I test drove a Tesla 3 this morning.

avahifi · « **Reply #320 on:** 1 Jul 2019, 12:40 pm »

Hi Ron.

Did you get it in time for the rebate?

Got all it’s controls figured out?

Frank

Tomy2Tone · « **Reply #321 on:** 1 Jul 2019, 01:08 pm »

Friend of mine was telling me about this new ev called Rivian. I think Ford is involved with them somehow. Maybe Tesla can have some competition

https://youtu.be/QMfxJEfb4lw

rlee8394 · « **Reply #322 on:** 1 Jul 2019, 07:30 pm »

Frank,

Yes, I did get it in time for the tax credit. Got most of the controls all figured out. A guy I work with has had his since November and got me up to speed. Ordered the key fob this morning. Need to get thumb drive for the Dash Cam and Sentry mode.

-Ron

stlrman · « **Reply #323 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 02:32 am »

Do they offer online classes on how to operate the vehicles? Seems like they should .

EkW · « **Reply #324 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 02:44 am »

The Rivian looks to be well thought out and funded. They didn't spend years promising delivery mext year but quietly went about setting up their company and preparing to produce the vehicle. I have no need or desire for a giant pickup or SUV but they seem to be very popular. I like vehicle and hope that they are very successful.

I've had a Model S for a couple of years (bought used) and really like it. Had a rental gas car last week during a business trip. Yuck. One day I parked, put it in park and walked away, as is usual in a Tesla. When I got back to the car it was still running. Oops.

stlrman · « **Reply #325 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 02:45 am »

65,000 to 70,000 for a freakin flatbed truck??!!
Let’s call that vehicle what it is . A toy for the rich .

When are electric vehicles going to be offered for 18 -28. grand ?
That’s when many people will jump in, I believe. When people see equal prices for moderately priced electric vehicles, then why not make the leap?

Saturn94 · « **Reply #326 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 03:34 am »

Something I’ve wondered about....

Tesla and others are posting range ratings that are getting more attractive. But then they say for the health of the battery, keep it charged between 30-80%. If one follows this advice, doesn’t it effectively cut the useful range in half?

Am I missing something here?

cliffy · « **Reply #327 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 05:37 am »

Interesting read.

https://economics21.org/inconvenient-realities-new-energy-economy

rollo · « **Reply #328 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 02:00 pm »

Another thing to consider is the battery. To manufacture one battery the CO2 emissions produced is more than 8 years of use of a gasoline vehicle according to a Swedish Gov't study. Very interesting fact to consider when purchasing an Electric car.

charles

Tomy2Tone · « **Reply #329 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 02:09 pm »

Quote from: rollo on 2 Jul 2019, 02:00 pm

Another thing to consider is the battery. To manufacture one battery the CO2 emissions produced is more than 8 years of use of a gasoline vehicle according to a Swedish Gov't study. Very interesting fact to consider when purchasing an Electric car.

charles

This one is from Germany...

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-04-21/new-study-shocks-electric-cars-considerably-worse-climate-diesel-cars?fbclid=IwAR2q5A5MorCkzcKfEJ5WrvkGVXrXXDk8dQVmuSmGllxKHztn05rYsUrUT0Q

DaveC113 · « **Reply #330 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 03:11 pm »

Yup, I keep on saying it but it'll take a lot of convincing after all the BS people have been fed.

Tesla in particular are likely FAR worse for the environment, including CO2 emissions, vs a small ICE powered car. On top of that, the batteries and motor's requirements for materials and manufacturing are creating an environmental and social disaster. Google rare earth and cobalt mining and see how good you feel about using these resources. It's like buying a 10,000 smartphones, and some African kid has to carry a few bags of cobalt ore for each one. The scale of rare earth mining in China is incredible, and only getting larger to make more batteries and motors for EVs.

EVs are the future, but that future is dependent on tech that doesn't exist yet. Getting into EVs now has some upsides, as any tech needs to be developed, but large-scale adaption of EV doesn't make sense right now.

And, folks with Teslas need to STOP with their saving the world BS. You're not. It would probably be better for the world if you bought a normal car. I have no issue with Teslas and ownership of Teslas, but just stop pretending it's anything other than a toy that uses just as much, if not more, resources than any other luxury car, sports car, or pickup truck.

lokie · « **Reply #331 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 03:44 pm »

Great discussion and excellent articles.
The public energy discourse in general needs more math and less group think emotion/ attitude.

DaveC113 · « **Reply #332 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 04:22 pm »

And if you believe the BS that's it's also the fastest car, it is in a straight line but it can't hang with a real sports car as far as handling. I do agree the way the Model 3 AWD launches off the line is amazing, it's the fastest accelerating car from a stop I've ever driven... BY FAR.

