JLM seems right:
1.) Study audio fundamentals (knowledge will steer one away from constant flipping and chasing unproven claims).
Study how SS and tubes amps works will show you its cost value when one see a innard photo.
On speakers dont even need study the subject just see Eminence price list to see how much cost a hi quality, 100dB tube friendly superb Neo woofer $220 each:
https://www.eminence.com/speakers/speaker-detail/?model=Kappalite_3015
There is no reason to a hi-end big enclosure speaker cost more than $5K pair.
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Confucius say:
"To achieve balance in life, one must cycle obsessions"
Audio today, CNC tomorrow and so on...
:icon_twisted:
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Confucius was smart cookie.
I haven't done much with new audio gear in quite a few years.
It's not that I wouldn't like to, it's just that any upgrades would cost quite a bit and other interests have taken precedence.
Right now it's men's dress hats (of all things) and then it'll warm up and be back to motorcycles.
If I move into a new place a pair of 20.7s will find their way in front of me but they simply won't work for this house.
I've been eyeing the Maggies For Condos write ups but they're talking even more expensive than the 20.7s so they won't work for my budget.
In the meantime, I shall be content with what I have until the bug bites and I spring for a pair of subs for the 3.7s...
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Confucius say:
"To achieve balance in life, one must cycle obsessions"
Audio today, CNC tomorrow and so on...
:icon_twisted:
f--- confucious - if it was up to him - we wouldnt do anything in this life - audio obsession is a positive
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The best way to stop spending money on audio is to take a sabbatical from AC. Stay away, Liz.
How true !! not just AC but audio forums in general have driven so many folks(myself included) to, IMO, put a far greater focus on their 'jewelry' than the actual music.
The addiction isn't in the audio purchases, it's in the false belief that someone else's gear sounds better than what you already have. The AC is much like facebook where people post about how super exciting their lives are, but it's actually just as mediocre as everyone else's.
again, true !
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The whole audio thing is a psychosis-- one example being a $40k system posted in the Cheap & Cheerful circle! (lol)
Hey!
Yeah, that's a ton of Cheap & Cheerful audio stuffs! :lol:
Buddy
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Ways to save money on audio:
1.) Study audio fundamentals etc.... you can read it all above
Excellent advise, well thought out. I would amend 3) with "expensive". Free or nearly free tweeks are fun, some actually work. And there are a multitude of cable manufacturers selling direct for very reasonable prices. If you don't hear a difference you have some well made cables for not a lot of cash. I agree with you once you get to expensive. I suppose if one is a multi-millionaire and has an TOTL system expensive cables might make sense, we have a few of those folks here on AC. For the rest of us not so much.
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My ony comment is to mention I could not find a place to put my post at all. I settled on Cheap and cheerful as the 'least problematic'
Anyone who can think of a better location? move it. (Galactic waste bin is good too :thumb:)
The idea was it is cheap(er) to do something else instead of endlesll ponder what to do on the stereo...
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The Wall Street Journal today reports that the entry level to a comfortable retirement lifestyle starts at $3M investible assets to generate a 6 figure sustainable investment income.
I suppose if one is a multi-millionaire and has an TOTL system expensive cables might make sense, we have a few of those folks here on AC.
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I think we're fine with the topic here, it's about NOT spending a zillion bucks on audio, which is close enough to the point of this circle.
Tone Depth, exactly what I was saying. If you have millions of dollars in investments and draw six figures in yearly income from that, you're a tiny, tiny percentage of America. That demographic is often attracted to expensive hobbies.
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The addiction isn't in the audio purchases, it's in the false belief that someone else's gear sounds better than what you already have
A corollary is the disparaging term 'mid-fi', which often seems to apply to equipment less expensive than one's own. One of the reasons I am still interested in audio in middle age is that, when I was a teenager, there were good but affordable systems available. I had a Dynaco system, bought with money I earned, when I was 15. When I was college age, all my friends had systems. I know a lot of people in that age bracket, and none of them have systems. The young person who's not buying the affordable equipment of today (it's not easy to find, but it's out there) is the person who won't be buying the higher-end stuff when they are further along in life. I'm straying from the original theme here, but my point re the original post is that the way to spend less on audio is to let go of the fantasy that some tube, or amp, or cable, or speaker etc can make the heavens part and provide audio reality, only problem being that that moment is forever one 'upgrade' away.
