[dlaloum]

By the way, thank you for the link to that D5000 stylus... it should be on its way to me shortly...

Just remembered that I posted my plots of the 7500 on my website... https://sites.google.com/site/zevaudio/turt/cartridge-comparison-list/pickering-xlz-7500-s

I need to review the original recordings in which I determined the resonant frequency - some of the ones I looked at showed 26kHz and the one I posted way back was showing 20kHz and 38kHz - which would indicate an even higher tip mass... I may have mixed something up!

[neobop]

From your old plots it looks like somewhere between 1 and 10K might be best.  I like that tracking ability -100um!  I'll have to give it another try in the AHT.

I forgot to wish you luck with the stylus.  According to Flood2 the guy on the Asylum thread, Stanton/Pickering QC wasn't always the best.  He spoke of sometimes getting bonded or industrial grade diamonds and sometimes getting gem quality.  That's the first I've heard of that. 
Hope you get a good one.
neo


http://www.audioasylum.com/cgi/vt.mpl?f=vinyl&m=1066624

[dlaloum]

Well the D7500 literature ( on Michael-otto's archive) claims 0.2mg but I measure substantially more.... Was it perhaps retooled... Who knows!?

The D5000 is purported to be 0.23mg according to the same archive docs, but we shall see....

The 1/2" mount cab body will also allow better comparison with the sox body.... What I need now to complete the set is a p-mount low z body!

Bye for now

David

[neobop]

The Stereohedron II is slightly smaller than the original.  It might be the same as the Quadrahedron.  I don't think that would be enough to account for the difference in tip mass numbers.  That plus a smaller/lighter cantilever might do it.  All those top Stanton/Pickering were spec to 50KHz.  That doesn't tell us HFR though.  I'd be curious to hear this with an exotic cantilever and a micro.

My D3001E is a .2 x .7 elliptical.  Although I don't have many hours on it, it will probably wear pretty fast.  When it needs replacing I'd like to get a micro on there. The Jico shibata would be a good candidate for a new cantilever and tip.  I prefer the Pickering stylus holder though.

I forgot to mention, I was just given a high quality conventional microscope with USB.  Top magnification is 400X - perfect.  The person who gave it said they couldn't get the USB to work.  I plugged it into my PC and it recognized it as a web cam.  Not sure if that's a good thing.  Maybe I can download the software from the mfg and get it going.  First it has to be adapted for stylus examination.
neo

[neobop]

Ok Neo,
 I've listened to your advice and I've reinstalled the Maestro. The difference between the Maestro and LS500 is smaller than you might imagine. Their character is almost identical. When listening to the LS500, it's almost as if it is a slightly sloppier version of the Maestro. I have to believe the difference is due to the stylus/cantilever. I can't describe the stylus on the Maestro (mostly because it's too miniscule).  The stylus on the Maestro is truly one of the finest I've tried to inspect!

Don grb

Looks like we guessed wrong about the LS500.  Did you see this?
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?p=7431285#post7431285

It makes sense now.  The 14Sa is a very nice cart - more like a 12Sa or 15/20 than a 13Ea. 
neo

[Grbluen]

I was watching. By the way, the problem that I was having was totally related to my not having compressed the rubber washer which is a part of the cantilever assembly. When compressed the Ls500 was every bit as brilliant as the AT-15Xe. For a brief moment, I had really good compression of the washer, but the magnets were mis-aligned. I then readjusted the magnets, but lost the compression. It really is tricky business.

[neobop]

FYI,
I measured the inductance of one body at 970 mH. It seems even higher than the 13EA based on the reports. I've not measured the 13EA.
Don grb

Just found this old post.  I wonder if the meter is giving false readings because of its impedance?  Remember that Elliott PDF?

neo

[Grbluen]

Neo,
I believe the LS500 is a different cartridge. I can't bring myself to open the AT-13EA.
I was hoping to pick up another 13EA, but I can't find one cheap! The rolled off characteristic puzzled me with the Ls500, but it was during some playing around that I realized the problem was mechanical. I'll have to compare the two head-to-head on the big table. Honestly, I've just been too focused on trying to figure out why Audio Technica would have spec'd the LS500 the way they did. I'm a bit like a beagle. I get sidetracked easily.

[neobop]

Well, Lini on Karma gave us the answer.  The LS500 is of the same series as the 14Sa, but has a different and high inductance generator.  Like the 12E and 12Sa, the former has the same motor as the 13Ea, and the later has a low inductance 4-ch motor.

