AudioCircle
Industry Circles => Bryston Limited => Topic started by: Larry Dickman on 25 Jan 2018, 03:08 am
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Sort of ironic considering how much bitchin' I did over Bryston's Tidal interface. But after about a year, realized it wasn't worth $20/month to me (YMMV).
My main complaint is how Tidal organizes music. Jazz and Classical, for example, are single giant categories, instead of breaking it down like Roon does. (But I also didn't continue my complimentary Bryston Roon subscription.)
I will now be building a library of high rez downloads and others as I find them.
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I will now be building a library of high rez downloads and others as I find them.
:thumb:
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I too have lost interest in Tidal. My original objective was to learn more about the newer music that I was "missing out on". I'm now back to listening to the music that I currently have and really enjoy. :D
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I too have lost interest in Tidal. My original objective was to learn more about the newer music that I was "missing out on". I'm now back to listening to the music that I currently have and really enjoy. :D
Thank You. Not even necessarily newer music, for example, I heard some Bossa Nova (independent from Tidal), and thought, I like that. So I put it in their search engine, and only got things with Bossa Nova with that name in the title (like a compilation), but not selections based on that genre, Tidal's search function stinks.
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Tidal's interface, and even more so, their search functions, could use some help, as you point out. I have found things I missed originally by 'tweaking' my search more than I should have to. It doesn't parse multiple terms or suggest alternatives to possible typos. Apple's search is much more effective, their discovery is 50 times better, and if they came out with a lossless option, I'd drop Tidal like a rock. (They don't care enough about SQ to do that though.) Re your complaint about how it handles Classical, the other problem is its artist-focused interface. Searching for a particular release can be difficult. Want to search by label? Forget it. Genres other than pop are the stepchildren. But until it improves or some better option emerges, I'm keeping it, warts and all.
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Yeah, I'm disappointed in it too. Either not much available in my interests or too hard to search if you don't know artists.
Signed up for the free 6 months deal, then found out my internet service/wireless router needed an upgrade (frequent drop outs). Will cost $370+ to install fiber optic service after winter/spring conditions relent and by then the free deal will be up. :(
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Sort of ironic considering how much bitchin' I did over Bryston's Tidal interface. But after about a year, realized it wasn't worth $20/month to me (YMMV).
I think many of us have wrongfully given Bryston a hard time at one point or another. At least you are honest enough to acknowledge it. :oops:
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Well, I must be an outlier.....because I really LIKE Tidal. I have recently been getting into ambient and electronica, and Tidal has a lot in this area that I can't get anywhere else. I have a lengthy "wish list" of CDs, and Tidal has had most of that (esoteric) list, allowing me to check out the CDs before purchasing.
I guess it just depends on what you are seeking. I have yet to try any of the curated lists, but that's next on my agenda.
-dGB
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I think many of us have wrongfully given Bryston a hard time at one point or another.
Bryston is not perfect. Criticism can lead to improvements.
cheers
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I'm with dburna on this one - still feel like I own a record store where I can have any record I want whenever I walk in. Used to carry lists around to buy cds - now instant gratification. Probably have 2K cds and they are hardly played (even though my cd setup sounds great) because I am addicted to exploring new music (classical, folk, jazz, old rock) through Tidal and Roon. Has been this way for pretty much 2 years now.
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+1 ... my 6-month free TIDAL subscription from Sprint just expired. I am not really listening to it much, so I let it go.
I find Spotify to be a better catalog for exploring new music and I already have a family plan for the wife & daughter.
If I like something, I order the CD or download it from HD Tracks, if it's available.
I am still using Roon, however, despite my earlier impression that it's value diminishes without TIDAL. I really like the Roon UI and I've grown accustomed to the features (e.g. Focus and Bookmarks).
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Personally I am tired of the complications and failings so reliably included in nearly everyone's software. Technology has helped me many times to be sure but, on balance, it is becoming more trouble than it is worth. So, to remain on point, I will say that Tidal looked like more trouble than it was worth to me so I dropped them today. Among other problems I, like some other posters, found it difficult to navigate and it seemed to be designed for a demographic that does not favor me. I believe I am experiencing encroachment as a very fine membrane of Luddite is slowly developing between me and my computer. I especially don't like feeling as if my computer is the portal through which I invite abuse.
