[mark funk]

Why? Are your cables worn out? How long do cables last? Must be replaced every few years? 


                                                                                   

[vermont99]

For L/R using Emotiva XLR cables to my 2 Xpa-1 amps and Emotiva RCA’s to the XPA-5, very happy with the sound quality and the seem very well made. The XLR’s did make an improvement over the RCA’s.

[saeyedoc]

I think everyone goes through this insanity.  That said, I think there are places where it makes sense. Recently I swapped out a stock HDMI cable for a DH labs HDMI cable and the results were astounding!  Even my wife noted how much of an impact it had.

Seriously? How does that work, cleaner 1s and Os? My understanding about HDMI cables is they either work or they don't, no in between.
I doubt it would hold up to a DBT.

[roscoeiii]

Seriously? How does that work, cleaner 1s and Os? My understanding about HDMI cables is they either work or they don't, no in between.
I doubt it would hold up to a DBT.

There is improvement that we hear and can explain, and there is improvement that we hear and can't explain. But both are worthwhile if you are hunting for the best sound.

More and more I find myself posting things along the lines of "audition and hear for yourself whether there is what you consider to be a worthwhile difference." In many cases you will only be out the cost of postage.

[mick wolfe]

There is improvement that we hear and can explain, and there is improvement that we hear and can't explain. But both are worthwhile if you are hunting for the best sound.

More and more I find myself posting things along the lines of "audition and hear for yourself whether there is what you consider to be a worthwhile difference." In many cases you will only be out the cost of postage.

I have to agree 100%. All the speculation on cables is for the most part useless. Especially those that claim cables make no difference. If someone really wants to know if there is a difference, do some real auditioning in your system. Be your own judge. Like you say, no real money changes hands until you decide to purchase.

[cujobob]

There is improvement that we hear and can explain, and there is improvement that we hear and can't explain. But both are worthwhile if you are hunting for the best sound.

More and more I find myself posting things along the lines of "audition and hear for yourself whether there is what you consider to be a worthwhile difference." In many cases you will only be out the cost of postage.

There is also that which you can't hear but believe you do. That's the problem with auditioning.

[saeyedoc]

I can see where analog cables could possibly make a difference, although I think there are better places to spend money if you are looking for improvements.
I don't see how different HDMI cables can make a difference, the engineer in me just doesn't think there's any scientific basis in it.
There can be differences in aesthetics, build quality and durability. Then there's pride of ownership.
I suppose if you think there's an improvement, even if it's a placebo effect, it can be real to an individual person.
I understand how people with 10k speakers and expensive electronics wouldn't want to put a $3 monoprice HDMI cable in their system, that's their perogative.

[roscoeiii]

There is also that which you can't hear but believe you do. That's the problem with auditioning.

True there is that. Double Blind testing ought to take care of that though. Whether folks are willing to do that or not is another question.

[roscoeiii]

I can see where analog cables could possibly make a difference, although I think there are better places to spend money if you are looking for improvements.
I don't see how different HDMI cables can make a difference, the engineer in me just doesn't think there's any scientific basis in it.
There can be differences in aesthetics, build quality and durability. Then there's pride of ownership.
I suppose if you think there's an improvement, even if it's a placebo effect, it can be real to an individual person.
I understand how people with 10k speakers and expensive electronics wouldn't want to put a $3 monoprice HDMI cable in their system, that's their perogative.

Well, if you or any other ACer uses HDMI (I don't), it is easy enough to test this out. Probably best to do Double Blind testing.

And the scientist in me also tells me that just because an effect can't be explained doesn't mean it is not there. And there may be audible effects whose explanations of bullshit, but that also doesn't mean that they aren't there.

Ultimately ears are the most important instruments for assessing audio equipment.

[rollo]

 Since you are using Emotiva gear it would make sense to try thier cables. I'm sure they are voiced to thier gear.
  Use what you own until the speaker and components break in. After 400 hours then try  cables. I would start with the speaker cable as it will make the biggest difference. Notice I said difference. Have fun trying.


charles

[vortrex]

I've done 3 stages of cabling changes, from bluejeans to zu to higher end stuff.  there is a difference.  I'll be the first to admit when I have wasted money or something is crap.

I found the following order of best bang for the buck:

phono
interconnects
speaker/power

like someone else mentioned though, room treatments will offer far more improvements than all of the above combined.

[saeyedoc]

I've done 3 stages of cabling changes, from bluejeans to zu to higher end stuff.  there is a difference.  I'll be the first to admit when I have wasted money or something is crap.

I found the following order of best bang for the buck:

phono
interconnects
speaker/power

like someone else mentioned though, room treatments will offer far more improvements than all of the above combined.

I agree with that order. I don't see how power cords can make any difference though. You're still dealing with all of that wire from the power station to the socket. AC is then converted to DC by the power supply anyway.
How about fuses, there's a long thread on Agon about them.
No HDMI DBT testing for me, it's a pain to run them through my walls and it's very time consuming. 
It's amazing the difference in attitudes about this stuff from forum to forum. 

[roscoeiii]

I've done 3 stages of cabling changes, from bluejeans to zu to higher end stuff.  there is a difference.  I'll be the first to admit when I have wasted money or something is crap.

