[WildPhydeaux]

It occurs to me that my BDP-3 is outputting DSD material (DSF files) as DoP when connected to my BDA-3.14 via USB. I can't seem to find how to make it output DSD natively.

Yes, I realize DoP is unaltered DSD inside a PCM wrapper. Still, the question stands: can the BDP-3 output Native DSD over USB without it being in DoP? And if so at what rates (64/128/256) and how to make it do this?

Secondly, in Manic Moose under Audio Devices I see "BDA3 Audio 2.0 - USB Audio (DSD Enabled)" which I assume is reporting the connection to my BDA-3.14. But I also see "Bryston BDP Audio Device - BUC Board (DSD Enabled)" - now what the heck is this?

EDIT:
Incidentally, I primarily use Roon so I thought perhaps that was an issue. I put the BDP-3 into MPD mode and used Manic Moose to queue up some DSD material that is stored on its internal hard disk (copy of same material I play with Roon pulling it from a NAS) and same thing: The BDA-3.14 shows DSD64 but not native, DoP.


@unincognito  ?

Cheers,
Robert

[bokko]

Hey Robert I don't have your hardware so can't be helpful there.

With Pi4b can tell you I am running Ropieee right now it's at Linux 4.19.126-1-SPCKFSH-V7l and can select Native under DSD playback strategy in Roon.
VitOS was also able to do this and can edit in it's Kernel if required later would have to switch back.

Cheers
Jerry

[BigGeek]

I am pretty sure the answer that you are going to get from the authorities on the subject is that DSD native output is not supported.

Now as to the "USB Audio (DSD enabled)" ...  that means that the check box has been checked next to that option to allow DSD data to flow through your USB connection. If you uncheck that box, you will not get DSD out of your USB ports.

The BUC board is the board that provides output to the AES and Coaxial outputs of the unit. I didn't even think that they were able to support DSD, so it is not clear to me why they would allow you to enable DSD through those outputs. I can check the box on my BDP-3. I know that if I check the box, I still will not get DSD to play on my BDA3 through the AES connection.

Maybe it is just that the BDA-3 won't accept DSD over those inputs and perhaps other DACs will allow it???

[James Tanner]

Hi Folks,

On the BDA3 only the USB will allow DSD playback.

james

[WildPhydeaux]

Hey Robert I don't have your hardware so can't be helpful there.

With Pi4b can tell you I am running Ropieee right now it's at Linux 4.19.126-1-SPCKFSH-V7l and can select Native under DSD playback strategy in Roon.
VitOS was also able to do this and can edit in it's Kernel if required later would have to switch back.

Cheers
Jerry

Thanks Jerry. And we know from your earlier thread that your BDA-3 does accept native DSD via USB since the DSD led lights pink and not blue for DoP. It's been said numerous times on this forum that the BDA-3.14 which I have is just a BDA-3 with the addition of a Pi, so assume mine would act identically.

Hey, quick question: have you tried any native DSD128? Reason I ask is that the manual lists that it accepts DSD64 and DSD256 over USB but doesn't mention DSD128 which seems odd.

Cheers,
Robert

[WildPhydeaux]

Thanks BigGeek, that clears up what BUC Board is. Good job its not documented in, say, the manual otherwise what would we need a support forum for...

Getting Bryston to clearly state what these devices can and cannot do seems to be a challenge.

Cheers,
Robert

[WildPhydeaux]

Hi Folks,

On the BDA3 only the USB will allow DSD playback.

james

Hi James, thanks for the response. The manual for the BDA-3/3.14 does indeed state that it can accept native DSD via USB (and also DSD64 via HDMI) but I knew that and it's not what I asked...

The question is how to make the BDP-3 send native DSD out of its USB port. Native, not DoP, to the BDA3/3.14

If it can, great, but how? If it can't, could I be told why and if it's likely to be remedied in the near future?

Cheers,
Robert

[bokko]

I have used transports Allo Digione Sig that were able to pass 24/192 1XDSD (64) it has a Coax or BNC connection. Nice board so is possible, USB works better for me. Not saying it is for this device no experience. What brought me to BDA-3 is separate paths for DSD and PCM.

I am pretty sure the answer that you are going to get from the authorities on the subject is that DSD native output is not supported.

Now as to the "USB Audio (DSD enabled)" ...  that means that the check box has been checked next to that option to allow DSD data to flow through your USB connection. If you uncheck that box, you will not get DSD out of your USB ports.