With government protections a thing of the past, I wonder what recourse will remain if ever I am hacked and need assistance. It is starting to look like anything goes.
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I'm keeping my Tidal. No issues streaming with my Lumin or its app. And I'm finding new music each day. And I still have over 3000 CD's, 400 - 500 LP's. So right now I'm still happy with the music I do discover on Tidal. OF course, with the Lumin no windows PC its all controlled by an ipad. Lumin > Ethernet right to my > Netgear modem and out to my carrier to a 115 Mbps down/12up service. No issues at all. So darn simple the wife can use it.
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That is why I still spin those silver discs on my dedicated 44.1 transport. The music server has only music I put in it. For new music WBGO radio and music reviews.
Everyone wants a piece of you. For me they cannot have it.
charles
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...I will now be building a library of high rez downloads and others as I find them.
Just wait 'til all you can buy is MQA or MP3 :cry:
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I'm on the very brink of starting this (just setting up my gear now; a brand new Player/Dac/Amp & Speakers are almost complete) and I am a bit confused. I thought Roon organized and played the music that it received from Tidal.
How exactly does this work?
Thanks,
JD
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Just wait 'til all you can buy is MQA or MP3 :cry:
No thank you. That is why those shiny discs will never leave my home. 44.1 done right is all I need. With dedicated transport and state of art DAC I'm in like Flynn.
charles
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I like Tidal overall and will be keeping it. I like all the new MQA albums which are really building up a library of music, but I don’t like the Jay Z hype and all the music that seems to cater to a younger audience. There appears to be more of those titles over say blues, jazz, clasical, or older albums. I think Tidal MQA might provide a spark to other streaming serives like Spotify or many others to offer hi-res content. That is good for those of us who like to stream. I am a big fan of this for the vast array of music I could not own and store myself.
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Interesting discussion. I’m still trying to wrap my head around the possibility of having immediate/instant access to millions of albums all for a meager $20 a month? Seriously, how can that NOT be worth $20??
Even if you own 10,000 or 20,000 albums (never mind the space required to keep 10K discs) that’s absolutely nothing, not even a drop in the bucket compared to having several million albums at your finger tips... And by the time you find a certain CD in your 10K collection and drop it into your CDP and push play, you could been half way through the album if you just streamed it.
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Interesting discussion. I’m still trying to wrap my head around the possibility of having immediate/instant access to millions of albums all for a meager $20 a month? Seriously, how can that NOT be worth $20??
Even if you own 10,000 or 20,000 albums (never mind the space required to keep 10K discs) that’s absolutely nothing, not even a drop in the bucket compared to having several million albums at your finger tips... And by the time you find a certain CD in your 10K collection and drop it into your CDP and push play, you could been half way through the album if you just streamed it.
Yes, that's essentially where I have landed over time. All the world's technological advances have not kept pace with people's expectations of what "should be"....nor could they. People forget (conveniently) how far we have come from a technology standpoint. Me, as I get older, my sense of gratitude grows about what I have (and to what I have access). If anyone in the 70's or 80's had access to this many albums at the snap of their fingers, they would have had to be a millionaire. Actually, even then it wasn't technically feasible to do so. I am just grateful for what I have. In this fast-paced world, the one thing I don't have time for is.....complaining.
Enjoy every sandwich, -dGB
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We may have another option coming in May
https://www.qobuz.com/gb-en/discover
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I'm a senior audiophool and so far I like Tidal and will continue for now. I can find music I know and like, I like the fact that the ECM catalog is becoming available on Tidal, and I continue to find new and great music as well. Spotify, however, does not impress me. Too few choices. I'll have to check out qobuz.
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Sort of ironic considering how much bitchin' I did over Bryston's Tidal interface. But after about a year, realized it wasn't worth $20/month to me (YMMV).
My main complaint is how Tidal organizes music.
I completely understand how the frustration of technical challenges can truly lead to one giving up. I was advised to stay away from Bryston for that reason... But how a streaming service organizes music seems like a non issue to me.
I haven’t tried Tidal yet (or any other streaming service for that matter) but don’t they offer a search option so that you can quite literally access anything and everything you desire with just a few key strokes? For example, some tells me about an album or band I’ve never heard of before, can’t I enter such information into a search field and quickly access it within a few seconds?
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I completely understand how the frustration of technical challenges can truly lead to one giving up. I was advised to stay away from Bryston for that reason... But how a streaming service organizes music seems like a non issue to me.