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f--- confucious - if it was up to him - we wouldnt do anything in this life - audio obsession is a positive
Well said! :D
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IMO, the main issue is the thrill of new purchases, waiting on the box to show up, the act of unboxing the new product, etc... If you don't believe me look up how popular "unboxing videos" are and google shopping addiction.
I think the goal should be very simple... moderation, a middle road where you're not spending to satisfy a thrill yet not abstaining from exploring your passions because of a feeling of not having enough or being stingy. People are stingy with themselves very often and being guilty about allowing yourself good food, clothing, etc if you can afford them is the opposite end of spending impulsively for no good reason, to satisfy a thrill, or to the extent you can't afford to pay the bills.
So this is a behavioral issue and will simply be transferred to whatever new thing or hobby that catches your attention. All hobbies and interests can be expensive, audio is super-cheap compared to racing anything with a motor, or anything that floats! Even if you wanna run, those shoes, sunglasses, heart-rate monitors, etc. are going to add up!
If I never allowed myself to spend money on audio over the years I certainly wouldn't have an audio business... Think of a young child that is expected to follow their passions so they can decide what they want to do with their life... parents will always spend time and money on their children's passions and it's considered not only reasonable, but letting the child down if you don't. At what point does that change? At what point is this unacceptable and you should just work and save for retirement? IMO you need to give yourself the opportunity to do what you want, and this WILL involve spending money. If you're passionate about audio why not explore it as you see fit, like anything it can be approached in either healthy or unhealthy ways. There's lots of opportunity to engage with high quality audio at ANY budget these days. This isn't the case with some things like racing cars or boats... if you want to do that you need to figure out how to make A LOT of money first. Don't let the existence of more expensive things detract from your enjoyment of what you have, there's ALWAYS more expensive stuff and at a certain point it becomes too much... your enjoyment of audio is not necessarily directly related to how much you spend on it!
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So you want to solve your audio dilemma? Find something else to do with your spare 'thinking'.
Yes! To an extent. I had a kid and went to law school at the same time. That pretty much took care of it, except... I STILL check AC multiple times a day!!!
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The young person who's not buying the affordable equipment of today (it's not easy to find, but it's out there) is the person who won't be buying the higher-end stuff when they are further along in life.
Audiophiles are typically older. I'll bet if we took a poll on age and income, most AC members would be 40-plus and earn slightly more than median wages. It would also be interesting to see how many of us have other expensive hobbies and the amount we spend on them.
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Audiophiles are typically older.
+1 To be audiophile requires equipment knowledge and a vast musical repertoire to justify the price.
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Yes, they/we are. But it doesn't have to be so. There are young people interested in audio. I know them, and I have gotten them to come to shows... usually once, because they see the prices and never come back- to the shows, and, in many cases, to audio itself. The shows aren't interested in attracting them and there is no retail infrastructure to be exposed to audio anymore (I don't consider speakers sitting on a shelf at Best Buy as a serious attempt to attract younger consumers. Like I said, almost everyone I knew in my teens and twenties had a system... not 'high end', but respectable. When the entry level fell out of the market, the younger demographic dropped out with it. The idea of spending $40K on audio equipment is mystifying to them. So even when they reach a point in life where they have that kind of scratch, they spend it elsewhere.
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I live next to a park with a major overlook, and on weekends there is an endless stream of cars booming their way up the mountain to the overlook parking area. This is not a wealthy town. And these booming vehicles are not owned by 40+ geezers. These “audio” investments by youth on their cars are not validated by the AC crowd, but they are most certainly “systems”, and they are prolific. Conspicuous consumption, even on audio, knows no age threshold. It’s all about culture and what is celebrated and what people find they take pride in.
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Car audio does have the advantage of making it easier to show off how loud your 'system' is and how much low frequency noise it can pump out. The SQ is horrible, but SQ isn't really the point.
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Yeah, but my point is that many youth are engaged in audio and investing in it. Just not the same values or conspicuous consumption or political economy of industry as those of us here.
