[JoshK]

John,

some more interesting specs to add would be heat generation between the amps and size of the amps.

[zybar]

And we see how the 201's compare to SOA in just a few days...

Can't wait to hear what people think.

George

there's a possibility that the Pass X-250 has been added to the mix as well...

I will be interested to see what others hear in this comparison as well.

I already compared the X-250 and 201's and we know which one I kept...

George

[zybar]

John,

some more interesting specs to add would be heat generation between the amps and size of the amps.

That is an area the 201's are far superior in.  They take up almost no space and run "ICE" cold.  You can also stack them.  

I didn't add that or looks because I didn't want to seem too biased towards the 201's.

George

[John Casler]

John,

Not trying to be defensive, but weight is really irrelevant in this case.  The 201's use the ICE module and don't have a big transformer in each amp.  As such, their weight is very low.  For the person who doesn't know much about the 201's, the weight parameter can lead to a false conclusion.

More important stats might be gain, impedance, connectors, etc...

George

Hi George,

I just posted weight since it shows an interesting difference, didn't think it would be a positive or negative in most instances (unless you buy your amps by the pound )

But here are the other things you asked for:

Jeff Rowland gain = 26 or 32 dB
Son of Ampzilla gain = 40x, +/- .707 VRms for 100watts (balanced)
20x, +/- 1.414 VRms for 100watts (unbalanced)
Ampzilla 2000 gain = not listed

Jeff Rowland 201 impedance = 40k ohms
Son of Ampzilla impedance = 33K ohms on each leg of balanced Inputs
Ampzilla 2000 impedance = 1 volt R.M.S. across 50kohms for 200 watts into 8 ohms on the unbalanced input,
+/- 1 volt R.M.S. across +/- 70kohms for 200 watts into 8 ohms on the balanced input

Most other specs and features can be found on their respective webpages.

John,

some more interesting specs to add would be heat generation between the amps and size of the amps.

I don't have any "posted" specs on heat generation, (actually don't recall ever seeing any ) but I think most know that digital amps certainly run at a lower temperature.

I might add however that the SOA I have gets warm after a hard run, but not hot at all.

The dimensions of the 201s are listed at: 2.6" x 8.4" x 11.5"

The SOA is: 8"h x 9.5"w x 15"d

Each Ampzilla 2000 monobloc is the same since they share the same chasis.

[zybar]

Thanks John.

Now that we have the "tale of tape"...

Let's get it on!!

 

[radiob]

Im not talking mid-fi theater amps, Im talking about something like MANLEY NEO-CLASSIC 250 monoblocks;
ALL-TUBE monoblock design 10 x EL34EH
High current double 12BH7A driver stage
12AT7WA input tube
BALANCED & UNBALANCED inputs
MUTE switch
TRIODE / TETRODE switching
S0FT-START/ EVER-WARM standby mode
MANLEY Precision output transformer
Factory set for 5 ohms nominal optimum speaker load
Front panel bias measurement and adjust (hiding under the black insert)
Large filter / reservoir capacitors 3800uF x 2
Angled rear of chassis provides for easy connections
WBT binding posts
Input sensitivity: 1V
Gain: 32dB tetrode; 30dB in triode
Input Impedance: 100 Kohm
Output impedance: 0.6 ohm Triode; 0.7 ohm Tetrode
S/N Ratio Ref 1W into 8 ohms: -80 dB; -90dB A-WGT
Dynamic Range: 93dB
FLAT frequency response: 10 Hz - 30 KHz continuous
Power Consumption: 30 Watts in "EVER-WARM"
Full power (tetrode): 250W
Full power (triode): 100W
Dims: W=19". D=13". H=9"
Shipping weight: 73 Ibs. each
Im not sold on any solid state design personally, I love the MAGIC tubes have, has anyone here tried big triode power on the VMPS speakers?

[shokunin]

Zybar has used Kora's as well as a couple of other members here on the AC. I'm sure the Manley's are nice, the Steelhead Phono I had borrowed was spectacular, too bad I it's no longer here.   It's going to have to be a personal decision as to which iis better.   I have not heard either, but am thinking that each would sound distinctively different enough to come down your system, your room and opinion.  

I'm thinking of bi-amping with a SET amp on the mid/treble and SS on the bottom.   Going the bi-amp route definitely gets more complicated with level matching, cabling, etc.

[John Casler]

Kevin also uses the Kora to good results in his system.

[John Casler]

Thanks John.

Now that we have the "tale of tape"...

Let's get it on!!

 

I'm looking forward to it. I have heard many good things about the 201's and I have heard many good things from the SoA.

While it is a "power mismatch" (the monobloc 2Ks would be closer) I think it will still offer an auditory view into amp qualities and performance.

On the Josh Groban Reference Cut "To Where you are". we use, there is a place where most every amp and cable cannot track a very small portion of his voice.

Most of the time you hear some "grain" on these two vocal peaks.

It is well disguised and even sounds a bit like his voice is adding vibratto and or cracking a bit (at higher volumes). The Son has been tracking this quite well and on Diana Krall's "My Love is" (from Love Scenes) the finger snaps are magnitudes above anything else I have heard reality wise.

[radiob]

Well guys, 7 weeks have gone by reading all of your posts. I finally received a call today from Estes trucking in FORT MEYERS not TAMPA[brian] My speakers will be here tomorrow between 12-3 in the afternoon. Finaly A true VMPS owner,not just reader.....