In the vid below the M2 destroys the 3 around a track, then look at the times posted at the end... a $45k Camaro 1LE smoked it by about 2.5 seconds! If you buy a Tesla because you think it's the best as far as driving dynamics, you may have made the wrong choice there too. Tesla can't come close to Chevy as far as suspension and chassis!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Pu9046wX9g

Emil · « **Reply #333 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 04:32 pm »

Quote from: rollo on 2 Jul 2019, 02:00 pm

Another thing to consider is the battery. To manufacture one battery the CO2 emissions produced is more than 8 years of use of a gasoline vehicle according to a Swedish Gov't study. Very interesting fact to consider when purchasing an Electric car.

charles

Not to mention what to do with these batteries at the end of their lives

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2018-06-27/where-3-million-electric-vehicle-batteries-will-go-when-they-retire

jtwrace · « **Reply #334 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 04:45 pm »

Quote from: DaveC113 on 2 Jul 2019, 03:11 pm

Yup, I keep on saying it but it'll take a lot of convincing after all the BS people have been fed.

Tesla in particular are likely FAR worse for the environment, including CO2 emissions, vs a small ICE powered car. On top of that, the batteries and motor's requirements for materials and manufacturing are creating an environmental and social disaster. Google rare earth and cobalt mining and see how good you feel about using these resources. It's like buying a 10,000 smartphones, and some African kid has to carry a few bags of cobalt ore for each one. The scale of rare earth mining in China is incredible, and only getting larger to make more batteries and motors for EVs.

EVs are the future, but that future is dependent on tech that doesn't exist yet. Getting into EVs now has some upsides, as any tech needs to be developed, but large-scale adaption of EV doesn't make sense right now.

And, folks with Teslas need to STOP with their saving the world BS. You're not. It would probably be better for the world if you bought a normal car. I have no issue with Teslas and ownership of Teslas, but just stop pretending it's anything other than a toy that uses just as much, if not more, resources than any other luxury car, sports car, or pickup truck.

100% agreed and I'll add solar panels into the mix too. The end of life issues that surround them are quite staggering and yet not thought about. It's such a farce.

https://theweek.com/articles/831864/recycling-crisis

audioengr · « **Reply #335 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 05:03 pm »

Quote from: Saturn94 on 2 Jul 2019, 03:34 am

Something I’ve wondered about....

Tesla and others are posting range ratings that are getting more attractive. But then they say for the health of the battery, keep it charged between 30-80%. If one follows this advice, doesn’t it effectively cut the useful range in half?

Am I missing something here?

Yes, but for local drivers, this is more than enough range. This extends the battery life. On vacation, you charge it fully.

audioengr · « **Reply #336 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 05:04 pm »

Quote from: rollo on 2 Jul 2019, 02:00 pm

Another thing to consider is the battery. To manufacture one battery the CO2 emissions produced is more than 8 years of use of a gasoline vehicle according to a Swedish Gov't study. Very interesting fact to consider when purchasing an Electric car.

charles

That assumes the power is coming from fossil-fuel plants. This will change in the future, hopefully near future or we will all perish.

audioengr · « **Reply #337 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 05:06 pm »

Quote from: DaveC113 on 2 Jul 2019, 03:11 pm

EVs are the future, but that future is dependent on tech that doesn't exist yet. Getting into EVs now has some upsides, as any tech needs to be developed, but large-scale adaption of EV doesn't make sense right now.

I does if you want your grandchildren to live in a normal world, not a world of constant disasters and wars.

audioengr · « **Reply #338 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 05:08 pm »

Quote from: jtwrace on 2 Jul 2019, 04:45 pm

100% agreed and I'll add solar panels into the mix too. The end of life issues that surround them are quite staggering and yet not thought about. It's such a farce.

https://theweek.com/articles/831864/recycling-crisis

How long do you think your battery in your laptop will last? I've had one for more than 15 years and it's still okay. Most people replace their cars within 5 years anyway.

jtwrace · « **Reply #339 on:** 2 Jul 2019, 05:15 pm »

Quote from: audioengr on 2 Jul 2019, 05:08 pm

How long do you think your battery in your laptop will last? I've had one for more than 15 years and it's still okay. Most people replace their cars within 5 years anyway.

What's your point? I'm not trying to save the world with a Tesla. Replacing your Tesla within 5 yrs is MUCH more wasteful than just driving a regular car anyway. The thought that it doesn't take oil to produce anything is where the issue starts. Oil is used for manufacturing every single item in the world regardless of what it is. That's fact.