If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's

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Madera59

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If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« on: 9 May 2012, 04:06 am »
Sadly my wife has let the smoke out of my treasured Strata Mini's.... well not really her fault... her Ipod was patched through an old amp.... but while playing the music at a "lively" level she for some unknown reason removed the jack from the ipod and then tried to reconnect.... not sure of the technical term... but I knew with all the squelching it was not good... so with smoke wisping from the upper part of one of the minis.... my heart sank....

Having had these speakers for four years (two in storage due to an old family dog... but thats another story).... I have not had much chance to enjoy them....  So I am asking for some help in tracking down possible parts and some information regarding where or how to repair any components ie : crossovers.... unless it proves to also be a good time to make some upgrades I would like to have them as they were initially designed.... I am not a proffessed audiophile... just a person who appreciates good sound  and music.... any ideas , suggestions  or help is greatly appreciated - note : still keeping wife :)

Nick77

Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #1 on: 9 May 2012, 10:20 am »
Welcome to AC, sorry to hear about your Mini's. I used to own them also, great speaker.

You posted in the right spot, either Danny or the Skiing Ninja can help.

Danny Richie

Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #2 on: 9 May 2012, 02:10 pm »
The only thing likely to hurt by hot swapping the cables in the plate amp, and that can be replaced. What works and what doesn't work?

And welcome to AC.

Madera59

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Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #3 on: 9 May 2012, 02:23 pm »
The only thing likely to hurt by hot swapping the cables in the plate amp, and that can be replaced. What works and what doesn't work?

And welcome to AC.

Thanks for the welcome.... the general sound from both speakers seem to have lost all depth and definition and the smoke seemed to have come from the top speaker in one of the cabinets.... I have swapped out amps and have the same sound results..... and I looked for any fuses but didn't seem to find any. Unfortunately it also appears that both of the tops speakers do not work.... since these are quite large would it make sense to remove the components and take them to an electronics repair for them to test... I am able to do most basic repairs but I am not  very conversant with electronics at a board level - sorry.


Danny Richie

Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #4 on: 9 May 2012, 09:45 pm »
Thanks for the welcome.... the general sound from both speakers seem to have lost all depth and definition and the smoke seemed to have come from the top speaker in one of the cabinets.... I have swapped out amps and have the same sound results..... and I looked for any fuses but didn't seem to find any. Unfortunately it also appears that both of the tops speakers do not work.... since these are quite large would it make sense to remove the components and take them to an electronics repair for them to test... I am able to do most basic repairs but I am not  very conversant with electronics at a board level - sorry.

Take the back of the speaker off to access the upper drivers.

Disconnect the tweeter and mid panel and check them with an ohm meter.

Let me know what you get.

JCarney

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Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #5 on: 9 May 2012, 10:01 pm »
Hi Madera59, you are in the best of hands. Danny will see to it that you have music again, and soon. I have to say I cracked up at the note of keeping the wife, awesome.

Good Luck,
JCarney

studiotech

Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #6 on: 9 May 2012, 11:39 pm »
Sounds like the circular ribbon fried.  I had this same thing happen many moons ago with an old pair of Genesis Genre 1's.  Same tweeter.  I got some kind of a bad, high frequency oscillation and a little wisp of smoke drifted out the top.  Back then, I did not know any better and thought I had to get a pair directly from Genesis.  They wanted too much money and I declined to fix them.  Now, if you look around you can find the same driver available to the DIY market for maybe $30-40.

Greg

woofersus

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Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #7 on: 10 May 2012, 01:56 pm »
I vaguely remember it being discussed at some point that those weren't exactly the same tweeter.  I could be wrong though.

studiotech

Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #8 on: 10 May 2012, 02:47 pm »
I vaguely remember it being discussed at some point that those weren't exactly the same tweeter.  I could be wrong though.

You might be right, but I've owned both speakers and they look the same.  Genesis likes to fool people that they've got something very expensive and esoteric in their speakers, but they are really not that special.  They sound great, but overbuilt, expensive to make, high-end tweeters they are not.  The tweeter connection also makes sense because Arnie Nudell(the founder of Genesis) was one of Mark Schifters(Mr. AV123 prior to his downfall) mentors.  He would have had access to the information on those drivers and who in China supplied them.

Greg

Hank

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Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #9 on: 10 May 2012, 05:28 pm »
How much smoke?  A guy here at work told me one of his Focal tweeters blew.  I took it out of the cabinet and saw that the wire from one of the terminals to the voice coil had burned open from an obvious milisecond zap.  That wire must have been smaller than 30 guage!  I spliced in a short length of small guage wire wrap wire and the tweeter worked just fine.

cujobob

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Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #10 on: 10 May 2012, 07:41 pm »
Genesis was using those tweeters quite a while ago so they could have come down in price. They have had a lot of issues with the tweeters blowing, so power handling likely isn't that high?

