Klipsch RP-504C Upgrade

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. Read 555 times.

Shives

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 121
  • Audio, video and a boat load of
Klipsch RP-504C Upgrade
« on: 20 Apr 2021, 02:46 am »
Hello! I don’t see much on the topic that’s not mixed in with other bits of information.

So, I’m going to put up my upgrades in hope that it may answer a question or two.

For now, and it’s late.. I’m going to upload the network I built for my center.

Using the schematic Danny provided, I took some of the items and mixed the orientation so I could get decent spread across the board to lesson inductor issues. All of the positive inputs are together, cause it makes the single connection easy! Then you can combine the parts to make wiring up a tad more easy and straight forward.

Laid on cherry with gunstock stain.




I’ll catch up more tomorrow. My eyes are killing me, and exhausted. Thanks

I have marked out the Pos input, which is listed in a darker green upper left hand of picture. Again, single positive from tube connector to here. The Negative is written in black bottom right. Again, my plan is to take one single run from
Input, to network then to the tweeter. Trying to keep that ground one line! (Choice between woofer and tweeter I always would pick tweeter! Why? It’s more susceptible to audible interference and noise! Where as the woofers or mids may not pick it up as much. So, I run the single line to tweeter. Then you can make your ground runs for the inner and outer mids.

Outer woofer positive is coming of the standing iron core inductor to the left. This is marked in green as well from here you’ll run a line from the network, to your positive outer woofer.. being these are in series.. you’ll then run from your neg speaker lug, to the other positive speaker lug of the outer woofer. Then, back to you neg on the network. Same goes for the inner.. you’ll run your positive from the yellow lug (in pic) to the positive on one of the inner woofers.. then run your neg to positive of the other side, and back to network with a ground. Photo to come

Outer and inner are series!!

Also, make note the polarity does NOT change in this setup! So those who’s built the other Klipsch upgrades with reversed polarity tweeters... This is not!

My board is just about 10 inches. This puts plenty of room between my inductors to try and prevent the cross-talk smearing of audio that can happen when placed on top of each other.

This network, I hope will help a few people that are running more then one run of wires, due to splitting up the network. Keep in mind, just like the RP600’s and others, you CAN combine the circuits! You just have to do so in a manner that won’t change the designed outcome. Not a big deal!!

Look, all those circuits shown have some things in common and meet at the same place (tube connections, network)

Positive can all be tied together.. Negative can be tied together. Keep track of your circuit design and don’t forget where each wire goes! Worst case, you can just look at your schematic! And or pull them apart and start over. I have this placemat type thing I’ve gotten that helps with laying out the components and looking how best to tie them together! Then doing that, this mat gives me the size I’ll need. Easy!

So, again solder your stuff! I twisted some of the items together, then solder.. my iron has a larger flat head tip! This helps with the heat dissipation across the leads your soldering! Clean your wires, and tin them! Don’t over twist!

More photos to come. Was considering doing a video to help some that might need it. If you do, please feel free to post, or message me.

I’m located in the New England area for those who are local! Just met someone from Fall River that’s going to drop ship the parts for his, and deliver his speaker to me to install! I try and mention GR any conversation that has anything to do with audio or electronics. Lol yup!

 
« Last Edit: 22 Apr 2021, 01:14 am by Shives »

Shives

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 121
  • Audio, video and a boat load of
Re: Klipsch 504C Upgrade
« Reply #1 on: 20 Apr 2021, 03:19 pm »
You don’t see any of my parts locked down yet! Don’t forget this step.

You can zip tie or hold them down how ever you want. If you use hot glue, make sure your inductors are a bit warm as well!!

Why Dave? Try adding a good amount of hot glue, then push it down.. good chance it will hold, but sometimes cause the inductor is cold, it will chill the glue to much before you can set it in place. So, want it up a little. Does not need to be burning hot! That would suck! But 100 deg? Sure! That will help!

Inductors spacing. Try and make sure all your inductors the are close are rolling into the field directly!! This way they oppose each other!  If you have three, make sure you got plenty of space for them. I also put them off just a little bit to try and make the field 180 from each other.

Ok, time to do some running around. When I get back I’m going to take apart the 504C and start to install the rest!