I haven’t tried Tidal yet (or any other streaming service for that matter) but don’t they offer a search option so that you can quite literally access anything and everything you desire with just a few key strokes? For example, some tells me about an album or band I’ve never heard of before, can’t I enter such information into a search field and quickly access it within a few seconds?
I stuck with Tidal for almost a year for some of the reasons mentioned. MQA promising high rez streaming. A huge library of music at your fingertips. But I still quit. If Tidal had an interface like Roon I probably would have stayed. But their search function is surprisingly poor, IMO. My experience was that you can search by artist or title only, not genre or anything else. And unlike YouTube, for example, there are no recommendations based upon your history or what you have favorited. I also really don't care for their fixed playlist-based format, or at least, the way they execute it. I have found more satisfaction with Pandora's format of Radio Stations of so many genres. For example, if I'm in the mood to listen to Smooth Jazz or 80s New Wave or tunes based on a specific band, I just select that. But finding such specific playlists on Tidal is just about impossible. I do think Spotify is better than Tidal in this regard. And Tidal's "Artist Radio" feature is unsatisfactory. If you select, say, Allman Brotners Artist Radio there are no Allman Brothers songs at all, and it's a fixed playlist of 15 or 20 songs that never changes (from what I can tell). If you select to play the most popular Allman Brothers songs (which you can also do on the artist's page) again, it's a fixed unchanged thing so once you listen to it once, there's nothing new (of course you can create your own playlist, and hit the "random" button, but I like the mystery and randomness of something like Pandora.)
If you see an interesting recommendation in Stereophile or The Absolute Sound, there's a good chance you won't find it on Tidal if it's classical, but jazz you might have better luck. Looking for a specific recording of something by Mozart? Good luck. Don't think that Tidal has EVERYTHING. They don't. To be fair they do have a rich selection on some things, for example their collection of Grateful Dead stuff is really extensive and pretty great.
Finally, and surprisingly (to me) was that having a huge library of music wasn't nearly as compelling as I thought it would be. I don't need every Elton John album, I like maybe four.
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Do you know that if you have 10,000 songs (at 3 minutes each) in your library and you listen for 8 hours a day that you won't hear the same song in over 62 days of listening?
Sometimes completely going through your library is a good way of listening to "new" music. When I put my library on shuffle, sometimes I'll say to myself - what's that?
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I stuck with Tidal for almost a year for some of the reasons mentioned. MQA promising high rez streaming. A huge library of music at your fingertips. But I still quit. If Tidal had an interface like Roon I probably would have stayed. But their search function is surprisingly poor, IMO. My experience was that you can search by artist or title only, not genre or anything else. And unlike YouTube, for example, there are no recommendations based upon your history or what you have favorited. I also really don't care for their fixed playlist-based format, or at least, the way they execute it. I have found more satisfaction with Pandora's format of Radio Stations of so many genres. For example, if I'm in the mood to listen to Smooth Jazz or 80s New Wave or tunes based on a specific band, I just select that. But finding such specific playlists on Tidal is just about impossible. I do think Spotify is better than Tidal in this regard. And Tidal's "Artist Radio" feature is unsatisfactory. If you select, say, Allman Brotners Artist Radio there are no Allman Brothers songs at all, and it's a fixed playlist of 15 or 20 songs that never changes (from what I can tell). If you select to play the most popular Allman Brothers songs (which you can also do on the artist's page) again, it's a fixed unchanged thing so once you listen to it once, there's nothing new (of course you can create your own playlist, and hit the "random" button, but I like the mystery and randomness of something like Pandora.)
If you see an interesting recommendation in Stereophile or The Absolute Sound, there's a good chance you won't find it on Tidal if it's classical, but jazz you might have better luck. Looking for a specific recording of something by Mozart? Good luck. Don't think that Tidal has EVERYTHING. They don't. To be fair they do have a rich selection on some things, for example their collection of Grateful Dead stuff is really extensive and pretty great.
Finally, and surprisingly (to me) was that having a huge library of music wasn't nearly as compelling as I thought it would be. I don't need every Elton John album, I like maybe four.
Regarding the Allman Brothers, there is over 35 LP's on there, from MQA to non.
And regarding Mozart over 30 LP's on Tidal
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but there are more than 1K digital recs of Mozart.....
