The SB3/SPDIF output thread.......

jhm731 · « **Reply #40 on:** 20 Dec 2007, 05:48 am »

Quote from: art on 20 Dec 2007, 05:09 am

I haven't made a post in this thread for almost 3 months. Yet, when I look at the traffic logs, I see where there are still lots of folks reading this every day. I suspect that many of them are being linked to here from some other discussion, on some other forum.

Anyone care to clue me in?

Thanks,
Pat

Pat-

See my post here:

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=48632.msg436758;topicseen#new

It seems that some people still think that powering the SB3 with an expensive linear psu will improve the digital output quality without going inside the box.

Happy Holidays!

art · « **Reply #41 on:** 20 Dec 2007, 03:30 pm »

I guess none of them have looked at the noise on the output of the SMPS. I can not see how changing the outboard supply will affect that. Yes, the input to the SMPS will be different, and quite possibly affect the sound in some manner. However, it is a bandaid.

Myths die hard in this business.

Thanks for your input. (Also explains why a lot of the traffic comes from Australia.)

Pat

mr_bill · « **Reply #42 on:** 20 Dec 2007, 04:13 pm »

Quote from: art on 20 Dec 2007, 03:30 pm

I guess none of them have looked at the noise on the output of the SMPS. I can not see how changing the outboard supply will affect that. Yes, the input to the SMPS will be different, and quite possibly affect the sound in some manner. However, it is a bandaid.

Myths die hard in this business.

Thanks for your input. (Also explains why a lot of the traffic comes from Australia.)

Pat

So an outboard power supply change to an upgraded linear supply would not make a difference in sound whether you use digital output or analog output of the SB3?
(Just asking, not judging)
Thanks,
Bill

tanchiro58 · « **Reply #43 on:** 20 Dec 2007, 05:22 pm »

Quote

So an outboard power supply change to an upgraded linear supply would not make a difference in sound whether you use digital output or analog output of the SB3?

An upgraded linear supply (mine is CI VDC-SB) WOULD MAKE a BIG difference in sound at least in my system whether you use digital output or analog output (I have not tried this since SB DAC sounds horrible to me) of the SB3 (mine is modded with SC947-02) and/or SB2 (modded with Newava).

IMO if you could modify or tweak around with your external DAC you will get the sound you expect.

mr_bill · « **Reply #44 on:** 20 Dec 2007, 05:27 pm »

Quote from: tanchiro58 on 20 Dec 2007, 05:22 pm

Quote
So an outboard power supply change to an upgraded linear supply would not make a difference in sound whether you use digital output or analog output of the SB3?

An upgraded linear supply (mine is CI VDC-SB) WOULD MAKE a BIG difference in sound at least in my system whether you use digital output or analog output (I have not tried this since SB DAC sounds horrible to me) of the SB3 (mine is modded with SC947-02) and/or SB2 (modded with Newava).

IMO if you could modify or tweak around with your external DAC you will get the sound you expect.

It would be great to hear any comments on how you like your CI power supply for the SB3. I would be very interested in hearing about this upgrade from the walwart ps.
I have had a SB3 with a Benchmark Dac 1 and really like it, but am reconfiguring and wondering what Dusty's power supply sounds like with an SB3 analog output.
Thanks,
Bill

art · « **Reply #45 on:** 20 Dec 2007, 05:32 pm »

I didn't say it wouldn't make a difference. It probably would. But it is just a bandaid. The only way that you can really improve it is to redesign the internal supply.

Or just make a small linear one for the chip that does the clock and SPDIF output. Even that would make a big change.

Of course, there isn't room inside for all of that, etc., etc., blah, blah.......

Pat

tanchiro58 · « **Reply #46 on:** 20 Dec 2007, 05:33 pm »

Quote from: mr_bill on 20 Dec 2007, 05:27 pm

Quote from: tanchiro58 on 20 Dec 2007, 05:22 pm
Quote
So an outboard power supply change to an upgraded linear supply would not make a difference in sound whether you use digital output or analog output of the SB3?

An upgraded linear supply (mine is CI VDC-SB) WOULD MAKE a BIG difference in sound at least in my system whether you use digital output or analog output (I have not tried this since SB DAC sounds horrible to me) of the SB3 (mine is modded with SC947-02) and/or SB2 (modded with Newava).

IMO if you could modify or tweak around with your external DAC you will get the sound you expect.

It would be great to hear any comments on how you like your CI power supply for the SB3. I would be very interested in hearing about this upgrade from the walwart ps.
I have had a SB3 with a Benchmark Dac 1 and really like it, but am reconfiguring and wondering what Dusty's power supply sounds like with an SB3 analog output.
Thanks,
Bill

Mr.Bill,

The first day I connected the CI VDC-SB to my SB2 and noticed the better change with better soundstage and warmer+ thick+ musical sound in my system. I swapped around between modded SB2+VDC-SB, modded SB2+custombuilt PS, modded SB3+VDC-SB and modded SB3+custombuilt PS. The best combination is still modded SB2+VDC-SB with the rest of my system.