And btw, I’m under-40 and have been at this hobby for around 20 yrs. An outlier in my generation who surely does not relate to the boomers driving by.
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Young people have a tremendously different association with music than we did at their age. First, their idea of an audiophile device is the latest cell phone. Second, they have a lot more debt, especially student loans, so spending thousands on audio gear takes a back seat. Third, we were exposed to audio systems; nearly every household in the 70's had a turntable, for example.
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First, their idea of an audiophile device is the latest cell phone.
Are you sure this? I think they are not this dumb.
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Since I have retired, ss sucks in pay. I am going metal detecting this summer so maybe I can hit it rich somehow. Then I will buy more audio.
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An interesting tidbit about youth and audio...
There’s a local vintage stereo shop that does repairs and sales. The guy’s been around over 40 years. He sells some vinyl too. We somehow got talking about the 20 somethings buying vinyl. I jokingly said “what are they listening to it through? Those retro-looking Crosley all in ones that sound awful and probably carve up the vinyl after listening to it twice?” He said he does a lot of business with that demographic. He sells them vintage receivers, speakers, and turntables.
IMO the overwhelming majority of home “stereo” sales today and more so down the road is and will be the wireless speaker stuff. Stuff like Sonos and Bluesound. Place a relatively small speaker in a room that’ll fill the room with background music without needing anything more than a single outlet and a smartphone to control. And voice integrated, like Alexa or Siri. Hell, IKEA released a lamp with a speaker in it co-designed with Sonos. IMO it’s genius. Sure it won’t sound nearly as good as a traditional stereo system, but stuff like that easily sounds more than “good enough” for the vast majority, and won’t break the bank.
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Now-a-days it's all about convenience. Convenience is measured in terms of portability, size, instant gratification, and up front cost. Convenience wins over quality and long term value. Just look at how "dumbed down" keyboards have gotten as an example. Back in the day the IBM Selectric typewriter had the best keyboard ever developed, now we treasure a MacBook keyboard but often settle for touching on a smartphone while on the go. That's the market forces audio is up against. The ideal compromise might be a "nice" sound bar connected to a remote controlled streaming TV.
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Now-a-days it's all about convenience. Convenience is measured in terms of portability, size, instant gratification, and up front cost. Convenience wins over quality and long term value. Just look at how "dumbed down" keyboards have gotten as an example. Back in the day the IBM Selectric typewriter had the best keyboard ever developed, now we treasure a MacBook keyboard but often settle for touching on a smartphone while on the go. That's the market forces audio is up against. The ideal compromise might be a "nice" sound bar connected to a remote controlled streaming TV.
Watch out, I'll start my MORE audio gear that is convenient. For me the two things I did for mega convenience and great SQ was to setup the DTS playfi ecosystem around the house and run the whole thing from a tablet. I got all the devices for roughly 60% to 90% discounts too.
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That's an awful lot of Shakti Stones.
Maybe she built a separate listening room with them and some audiophile mortar
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a commercial comes on for Austin Martin. Their new car is on sale for only $1,799 a month on lease. Would I get more enjoyment from the Austin over my Honda, sure, I guess.
007 Limited Shag edition?
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Hobbyists build their gear. Others buy gear. Golf as well as cooking take a lot of my time away from audio. Sitting that long in front of anything is a downer for me. Sitting IMHO is the new smoking. Not good for ya.
Saying that though for me nothing like a stereo system that brings me relaxation, joy and stress relief. Humming or singing along stimulates Vagus nerve a good thing. Check it out.
charles
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I have other hobbies tbat keep me busy. Some can be expensive, some not so much.
I love fishing and camping and have had a camp site for several years.
Hoping on the bike and going for a cruise through the hack roads of Upstate NY.
My younger years were spent building classic muscle cars. Now im more i to luxury so this spring I will be doing some upgrades on my Jaguar which is just as much fun cruising the back roads.
I am also an aquarium enthusiast and have a few aquariums set up.
