AudioCircle
Audio/Video Gear and Systems => Tube-o-phile Circle => Topic started by: zybar on 27 Mar 2009, 12:24 am
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I have been using them with great effect on the rectifier and signal tubes of my Modwright Transporter (others are also quite happy with this combination) and I finally put the Ultrasonic 30's on all 10 6SN7 signal tubes (5 in each amp) on my Atma-Sphere MA-1's mono blocks.
Adding the Ultrasonic 30's was equivalent to properly calibrating a good monitor or projector - everything across the board improved and so far I can't hear any negative impacts (like I could in previous versions which used different materials).
If it makes sense, the notes last longer, yet are faster and have more texture. The perceived volume also increased since there is a noticeable amount of new detail and clarity.
Listening to the opening guitar and piano on "Sunken Treasure" by Wilco really highlights the improvements brought about by the Ultrasonic 30's. This song starts off with just an acoustic guitar and adds a piano. Both instruments really sing and have a tremendous amount of texture and nuance to them. When Jeff starts singing, his voice has a little more body and weight to it, without sounding artificial or exaggerated. When the drums are added into the mix, they are tightly focused in the soundstage and incredibly detailed.
For a rather modest investment ($14.25 per damping instrument for 6SN7 tubes), this is a seriously good improvement.
Steve ("Herbie") offers a 90 day money back guarantee, so there really is nothing to lose.
George
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Here, here on Herbies, George.
Lotsa' good stuff in his catalog (his turntable mat is the best I have used...but have by no means used all of them out there)
Steve Herbelin is a nice fella', too...just schedule a full half hour to talk to him as he ca really gab :)
John
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While I agree on their virtues I have had equally good luck with high temp silicone o-rings....50 cents.
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I also use Herbie's Ultrasonic 30's on the 6SL7 input and 6SN7 driver tubes in my Manley monoblocks. For about $60 for a set of 4 they were certainly a very worthwhile tweak and I agree 100% with Zybar's comments. :thumb:
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Thanks Guys:
I just placed an order for 5 UltraSonic 25's and one UltraSonic 70. Also thanks to Ted_B for the recommendation of the UltraSonic 70 with hard pads for the EML 5U4G used in my ModWright Transporter.
Ken
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Thanks Guys:
I just placed an order for 5 UltraSonic 25's and one UltraSonic 70. Also thanks to Ted_B for the recommendation of the UltraSonic 70 with hard pads for the EML 5U4G used in my ModWright Transporter.
Ken
Ken,
None for the 6SN7's in the Modwright TP?
You definitely want to try that.
George
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George,
Good to hear they are working out. I have been using them for about 4 years now on my Pre Amp and in My Amp. :thumb:
Now if you really want to spend some time,you can tailor the sound even more by placement on the rectifier which will be easy but also on your tubes. It is very sensitive on small signal tubes and rectifiers not sure about the big tubes that you have as I have not experimented.
Have fun :duh: 8)
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Yes they are!!!
I have them all through my system.
Dac 6922's
Pre 5687's
Amp 300b's, 5AR4, and 6SN7's
They did wonders for the harmonic feedback that I was getting.
Highly recommended,
Rodge
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Ken, thanks for the kudos. I didn't care for the Teflon versions earlier, but the titanium ultrasonic ones are tremendous. They are neutral and great for everything George mentioned. Size 70 for the EML and 30's for the 6SN7's are mandatory for the Modwright Transporter.
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Thanks Guys:
I just placed an order for 5 UltraSonic 25's and one UltraSonic 70. Also thanks to Ted_B for the recommendation of the UltraSonic 70 with hard pads for the EML 5U4G used in my ModWright Transporter.
Ken
After placing this post last night Ted and George let me know that I need the UltraSonic 30's for the 6SN7 tubes I use in the Transporter. Thus, I contacted Herbie and changed my order to the 30's. Thanks again guys and I look forward to receiving them.
Ken
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Alright, enough procrastinating my me :wink:, I guess I need to order some
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Another thumbs up for the titanium dampers. I've been using them for over a year on various pieces of gear and they have never failed to produce positive, audible results.