Here are some comments:

Quote

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=44661.0

Charles Calkins · « **Reply #47 on:** 20 Dec 2007, 06:38 pm »

Tan:

What kind of mods does your SB3 have. Digital? Analog? Or the whole nine yards.

Cheers
Charlie

tanchiro58 · « **Reply #48 on:** 20 Dec 2007, 07:27 pm »

Quote from: Charles Calkins on 20 Dec 2007, 06:38 pm

Tan:

What kind of mods does your SB3 have. Digital? Analog? Or the whole nine yards.

Cheers
Charlie

Charlie,

I only modded on the digital part with SC947-02 pulse transformer and BNC connector. However, I prefer the SB2 modded with a Newava pulse transformer with RCA connector.

Tan

Charles Calkins · « **Reply #49 on:** 20 Dec 2007, 09:15 pm »

Tan:

Thanks for the info. Wayne modded my SB3 digital and I have no idea what he did to it. But things do sound good with the SB3 hooked up to an APLhifi DAC. Won't hear me complaining about the sound.

Cheers
Charlie

tanchiro58 · « **Reply #50 on:** 20 Dec 2007, 11:26 pm »

Quote from: Charles Calkins on 20 Dec 2007, 09:15 pm

Tan:

Thanks for the info. Wayne modded my SB3 digital and I have no idea what he did to it. But things do sound good with the SB3 hooked up to an APLhifi DAC. Won't hear me complaining about the sound.

Cheers
Charlie

But I would not spend $$$$$$$ for PS like that!!!???

Charles Calkins · « **Reply #51 on:** 20 Dec 2007, 11:44 pm »

Tan;
No comprende?? What are you trying to tell this dumdum???

Cheers
Charlie

bhobba · « **Reply #52 on:** 21 Dec 2007, 12:00 am »

Quote from: mr_bill on 20 Dec 2007, 04:13 pm

So an outboard power supply change to an upgraded linear supply would not make a difference in sound whether you use digital output or analog output of the SB3?

Pat can correct me if I am wrong, but what he is saying is that grunge is not only determined by the SMPS but, by the device itself - his scope pictures show quite an improvement by changing stuff in the circuit. One would need both measurements and listening tests (including some blind) to get to the bottom of exactly what influences the sound.

Thanks
Bill

bhobba · « **Reply #53 on:** 21 Dec 2007, 12:29 am »

Quote from: Charles Calkins on 20 Dec 2007, 11:44 pm

No comprende?? What are you trying to tell this dumdum???

The Boulder supply is rather expensive. Tan may be saying he believes the cost is not commensurate with the improvement in performance. The reports of people who have listened to it suggest it is. But futher study is definitely required to see if the claims stack up - eg could you achieve the same or better improvements by the changes Pat made at a much lower cost.

The exact nature of Hugh's power supply is his secret. He designed it to have very low ripple and a negative impedance at higher frequencies. He claims it makes a big difference. Those of a more technical bent tend to scoff at this sort of stuff. Me - I would like to see the claims subjected to a blind listening test. Failing that you have to fall back on the respect you hold for the people making the claims. I have a very high respect for Hugh Dean.

Thanks
Bill

mr_bill · « **Reply #54 on:** 21 Dec 2007, 12:32 am »

How much is the hologram power supply and how do you buy one?

bhobba · « **Reply #55 on:** 21 Dec 2007, 12:38 am »

Quote from: mr_bill on 21 Dec 2007, 12:32 am

How much is the hologram power supply and how do you buy one?

Contact Hugh Dean at Aspen - it is $800.00 Australian. Although I have the greatest respect for Hugh it is a whack of money for a power supply - but then again the claims made for the increase in performance are also impressive. Only you can judge if those claims hold water since they are backed up by neither blind listening tests, nor a definitive measurement based analysis.

Thanks
Bill

art · « **Reply #56 on:** 21 Dec 2007, 04:29 am »

You guys are going to spend $800, Aussie, on an outboard power supply to drive a $300 doo-hickey that has a ratty SMPS inside!?

Are you all meshugah?

Pat

F-100 · « **Reply #57 on:** 21 Dec 2007, 04:38 am »

Quote from: art on 21 Dec 2007, 04:29 am

You guys are going to spend $800, Aussie, on an outboard power supply to drive a $300 doo-hickey that has a ratty SMPS inside!?

Are you all meshugah?

Pat

You ain't see nothing yet!!!
Some people here has spent over $1,000 USD on a power supply for their doo-hickey.

AliG · « **Reply #58 on:** 21 Dec 2007, 04:44 am »

I wish it was only $1000...

Quote from: F-100 on 21 Dec 2007, 04:38 am

You ain't see nothing yet!!!
Some people here has spent over $1,000 USD on a power supply for their doo-hickey.

art · « **Reply #59 on:** 21 Dec 2007, 04:45 am »

And still use the internal SMPS? They could take some of that money and buy an oscilloscope. Might change their whole outlook on life.

Pat