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Sitting that long in front of anything is a downer for me. Sitting IMHO is the new smoking. Not good for ya.
charles
100% agree. Listening (sitting with little movement) is one of the worst things we can do to our bodies. Home audio falls directly into this category. Heck, as least vinyl you have to get off your rump and flip the record every 20 min.
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But sitting and listening to music at night with the lights off is very relaxing and a good release. In today's world, it seems less people take the time out of their busy lives to relax and unwind
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That is so true. People are way too stressed and they don't know how to relax anymore. It's almost like the masses are addicted to stress and stimulation. It's no wonder heart disease is the number one killer in America. People need to chill. That's what this hobby is all about.
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That is so true. People are way too stressed and they don't know how to relax anymore. It's almost like the masses are addicted to stress and stimulation. It's no wonder heart disease is the number one killer in America. People need to chill. That's what this hobby is all about.
Exactly, listening to music can be a form of meditation.
Sitting is not bad. Sitting for too long is bad. Just like drinking water is not bad, but drinking too much water can actually kill you. Life is all about moderation and balance, not black and white.
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Exactly, listening to music can be a form of meditation.
Sitting is not bad. Sitting for too long is bad. Just like drinking water is not bad, but drinking too much water can actually kill you. Life is all about moderation and balance, not black and white.
Yes Dave. Healing as well. Lots of research being conducted with music therapy, resonance and light stimulating the Vagus nerve and other body systems. All you need to do is Hum between 80HZ and 220HZ. Give it a try for 30 seconds.
charles
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Yes Dave. Healing as well. Lots of research being conducted with music therapy, resonance and light stimulating the Vagus nerve and other body systems. All you need to do is Hum between 80HZ and 220HZ. Give it a try for 30 seconds.
charles
Interesting, maybe it has to do with why all cultures have some sort of chanting associated with their spiritual traditions. Tibetan Buddhism has a style that contain an almost continuous low frequency "rumble"...
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This seems logical why cats purr.
(https://www.catster.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/Leonard-Nimoy-Spock-Cat-HERO.jpg)
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Car audio does have the advantage of making it easier to show off how loud your 'system' is and how much low frequency noise it can pump out. The SQ is horrible, but SQ isn't really the point.
Modern day car audio does not have personality.
There were high current/low impedance "cheater" amplifiers, full-range speaker boxes, tri-mode setups, under dash horns, and demo vehicles seamed more special.
Nowadays, it's all about decibels. Every smuck has super-douper woofers and zillion watt amplifiers.
I object to car audio being called lacking SQ. They can sound good.
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007 Limited Shag edition?
No, that model was almost quaint compared to Austin's modern examples. They did eliminate the ejection seat though, too many blondes asking what's that button for while pushing it.
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No, that model was almost quaint compared to Austin's modern examples. They did eliminate the ejection seat though, too many blondes asking what's that button for while pushing it.
You realize he’s making Austin Powers references, right? You’re calling the car an “Austin Martin” instead of an Aston Martin.
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Back in the day when I was younger the car system was a must. All Nakamichi amps, crossover Polk and Infinity speakers built in. Cassettes were the thing back then. 1983 was the year. Since the systems that comes in the new cars today are so good no need for me any longer. Then I heard Berning makes or made tubed car audio amps. Hey Lawrence Welk had a TT in his car.
charles
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(https://i.pinimg.com/236x/8d/cd/9e/8dcd9e46db0c9cf3c0d0a811cbc0a06b--vinyl-record-player-cd-player.jpg)
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Back in the day when I was younger the car system was a must. All Nakamichi amps, crossover Polk and Infinity speakers built in. Cassettes were the thing back then. 1983 was the year. Since the systems that comes in the new cars today are so good no need for me any longer. Then I heard Berning makes or made tubed car audio amps. Hey Lawrence Welk had a TT in his car.
charles
I have a friend with a tube setup in his car. Out of this world. Poor guy has to spend a part of his day listening to it.
Alan
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Back in the day when I was younger the car system was a must. All Nakamichi amps, crossover Polk and Infinity speakers built in. Cassettes were the thing back then. 1983 was the year. Since the systems that comes in the new cars today are so good no need for me any longer. Then I heard Berning makes or made tubed car audio amps. Hey Lawrence Welk had a TT in his car.
charles
The car manufacturers have smartened up somewhat with their factory systems. It’s getting a lot more difficult to use an aftermarket head unit because they’re tying more and more controls to the stereo system. Stuff like climate control, back up cameras and so on are controlled by the “head unit.”