Once I get the all the drivers out.. I’ll look and see how I’m going to do my no res! Will I use the cut sheet from the RP600 and Homers help? Or will I design a new cut sheet that will allow larger chunks of no res to be installed in place! With this unit, the box is LARGE! But your driver opening is 4”. This makes the no res a bit of a trick!!

Stay tuned y’all.

Shives

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 121
  • Audio, video and a boat load of
Re: Klipsch RP-504C Upgrade
« Reply #2 on: 22 Apr 2021, 01:32 am »
Couple new photos.
Been a tad busy!

Today was my Grandmothers 90th birthday!! She’s such a spit-fire still! Took her out to lunch, and my uncle showed up.. I really have him to thank, or kick for getting me into this stuff. Anyways, took them all out for a nice lunch! Then some cake and time to hang-out!

I was able to get into the cabinet! Wow!! This is amazingly nothing! I want to add bracing in this box! So so bad! But I feel I’m over-doing what already is.

I feel like it may need a little more no res, it’s that bare and open. It’s like a half-done room in a house! They started the work... but never finished and used bottom barrel components.

Ewww.
Glad I’m doing this, will be happy to build some better speakers very soon!

My crossover fits in the back, where the stock one was! Perfect!
I would go no more then 5x10! You can do 5x9 and push the inductors closer! I’m again spacing them way out.

Taking apart the 5-way and installing the tube connections. Looking how I want to go about cutting the no res and installing. Homers RP-600M cut sheet will not work for this.. So I’m going to try and come up with something for folks to go by.
So, as I eat a late dinner and prep for some all night work! Love these nights.

Holes drilled for my crossover and brass screws again. Matching in all! Lol.

I did add some exact feet on these ones! To which I’m going to add a little glue to those when installing.

Need to clean this thing up! 















Clean!!! Clean the wall for no res! Long wire lengths so I’m going to wrap them in a foam like tape sort of like the factory did, but nicer. It’s going to be hard to twist wires in series! Lol. But again, I think I’m going to have enough wire. Was mentioned I may need some more by a couple members. I’m wondering if my crossover will help this, or make it harder by everything being together. We will see.

Second note! Got a awesome score from Danny!! (Thanks very much!) Some wire and tube connectors for the project Av/1 clone build. Really, at this point I would love to off load those and go right to the X-LS encores !!! I really want those in my life! I think they will replace the RP-600 nicely.


Shives

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 121
  • Audio, video and a boat load of
Re: Klipsch RP-504C Upgrade
« Reply #3 on: 23 Apr 2021, 01:14 pm »
Some new photos on the bottom. All wired, location is pre-drilled for my brass screws. I’m going to lay some poly under the crossover board before I mount is down. As well the bottom of the board is not smooth by any means, so I’m not worried about reflection from that. But the poly will help.

Thinking due to the size of the box, I spent sometime yesterday running around to find some materials I could use to make a version of the No Res that Danny has made.. (it’s a neat way it’s done, I’ve figured out) But.... I was able to make a very very close resembling product. It cost me about 30.00 and it can yield a good amount. But, I’m just going to use it for spots left when I run out of no res. Honestly.. This box sucks for construction! The amount of bracing is a joke, the wood is cheep.. But... that’s what you get with store bought stuff. I’m ok with it! It’s helping me hone my upgrade skills.

Attention all local area folks (local to Western Ma)

I have folks around me that A. Don’t have the time, or B. Don’t have the ability to get these upgrades done. Could be due to tools, or knowledge. Yet, I know a ton of you want them. Please feel free to contact me, I’m happy to help.

I have 3 builds waiting.. (parts just coming in) two can be pushed, one is for a local customer that Danny set me up with! (Yes Danny told him I can do the work)

 So... don’t have that worried look upon your face.. Cheer up butter cup.. We all got you! If your not from around my area, you can drop ship.. or what ever you would like. Please contact me directly! DM for phone number, or ask Danny for it! Thanks! Normally he will tell you the pricing as well or at least ballpark. I want to keep in-line with all the other helpers on the forums! It’s not making a ton of money, it’s making a ton of sound! And I like to help!
















Shives

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 121
  • Audio, video and a boat load of
Re: Klipsch RP-504C Upgrade
« Reply #4 on: 28 Apr 2021, 11:58 am »
Morning!! Quick post!