The BUC board is the board that provides output to the AES and Coaxial outputs of the unit. I didn't even think that they were able to support DSD, so it is not clear to me why they would allow you to enable DSD through those outputs. I can check the box on my BDP-3. I know that if I check the box, I still will not get DSD to play on my BDA3 through the AES connection.

Maybe it is just that the BDA-3 won't accept DSD over those inputs and perhaps other DACs will allow it???

[bokko]

Yes I have played DSD 64, 128, 256 all successfully except the problem at playback. DSD128 Eagles - Greatest Hits is the first one that popped on playback with no native light on. The other 128 Earth Wind and Fire - Raise is fine but no native light edit Mac doesn't pas native

I have done so connected digital and USB from my MAC Mini, USB from my PC (disconnected) and USB from Pi4b. Tried a bunch of setting in Roon too. 

Thanks Jerry. And we know from your earlier thread that your BDA-3 does accept native DSD via USB since the DSD led lights pink and not blue for DoP. It's been said numerous times on this forum that the BDA-3.14 which I have is just a BDA-3 with the addition of a Pi, so assume mine would act identically.

Hey, quick question: have you tried any native DSD128? Reason I ask is that the manual lists that it accepts DSD64 and DSD256 over USB but doesn't mention DSD128 which seems odd.

Cheers,
Robert

[WildPhydeaux]

Yes I have played DSD 64, 128, 256 all successfully except the problem at playback. DSD128 Eagles - Greatest Hits is the first one that popped on playback with no native light on. The other 128 Earth Wind and Fire - Raise is fine but no native light (recording from record) and sounds better than my record player.

I have done so connected digital and USB from my MAC Mini, USB from my PC (disconnected) and USB from Pi4b. Tried a bunch of setting in Roon too.

Thanks for that. So inconclusive then. The led is not pink with either of the two DSD128 albums you tried (I assume it's blue for DoP) but it was pink (native) for the DSD64 and DSD256. Good to know. I wonder why it doesn't do 128 native, but that jives with what the manual says.

Cheers,
Robert

[bokko]

Yes I think you would have to connect USB from BDA-3.14 to one of devices listed above bypassing BDP-3 which why I went for a BDA-3 only at least that's how I read it.

Hi James, thanks for the response. The manual for the BDA-3/3.14 does indeed state that it can accept native DSD via USB (and also DSD64 via HDMI) but I knew that and it's not what I asked...

The question is how to make the BDP-3 send native DSD out of its USB port. Native, not DoP, to the BDA3/3.14

If it can, great, but how? If it can't, could I be told why and if it's likely to be remedied in the near future?

Cheers,
Robert

[bokko]

Never mind just connected my Mac Mini it can't do Native it seems.
Switched over to the Pi4b and played same two dsd128 albums and native light came on for both and playback start problem was back.
Interesting while playing out of Mac it made playback start sound but light for native did not come on...

Thanks for that. So inconclusive then. The led is not pink with either of the two DSD128 albums you tried (I assume it's blue for DoP) but it was pink (native) for the DSD64 and DSD256. Good to know. I wonder why it doesn't do 128 native, but that jives with what the manual says.

Cheers,
Robert

[unincognito]

It occurs to me that my BDP-3 is outputting DSD material (DSF files) as DoP when connected to my BDA-3.14 via USB. I can't seem to find how to make it output DSD natively.

Yes, I realize DoP is unaltered DSD inside a PCM wrapper. Still, the question stands: can the BDP-3 output Native DSD over USB without it being in DoP? And if so at what rates (64/128/256) and how to make it do this?

Secondly, in Manic Moose under Audio Devices I see "BDA3 Audio 2.0 - USB Audio (DSD Enabled)" which I assume is reporting the connection to my BDA-3.14. But I also see "Bryston BDP Audio Device - BUC Board (DSD Enabled)" - now what the heck is this?

EDIT:
Incidentally, I primarily use Roon so I thought perhaps that was an issue. I put the BDP-3 into MPD mode and used Manic Moose to queue up some DSD material that is stored on its internal hard disk (copy of same material I play with Roon pulling it from a NAS) and same thing: The BDA-3.14 shows DSD64 but not native, DoP.


@unincognito  ?