I just bought a 2007 Volvo S40. I really, really wanted Apple Car Play. Can’t do it. Actually, I could, but it would be a nightmare. And I’d lose several programmable options.
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I've left the scene for a while as well....Too much.....much.
I've other hobbies that keep me busy.....Arabian horses are a
family passion and we have a small boarding stable that keeps us hopping.
$1600.....If you were Canadian I'd guess Cannabis cultivation.... :wink:
Keeps me busy these days..... :thumb:
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Many hobbies / interest are even more expensive than audio!
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$1600.....If you were Canadian I'd guess Cannabis cultivation.... :wink:
Keeps me busy these days..... :thumb:
Kept me busy last summer, quite surprised with the result of my novice effort. Quite the system tweak. :D
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You realize he’s making Austin Powers references, right? You’re calling the car an “Austin Martin” instead of an Aston Martin.
No, my misspelling went right over my head, duh. I should be so lucky if that were my only faux pas. And I've never watched an Austin Powers movie in my life. I've tried to a couple of times and can't get through more than a couple of minutes before diving for the remote to end the agony.
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I've left the scene for a while as well....Too much.....much.
I've other hobbies that keep me busy.....Arabian horses are a
family passion and we have a small boarding stable that keeps us hopping.
So you currently a neigh sayer to audio?
Couldn't resist. Im losing my filters and I'm running for the door now....
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Take up Pickleball, then you can spend your money on an orthopedist to fix your knees. :lol:
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I love vintage sticker albums :thumb:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXha8XGb0RU
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New hobbies rob money from my record buying.
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I think an audiophile to a car is more like a exotic or sport car enthusiast. Even used $4000 Honda get juiced up with shocks/springs (also lowering) wheels engine bits exhaust.. Like a college student might buy a used but good old kit and work on it/ I had to chuckle at the landau roof notion.
My car is a hot hatch six speed manual transmission. 250+hp 153mph top speed .. 235/40/18 wheels and Z rated HD tires for 186mph (the HD rating tires are to withstand the cornering loads... A separate set for Winter duty also Z rated snowflake symbol Autobahn type means I can take right angle freeway curves at 90mph .. City corners at 35mph ... easy, even when it is 20F outside.. (as long as the road is dry... yup.. just to mention this is not the tire screeching car sliding tilted notion. This is flat even body,no tilt, just tracking the corner, no fuss. no noise.. like any modern high performance suspension can do)
The base car just like mine cost $13,000 new. Mine cost $33000. I guess it has a few bits added. The top of the line was $44,000. Same body.. just to mention. (Focus RS) This is more like what being an audiophile is.. Wanting the best performance one can afford.
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BobM
0-0-2
:thumb:
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New hobbies rob money from my record buying.
Not if you treasure hunt. :thumb:
A friend of mine found a KGC treasure that is probably worth millions, but when he started to dig, someone shot a gun in the air. These KGC treasures were buried during the Civil War.
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Fuck trying to find treasure LP's. That shit never happens. You'll spend your whole life trying to find something, it's pointless. If you want to see lots of records open a record store and start buying collections you might find something special. There is no other way to find truly good and rare stuff than to have people seek you out. If you stop at a thrift store or something and find an ok LP that's cool. If you try to see them all so you never miss a "treasure" you'll have 2nd & 3rd job and probably get nothing.
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You'll spend your whole life trying to find something, it's pointless.
Well// if you actually DID spend your whole life chasing records.. then back in the mid 1990's to at least 2007 or so you had a great time!!!
Record collections were being sold off and the used market was full of great used LPs at dirt cheap prices, in great condition too.
I bought THOUSANDS for ten cents, twenty cents each from Half Price Books. Over 2000 of the BEST Jazz from a local dealer at rock bottom prices and in VG+ condition.
So timing has a LOT to do with it.
Trying to buy now? I laugh...