So, all 3 speakers are done! This is a huge difference in my sound stage and more! Will give a more in-depth when I have a few minutes later. You can notice a change right away. As well I kept from using my tube connectors for a bit.. I used my AVR to try and smooth things, and it was better.. yet once I installed my tube connections, even the AVR had an easier time trying to achieve that flat line.

Many modes on this AVR. So disabling them all.

If your thinking about this upgrade, think no more! You should do it!!

I have to run out, and really wanted to put this up!

Thanks Danny! I appreciate you work into these upgrades!! They DO make a difference! A large one!









If you go to my Gallery, you’ll see some more. Again I’ll write this up a bit later on.

Thanks again, and I do hope this helps someone.. Or least someone reads this.

Hobbsmeerkat

  • Industry Participant
  • Posts: 1236
Re: Klipsch RP-504C Upgrade
« Reply #5 on: 28 Apr 2021, 02:06 pm »
This is looking great!  :thumb:
Glad to hear it's made a big difference! I'm sure it'll only get better!

Shives

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 121
  • Audio, video and a boat load of
Re: Klipsch RP-504C Upgrade
« Reply #6 on: 29 Apr 2021, 04:00 pm »
This is looking great!  :thumb:
Glad to hear it's made a big difference! I'm sure it'll only get better!

Hey man... thanks! I appreciate that! Hoping it will help someone with questions on adding the upgrades.
Just picked up some SVS Books and center to build for a local guy. Excited! Funds for the next build!!
Your stuff is amazing!! FYI.. lol. Have a good day!

cjsailer

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 26
Re: Klipsch RP-504C Upgrade
« Reply #7 on: 30 Apr 2021, 12:05 am »
It looks like you knew what you were doing.  I ran out of wire when I did my upgrade, still not sure what I could have done more efficiently.

Shives

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 121
  • Audio, video and a boat load of
Re: Klipsch RP-504C Upgrade
« Reply #8 on: 30 Apr 2021, 12:11 am »
It looks like you knew what you were doing.  I ran out of wire when I did my upgrade, still not sure what I could have done more efficiently.

It’s done now, and I’m sure your works great. But, to answer.. did you have all three of your circuits (tweeter, inner and outer woofers) combined for the positive in? As well Negative in/out?

I had one wire from post to crossover feed all circuits.. one neg ran from input, to crossover then to tweeter. Made a u shape for the neg to both inner and outer woofer. Positive for woofer had its own run from its circuits.

If you take a look at the photo. Combined circuits will save wire runs and keep things meter circuit wise.









Shives

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 121
  • Audio, video and a boat load of
Re: Klipsch RP-504C Upgrade
« Reply #9 on: 30 Apr 2021, 03:47 pm »




Done with REW, Audyssey, and some placements or treatments.

Before the work, this looked like a small child was angry!

Now.. little different.

This still needs some love, but I wanted to start with flat, and then try to adjust. Before the crossovers, I could not get anything close to this. Room mode was having some issues. Lol.

Shives

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 121
  • Audio, video and a boat load of
Re: Klipsch RP-504C Upgrade
« Reply #10 on: 2 May 2021, 08:09 pm »
Hello!! Sadly I could not do this before the work, as I was waiting on some equipment.

But, this is REW going through optical out, to my Denon AVR. Left and right are unhooked. Sub off. This is taken in location. Most would say my location sucks. Sadly I have some shelves that stick out below me. I have it adjusted up and aimed to me. I sit about 10-13 feet back. Mic location was 3 ft. Set at tweeter. I was asked to take this measurement by another member to compare. I need to get longer cables as wel so I can sit the laptop back further away. I’m limited by 6 ft. So keeping it off to one side far away as possible.

No EQ done! All DSP turned off.

I have all settings off in my AVR. Honestly, from what I see people running on these online before to now... I’m happy! I don’t quite have 100 hours on this. Where as my 600’s I think I’m close. I’m going to measure those next.

Another observation.. I see a ton of people trying to get flat lines, or house curve lines.  My biggest thought is... Well if your starting off with something broken already, these EQ’s and DSPs can only do so so much, and will have to work there ass off to get a flat line. And if you, out of the box have a shit ton of nulls, and peaks..Only thing it can do is try and bring down the volume to get rid of them, jacking frequency, Thus fighting everything. Room treatments then go on full tilt, people just go insane and buy every thing they can to make it happen. A nice smooth curve.