Steve is also a great guy to deal with and truly stands behind his guarantee. You just can't lose.
I'm also a big fan of the big black dots, baby booties and tenderfeet.
-- Jim
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I use em through the whole system. They are great!
Most cost effective tube dampeners next to Silicone O rings for small tubes.
Can't fit Herbies on My Raysonic 128.
D
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I have a tube rectified Modright 9.0 SE Signature preamp, I should just use the dampers on the two 5687 input tubes right?
cheers, ed
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I've had great results using Herbies on 6SN7's.
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Has anyone compared HTDI's dampers to plain vanilla silicon O-ring dampers? (I've never tried either, but read some diy'ers that use the silicon o-rings).
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Josh,
I did that a bit over a month ago when I had the AN P1SE amp in for demo, and the Herbie's did a better job, especially on the driver tubes -- better, cleaner highs. There was a tendancy for the silicone rings to change the tonality a bit, and that can work for or against you. With the 4 TAD el84s it added just a bit of wrmth that the f120as liked. I suppose technically the herbie's were again a bit more focused, but to my ears the f120as needed a bit of that something that the silicone ones provided. On the other hand, the herbies on the pair of 12ax7s was clearly better.
-- Jim
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Has anyone compared HTDI's dampers to plain vanilla silicon O-ring dampers? (I've never tried either, but read some diy'ers that use the silicon o-rings).
I haven't tried Herbie's dampers to silicone O-rings....but have made mortite rope caulk top hats (dime sized hats on top of tubes and allowing the nipples to pike thru)
Frankly, they had much the same effect (and a box of mortite costs $5 and will treat about 15,000 tubes!)
That doesn't 'dampen' (pun totally intended) my enthusiasm for Herbies stuff...they work great, too.
John
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Since I posted this I figured I'd taste my own 'medicine' when I realized that since a changeover to new tubes a few months ago, I didn't have Mortite or Dennis rope caulk top hats (yarmulke's?) on the current tubes. I only have the Herbie's dampers for small signal tubes, I have not bought the larger ones for my rectifier, voltage regs and output tubes.
So, I carefully applied the mortite hats to the larger tubes in my mono amps.
POW! ZOWEY! KABOOM!...what a startling :o difference it is. My amps did not sound bad before, but they take on all new focus and tautness (in the bass, particularly). I probably used about US$0.20 worth of Mortite to do this :wink:
I have no idea if the Herbie's could improve upon this result (maybe they can and maybe I couldn't even decipher it on my system), but the betterment is clearly noticeable in and of itself, it took only 15 minutes and cost US$0.20.
Life and today cannot get any sweeter...except if my Villanova Wildcats win the game in a few hours.
Sorry guys - I had to gush about it :oops:
John
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John,
Why don't you try the Mortite on your signal tubes? You would than have a Herbies/Mortite shootout. 8)
-Roy
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John,
Why don't you try the Mortite on your signal tubes? You would than have a Herbies/Mortite shootout. 8)
-Roy
I did a long time ago (3+ years) RajaRoy....the two together didn't provide any accretive benefit and each one had about the same affect. But, I bought the Herbie's already so I use them on the small signal tubes instead of the Mortite/Dennis rope caulk.
John
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Congrats on your Cats :thumb: A true Big East battle
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That was a great game! :thumb: Take no prisoners, sacrifice your body and leave it all on the court.
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Oh Goody! Gonna get me some right away.
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Thanks Guys:
I just placed an order for 5 UltraSonic 25's and one UltraSonic 70. Also thanks to Ted_B for the recommendation of the UltraSonic 70 with hard pads for the EML 5U4G used in my ModWright Transporter.
Ken
After placing this post last night Ted and George let me know that I need the UltraSonic 30's for the 6SN7 tubes I use in the Transporter. Thus, I contacted Herbie and changed my order to the 30's. Thanks again guys and I look forward to receiving them.
Ken
Ken,
Did you receive your order?
Any thoughts or comments?
George
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Yes, the Herbies are great. I've been using them for several years.