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There came a time when I realized constantly throwing money at this hobby resulted in "sideways" moves more often than not. Looked around and realized there were a lot of areas in my house and yard that could be updated and improved. This might be defined as an investment that could even yield a return. Within the last few years I've added a covered patio, new kitchen appliances and had the house painted. If I'd have spent that money on audio, I doubt if I'd be any more satisfied with my system than I am now.
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Well// if you actually DID spend your whole life chasing records.. then back in the mid 1990's to at least 2007 or so you had a great time!!!
Record collections were being sold off and the used market was full of great used LPs at dirt cheap prices, in great condition too.
I bought THOUSANDS for ten cents, twenty cents each from Half Price Books. Over 2000 of the BEST Jazz from a local dealer at rock bottom prices and in VG+ condition.
So timing has a LOT to do with it.
Trying to buy now? I laugh...
I'm too young. I didn't make a mistake, I never had the opportunity.
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I was also young, but did have the opportunity. But not the taste at the time. Damned lack of perspective in youth, and lack of system ready for it. But, well, hurrah for Tidal/Qobuz! I'm spending the least on music in my life, and have access to way way more music. I never would have bought enough classical albums (in either vinyl or CD) to gain an appreciation for it, but because of the ready access to SO MUCH classical (and jazz, and blues, and whatever you want to explore), I am developing new tastes for genres of music I had never appreciated before. Again, the album-purchasing model would never have yielded this result. The ready-access subscription streaming model does.
Maybe we should create an audiophile estate planning sub-circle in the markets section - to help younger audiophiles connect with older ones who are trying to think through what to do with their amazing collections in their wills/estates, and who don't want to go through the trauma of trying to sell via Ebay, Craigslist, whatever.
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I'm not sure the vinyl fad will last past the boomers dying off, we'll see. And when they do we'll start seeing more record collections being auctioned off, I think opportunity will be there for those who value it... personally, no thanks! Vinyl can be good but a good tt setup costs far too much. I'd rather have a good high-rez vinyl rip than my own mediocre tt, unless I start making more $ a good tt is simply not an option.
Digital is always getting better and better, and hi-rez streaming is much less expensive.
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"Best way to save moeny on audio is to..." Don't really agree with the basic premise, but I'm all for saving money.
Used gear and kits have been my pathways to reducing cost. I had perhaps 300-400 vinyl before 2005. Over the next 10 years that expanded to around 3000 due to a local record store not valuing jazz and classical. Most of that collection was at two bucks a pop.
Used amps, turntables, phono pre's, cables, even cartridges. Speakers were kits, albeit big ones. Most my stuff was bought at about 1/3 new price.
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I would love to be on inheritance lists. In fact I thought about giving discounts on high end gear for contractual obligations to inherit vinyl collections. The problem would be I’d have to know when they die otherwise if they have any relatives I’d lose out unless they avoided inheritance all together because it was a waste of time for them.
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yeah, I was thinking mainly about having a good central place where audiophiles congregate where wills could direct families to market collections (or gear for that matter) after the passing of a loved one. They may know their loved one was part of a community of crazy audio geeks who would value their collection and/or equipment, but not have a clear idea how to connect and best market to that community efficiently. The right kind of online space would enable collectors to place suggestions for doing so in their wills.
And those who wanted to be more proactive could certainly attempt to develop relationships (and even contracts) ahead of time if it made sense to everyone involved.
And it could involve the turntables too, Dave!
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Just go to estate sales and sooner or later you’ll hit the jackpot.
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Well to be honest I’m more on Dave’s side of the issue for my own interests. But yeah, I guess you’re right. Not worth thinking about how to preserve the value of lives spent curating truly quality collections of music. Better to just take a random walk in the hinterlands of estate sales, metal detectors in hand, fingers crossed we’ll find treasure, with no knowledge of where it came from nor how we came to find it.
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If you learn to be happy with what you have and not worry about what anyone else have, then you will not go wrong.
Too many people are not satisfied and think that new stuff will fix the issue, no it will not. The new purchase is short lived.
These people have other issues which they need to address.
Since i always do my research properly, as in i listen to kit and take them home and use it in my room / with my setup. Hence i don’t make mistakes that often. I always buy new and i keep everything for a long time and i am always satisfied with what i have. Hence i have no desire for the constant upgrades.
