Prices on self contained roof top AC units?

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JLM

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Re: Prices on self contained roof top AC units?
« Reply #40 on: 31 Jul 2016, 10:02 am »
Probably true but you can do a lot of nice stuff to a small house without spending a lot.
My entire house has 7 windows. I went with the Marvin Integrity glider with LoE 366 w/Argon - total cost $3352.27
Replacing the windows was a no-brainer. Did I mention new windows are quiet? You wouldn't believe how low the ambient sound level is with new windows (think music room).

Most efficient windows: fixed (not every window in the house needs to open, most of ours don't).
Next most efficient windows: casement/awning (hinged like a door, the seals work better).
Worst efficiency windows: sliders/double hung (no compression of seals along the sliding portions).

But yes, good windows are quiet.  We bought poor man Pella (the ones with 13/16" separation between glazing which are great) windows (Norco, now called Jel-Win) and can barely hear 40 mph wind outside.

JLM

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Re: Prices on self contained roof top AC units?
« Reply #41 on: 31 Jul 2016, 10:25 am »
If you are looking to do insulation, you may want to consider this product rather than traditional OC pink.

http://www.insolcorp.com/

InifinteR is a phase change material that has some amazing qualities. We're getting ready to do a major addition to our house adding almost 1000 square feet. I've currently got a 3 ton, 21 SEER variable speed Carrier heat pump. With the properties of InfinateR, I'm estimating I'll be oversized after I add a few VAV dampers to the system and play with diversity a bit.

On their website, watch this video in particular;
https://vimeo.com/157063495

If you are an engineering geek in the building industry, this stuff is uber cool. I've got one of my commercial customers ready to install 120K sf on their buildings.

This stuff runs $2/sf in quantities under 5000sf and $1.50/sf in quantities over.

I'm wrapping as much of my house, garage, barn and condo as I can with it.

Know the concept of thermal mass well (thought about underground houses in the 70's) and phase change (have an engineering degree) but not convinced of the value of this product.  On moderate days (temperature swings between say 40F and 80F) our furnace/air conditioning barely runs (due to the inherent thermal mass the house already has).  On colder days (with temperature swings between -20F and 30F) where the real energy costs are experienced don't foresee the phase change (the real energy savings of this product) occurring.

Better to add "real" thermal mass inside the house and insulate/seal the house.  For instance we have R11 insulation under our basement slab and a 13 foot tall stone fireplace totally inside the thermal envelope.  We put 75% of our windows facing south (with 2 foot overhangs) and 5% facing north.  And we used house wrap plus a 1/4" fan-fold styrofoam sheathing.  Wished we had used SIP (structural insulated panels) throughout that turns your house into a plywood refrigerator.  (The panels are made up of sheets up to 8ft x 24ft of rigid foam glued between sheets of OSB/plywood and are very strong, so there are no/few studs to create a thermal break.  These can be used for walls, foundation walls, or ceilings/roofs.) 

Sorry for dragging this thread off topic.

Scott F.

Re: Prices on self contained roof top AC units?
« Reply #42 on: 31 Jul 2016, 12:40 pm »
...the product is used to supplement building insulation

WGH

Re: Prices on self contained roof top AC units?
« Reply #43 on: 31 Jul 2016, 03:11 pm »
I think everything mentioned so far is related to AC units. Until recently all the older homes in the center of Tucson had evaporative (swamp) cooling. Many of these houses now have AC but without adding extra insulation and they still have the single glazed crank open steel casement windows. I saw many of these homes when I was looking to buy and thought the cooling cost during our 6 month long summer has to be sky high. Even with ceiling fans the temperature in these houses roller coasters up and down, from getting uncomfortably warm to getting blasted with cold air then actually feeling the heat increase as soon as the AC turns off.

Wayne