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I for one am tired of algorithms telling me what they I should listen to, watch, and read. Because if you have a truly broad range of interests they don't know how to handle that. They are only good for filling in whatever bubble they think you live in. So I am not bothered by tidals lack of recommendations. And I am not willing to pay roon hundreds for what I can learn for free on the internet.
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I, like others here, still enjoy Tidal very much. I don't see that they lump Classical and Jazz together, at least not when I search for new recordings by genre. That said, their search function is pretty bad and there's practically nothing available in the way of metadata when accessing it through the awful Audirvana Plus remote app. I much preferred Roon in this regard, but I just could not justify paying $500 for a "lifetime" membership.
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Do you know that if you have 10,000 songs (at 3 minutes each) in your library and you listen for 8 hours a day that you won't hear the same song in over 62 days of listening?
Sometimes completely going through your library is a good way of listening to "new" music. When I put my library on shuffle, sometimes I'll say to myself - what's that?
I've been doing that some lately: "Hmm, haven't listened to this in a long time...."
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I like Tidal a lot and use it more or less all the time.
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I've been doing that some lately: "Hmm, haven't listened to this in a long time...."
Not to sound like a shill for Roon, but... this is one reason why I've been using Roon more with the BDP-1.
I sometimes get stuck in a rut and listen to a dozen albums over-and-over (usually the newer ones purchased). With Roon, I will still play those new albums, but clicking on "Focus on Similar" brings up a collection of similar albums (based on genre and who knows what else).
Then I will say: "Hmm, haven't listened to this in a long time...."
The genre browser on Roon is good for this, as well.
By the way, Soundirok does a decent job at showing related artists, in case you don't use Roon and are listening with MPD playback on your BDP.
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I only use Tidal BECAUSE of it's interface in Roon. As a stand-alone service, I'd drop it. I agree the search function, similar artists-type functions, and selection doesn't fit me. If Roon offered integration with other services (even without CD quality, just so I could discover and try new stuff easily before purchasing), I'd definitely explore that. I'm excited for a Qobuz option IF Roon can get them on board.
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Larry:
I agree that Tidal's classical search is not very user friendly, but I have found that if you look up the album on Presto Classical and enter the artists listed in the description you will often find what you want. The artist may be the orchestra, one of the soloists, the conductor or maybe, as i should be, the composer. At times you will only find what you want in the Top Tracks or Appears On listings.
Often I can find a piece by searching as such: Shostakovich Symphony no. 8. Now they will all be listed. For instance, I was just now looking for the album Robin de Raaff: Entangled Tales. From Presto Classical I tried all the artists listed in Presto which included 3 orchestras and 2 conductors. None of those worked, but when I tried Robin de Raaff and chose to view all Artists the listing showed "The Hague Philharmonic, Robin de Raaff & Neeme Jarvi" which when used, found the correct album. Using "Entangled Tales" also found the album.
Usually I find what I'm looking for and then I list it in a document so I know where to find it in the future.
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I for one am tired of algorithms telling me what they I should listen to...
I am not bothered by tidals lack of recommendations...
I am not willing to pay roon hundreds for what I can learn for free on the internet.’
All very good points. :thumb: :thumb:
Some people want to be spoon fed, I don’t.
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And regarding Mozart over 30 LP's on Tidal
but there are more than 1K digital recs of Mozart.....
Exactly! 30 Mozart LP's is a bit of a joke. And it's not like those 30 LP's are the cream of the crop of Mozart recordings. They are not. However, with classical, many more albums are available that are not on the composer's homepage. You have to search the name of the piece, and get one letter or word wrong and you probably won't find it. (So if you search for--Bach suites for solo cello--you will find stuff not on the Bach homepage, and the homepage doesn't help at all in informing you of this.)
I only use Tidal BECAUSE of it's interface in Roon.
Agreed, but I can't really justify the cost of both, month after month. Perhaps I'm too set in my tastes and don't need access to so much stuff.
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Larry, your posts have been a big help to me. I have a brand new BDP-pi, and I've been wondering if TIDAL is worth investigating. I'm mainly a classical music listener, with some excursions into jazz and older pop standards. From what I'm reading here about TIDAL, I needn't bother. The price of Roon makes it a non-starter for me.