I would suggest experimenting with each tube in one's system. I started with the shotgun approach and put the dampers on every tube in my system. Later I found out that some tubes seem to sound better without them. So I suggest experimenting. I've found that some tubes even like two dampers on them.
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placed my order yesterday for all three MW-Transporter tubes, if they work out I will eventually order another three for the tubes in my LS-36.5. Have any of you tried damping the tubes in a 36.5?
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Thanks Guys:
I just placed an order for 5 UltraSonic 25's and one UltraSonic 70. Also thanks to Ted_B for the recommendation of the UltraSonic 70 with hard pads for the EML 5U4G used in my ModWright Transporter.
Ken
After placing this post last night Ted and George let me know that I need the UltraSonic 30's for the 6SN7 tubes I use in the Transporter. Thus, I contacted Herbie and changed my order to the 30's. Thanks again guys and I look forward to receiving them.
Ken
Ken,
Did you receive your order?
Any thoughts or comments?
George
George:
Yes, they arrived on Monday and I immediately installed them. I listened to the system for approximately 4 hours and had to leave home for business travel. Honestly, I was surprised as there was a definite change in the sound. There was more detail and a more distinct quality to the sound. For roughly $60.00 it is a no brainer investment and I talked Philistine into ordering them for his Transporter.
Thanks again for publishing your comments about the Herbies and for Ted and you providing the correct sizing information.
Ken
PS. I would also like to add that Steve (Herbie) is a great guy to deal with and ships immediately!
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George:
Yes, they arrived on Monday and I immediately installed them. I listened to the system for approximately 4 hours and had to leave home for business travel. Honestly, I was surprised as there was a definite change in the sound. There was more detail and a more distinct quality to the sound. For roughly $60.00 it is a no brainer investment and I talked Philistine into ordering them for his Transporter.
Thanks again for publishing your comments about the Herbies and for Ted and you providing the correct sizing information.
Ken
PS. I would also like to add that Steve (Herbie) is a great guy to deal with and ships immediately!
Ken,
Glad it worked out for you.
Sounds like your experience was very similar to the rest of us.
George
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Thanks Guys:
I just placed an order for 5 UltraSonic 25's and one UltraSonic 70. Also thanks to Ted_B for the recommendation of the UltraSonic 70 with hard pads for the EML 5U4G used in my ModWright Transporter.
Ken
After placing this post last night Ted and George let me know that I need the UltraSonic 30's for the 6SN7 tubes I use in the Transporter. Thus, I contacted Herbie and changed my order to the 30's. Thanks again guys and I look forward to receiving them.
Ken
Ken,
Did you receive your order?
Any thoughts or comments?
George
George:
Yes, they arrived on Monday and I immediately installed them. I listened to the system for approximately 4 hours and had to leave home for business travel. Honestly, I was surprised as there was a definite change in the sound. There was more detail and a more distinct quality to the sound. For roughly $60.00 it is a no brainer investment and I talked Philistine into ordering them for his Transporter.
Thanks again for publishing your comments about the Herbies and for Ted and you providing the correct sizing information.
Ken
PS. I would also like to add that Steve (Herbie) is a great guy to deal with and ships immediately!
Yes, Ken beat me into submission :bowdown:
Mine arrived today and they've tightened things up (sound wise), much much better than the teflon ones.
It's also worth the $60 dealing with Herbie (Steve) just to experience someone who knows about great customer service :thumb:.
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:duh: You guys are killin me. Reading this I had to order 4 of the Ultrasonic 9's for my Van Alstine Transcendence Eight Preamp. I already have silicone rings on the 12AX and AT7 pairs so we'll see how much of difference can be heard in a week or so when they arrive. More soon. aa
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Yes, please share your thoughts. I'm using 4 pair of the older silicone version. It looks like the new Ultrasonics would be easier to install in tight spaces as well.
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Herbie's arrived, but one of the amps needs a new quad cap. So I took a ride to Dynakit and bought a pair of 80-40-30-20 cans from Kevin. Will get them installed soon and be back on the case. If time permits I'll change the octal power tube sockets at the same time. Just a lot of holiday/family stuff going on these days.
