ACI Jaguar owners- Q's on placement, height, toe in, etc.

Lkdog · « **on:** 30 Jul 2005, 05:28 am »

Just got a pair of the ACI Jaguars from the Summer Sale and am trying them out and comparing to my beloved Sapphire 25th Ann Editions.
The Jags have a beautiful cherry finish by the way and are one heavy pair of monitors.

Question for Jaguar owners since these are such a unique enclosure:

Any suggestions on speaker placement height, how far apart and toe in on these?
Have only listened to them a few minutes and do not have speaker stands built yet for them (my present Premier 26" stands will not hold them).
Will make some this weekend I hope.
I have one on top of my Titan sub and the other on a heavy LP cabinet right now just to get them out in the room and breaking in.

Oh yeah, how long for break in and what changes to expect?

Thanks guys.

Lkdog · « **Reply #1 on:** 1 Aug 2005, 04:04 pm »

Anybody with any thoughts, particularly with regard to height of speakers on stands?
Normally, I would build stands that bring the tweeter to ear height in standard listening position, but since the face of these angle up slightly I was not sure if there are others with some experience that might be helpful.
Thanks!

JAMn Joe · « **Reply #2 on:** 1 Aug 2005, 04:16 pm »

I was listening to Eric's pair this past Friday in my listening room and we had them 4' off the front wal and 3' off the side walls with a slight toe-in. The stands were 24" height. This is close to the height of the Jag's when they are sitting on top of the LFM's although you could easily raise them several more inches without hurting the presentation of the sound.

The further out in the room you go with these speakers the better the depth perception becomes.

Enjoy, your a lucky guy to get one of the last pair available! They are truly a wonderful speaker and I'm sure you'll spend hours on end listening to them.

Joe

JAM'n Audio

Harry P · « **Reply #3 on:** 2 Aug 2005, 01:10 am »

I don't have Jaguars but I have Sapphire 25ths, a Protege setup and I've helped friends with Emeralds. It alsways seems better to be a bit to high than on a too low stand. I'd shoot for the same height the LFM is. Toe in is system and room dependent. I start straight ahead, toe them in until the center image is as full as possible before the width starts to suffer.

Lkdog · « **Reply #4 on:** 2 Aug 2005, 03:12 am »

Hey, thanks guys for the info!

JAMn Joe- About how far apart would you guess you tried them?
I have them likely too far apart (12 feet) right now as I did not get the stands built yesterday - Home Depot couldn't cut the PVC pipe sections

I need to get them on stands so they are set up properly.

Amazingly, even at 12 feet apart as they break in the hole in the middle has filled in. These things throw quite a large soundstage and image like crazy.

I have my Sapphire 25's dialed in at 9 feet apart, slight toe in and my listening spot is 13 feet at the point of the triangle.

The height of the soundstage on the Jags is quite good also.

JAMn Joe · « **Reply #5 on:** 2 Aug 2005, 04:32 am »

Lkdog,

When I went to Eric's house he had the speakers roughly 10' apart in a room that's easily 16-18' wide but he was only sitting about 10' back from the speakers. The speakers were around 4' from the back wall with almost no toe-in. The sound was good but the soundstage on several of my test CD's was not as good as I've experienced in the past.

We brought the speakers closer in by 1' for each speaker giving us an 8' span between speakers. We toed the speakers in 10-15 degrees and the sound stage went from a few feet outside the speakers to the width of the full room. The speakers in essence disappeared and the only thing left was the music. If the speakers are spread too far apart the sound becomes directional meaning you can tell what's coming out of the left and right speakers.

Your room will dictate what the optimum width is between your speakers and sidewalls. I would suggest starting with them closer together and moving them out further and further until the soundstage looses it's majic then readjust them back in a little to the optimum location. This will help you get to know the accoustics of your room better at the same time making it easier to make further adjustments as you add or change things in your system.

Email or call me if you have any additional questions, I'm more than happy to try and help you out if I can.

FYI, I highly suggest looking at putting audiopoints under your speakers and speaker stands. They made a noticable improvement when we put them under Eric's speakers and LFM. When we played them here I put them on one of the Sistrum speaker stands that already have audiopoints built into the design. I am a dealer for them so don't take my word for it. PM Eric and talk to him about it. He ended up buying them for his system after hearing the differences they made.

Eric · « **Reply #6 on:** 2 Aug 2005, 02:50 pm »

I will vouch for the differenc the aupdip oints made under my Jags. Everything tightened up and became immediately more coherant. They really work. And the jags are great speakers.

I just heard the new Sapphires last Friday. They are awesome as well

Lkdog · « **Reply #7 on:** 2 Aug 2005, 09:01 pm »

Ok, at the risk of sounding like a dumba$$-are Audiopoints some type of brass cones, spikes, or points?

I was going to use some basic spikes on the speaker stands bottom plate which will have a 3/4" MDF bottom plate, (2) 25" sand filled 4" diameter PVC columns, and a 3/4" MDF top plate to place the Jags upon.

I was not sure what material to use on the top plate which the Jags would actually contact. I never quite understand the various theories behind using some rubber type pads on the top plate, or spikes, or little felt pads, etc.

Glad to experiment and listen to any ideas.

JAMn Joe · « **Reply #8 on:** 2 Aug 2005, 09:53 pm »

Lkdog,

Check out the following web links for a clearer picture of what works extremely well, at least with all the setups we've installed them in.

These go between your speaker and top plate:
http://www.audiopoints.com/2ap7d.html

These go under the base of your speaker stand:
http://www.audiopoints.com/15apthreaded.HTML

The finishing touch is to use their Micro-Bearing steel fill instead of sand or lead shot:
http://www.audiopoints.com/micro.html

The web-site has full information explaining the technology and scientific theories behind the technology. There is a lot of snake oil out on the market when it comes to audio but Star Sounds products really do work.

Ultimately, the best solution would be to use one of their speaker stands that incorporate all their technology if that's an option you can explore.

You can contact them directly and speak with Robert when you call. They do have a money back policy if your interested in trying them out. I would not want you to purcahse them through me as I want to be sure you understand their is no financial motivation to me regarding this recommendation.

Hope this answers your questions.

Lkdog · « **Reply #9 on:** 2 Aug 2005, 11:51 pm »

JAMn Joe-

Thanks for the links-I will read up on this topic which has always been kind of a mystery to me.
I do have my SACD player and amp on isoblocks, but other than basic spikes on my subwoofer and speaker stands- I have not done much with speakers.

I also appreciate your honesty and ethics in this discussion. That is in short supply in a lot of audio forums.