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Exactly! 30 Mozart LP's is a bit of a joke. And it's not like those 30 LP's are the cream of the crop of Mozart recordings. They are not. However, with classical, many more albums are available that are not on the composer's homepage. You have to search the name of the piece, and get one letter or word wrong and you probably won't find it. (So if you search for--Bach suites for solo cello--you will find stuff not on the Bach homepage, and the homepage doesn't help at all in informing you of this.) Agreed, but I can't really justify the cost of both, month after month. Perhaps I'm too set in my tastes and don't need access to so much stuff.
Hey, I didn't think you were the "type" who listened to classical. Maybe your avatar photo biased me..... :lol: :green:
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Larry, your posts have been a big help to me. I have a brand new BDP-pi, and I've been wondering if TIDAL is worth investigating. I'm mainly a classical music listener, with some excursions into jazz and older pop standards. From what I'm reading here about TIDAL, I needn't bother. The price of Roon makes it a non-starter for me.
It's not clear to me if this is a 3-month free trial, but it might be: https://www.groupon.com/deals/tidal-music-streaming-3
The Tidal website offers a one-month free trial. Why not give it a whirl? But obviously I found it really wasn't for me.
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We may have another option coming in May
https://www.qobuz.com/gb-en/discover
About time. They can fill the void that leaves some Tidal people unhappy. Won't be cheap, though. I'm betting it'll be >$25/mo.
Sigh. I miss you MOG, you were the best.
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Hey, I didn't think you were the "type" who listened to classical. Maybe your avatar photo biased me..... :lol: :green:
https://www.newyorker.com/culture/new-yorker-festival/clint-the-composer
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=175180)
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I, like others here, still enjoy Tidal very much. I don't see that they lump Classical and Jazz together, at least not when I search for new recordings by genre. That said, their search function is pretty bad and there's practically nothing available in the way of metadata when accessing it through the awful Audirvana Plus remote app. I much preferred Roon in this regard, but I just could not justify paying $500 for a "lifetime" membership.
I was unclear, perhaps. Not that Jazz and Classical are lumped together, but that all things Classical are lumped together, and all things Jazz are lumped together. So if you select Classical on the genre page, it is not broken down, same with Jazz, i.e. you can't select Bepop, Bossa Nova, Cool Jazz, Swing, Ragtime, etc., it's all one category: Jazz. Roon accomplishes this beautifully, but as you say, it's not cheap when combined with a Tidal subscription.
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It's not clear to me if this is a 3-month free trial, but it might be: https://www.groupon.com/deals/tidal-music-streaming-3
The Tidal website offers a one-month free trial. Why not give it a whirl? But obviously I found it really wasn't for me.
Yeah, I know they have a free trial. From my perspective, a streaming service would be worthwhile if it can replace the thousands of CDs I already have. A streaming site that has only 30 Mozart listings isn't going to cut it.
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Exactly! 30 Mozart LP's is a bit of a joke. And it's not like those 30 LP's are the cream of the crop of Mozart recordings. They are not. However, with classical, many more albums are available that are not on the composer's homepage. You have to search the name of the piece, and get one letter or word wrong and you probably won't find it. (So if you search for--Bach suites for solo cello--you will find stuff not on the Bach homepage, and the homepage doesn't help at all in informing you of this.) Agreed, but I can't really justify the cost of both, month after month. Perhaps I'm too set in my tastes and don't need access to so much stuff.
"-Bach suites for solo cello"
Went into my Lumin, Tidal, Search - yep NO actual BACH Suites for Cello, but a lot of BACH suites for cello by other artist. I would think that's not a Tidal problem but a Label problem as not releasing the LP's to Tidal. You can't play whats not there.
Also, I'm not about to pay ROON when I can just do things myself.
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Yeah, I know they have a free trial. From my perspective, a streaming service would be worthwhile if it can replace the thousands of CDs I already have. A streaming site that has only 30 Mozart listings isn't going to cut it.
As mentioned, the 30 album figure is misleading, as there is much more if you search by the name of the piece or the artist (which could be the soloist or orchestra, not the composer) rather than than relying on what's on the composer's homepage. And nowhere on that homepage do they clue you in about that. It's one of the reasons I said that I don't like the way Tidal organizes music! It's a mishmash, IMO.