This question about inductance is tricky, especially since David posted about getting reasonably flat response with some low inductance carts.  I tend to think like CarlosFM on the VE cart loading thread, characterizing inductance as the enemy.  There's no doubt cart inductance combines with capacitance and rolls off the high end.  IMO high inductance carts might sound nice, but don't have the potential of a low inductance one.  Carts have to be evaluated on an individual basis and some might require an exotic cantilever and/or loading, but it seems to me low inductance ones are more transparent, less cloudy (for lack of better descriptors).  Does it come back to the same old thing, "musical" vs detailed?   I haven't tried an exotic cantilevered stylus on my 12E.  I could chop the plastic on a 20SS stylus and try it, but for now I'll take Timeltel's word for it - sweet, rich, and reasonably detailed.  Maybe some day I'll try it.  Lately, it's all I can do to stay warm.
neo

[Grbluen]

 

[griffithds]

Hello fellow Frankensteiners,

I have a question I would like to address to anyone with knowledge that deals with doing a possible transplant in a Signet TK 9 or 10ML.
Replacements for either of these have become nonexistent so it would appear transplanting will be the only option other than sending it off for someone else to graft on a new cantilever assembly. 
Does this cantilever/stylus assemble also have the tiny screw that holds the cantilever in position, like the screw we were finding on some of the AT95's?
BTW Neobop:  The Maestro with the 440MLa cantilever has become my favorite M/M.
Regards,
Don

[neobop]

Don,
The 95E doesn't have a compliance screw.  It has a press fitting.  The higher end replacements have the screw as do most ATs except the 3400 series and Clearaudio. 

I had a TK10ML II years ago, but I never removed the stylus. I assume it has a compliance screw, maybe David can confirm this. I think he has an AT23 which has the same stylus fitment type.  It has an additional screw on the bottom to secure it, no wings. 

So, a Maestro/440MLa has replaced the LS500 at the top?  What other styli have you tried on the Maestro?  Did it have the stock stylus when you got it?
neo

[Grbluen]

Neo,
I'm not sure if that last message was for me, but I'll answer anyway.
I'm still stuck on the LS500 with the 440mla (Ls540mla). I'm sorting thru the compliance issues due to the info in the other threads. I'm leaning toward the LS540mla combo, but I haven't been fair to any of the other cartridges.

Dongrb

[neobop]

Apologies to both Dons.   I guess I saw a G and assumed.....

Griff,
Really?  I found this post of yours on p15 of this thread:

Hi Neo,

Currently I have 2 turntables. One is the VPI Extended Aries with the outboard flywheel and a Graham 2.2 arm.  The other is a Victor (JVC) TT-81 with a JVC 7045 arm.  Both are run from a BAT VK10SE with the (what is referred to as ), 'depth charges'.  I'm a little embarrassed to say but I'm pushing 60 cartridges.
The TK10 and the AT180 sound so similar, that I would could consider them twins.  Another one that is also so similar that perhaps what I have is triplets, it the Technics U205C MK4.  The CA Maestro/440MLa is a great sounding cartridge, but (isn't there always a 'but'), it just is not at that level.  There is a delicate refinement with the previous mentioned 3 that just doesn't present itself with the FrankenMaestro. Still, it does stick its head above the crowd of many of the cartridge of the month also rans. I sure you do know which forum I referring too! (grin)
I have not heard about using a cartridge as a dummy load?  Where can I find this thread about phase and this dummy load?  Sounds like something I definitely would be interested in.
BTW:  I like your 'more like good and better' comment. I need to remember that!
Regards,
Don

If you have a TK10 I guess you didn't want to pull the stylus and check for a compliance screw?

That's an impressive list and now the Maestro/440MLa is your favorite?  Did you ever get around to trying it with an ATN150MLX ?   
neo

[neobop]

I was just thinking it's funny how this mix and match works out.  Griff likes the Maestro/440MLa.  Dongrb likes the LS500/440MLa.

I have a 440 and much prefer it with a 152ML or 150MLX.  I think the 160 has the same generator as the 440.  Beryllium ML methinks.

Maybe I'll get 440 stylus and transplant it into my Virtuoso. 

Dongrb,
What's the compliance issue?
neo

[dlaloum]

Hello fellow Frankensteiners,

I have a question I would like to address to anyone with knowledge that deals with doing a possible transplant in a Signet TK 9 or 10ML.
Replacements for either of these have become nonexistent so it would appear transplanting will be the only option other than sending it off for someone else to graft on a new cantilever assembly. 
Does this cantilever/stylus assemble also have the tiny screw that holds the cantilever in position, like the screw we were finding on some of the AT95's?
BTW Neobop:  The Maestro with the 440MLa cantilever has become my favorite M/M.
Regards,
Don

Hi Don,

I will take a look to see whether it has a compliance screw.
The needle holder on these is not plastic but a solid chunk of metal, which screws into the body - so there is no question about a positive mating with the body!

I have a couple of these bodies with broken styli (intended for a retip at some point) - I will remove the stylus (stub) and look for a compliance screw....

Need to find them in my storage first...

bye for now

David

[dlaloum]

Lately, it's all I can do to stay warm.

Come here and you can have some of our heat...44c (111F) today, yesterday was only 43c (109F), tomorrow is expected to be 43c again....

Give us some of your cold and take some of this stifling heat!