I found the following order of best bang for the buck:

phono
interconnects
speaker/power

like someone else mentioned though, room treatments will offer far more improvements than all of the above combined.

+1 to most of that post (and the point about room treatments). But depnding on your situation # 2 & 3 may change in their order.

Speaker cables may make a bigger difference with certain amp and speaker combos. For reasons that are beyond me, but that has been my actual experience

And the impact of a power cord or power conditioner may differ according to the quality of your AC (mine is fluctuating junk for example) and the quality of your components' power supply.

Saeyedoc, it sounds like you also haven't actually tried an upgrade in power cords or conditioners. I would highly recommend looking into this. Easy to audition and at most just be out shipping. Maybe start with a Shunyata Venom 3 from Music Direct. Shunyata is an established brand and these cords have gotten some nice praise.
 

[vortrex]

I don't see how power cords can make any difference though. You're still dealing with all of that wire from the power station to the socket. AC is then converted to DC by the power supply anyway.

I have no idea, but I'm no electrical engineer.  I'm only using cheapo shunyata venom 3's too and there is a difference from stock.  there is a blacker background.  you could use the same argument for speaker cables though.  Selah (maybe Salk too?) use cheapo internal wiring.  so how do speaker cables between the amp and binding posts make a difference when the "last mile" is stuff from home depot or wherever?

[werd]

I have no idea, but I'm no electrical engineer.  I'm only using cheapo shunyata venom 3's too and there is a difference from stock.  there is a blacker background.  you could use the same argument for speaker cables though.  Selah (maybe Salk too?) use cheapo internal wiring.  so how do speaker cables between the amp and binding posts make a difference when the "last mile" is stuff from home depot or wherever?

I think it has to do with how the local service transformer sees your house. It's a known fact that current will take the easiest path. Your house and even your stereo are all in competition with the entire neighborhood on power consumption. You are basically fighting for power from your neighbors fridges,stoves etc.

Does it not make sense then if you want to up your stiffness or power then lower the entire house impedance. This is what I think power cables do. They lower the impedance that the local service sees. You can even take it one step further by employing larger power cables on everything in your house along with hospital grade outlets. This will lower the impedance of the entire home which will in the end benefit your stereo.

[music_lover_v2]

Selah (maybe Salk too?) use cheapo internal wiring.

I hope this is not the case with the Salks. But, it would be interesting to know what is used here. I remember reading somewhere that the internal wiring is a good quality 14AWG silver coated copper wire.. But, someone can confirm.

[saeyedoc]

I think it has to do with how the local service transformer sees your house. It's a known fact that current will take the easiest path. Your house and even your stereo are all in competition with the entire neighborhood on power consumption. You are basically fighting for power from your neighbors fridges,stoves etc.

Does it not make sense then if you want to up your stiffness or power then lower the entire house impedance. This is what I think power cables do. They lower the impedance that the local service sees. You can even take it one step further by employing larger power cables on everything in your house along with hospital grade outlets. This will lower the impedance of the entire home which will in the end benefit your stereo.

Now that just seems silly. No way changing a power cord on your amp and pre-amp are going to significantly lower the impedence of your whole house. Are you changing all the wires going to your AC also?
I could see how a power conditioner could make a difference and it may then make sense to use an upgraded cord from the conditioner to the equipment.

[vortrex]

I could see how a power conditioner could make a difference and it may then make sense to use an upgraded cord from the conditioner to the equipment.

I should note I use a PS Audio Duet, with Venom 3's to the wall and equipment.  Also a PS Audio wall plug.

[DaveC113]

I went with DH labs for digi coax, it sounds nice but I haven't tried a lot of different cables of this type. You can DIY coax, but you'd have to invest in a crimper, which I do not want to do.

I DIY my own ICs, PCs and Speaker Cable.

For speaker cable, best bang for the buck, and what I still use is a star-quad of mil-spec silver plated copper wire with teflon insulation. Choose your favorite 2 colors, put one end in a vice, the other in a drill, and twist the wires into a star quad...   goal here is to reduce inductance, it raises capacitance, but not excessively. Price varies depending on the deal you get on the mil spec wire and what gauge you choose, mine came out to under $0.50/ft. It beats a lot of more expensive wires I've tried.

For ICs the goal is to reduce capacitance, the best designs have creative 3-D geometry that accomplishes this goal, my favorite is a counter-rotating, litz-braided helix using several conductors per pole. I used this Jupiter 8-strand wire, at $20/ft it's not cheap, but not bad either if you buy the RCA connectors and terminate it yourself.

http://jupitercondenser.com/Cable/cotton-insulated-cable.html

Power cords I built are a twisted pair of 12 ga mil-spec wire (as above) with the ground counter-rotating around the twisted pair. Again, super cheap and big improvement in sound vs. "regular" pcs.

[PSB Guy]

Selah (maybe Salk too?) use cheapo internal wiring.

I hope this is not the case with the Salks. But, it would be interesting to know what is used here. I remember reading somewhere that the internal wiring is a good quality 14AWG silver coated copper wire.. But, someone can confirm.

I'm sure Jim can confirm this, but when I had my SongBird apart to replace the damaged woofer, the internal wiring looked anything but cheap. Quite heavy, in fact, but I don't know the AWG.

Cornelis