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As mentioned, the 30 album figure is misleading, as there is much more if you search by the name of the piece or the artist (which could be the soloist or orchestra, not the composer) rather than than relying on what's on the composer's homepage. And nowhere on that homepage do they clue you in about that. It's one of the reasons I said that I don't like the way Tidal organizes music! It's a mishmash, IMO.
I don't want to spend forever hunting for stuff. TIDAL may be a great site for pop/rock enthusiasts. Based upon what I'm reading here, it's not for me.
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Roon looks interesting, but, it's essentially $120 a year for a user interface and functionality that should be provided with Tidal (or whichever) to begin with.
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Great discussion folks! :thumb:
For me, spending a few hundred bucks a year for the Tidal/Roon interface is worth every penny. Sure, there are humps and bumps and it's not perfect - but, for me, it's access to tons of music i don't own or never will own. And the SQ is pretty damn good. Not as good as bryston's MPD playing directly from a hard drive, but still damn good.
I have all Bryston gear - and the Tidal/Roon set up works just about flawlessly for me.
I'll spend thousands on electronics, cables, stands, etc etc....it seems every year......so i don't mind the extra few hundred bucks on Tidal.Roon services. Money well spent in my opinion.
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I cancelled my Tidal HiRes for 3 months and came back. I have 7 TB of music on an Aurender N10. The N10 (and my vinyl collection) is what I call my reliable source but Tidal has reduced it self to kind of a novelty for me. It can be clutch when you need holiday music or something new but ideally, it buy the recording whether vinyl or CD/download an put it on the N10 or the TT. I quit Tidal because I was so tired of listening to Tidal than the signal drop. I increased my Comcast from 10mb/sec to 200mb/sec and it still dropped. All the convenience in the world is lost with a couple of these untimely issues. Too frequent I may add. Before the N10 I had an A10 with the full MQA treatment. Tidal did shine there but still reliability is priority one. Edit: Sorry, thought this was discless circle not brand specific.
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I 've been a big supporter of Tidal and have no intention of cancelling my subscription. This thread has introduced me to many of you that I'm not familiar with. I've been a member here on AudioCircle almost since day one and am currently the Facilitator of the Jazz Circle.
I have found Tidal's interface issues mostly surmountable and I'm not running Roon, simply can't afford it. Just like anything else, the more you use it the better you get at it. I'm retired and forced to justify (to my self), the costs of my HiFi addiction. The $20 a month for Tidal is one of the greatest values I've ever come across.
I really don't like preaching but I 'm a bit put off by all the bitching about the complexity of using Tidal on a web site that is pretty technical in nature. This is a great deal and you're foolish (not the word I wanted to use) not to take advantage of it.
Larry
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+1
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I 've been a big supporter of Tidal and have no intention of cancelling my subscription... and am currently the Facilitator of the Jazz Circle.
Well perhaps you can write it off as a business expense. Just Kidding. For someone who knows what to search for, I agree with you. Others have suggested I need or desire to be spoon-fed. I think being offered suggestions based upon search history and favorites is a good thing, not a crutch. Tidal doesn't have such a feature.
Tidal has much more than I realized after starting this thread. It's a question of finding it, which at least one poster states isn't worth the hassle. Just by putting Wiener Philharmoniker in the search box rather than a composer, i see so much I didn't see before, when I searched only by composer or visited the composer's page, which should have been revealed.
One poster states that Tidal should have the functions of Roon. I partially agree. When it comes to organization and break down of genre and sub-genre, and results of a simple search, I totally agree. But Roon's other features, I don't expect them.
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As a mostly Jazz listener I was disappointed in Tidal's lack of database content when it comes to listing the musicians/personnel on an album.
During my trial I found no musician listing (except the primary artist, duh!) more than 50% of the time while the Radio Swiss Jazz database listed the musicians > 95% of the time.
Steve
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Until other streaming services offer CD quality audio I will stay with Tidal. The vastness of the music library plus the sound quality at $20 a month is a bargain to me. I have discovered so much new music. I did have some issues with drop outs a while back but those have since been resolved. The user interface may not suit everyone but I have managed to find everything I have searched. Tidal supplements my vinyl and CD listening, it has not replaced it. I read a lot of music and audiophile forums and as I see mentions and recommendations of artists and albums, I enjoy being able to find the music on Tidal and give it a listen.
