[gary]

The title pretty much says it all... I'm tired of buying cds and finding they've been remastered and have no dynamic range. For instance, I'd like to get a copy of Business As Usual by Men At Work, but I know that if I get it from Amazon I'll get a recent remaster that will sound like trash. This just happened to me with Diesel And Dust, I have it on vinyl just like the Men At Work albums but I wanted a digital copy and ended up with one that is a definite casualty in the loudness war.

Some sites may have discs like this used, but odds are they're the same later copies. With no way to tell what I'm getting before it arrives. I'm wondering if anyone can suggest a site that sells used CDs and provides pictures or more detailed info so that I can find out when a specific disc was made? And yes I could go to some stores that sell used records, but here in Jacksonville there really isn't a good way to do that like there was back up North.

thanks
gary

[FullRangeMan]

There is no such that shop today, all CDs today are extremelly compressed dinamic range to be listened in the car, ear buds, boom boxes or copied to smart phones.

An alternative could be sacd versions:
http://www.sa-cd.net/titles

[Brettio]

Second Spin seems to do a pretty good job of identifying remastered copies if you’re looking to avoid them and also provides a disc release date (not sure how accurate those dates are as I’ve never paid attention to them).

https://www.secondspin.com

[charmerci]

I would try eBay. Individuals selling CD's will tell you what you want.

[konut]

There is a fair amount of selling on  http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/  . Sellers are usually cognisant about identifying which mastering and year of issue. While it's not a market place per se, if you're patient you can snag some of what you're after.

[jseymour]

I use the Dynamic Range Database http://dr.loudness-war.info/ to find which version has the best range. 
Discogs https://www.discogs.com/search/ is a great site to find sellers.

[LesterSleepsIn]

Search on Discogs. Discogs will provide you with a release date, label, a catalogue number and a country of origin. For Business As Usual the first cd release was on Epic in 1983 from Japan. The second cd release was on CBS from the US in 1984, etc.

Of course there’s no guarantee that the early cds will sound better than the remastered.

https://www.discogs.com/Men-At-Work-Business-As-Usual/master/82009

[timind]

It takes a little research to ensure you get the best copy of whichever cd. I use a combination of https://www.discogs.com and the dynamic range data base at dr.loudness-war.info to determine which particular release has the best, or acceptable, DR rating. As stated by Konut, you can also get a feel for the cd with the best mastering at http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/categories/discussions.65/. ALthough, the best master is sometimes debatable over there. 
Once I have the label and catalog number I either buy it on Discogs or ebay. If using ebay I will only buy if I can determine the correct catalog number through pictures.

http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/list?artist=&album=business+as+usual

[WGH]

I would buy re-mastered high dynamic hi-res flac files from HD Tracks, convert the files to 16/44 .wave with dBpoweramp and burn to disk.

[GoldenVibrations]

There is no such that shop today, all CDs today are extremelly compressed dinamic range to be listened in the car, ear buds, boom boxes or copied to smart phones.

Nonsense. Not "ALL" CD's today are dynamically compressed. There are many that have excellent dynamic range, but they won't be the mainstream pop, rap, hip hop, etc.

[FullRangeMan]

Nonsense. Not "ALL" CD's today are dynamically compressed. There are many that have excellent dynamic range, but they won't be the mainstream pop, rap, hip hop, etc.

An special sound quality CDs I would recommed is the first pressing CDs of Van Der Graaf Generator for prog rock fans, these CDs were pristine analog recorded and mixed by Pat Moran and few compression was used offering a impressive good sound even today, the transients are stunning.

[maty]

Like others, before to buy a CD, SACD, Vinyl or HR files you need to search:

* http://dr.loudness-war.info/

* https://www.discogs.com/search/

or better, to know who and/or where to ask!!!   

With vinyls, the pressing is very important.

Classical, antique, jazz... from known Editorials take care of the product they sell. But commercial/popular music is a jungle without law.

Note: a lot of HR files are resampler from the CD 16/44 and not from the analogue/digital masters.

[maty]

By the way,

Digital masters from 80 and 90 decades have a lot of jitter inside. It can not be eliminated but it can be mitigated or disguised. The studio master clocks were no precise like now.

Jitter -> "digititis" sound, artificial, bright, lifeless...

Bad clocks -> CD from old analogue masters have a lot of jitter inside.

80's and 90's are very problematic decades if you want very good sound -> hence the mania of many vinyl lovers to the CD without knowing the cause. The problem with vinyl is you need to spend a lot of money, a lot of, if you want a very good sound -> Tthat is why many detest vinyl without knowing the real reasons.

The vinyl lovers use very expensive cartridge. With a good vinyl system you can tell the difference but ... $$$

Clearaudio Titanium V2, castridge -> "official" price/prize: € 7000 if you are not a regular customer, you know.

