[TONEPUB]

Plug your Zen Torii into a Running Springs Haley and you'll be blown away.  That's what I use with mine.

As for our pal Soundminded, do your homework, the Torii has a highly regulated power supply.

But seriously, I couldn't suggest a Haley higher. Works wonders with modestly powered tube amps and will have enough capacity to plug the rest of your system into.

[roscoeiii]

+1 on the Running Springs Haley. Best I have had in my system, and doesn't limit amp performance the way other products I have used have (many amp makers and audiophiles recommend plugging amps straight into the wall so as to not lose dynamics).

[TomS]

I've had the RSA Haley, PI UberBuss, Sound Application RLS, among others. All are very effective at what they can do (I like the PI), but I doubt any of those deal with distortion such as an asymmetric waveform creating DC on your line, IF that is what is happening. The only way I know of is measuring for it with the right tool and fixing it at the source as was suggested by HAL or regenerating a new clean AC waveform such as PS Audio's P5/P10 do. They're basically a power amplifier for 60hz.They are very big $$$ though.

[roscoeiii]

Yes, with most power conditioning, results will often be very system dependent. If you aren't able to audition locally you might want to try out the Cable Company or another online reseller with a solid return policy (Music Direct and Audio Adviser come to mind).

If your problem is DC on the line, then both PS Audsio and CI Audio sell devices designed to remove DC on the line. PS Audio is the Humbuster. CI Audio is the XDC-2. DC on the line usually manifests as a humming in toroids on amplifiers and maybe preamps. NOT out of the speakers.

[TONEPUB]

I'm trying the P10 right now and it certainly is impressive, though I haven't had time to connect any large, SS power amps.

Seeing the Torii doesn't draw that much current, a used P600 might do the job for you without costing crazy money...  You can probably find one for about 5-600 bucks.

[Soundminded]

Plug your Zen Torii into a Running Springs Haley and you'll be blown away.  That's what I use with mine.

As for our pal Soundminded, do your homework, the Torii has a highly regulated power supply.

But seriously, I couldn't suggest a Haley higher. Works wonders with modestly powered tube amps and will have enough capacity to plug the rest of your system into.

"As for our pal Soundminded, do your homework, the Torii has a highly regulated power supply.

But seriously, I couldn't suggest a Haley higher"

What's in it? How does it work? I looked at a few web sites mentioning it. They're long on testimonials, short on facts. No clue as to what's inside it except that they make a lot of their own parts? What are its specs? Which of the 9 categories of electrical disturbances does it deal with and to what degree? Why is it better than a static double conversion UPS?

[roscoeiii]

If a manufacturer wants to keep this info from the public due to concerns about intellectual property, fine by me. Especially as there exists the possibility of trying the product in your system, which is the case with most power conditioners I have come across. Either through a local dealer, or online sellers which allow returns (Cable Company, Music Direct, Audio Advisor are examples that come to mind. Think Cable Company is the only one with Running Springs at present).

[TONEPUB]

"As for our pal Soundminded, do your homework, the Torii has a highly regulated power supply.

But seriously, I couldn't suggest a Haley higher"

What's in it? How does it work? I looked at a few web sites mentioning it. They're long on testimonials, short on facts. No clue as to what's inside it except that they make a lot of their own parts? What are its specs? Which of the 9 categories of electrical disturbances does it deal with and to what degree? Why is it better than a static double conversion UPS?

It's better because it sounds better.

The guy who designed it, has a master's in Electrical Engineering and a PhD in physics.  Everything is designed and built in an ISO 9001 facility.  I don't really care about the "specs"  I've plugged millions of dollars worth of gear into it and it does what a line conditioner should, remove noise and distortion from the power line, nothing more.  It doesn't affect dynamics or tonality.

Seriously, I don't care what the approach is as long as it works.  If you are the scientist you claim to be, you know there is always more than one way to achieve a result.  I've never heard a UPS sound good in an audio system.

As RSA has a 15 day money back return policy with their dealers and they've had ONE returned in seven years, I have to believe they are on to something.  Shunyata does the same thing with their dealers.  Anyone who makes a reputable product isn't worried about people returning it.

Pretty much about 30 sec with a good PLC in your system will tell the tale.

What I suggest to our OP is to get some experience, rather than arguing with all of us on a forum.

[Quiet Earth]

If you have DC on your line because of asymmetric waveform distortion, I think a balanced transformer will take care of it. Please correct me if I am wrong. I'm pretty sure you can't get DC out of a transformer in this application, but perhaps I have overlooked something.

The Haley looks interesting, and even though I have no reason to doubt how good it is I would also like to know what makes it work. Their website says that it is a passive regulator, but I don't know what that means. There are inductor(s) and capacitors inside, but the basic "circuit" is a mystery.

[Quiet Earth]

Also I think the op had a good idea to measure first to get an idea of where to begin. He is not arguing with anyone, just making us think.

 

[Soundminded]

It's better because it sounds better.