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I have a question for the followers of this thread. There have been a few complaints about the expense of Roon. On Roon's website it states a subscription is $119/year which breaks down to $9.92/month. Tidal is $9.99/mo for standard and $20/mo for hifi (which I and many others pay for).
So...why the complaints?
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There have been a few complaints about the expense of Roon. On Roon's website it states a subscription is $119/year which breaks down to $9.92/month. Tidal is $9.99/mo for standard and $20/mo for hifi (which I and many others pay for).
So...why the complaints?
Roon is a music player and music management / database / metadata service that doesn't have its own streaming content so you would subscribe to it in addition to your subscription with Tidal, Spotify, Lumin, etc.
That would bring your total monthly subscription to ~ $30/month, which may still be a good deal depending on how many CDs or digital downloads you would ordinarily purchase each year.
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Thanks for the clarification, srb.
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Qobuz might be too rich for the bulk of us.
Quote from an article on www.rtbf.be:
"With an average revenue per subscriber of 178 euros per month, the expenses of its customers are however much higher than those of Spotify."
This number must include downloads as the starting subscription £9.99/mo (~$14). Still, looks to be interesting.
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This being a Bryston forum -- is there any way to get Spotify or Qobuz through a Bryston digital player?
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I have a question for the followers of this thread. There have been a few complaints about the expense of Roon. On Roon's website it states a subscription is $119/year which breaks down to $9.92/month. Tidal is $9.99/mo for standard and $20/mo for hifi (which I and many others pay for).
So...why the complaints?
I think it's a hard pill to swallow because you don't really own anything tangible and it doesn't (or probably shouldn't) make your music sound better. Most of us are used to paying (what I think is) a lot of money for a DAC, player, amplifier, speakers, etc., all of which probably do something to improve the sound of your music. Roon adds some great functionality though. And even though I've no guarantee that Roon will be around tomorrow, I still paid the full price rather than monthly.
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I am a little surprised by this thread. I bought a lifetime membership to ROON (maybe 3 years ago) and have had TIDAL since day 1. Once ROON implemented TIDAL integration there was no way I would every drop TIDAL. I am close to L.A. and can listen to the best analog radio station I ever came across, KCRW.com (on internet). The diversity of music is incredible. I work from home and whenever I hear something great (which is often) i look up the online playlist and then search TIDAL via ROON. A match made in heaven.
I have great connectivity with TIDAL, maybe 99.9999 percent of the time it is up. For me it is not about hi-res, low-res, MQA etc... It is about hearing great music.
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It's the Tidal search results that I can't stand. I did a simple search for "The Boxer", expecting to come up with Simon and Garfunkel under "TIDAL Tracks". Nope, not even when I clicked "View All". Had to search for Simon and Garfunkel and then sort through to find "The Boxer". I have these issues repeatedly with Tidal, not with other online music services. I keep thinking/hoping *I* screwed up a setting somewhere, but I can't figure out if/how.
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I see. I do agree with you that the search results are not GOOGLEesqu. I tend to listen to complete albums so once I find what I want I forget about the computer interface and get into the music for a long listen.
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I am a little surprised by this thread. I bought a lifetime membership to ROON (maybe 3 years ago) and have had TIDAL since day 1. Once ROON implemented TIDAL integration there was no way I would every drop TIDAL. I am close to L.A. and can listen to the best analog radio station I ever came across, KCRW.com (on internet). The diversity of music is incredible. I work from home and whenever I hear something great (which is often) i look up the online playlist and then search TIDAL via ROON. A match made in heaven.
I have great connectivity with TIDAL, maybe 99.9999 percent of the time it is up. For me it is not about hi-res, low-res, MQA etc... It is about hearing great music.
With the announcement of Best Buy dropping CDs and Target expected to follow their lead, it's sadly going to be difficult to get certain music on CDs let alone an LP, so I am giving Tidal and Roon a go for a year. Also it's hard to support the local record store when their prices is 2x of amazon and they never seem to have that new release i'm after...
Jim
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It's the Tidal search results that I can't stand. I did a simple search for "The Boxer", expecting to come up with Simon and Garfunkel under "TIDAL Tracks". Nope, not even when I clicked "View All". Had to search for Simon and Garfunkel and then sort through to find "The Boxer". I have these issues repeatedly with Tidal, not with other online music services. I keep thinking/hoping *I* screwed up a setting somewhere, but I can't figure out if/how.
