AudioCircle
Industry Circles => Audio by Van Alstine => Topic started by: DecibleDude on 3 Mar 2024, 03:34 am
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I'm curious what speakers people with this Control amp are using and why?
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I am using a set of Philharmonic BMR Monitors with excellent results.
Frank
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I have GR Research X-LS Encore monitors and Tyler Acoustics Lindbrook Signature Floor standing speakers and both sound great. I Have to say i was surprised how well this little amp drives the Lindbrook's.
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Fritz Carbon 7 SE MK2’s
Lovely pairing with the SET120
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I have GR Research X-LS Encore monitors and Tyler Acoustics Lindbrook Signature Floor standing speakers and both sound great. I Have to say i was surprised how well this little amp drives the Lindbrook's.
That's the thing that had me wondering, because by todays standards 60 wpc isn't a great deal and most modern speakers are fairly inefficient. I have a pair of Elac's which are power sponges and yet this little amp drives them nicely to loud levels in a small room. So I was wondering about the efficiency of other peoples speakers relative to room size.
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I am using a set of Philharmonic BMR Monitors with excellent results.
Frank
Holy Moley, if it can drive those it should be able to handle most speakers I would think. Do you ever play loud music on them?
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I have GR Research X-LS Encore monitors and Tyler Acoustics Lindbrook Signature Floor standing speakers and both sound great. I Have to say i was surprised how well this little amp drives the Lindbrook's.
So the Lindbrook's appear to be fairly efficient at 92db which is probably ideal. For some reason they state the minimum amp power for those speakers to be 25 wpc but I think even less than that could drive them pretty well, but then again, maybe they're designed for larger rooms. Are they large speakers?
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Fritz Carbon 7 SE MK2’s
Lovely pairing with the SET120
Yeah, that seems like a good match at 88db at one meter. How would you characterize the sound of the speakers?
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Watkins G4 stand mounts (88 dBm@1/1)...why this choice of speaker? You know it when you hear it - exactly like all of the Audio by Van Alstine equipment has performed over the decades - you know you have found something special when you hear it
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I used the Fritz Carreras with mine.
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That's the thing that had me wondering, because by todays standards 60 wpc isn't a great deal and most modern speakers are fairly inefficient. I have a pair of Elac's which are power sponges and yet this little amp drives them nicely to loud levels in a small room. So I was wondering about the efficiency of other peoples speakers relative to room size.
The SET120 is rated at 60wpc but with a robust power supply that can supply current when the load (speakers) require it to. This amp doubles its 60wpc @8Ohms rating to 120wpc when the speakers are 4Ohms and can supply bursts of power necessary when the impedance load of the speakers dips down even lower in certain frequency bands.
Yeah it’s the least powerful amp in the AVA lineup but it’s plenty of power for most reasonable speakers in reasonable rooms.
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It's funny, I had concerns before buying this amp whether first of all it would have enough power, and then secondly, if the passive preamp would prevent me from reaching loud volumes with my fairly inefficient speakers. None of those things were an issue, so now as a non-technical person I'm wondering why any integrated amp needs a preamp? I've also discovered that the amp is damn near silent noise wise even with the volume set at the twelve O'clock position, which in my smallish room and with my speakers would be louder then I would likely ever play music. All this is obviously good, but confusing, given that the amp supposedly has it's gain 3db higher from the get-go.
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Yes, since I also use the Vision Q+ Phono Preamplifier and I use a stand alone DAC, I actually don't hear ;) a need for a stand alone preamp. I like this way of doing things. And the sound is exquisite.
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The Lindbrook's are fairly large, 2- 8" woofers and 2- 7" mid's
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Yeah, pretty big so definitely not for small rooms.
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Apologies for going off topic here but can someone tell me what the gain of this amplifier is please? The website says 6db more gain than the standard SET 120, but doesn't say what the gain of that amplifier is. Thanks !
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Gain of SET 120 Control Amp is 26 dB.
Gain of the basic SET 120 power amp is 20 db.
Frank
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Closer look at the system and Watkins
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=262092)
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What speakers are those TomBo, and how big a room? Do you know what the speakers efficiency is?
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Gain of SET 120 Control Amp is 26 dB.
Gain of the basic SET 120 power amp is 20 db.
Frank
Frank, Thank you for the quick reply. Not to disrupt this thread further, but could you also tell me what the gain of the M225s is please?
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DecibleDude , these are the leap of faith rewarded Watkins Generation Fours... Room is 18 x 10... with a vaulted ceiling... very good sound. No need to add a bunch of sound absorption materials... fantastic sound
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Close up of the room with emphasis on the vaulted ceiling...
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=262094)
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I just got a used black SET 120 control amp and I'm using Philharmonic Audio's Affordable Accuracy Monitors. With the SET I'm hearing more clarity overall and improved bass response. I'm looking to pick up a used pair of Philharmonic's BMR monitors. Can't afford 'em right away, though. The AAMs are the last version - he doesn't make them any longer. Before this pair I had his previous version - the modified Pioneers.
I moved up from an Insight control amp - never made for production but designed by and AVA for his own use.
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The voltage gain of the set 120 is 22 or 23. This should be: 20 log 22 = 27 db
The voltage gain of the M225 is pretty close to the voltage gain of the set 120 control amp (with volume on full) which is about 45. This should be 20 log 45 = 33 db
Note: The set 120 control amp (with volume around half) will be quite close to a stock set 120.