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I would think that, assuming tube damping is actually worthwhile, doing something like applying RTV silicone to the tube (perhaps in a ring around the middle) would be the best bet. You'd just have to make sure it could stand up to the high temperatures, but I've seen silicone for automotive use that should do the trick.
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I would think that, assuming tube damping is actually worthwhile, doing something like applying RTV silicone to the tube (perhaps in a ring around the middle) would be the best bet. You'd just have to make sure it could stand up to the high temperatures, but I've seen silicone for automotive use that should do the trick.
A quick search finds some RTV that will stand up to 700 degrees F.
http://www.permatex.com/products/Automotive/automotive_gasketing/gasket_makers/auto_Permatex_Ultra_Copper_Maximum_Temperature_RTV_Silicone_Gasket_Maker.htm
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I would think that, assuming tube damping is actually worthwhile, doing something like applying RTV silicone to the tube (perhaps in a ring around the middle) would be the best bet. You'd just have to make sure it could stand up to the high temperatures, but I've seen silicone for automotive use that should do the trick.
Less permanent would be Mortite or Dennis brand rope caulk. A $5 package will probably treat 3000 tubes 8)
I've not tried a bead around the middle, but a dime sized 'tophat' works fine with all tubes tried (voltage regulators, output, input and rectifiers). My tubes seems to last for quite a while with the dime sized hat on top....perhaps I should try a middle band in the future :scratch:
John
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Less permanent would be Mortite or Dennis brand rope caulk. A $5 package will probably treat 3000 tubes 8)
If it works, you wouldn't want to remove it anyway.
I was also figuring that you would want a good bond with the glass for the best damping.
Mortite is not quite elastic enough IMO. It permanently deforms and thus will not absorb repeated movement as well as something more elastic. Also, how does it hold up to the heat?
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If it works, you wouldn't want to remove it anyway.
I was also figuring that you would want a good bond with the glass for the best damping.
Mortite is not quite elastic enough IMO. It permanently deforms and thus will not absorb repeated movement as well as something more elastic. Also, how does it hold up to the heat?
It works great and leaves only a little sticky residue on the tube if you pull it off....which can be cleaned off easily with lighter fluid, Un-Du or GooGone :)
The only time I've removed it has been to test them with and without the rope caulk on it....each time the rope caulked tube wins.
As I mentioned a little earlier in the topic, I own the Herbie's dampers and they work great, too (only at 1000x more expensive then rope caulk).
Don't use modeling clay tho.....I think there is some plastic compound in those (which is why is more malleable) and I don't think it would stand a chance against tube heat.
John
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Don't use modeling clay tho.....I think there is some plastic compound in those (which is why is more malleable) and I don't think it would stand a chance against tube heat.
Stick some in the microwave sometime. It turns to liquid. :)
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Replaced some sorbathane rings around my pre amp tubes with Herbie's. At first, I thought it was more of the same, maybe a tad better separation in the soundscape. Putzing around later, I found that my right speaker was very slightly further away from the side wall and nearer to the virtual center than my left speaker. I measure this stuff out so I was suprised that I had done this. I corrected it. We all know that our room is a part of our reproductive system and we treat surfaces and whatnots to make our room less invasive. Let me suggest that you re-measure the distances from your speaks to your side and back walls and that the measurements be EXACT! The Herbie's are doing well. Best device of it's kind I have tried. You know, yer not supposed to be elated every time you sit and listen. Life just isn't that fair. You're suppose to be thinking about what you could do to make things better. Well, speaker placement is free and you got to get that right before yer gonna get the most value out of anything else you have or may have. I think I must be lucky. Must be a synergistic thing with the size of my speaks and the dimensions of my room. And a tape measure has become my new (old) best friend. Next thing for me is a Grant Fidelity power conditioner and cable. Should be here tomorrow. Life is good at my house. Pulled out Lhasa's The Living Road last night. Her voice on this is perfectly centered and forward but there was a little irritation to sibilants. Not any more. Her voice is smooth and balanced now and demo quality. Herbie has to be having a hand in that.