I always hoped the on wall version of that speaker would be released because they're an elegant design especially with a piano finish.
Good luck figuring this out, if you google strata tweeter issues you'll probably find a lot of similar folks in the same boat.

SlushPuppy

Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #11 on: 10 May 2012, 09:08 pm »
VMPS used to use a spiral ribbon tweeter. Not sure how close it is to the one in the Strata Mini. Brian used to stock MLS cabinets, so who knows. Might be worth a call to VMPS to find out.

F-100

Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #12 on: 10 May 2012, 09:29 pm »
Let me know if you're interested in pair of Strata Mini with full upgrade crossovers kit that I got from Skiing Ninja.
I'm getting out of the hobby so willing to let them go at cheap price.

woofersus

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Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #13 on: 10 May 2012, 09:39 pm »
You might be right, but I've owned both speakers and they look the same.  Genesis likes to fool people that they've got something very expensive and esoteric in their speakers, but they are really not that special.  They sound great, but overbuilt, expensive to make, high-end tweeters they are not.  The tweeter connection also makes sense because Arnie Nudell(the founder of Genesis) was one of Mark Schifters(Mr. AV123 prior to his downfall) mentors.  He would have had access to the information on those drivers and who in China supplied them.

Greg

Yeah, I'm aware of all the connections there and I have no doubt they're from the same manufacturer.  I'm just not sure if they were customized a little or not.  It seems people have had a real hard time finding replacements, which leads me to believe it's not an off-the-shelf model.

Madera59

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Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #14 on: 11 May 2012, 06:17 am »
Let me know if you're interested in pair of Strata Mini with full upgrade crossovers kit that I got from Skiing Ninja.
I'm getting out of the hobby so willing to let them go at cheap price.

Thanks for the offer.... suppose it may depend on a) what turns out to be the problem or problems?
And the price you are asking?
Are you anywhere on the west coast? I live up here on Vancouver Island, north of Seattle

However before I do anything I would like to work with Danny's help (which is really appreciated) to determine the issues and what the fixes turn out to be
thx again for the offer

Madera59

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Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #15 on: 11 May 2012, 01:49 pm »
Take the back of the speaker off to access the upper drivers.

Disconnect the tweeter and mid panel and check them with an ohm meter.

Let me know what you get.

Good Morning Danny,

I had actually sent a reply last night but it appears that \i must have timed out as it is not posted.
I have desoldered both the planer tweeter and the mid planer and tested with an autorange multimeter :
planer tweeter :  OL on the multimeter - short???
mid planer :  3 ohms.

regards, 
Michael
PS - only one speaker tested I am taking the other speaker apart tonight- that work thing seems to get in the way  :)

F-100

Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #16 on: 11 May 2012, 02:02 pm »
Thanks for the offer.... suppose it may depend on a) what turns out to be the problem or problems?
And the price you are asking?
Are you anywhere on the west coast? I live up here on Vancouver Island, north of Seattle

However before I do anything I would like to work with Danny's help (which is really appreciated) to determine the issues and what the fixes turn out to be
thx again for the offer

I'm in LA so you're too far from me. Anyway, I have a spare set of the original XO. If you need them, you can have them for free.

HAL

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Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #17 on: 11 May 2012, 02:05 pm »
Good Morning Danny,

I had actually sent a reply last night but it appears that \i must have timed out as it is not posted.
I have desoldered both the planer tweeter and the mid planer and tested with an autorange multimeter :
planer tweeter :  OL on the multimeter - short???
mid planer :  3 ohms.

regards, 
Michael
PS - only one speaker tested I am taking the other speaker apart tonight- that work thing seems to get in the way  :)

Sounds like the mid planer is fine.  The tweeter measurement sounds like it is open and no continuity.

If you can check the wiring back to the crossover board and just look for anything else unusual.  If nothing, probably just need a new tweeter.

Danny Richie

Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #18 on: 11 May 2012, 02:28 pm »
What HAL said...

Madera59

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Re: If smoke comes out is it bad? - Strata Mini's
« Reply #19 on: 12 May 2012, 01:24 am »
What HAL said...

I have pulled the amp....no apparent problems.... no burnt traces or resistors. caps look oK... however not sure what I may need to be looking for... no burnt smell.... did not pull the crossover board as it is tucked away in the bottom of the cabinet.... Although part of me says - to continue on if I have gone this far....

I did pull the tweeter apart and yes it is gone.... as the traces are burnt.  Are their replacement ones avail..... ??? if so how much? I will be taking the other speaker apart on saturday.... I figuring I will need two.....

Are there any tests I can run without having to pull the crossover board out?

regards,

Michael