The smoother your speakers response, the better your EQ and DSPs will be able to make your response curve smooth without hindering volume and quality.

This first hand shows how Danny’s modification can really work for you! Where the rest are buy everything under the sun and all gimmicks.. (the real snake oil to good sound I feel..) Danny has started at the right spot. Sadly some of us that have Klipsch, and SVS what have you.. don’t have his built speakers. Which is ok.. this process will get you much closer then anyone else. Why spend 1000’s in DSP software, just build your speakers or rebuild upgrade your speakers and have a much better starting point. Now your at some afternoons and some elbow grease, rather then empty pockets!

It feels good not fighting factory flaws! Honestly! My ears could not be happier!! With so much pointing fingers of what you should and should not do... I’m not going to point any at all. I’ll tell you my experience.

When I first got these speakers, I thought.. yes! Back to audio. Back to good sound! (Had a sound bar before.. I know.. I know). I set everything up, speakers, subs, new AVR, setting up room correction and such.. I was happy... I guess. It was new, and upgraded sound, but I felt.. something is not right. So I waited! I trusted a “friend” who owned a shop, yea these a great! So I did not want to return them. I waited some more in hopes they would break in more. Nope.. Time later I started my Google searching. Improve Klipsch RP600, 504C sound. Guess where it brought me? Some time and videos later, I made a quick choice to purchase the products. The paper work he has showing the results were more then enough for me. As well being in electronics for a long time and I’m a nerd folks.. I love this shit.. lol. But really driven by wanting the best of everything, be competitive... What cooler thing to do! Lol

I did visit GR but that’s a whole different story.. I highly advise you to visit Danny and the men. 

So, jumping fast forward.. parts installed and some short time later.. I don’t need the graph to show me, allow me to hear the difference.

The sound! I have a sound stage! It’s great!! My vocals are so different! People don’t sound like they have a blanket over there mouth! Before the upgrade I could always close my eyes and know exactly where things are. That speaker there!! Well, this has become a bit harder to do now. I like that! I want my sound coming from everyplace but directly from my speaker. Sounds goofy right? I want my sound to come the people that I imagine are standing in front of me, putting on this show.. (watching TV) or when music is playing, I want to hear the drummer in the back, and Lead guitar come from stage right. I did not have any of this before the upgrade.

Now I have a concert, a show just for me each time I play music, or watch a movie.  Sometimes I swore my center was on in 2ch mode. Some head turns..

This brought my music and my movies back to life! I can hear in color, and see in sound!
The bass response is much tighter, and responsive. Not as muddy.. the 600’s have so much lower end.. it’s ridiculous! It makes me smile like a kid in a candy store. Love bass! Love response.  I love that my 504 sounds more not there. But there.

The highs are not so... beating my eyeballs through my ears. Can it get bright still.. yea.. I feel this is design with the tweeter. Maybe if that cup was 8 inches deeper it would help! Opening the area up a bit. Or opening the top and mounting it backwards.. (thoughts) again.. It can still be bright. So, I can install the grills and that will also help that a bit too. Again, my ears are pleasantly surprised at how he could take this tough tweeter and smooth it out! Making it a natural baby, rather a fricken T-Rex angry and mean!

Not as good as his speakers, or the open baffles.. But man has this added some life, pizzazz, and some style to these, very much needing love set of speakers.

The 504 has just brought on this level that I was hoping for. Each day they keep impressing as they break in.

So folks.. all you who doubt and more.. you can’t doubt facts. The theory behind what’s going on. We want sound reproduced just as it was done live in front of us. Only way your going to really get to that point is starting off with a good set of speakers! Something that will be able to reproduce sound as intended, out of the box.. with little to no EQ! Being nothing is perfect, the DSP and EQ then can be used to help room mode and get them back to where they need to be.. Or where they already play at! Worst case, you add room treatments.. but again those won’t help a speaker that can’t make the note in the first place.

This should be proof enough. Lol it’s good shit!


Also, make sure those settings are right.



This is more of a positive rant, then a review. But a short review is mixed in I guess.

The perma-smile I have.. I’m thankful for! Thanks Danny and the guys