I'm scratching my head in wonder. I just entered "the boxer" in Tidal and up came Simon & Garfunkel under "tracks" and under "videos". Perhaps there were enough readers of this thread who searched for "the boxer" that Tidal now shows it(?). Dunno.
I have had the premium Tidal membership for nearly two years now. It is well worth my $20 each month.
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I'm scratching my head in wonder. I just entered "the boxer" in Tidal and up came Simon & Garfunkel under "tracks" and under "videos". Perhaps there were enough readers of this thread who searched for "the boxer" that Tidal now shows it(?). Dunno.
I have had the premium Tidal membership for nearly two years now. It is well worth my $20 each month.
What are you searching for Tidal gave you everything it could find on "the boxer". not to mention anything in a general search with the word 'boxer', is going to be displayed. Simon and Garfunkel had a track called 'the boxer'
Are you using the Tidal desktop or another device with its own Tidal supported app ?
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It's the Tidal search results that I can't stand. I did a simple search for "The Boxer", expecting to come up with Simon and Garfunkel under "TIDAL Tracks". Nope, not even when I clicked "View All". Had to search for Simon and Garfunkel and then sort through to find "The Boxer". I have these issues repeatedly with Tidal, not with other online music services. I keep thinking/hoping *I* screwed up a setting somewhere, but I can't figure out if/how.
The interface DOES have issues, some serious. I sometimes get myself trapped in the useless 'spinning album art' screen and can't get back to grid view (it seems to be a 'one-way door'). Sometimes it won't find something i KNOW is there unless I phrase the search EXACTLY right (It won't parse a search query that is not a verbatim release title). But I put up with it as it's currently the only lossless option in town. Reportedly another (Qobuz) is landing in the spring sometime. We'll see about that one.
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Since TIDAL has been included in default and artist view, I never, and I mean never touch the Tidal app anymore.
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What are you searching for Tidal gave you everything it could find on "the boxer". not to mention anything in a general search with the word 'boxer', is going to be displayed. Simon and Garfunkel had a track called 'the boxer'
Are you using the Tidal desktop or another device with its own Tidal supported app ?
iPhone app
Actually, in all fairness and now that I consider it, this is all through Roon, so perhaps THAT is the problem.
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With the announcement of Best Buy dropping CDs and Target expected to follow their lead, it's sadly going to be difficult to get certain music on CDs let alone an LP, so I am giving Tidal and Roon a go for a year. Also it's hard to support the local record store when their prices is 2x of amazon and they never seem to have that new release i'm after...
Jim
Hadn't heard that. Some people are going to feel the impact. Last time I was in a BestBuy, they still had portable CD players, for $29.00.
I miss record stores (not that BB ever qualified as one especially). Music business sure has changed.
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iPhone app
Actually, in all fairness and now that I consider it, this is all through Roon, so perhaps THAT is the problem.
I keep hearing great things about Roon, but have been resistant to paying all that money just to have a decent interface, which should be part of the deal with the service IMO.
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I keep hearing great things about Roon, but have been resistant to paying all that money just to have a decent interface, which should be part of the deal with the service IMO.
Roon is three parts: database server, audio endpoint and a client controller app. The server doesn't manage any files, just creates a large database of your files and Tidal is just one more source providing a consistent set of metadata per song, artist, etc, hiding duplicates preferring higher quality source. The endpoints can be the BDP, RPI, airplay, etc and the server can downmix the music files as necessary as it also keeps track of the clients and their abilities, finally the client app can be any computer or mobile device. There might be some quirks but it's rather impressive that you can play a Tidal song and then queue up your own song, and you can even enable zones for whole house audio. There's lot going of stuff going behind the scene to make the interface more than a list of tracks and they seem to enabling all sorts of open source and closed source devices.
Sadly the database server appears to be written in .net/mono so there are some steep hardware requirements for the server, so do the trial run before buying it. (tip: do not sign up for Tidal over an apple device)
Even if i don't stick with Tidal, I think Roon is worth the money if you have a late model synology/qnap NAS with several devices. Roon is a whole new level over mPod/mPAD and Soundrok MPD client apps.
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I'd consider using an Intel NUK too. Great device for servers, assuming you are doing your file storing/serving elsewhere. Another option is an older computer... most 5-6 year old computers will make a fine server for Roon, if you have a place to store it.