Cheers,
Robert

DoP (represented by a green led on the BDA-3 DAC) is just as much DSD as native DSD (represented by an amber led on the BDA-3 DAC) is; same DSD format just different method of transmitting it.

(DSD Enabled), means that its safe for the BDP to send DSD content on that interface
BDA3 Audio 2.0 - USB Audio, this is the usb connection between the BDP and the BDA
Bryston BDP Audio Device - BUC Board, this is the digital output on the back of the BDP-3, the digital AES/EBU and coax output

Chris

[WildPhydeaux]

DoP (represented by a green led on the BDA-3 DAC) is just as much DSD as native DSD (represented by an amber led on the BDA-3 DAC) is; same DSD format just different method of transmitting it.

(DSD Enabled), means that its safe for the BDP to send DSD content on that interface
BDA3 Audio 2.0 - USB Audio, this is the usb connection between the BDP and the BDA
Bryston BDP Audio Device - BUC Board, this is the digital output on the back of the BDP-3, the digital AES/EBU and coax output

Chris

Thanks very much for jumping in Chris, I appreciate the informal access we have to you and James.

And thank you for clearing up what the BUC Board is, makes perfect sense now to me.

But on the primary question you haven't really answered to my satisfaction. As I mentioned in my initial post, I do know that DoP is fully DSD content, just inside a transport wrapper. I don't question for a second that what's inside is the original content. And DoP likely makes DSD transport more flexible when interfacing other manufacturers gear, just my speculation. That's all fine. But the question is: can the BDP-3 output DSD natively (not wrapped in DoP) when connected to a BDA3/3.14 directly via USB? If not, why not? I know the BDA3/3.14 can accept and process native DSD. Please ignore Roon as a factor and assume I'm using MemorableMousse...

Grandma is visiting my house and wants to give me $10 for my birthday. She is right there in front of me yet she takes it from her purse and puts it in an envelope and hands it to me. It's the same $10 bill and we're in the same room looking at each other. Why put it in an envelope?

If I can press you for one other query that has recently puzzled me. From the BDA-3.14 manual the graphic/table that lists interfaces and their protocol/bitrate capabilities it appears the USB port can handle DSD64 and DSD256 but DSD128 is not listed. This seems odd - could you comment on that?

Thanks again and Cheers!
Robert

[unincognito]

can the BDP-3 output DSD natively (not wrapped in DoP) when connected to a BDA3/3.14 directly via USB? If not, why not? I know the BDA3/3.14 can accept and process native DSD. Please ignore Roon as a factor and assume I'm using MemorableMousse...

Grandma is visiting my house and wants to give me $10 for my birthday. She right there in front of me yet she takes it from her purse and puts it in an envelope and hands it to me. It's the same $10 bill and we're in the same room looking at each other. Why put it in an envelope?

If I can press you for one other query that has recently puzzled me. From the BDA-3.14 manual the graphic/table that lists interfaces and their protocol/bitrate capabilities it appears the USB port can handle DSD64 and DSD256 but DSD128 is not listed. This seems odd - could you comment on that?

Currently no, its a software change and one that is part of a massive change in the firmware.  That change will apply to other units as well, most likely the BDP-2, BDP-Pi, BDA-3.14 (not that it will recieve native dsd support but the firmware will be released for it) and any future Bryston products containing these types of features.

Second question, I'm not sure, but my inner 8 year olds wants to say the cookie fairies sprinkled a little magic on said bill while grandma was stuffing it into the envelope.

I can't really speak on behalf of the manual as i didn't write it or was involved in its construction, but would say either DSD128 support was intended to be inferred, over looked (this sort a thing happens) or otherwise not realized.

Chris

[WildPhydeaux]

Currently no, its a software change and one that is part of a massive change in the firmware.  That change will apply to other units as well, most likely the BDP-2, BDP-Pi, BDA-3.14 (not that it will recieve native dsd support but the firmware will be released for it) and any future Bryston products containing these types of features.

Second question, I'm not sure, but my inner 8 year olds wants to say the cookie fairies sprinkled a little magic on said bill while grandma was stuffing it into the envelope.

I can't really speak on behalf of the manual as i didn't write it or was involved in its construction, but would say either DSD128 support was intended to be inferred, over looked (this sort a thing happens) or otherwise not realized.

Chris

Thank you very much Chris, this answers my questions perfectly. Appreciate the clarification.

Cheers,
Robert