Dan
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....The voltage gain of the M225 is pretty close to the voltage gain of the set 120 control amp (with volume on full) which is about 45. This should be 20 log 45 = 33 db....
Dan
Apologies for my confusion. Are you saying both the SET 120 Control amp and the M225 have 33db of gain, and the standard SET 120 has 27db of gain? Just verifying, as Frank just posted the SET 120/120 Control amp have 20db and 26db gain respectively.
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My numbers are accurate, both the SET 120 Control amp and the M225 have 33db of gain (voltage gain of 45), and the standard SET 120 has 27db of gain (voltage gain of 22).
We did a very limited production run of special low gain SET120's a few years back, that may be where the 20 db number came from (voltage gain of 10) and then the control amp is 6 db more.
Dan
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My numbers are accurate, both the SET 120 Control amp and the M225 have 33db of gain (voltage gain of 45), and the standard SET 120 has 27db of gain (voltage gain of 22).
We did a very limited production run of special low gain SET120's a few years back, that may be where the 20 db number came from (voltage gain of 10) and then the control amp is 6 db more.
Dan
Dan, Thank you for the clarification, that's exactly what I needed to know. :thumb:
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The voltage gain of the set 120 is 22 or 23. This should be: 20 log 22 = 27 db
The voltage gain of the M225 is pretty close to the voltage gain of the set 120 control amp (with volume on full) which is about 45. This should be 20 log 45 = 33 db
Note: The set 120 control amp (with volume around half) will be quite close to a stock set 120.
Dan
Hi Dan, the 33db gain on the control amp sounds kind of high to a non tech like me. Are there any downsides to this? Thanks.
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Gain of M225 and M750 balanced mono differential amplifiers are both 33 db. Gain of SET 500 stereo amp is 27 db.
Frank
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Gain of M225 and M750 balanced mono differential amplifiers are both 26 db. Gain of SET 500 stereo amp is 20 db.
Frank
Hi Frank, you had previously said that the gain of the set 120 "control amp" was 26db, but Dan said it was 33 db, has it changed or was one of you just mistaken? Thanks.
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Well, one of us is probably wrong. Dan however has worked with that circuit much more recently than I have.
I will check with him.
Frank
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Thanks Frank, much appreciated.
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Salk Songtowers
Salk SS6M
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Well, one of us is probably wrong. Dan however has worked with that circuit much more recently than I have.
I will check with him.
Frank
Just hoping to confirm what the gain of these 3 amplifiers is. SET 120, SET 120 Control, M225. Thanks!
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Just hoping to confirm what the gain of these 3 amplifiers is. SET 120, SET 120 Control, M225. Thanks!
Rusty,
The SET 120 amplifier has a gain of 27dB.
The SET 120 Control amplifier has a gain of 33 dB with the volume control full on.
The M225 amplifier has a gain of 33dB.
I promise these are the correct numbers straight from the designer :)
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Thanks so much (again :D) for the clarification!
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Thanks everybody, It's interesting to see what speakers are being matched with the 120 control amp. Some I have never thought of. :D
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Thanks everybody, It's interesting to see what speakers are being matched with the 120 control amp. Some I have never thought of. :D
When I called and talked to Frank about amps and preamps last fall, he steered me toward the DM225's and the Vision SLR w/phono, so this thread is not asking for my feedback, but... When Frank asked me what I was thinking about in terms of speakers and I told him, he (somewhat firmly) suggested I look at Philharmonic Audio, which I did. Frank and Dennis (the designer and brains behind Philharmonic) go back a ways. Anyway, I love love love my HT Towers, and believe they are a match made in heaven w/ my AVA gear.
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Right now I'm using my SET 120 (standard, not Control) with the new Mission 770 and the results are outstanding. Previously the amp was on Spatial Audio M3 Triode Masters as well as Falcon Gold Badge LS3/5a -- both excellent pairings. The only speakers that were not a good match for me -- and I don't mean to cause controversy -- were the Magnepan LRS+. Maybe it was the room, maybe I just don't care for Magnepans, I don't know. But the pairing didn't work for me at all. But before I get roasted here, let me be clear, I kept the SET120 because it's brilliant but sold the Maggies!
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Why would anyone roast you, you're intitled to your opinion. By the way what preamp are you using?
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When I called and talked to Frank about amps and preamps last fall, he steered me toward the DM225's and the Vision SLR w/phono, so this thread is not asking for my feedback, but... When Frank asked me what I was thinking about in terms of speakers and I told him, he (somewhat firmly) suggested I look at Philharmonic Audio, which I did. Frank and Dennis (the designer and brains behind Philharmonic) go back a ways. Anyway, I love love love my HT Towers, and believe they are a match made in heaven w/ my AVA gear.
Honestly, I had never even heard of them until Frank mentioned them. I've been out of the HiFi hobby for a long time until a couple of years ago when my interest returned so I missed a lot of changes in the industry in the intervening years. So those speakers with their efficiency sound ideal but for my not having room for towers.
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Why would anyone roast you, you're intitled to your opinion.
I just meant I know I'll be in the minority on that experience -- I believe there's a whole thread here about how well the LRS pair with the SET 120!
By the way what preamp are you using?
I have a Rogue RP-7, a Quicksilver line stage, and a Tisbury passive as pres and tried them all with the LRS+. Usually that Rogue with the SET 120 is my go-to pairing. But my room can get just a little bright at times and when I finally did get a power amp that worked better with the LRS+, I ended up using the Quicksilver more for the slightly smoother top end.