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If you learn to be happy with what you have and not worry about what anyone else have, then you will not go wrong.
Too many people are not satisfied and think that new stuff will fix the issue, no it will not. The new purchase is short lived.
These people have other issues which they need to address.
Since i always do my research properly, as in i listen to kit and take them home and use it in my room / with my setup. Hence i don’t make mistakes that often. I always buy new and i keep everything for a long time and i am always satisfied with what i have. Hence i have no desire for the constant upgrades.
+1 :thumb:
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Too many people are not satisfied and think that new stuff will fix the issue, no it will not. The new purchase is short lived.
Not if it’s a big leap forward. Lateral moves achieve nothing and incremental baby steps are just that. But if you really kick things up a few notches, you’ll hear all your music again for the first time. :thumb:
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Not if it’s a big leap forward. Lateral moves achieve nothing and incremental baby steps are just that. But if you really kick things up a few notches, you’ll hear all your music again for the first time. :thumb:
Yes that is true, but i am talking about people changing kit every 5 minutes or changing because the latest stuff is out.
When i make a change, i make a big one and only after having a good listen to what ever in my system. Also it must be significantly better than what it is replacing.
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Yes that is true, but i am talking about people changing kit every 5 minutes or changing because the latest stuff is out.
When i make a change, i make a big one and only after having a good listen to what ever in my system. Also it must be significantly better than what it is replacing.
Those types sound like impulsive fools not hobbyists. Exactly. A new anything must be heard in ones system before purchase. A total MBG is a must for me.
charles
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My story about old record collector farts dying.....
..
....
SO a coworker tells me about this really great Classical record collection of a deceased musician, and gives me a phone number.
Turns out a fellow musician had the record collection, and was wanting to sell it for the deceased.
Yes they are all really wonderful and in perfect condition....
I arrange a time and get the address.....
...
..
So I get there, the woman shows me the stacks of records in cardboard boxes.
(Clearly they have been perused many many times by others, since they are no longer in any order.. the boxes half full... I see plenty of fodder labels and zero valuable records. A sure sign this is not worth anything.. And yup, I pull one out of the jacket, cat hair, food, fingerprints, greasy ones.. scratches yes more that a fair share of scratches...
She asks me if I will take them for $500?
I stifled a hearty laugh.
I just said sorry not interested.
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Yes that is true, but i am talking about people changing kit every 5 minutes or changing because the latest stuff is out.
When i make a change, i make a big one and only after having a good listen to what ever in my system. Also it must be significantly better than what it is replacing.
The approach that saves money in the long term is to learn as much as you can about audio and audio equipment, and electronics. I would suggest gaining some skills with a DIY kit.
You may be able to grasp then how components, directly in some cases, relate to what you hear, and gain insight into every facet, rather than just otherwise enjoying aimless buying of equipment.
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My system is built for me, and I'm generally pretty happy with it and don't churn equipment. Having other financial priorities really helps with keeping the churn to a minimum. I found joining a local audiophile group, and attending meetings at the homes of others, to listen to their systems, usually left me very happy with my own upon my return home. If someone's system did turn me on, I still wasn't generally disappointed when going back into my room.
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My system is built for me, and I'm generally pretty happy with it and don't churn equipment. Having other financial priorities really helps with keeping the churn to a minimum. I found joining a local audiophile group, and attending meetings at the homes of others, to listen to their systems, usually left me very happy with my own upon my return home. If someone's system did turn me on, I still wasn't generally disappointed when going back into my room.
+1
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+2
Barry absolutely correct! It gets pretty stupid and quick.
Buy wisely always. Buy the "flippers" changouts, never pay retail!
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My system is built for me, and I'm generally pretty happy with it and don't churn equipment. Having other financial priorities really helps with keeping the churn to a minimum. I found joining a local audiophile group, and attending meetings at the homes of others, to listen to their systems, usually left me very happy with my own upon my return home. If someone's system did turn me on, I still wasn't generally disappointed when going back into my room.
Plus 3,4, and 5 - im taking 3 spots for this one