[griffithds]

Hello Neobop,

Do not confuse my current favorite (maestro/440MLa), statement with best sounding.  My best sounding non M/C would be the London Decca Jubilee in addition to the ones you and just mentioned.  By favorite I meant most fun and most often used M/M. 
I did (I guess you could say for a couple of days), successfully transplanted  the AT 150 MLX.   Because it was a NOS stylus, I was giving it a few day to run in before I did any close listening when one morning I found the forward half of the cantilever sitting on the surface of the turntable.  Forward half being the part forward of the screw.  I have no ideal what happened. I'm leaning towards the thought that perhaps I had to much force applied to the screw because when I loosened the screw, a small piece of the cantilever fell out.  I try to be extra careful with the Clear Audio's because of how the cantilever sticks out in such a way that it appears to be begging to be bumped so I don't think the problem was cause from anything I did.   Anyway, I put the 440MLa back in and have left it there ever since.
Neo, I perfer the shibata from Jico or the Vivid Line from LP Tunes  over the 440MLa in the Virtuoso.  There is a brightness with the 440MLa/Virtuoso combination that is not complimentary.  Very detailed but leans towards the bright side. I did consider trying to load it down, but really wasn't interested in trying to make it improve.  At the time,  I was still disappointed in the lost  AT 150MLX cantilever.   I'm sure there are systems out there that could use a little brightening up, but my system is not one of them. The extra wood on the Maestro seems to help damp this effect down when the 440MLa is installed in it. I bought the Maestro without a cantilever so the closest that I have heard the Maestro sound as intended by Clear Audio would have been from the little audition I did with the 150MLX installed.
Regards,
Don

[dlaloum]

Hi Don,

Given the cartridges you are/have been playing with and the exalted company they are keeping....

Have you tried the Dynavector Karat family? or the classic Panasonic Strain Gauge?

I have a feeling these are very similar to the Decca family....

I put my straing gauge aside a couple of years back due to a chanel imbalance that may be due to the strain gauge pre...

[neobop]

Hello Neobop,

Do not confuse my current favorite (maestro/440MLa), statement with best sounding.  My best sounding non M/C would be the London Decca Jubilee in addition to the ones you and just mentioned.  By favorite I meant most fun and most often used M/M. 
I did (I guess you could say for a couple of days), successfully transplanted  the AT 150 MLX.   Because it was a NOS stylus, I was giving it a few day to run in before I did any close listening when one morning I found the forward half of the cantilever sitting on the surface of the turntable.  Forward half being the part forward of the screw.  I have no ideal what happened. I'm leaning towards the thought that perhaps I had to much force applied to the screw because when I loosened the screw, a small piece of the cantilever fell out.  I try to be extra careful with the Clear Audio's because of how the cantilever sticks out in such a way that it appears to be begging to be bumped so I don't think the problem was cause from anything I did.   Anyway, I put the 440MLa back in and have left it there ever since.
Neo, I perfer the shibata from Jico or the Vivid Line from LP Tunes  over the 440MLa in the Virtuoso.  There is a brightness with the 440MLa/Virtuoso combination that is not complimentary.  Very detailed but leans towards the bright side. I did consider trying to load it down, but really wasn't interested in trying to make it improve.  At the time,  I was still disappointed in the lost  AT 150MLX cantilever.   I'm sure there are systems out there that could use a little brightening up, but my system is not one of them. The extra wood on the Maestro seems to help damp this effect down when the 440MLa is installed in it. I bought the Maestro without a cantilever so the closest that I have heard the Maestro sound as intended by Clear Audio would have been from the little audition I did with the 150MLX installed.
Regards,
Don

Excuse me for jumping to conclusions (current favorite MM = best sounding).  How is the tracking on the Decca?  Some say you trade off some detail/resolution for dynamics.  What's your take on this Don?  I bought an old Decca on fleabey once and figured I'd get it retipped, but it was DOA.

I thought perhaps the wood on the CA body and difference in generators might compensate for the aggressive sound of the 440 stylus in the 440/120 body.  Maybe I won't get another one.  Maybe it's better in a higher inductance body like Dongrb's LS500?  Probably still depends on system and loading.

Speaking of loading if you're running at 47K sometimes just going down a hair will smooth it out.  400K in parallel will net you around 42K.  My experience with the stylus is somewhat different.  I found that switching to boron or beryllium afforded a big improvement in detail and harmonic textures.  That was with the 440 body.  Rigidity has it's benefits but I don't think extra warmth/dynamics is one of them compared to aluminum.  Unfortunately, I too broke a couple of nice styli attempting transplant.  The patient survived but the donor organs didn't.   This mix/match aspect leads me to Raul's take on the Maestro vs Virtuoso.  He was using a Virtuoso with Soundsmith level 1 - alum/elliptical and preferred it to stock Maestro saying it was overdamped.  I suspect the best Maestro is with a SS level 2 or 3 - ruby/LC.  Short of that, I think the 3472 P-mount series outperform the upgrade 95 series, at least on a Virtuoso in a med or light arm.  Try a 92E for $21 (B&H) and see what I mean.  That's a .3 x .7  If you like it you can get a 3472 Vivid line or whatever.
neo