The guy who designed it, has a master's in Electrical Engineering and a PhD in physics.  Everything is designed and built in an ISO 9001 facility.  I don't really care about the "specs"  I've plugged millions of dollars worth of gear into it and it does what a line conditioner should, remove noise and distortion from the power line, nothing more.  It doesn't affect dynamics or tonality.

Seriously, I don't care what the approach is as long as it works.  If you are the scientist you claim to be, you know there is always more than one way to achieve a result.  I've never heard a UPS sound good in an audio system.

As RSA has a 15 day money back return policy with their dealers and they've had ONE returned in seven years, I have to believe they are on to something.  Shunyata does the same thing with their dealers.  Anyone who makes a reputable product isn't worried about people returning it.

Pretty much about 30 sec with a good PLC in your system will tell the tale.

What I suggest to our OP is to get some experience, rather than arguing with all of us on a forum.

This is a bunch of horse hooey. People who are in this business for real by selling large quantities and large dollar volumes of this kind of equipment to industry are only too happy to discuss how their equipment works, how well it performs, and how it stacks up to the competition. There are no secrets. ISO9000 is only a manufacturing process that guarantees that the unit you buy will be as similar to the prototype in all respects as possible. It doesn't mean the design is any good or that you cannot obtain equal or better results from alternative products.

"It's better because it sounds better."

That's about as much scientific information as most manufacturers catering to high end audio equpment buyers will give you. BTW, does it have a built in bypass switch so that you can compare it to a shunt around it? All UPSs worth their salt have.....for the purpose of facillitating maintenance without interruption to the load. But then their customers demand much more than "it sounds better" from their vendors.

Here's what the real thing looks like;

http://powerquality.eaton.com/Products-services/Backup-Power-UPS/9355.aspx?cx=3

[Quiet Earth]

Sure are a lot of fans on that thing . . . .

[roscoeiii]

If you don't like their policy on openness about their technology, you don't have to buy. But I respect the desire to keep secrets about the techology that a manufacturer has placed significant time and expense developing. Trial periods make this a no risk proposition. Happy to pay postage in exchange for being able to try things in my system. Try it. If you don't like it, send it back. No need to whine about a company's decisions on what details to make public. That is the manufacturer's perogative. 

[schw06]

Tonepub,
   If money weren't the issue, would you recommend the P10 or the RSA line? Thanks for the input.

[Soundminded]

Tonepub,
   If money weren't the issue, would you recommend the P10 or the RSA line? Thanks for the input.

If money isn't an issue, try one of these, the 3KVA Apostar model looks like a good choice for a home audio system;

http://www.piller.com/

This industrial type equipment like this and the others I've mentioned leaves consumer and pro-sumer grade equipment in the dust.

[TONEPUB]

Tonepub,
   If money weren't the issue, would you recommend the P10 or the RSA line? Thanks for the input.

PM sent....

[HAL]

If money isn't an issue, try one of these, the 3KVA Apostar model looks like a good choice for a home audio system;

http://www.piller.com/

This industrial type equipment like this and the others I've mentioned leaves consumer and pro-sumer grade equipment in the dust.

From the specs the Apostar site lists, it is a 3KVA, 3 phase system that would not be appropriate for home audio gear.  Besides they list harmonic distortion at <3%THD.  That is not very good when compared to the PS Audio power regenerators.  Those are typically less than 0.5%THD. 

[kingdeezie]

Tonepub,
   If money weren't the issue, would you recommend the P10 or the RSA line? Thanks for the input.

I would like to know the answer that you received to this question from TonePub.

I have a Synergistic Research Powercell 10SE, and while it does improve my power greatly, I still feel some days, and certain times, that the system just doesn't sound as good as it should.

I feel this has to be because of the power, and since I am in a town home, without measuring the power, lord knows how much distortion is on the line.

I just am not sure that the PS Audio P10 can handle as much system as it states. I have Manley Neo Classic 250's that draw 800 watts a piece at full boogie.

That would quickly exceed the 1200volts that PS Audio lists as the maximum draw of the unit. Getting one for each amplifier would be a little above my budget at 10K.

[Soundminded]

From the specs the Apostar site lists, it is a 3KVA, 3 phase system that would not be appropriate for home audio gear.  Besides they list harmonic distortion at <3%THD.  That is not very good when compared to the PS Audio power regenerators.  Those are typically less than 0.5%THD.

If money wasn't an issue you could pay your local electrical utility to bring three phase power into your home. They'd be only too happy to especially when you tell thems it's so that you could install a Piller Apostar to make your stereo sound better. 

[HAL]

The issue is that all my audio equipment runs on single phase power, or runs on batteries to get off the grid.   Since the distortion level is high in the three phase unit, it is not a good solution.

The PS Audio Power Plant Premier regenerates AC power making this a non-issue for my setup.  Batteries take care of the rest of the AC power issues.

Have fun with converting all the gear to three phase!