[zybar]

Radiob,

Which ones did you get?

George

[radiob]

STR/SEs, I heard them 4 or 5 years ago and was impressed, I started reading after I ordered them, I probobly should have bought the RM 40s, from what I have learned after the fact. Anyway Im anxious. I currently have K-horns, Paradigm studio/60s w/servo 15 and Klipsch CHorus2s. I use SET aplification on the klipsch products and Sunfire on the paradigm. I Am in the market for a set of amps for the VMPS, but am torn from what I have read here and what I know about tubes, so I will use the sunfire 300two for now.

[John Casler]

STR/SEs, I heard them 4 or 5 years ago and was impressed, I started reading after I ordered them, I probobly should have bought the RM 40s, from what I have learned after the fact. Anyway Im anxious. I currently have K-horns, Paradigm studio/60s w/servo 15 and Klipsch CHorus2s. I use SET aplification on the klipsch products and Sunfire on the paradigm. I Am in the market for a set of amps for the VMPS, but am torn from what I have read here and what I know about tubes, so I will use the sunfire 300two for now.

Congratulations!!

Welcome to the club.  I think Kevin is almost your neighbor (Tampa I think).

You two should hook up and hear each others systems.

Kevin???  You out there?

[zybar]

I'm looking forward to it. I have heard many good things about the 201's and I have heard many good things from the SoA.

While it is a "power mismatch" (the monobloc 2Ks would be closer) I think it will still offer an auditory view into amp qualities and performance.

On the Josh Groban Reference Cut "To Where you are". we use, there is a place where most every amp and cable cannot track a very small portion of his voice.

Most of the time you hear some "grain" on these two vocal peaks.

It is  ...

John,

A couple of other cd's that not only sound great but are very useful for comparing gear:

Bozzio Levins Stevens - Black Light Syndrome

Bad Plus - These are the Vistas

George

[zybar]

Zybar has used Kora's as well as a couple of other members here on the AC. I'm sure the Manley's are nice, the Steelhead Phono I had borrowed was spectacular, too bad I it's no longer here.   It's going to have to be a personal decision as to which iis better.   I have not heard either, but am thinking that each would sound distinctively different enough to come down your system, your room and opinion.  

I'm thinking of bi-amping with a SET amp on the mid/treble and SS on the bottom.   Going the bi-amp route definitely gets more complicated with level matching, cabling, etc.

I had the Kora Cosmos Reference monos.  These amps were 100 watt Class A Triode.

They sounded great on the midrange panels, but couldn't really control/drive the woofers to my satisfaction.  

As John  mentioned, Kevin also uses Kora (he has the non-reference version of the Cosmos) and he loves it!

George

[John Casler]

John,

A couple of other cd's that not only sound great but are very useful for comparing gear:

Bozzio Levins Stevens - Black Light Syndrome

Bad Plus - These are the Vistas

George

"Duende" by BLS, is on every Reference Disc I use.  If your system gets the Bass right on that cut it is really doing something.

I'll have to look into Bad Plus.

[zybar]

John,

A couple of other cd's that not only sound great but are very useful for comparing gear:

Bozzio Levins Stevens - Black Light Syndrome

Bad Plus - These are the Vistas

George

"Duende" by BLS, is on every Reference Disc I use.  If your system gets the Bass right on that cut it is really doing something.

I'll have to look into Bad Plus.

John,

I think it does Duende very, very well (that was my reference cut for last weekend's digital shooutout).  Last time Frank (Horsehead) was up, he couldn't believe how good that cut along with the Diana Krall finger snaps and stand up bass were.

George

George

[John Casler]

John,

I think it does Duende very, very well (that was my reference cut for last weekend's digital shooutout).  Last time Frank (Horsehead) was up, he couldn't believe how good that cut along with the Diana Krall finger snaps and stand up bass were.

George

George

You use the snaps too??

Just shows great ears "hear" alike

[zybar]

Here are two more...

Rusted Root - When I Woke (especially tracks 10, 11, 13)

Ben Harper - Fight For Your Mind (especially tracks 5-8)

Not only will these test your system across the board, they are great music to listen to.

George

[doug s.]

re: amps for vmps, i have the sneaking suspicion that melos tube amps would be a great match.  one like this:

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?ampstube&1098668430


this beast puts out ~180wpc of pure triode power.  if this particular iteration f/s on a-gon is 100% bone stock, then it needs, at minimum, the "a" mod ($650) from melos audio restorations, to keep it from self-destructing under hard use.  also will make it sound better.  m.a.r. also offers two additional mods, ($400 & $650), which supposedly take this amp to a completely different plane.  these amps always got great press, & were always part of the pipedreams demos at ces shows, which always wowed showgoers.  (mark porzilli was the the designer of the amps & speakers.)

due to an unfortunate domestic struggle between my wife & my beloved mesa baron tube amp, which the amp lost (it's ugly - don't ask), i found myself in the market for another tube amp.  i was fortunate enuff to "steal" this same model amp, w/all the mods awreddy done, still under warranty, for less than the asking price of the above amp.  so, i guess every cloud has a silver lining!    

now, i guess i yust need to scope out a pair of vmps' to see how it would be able to drive 'em.  (i also think the mesa baron would be a good match w/the vmps' w/between 60wpc-150wpc, depending on whether yure running full triode, full pentode, or somewhere in between.  i will miss that amp.)

doug s.