I know, there are others very good cartridge less expensive but this is incredible good. But a very good cartidge needs a very good hard too. $$$$$$$

[maty]

Talking about Dynamic Range, aka DR. Just now:

The Cars - Shake It Up (1981), CD, Elektra, Germany

DR         Peak         RMS     Duration Track
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DR12      -1.52 dB   -15.79 dB      3:31 01-Since You're Gone
DR12      -1.87 dB   -16.04 dB      3:32 02-Shake It Up
DR12      -2.35 dB   -16.81 dB      4:10 03-I'm Not the One
DR13      -3.09 dB   -18.62 dB      4:25 04-Victim of Love
DR15      -1.82 dB   -17.65 dB      4:57 05-Cruiser
DR14      -1.91 dB   -18.58 dB      5:40 06-A Dream Away
DR13      -2.36 dB   -18.42 dB      4:27 07-This Could Be Love
DR12      -2.04 dB   -16.59 dB      4:56 08-Think It Over
DR13      -1.60 dB   -17.69 dB      5:03 09-Maybe Baby
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Number of tracks:  9
Official DR value: DR13


The Cars - Shake It Up (1981) CD, Rhino, Expanded Edition 2018

DR         Peak         RMS     Duration Track
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DR8       -0.16 dB   -10.23 dB      3:31 01-Since You're Gone (Remastered)
DR7       -0.16 dB    -9.40 dB      3:32 02-Shake It Up (Remastered)
DR9       -0.16 dB   -10.82 dB      4:10 03-I'm Not The One (Remastered)
DR8       -0.16 dB   -10.37 dB      4:24 04-Victim Of Love (Remastered)
DR7       -0.16 dB    -8.57 dB      4:57 05-Cruiser (Remastered)
DR10      -0.16 dB   -11.87 dB      5:40 06-A Dream Away (Remastered)
DR9       -0.16 dB   -10.56 dB      4:27 07-This Could Be Love (Remastered)
DR7       -0.16 dB    -8.97 dB      4:56 08-Think It Over (Remastered)
DR6       -0.16 dB    -8.33 dB      5:06 09-Maybe Baby (Remastered)
DR9       -0.05 dB   -10.58 dB      5:57 10-Since You're Gone (Early Version)
DR9        0.00 dB   -10.83 dB      4:10 11-Shake It Up (Demo)
DR11      -0.08 dB   -12.78 dB      4:11 12-I'm Not The One (Remix) (Remastered)
DR10      -0.08 dB   -10.97 dB      5:00 13-Cruiser (Early Version)
DR10      -0.07 dB   -11.31 dB      6:19 14-Take It On The Run (Early Version of A Dream Away)
DR9        0.00 dB   -10.31 dB      5:21 15-Coming Up You Again (1981 Version of Coming Up You)
DR9       -0.21 dB   -10.65 dB      2:54 16-Little Black Egg (Remastered)
DR9       -0.07 dB   -10.35 dB      4:22 17-Midnight Dancer
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Number of tracks:  17
Official DR value: DR9


Well, that is how you do not have to become a remaster. Damn volume war!

Usually problem with commercial music, modern or remastered.

[maty]

Btw, very good reviews in Amazon.com:

https://www.amazon.com/Shake-Up-Expanded-Cars/dp/B079J83X4S#customerReviews

You know, less DR -> you need less watts. The music sounds louder in the FM radio first and now in the phones and others gadgets.

Since we do a remaster, let is raise the bass to the current taste.

The important thing is to obtain economic benefits and not do the job well, no matter how much excellent technology is available.

And then the Industry complain that people do not spend money on music or on decent audio equipment.

In Spanish/Castillian we have a saying: Se cosecha lo sembrado / What is sown is harvested.

[maty]

Before, played the first track with foobar2000 (32 bits), with Kernel Streaming.

Now, with JRMC 64 bits, wit Kernel Streaming.

The original sounds better, again, with JRMC. The same with the remastered track.

JRMC 64 bits. Original vs Remastered, first track. I do not like foobar2000 as a player, only ISO (SACD) with the SACD plugin.

First seconds is OK. You can like more one or other but when the singer's voice appears is much more artificial 

And my Win 10 Pro 1709 64 bits without the last tweak working!

[maty]

White noise to clean my brain.

Full tweaked to to reduce noise and jitter generated by the processor (i5 four generation).

With JRMC 64 bits and Kernel Streaming.

Original, first track. Much better!!!

Remastered, first track. As before, I have to lower the volume. More bass than never, too muchhhh. Voice less artificial but... Much better than before the FULL tweaks. But more I listen to the track, more unbearable!

With the original my feet are more restless as I write.

My advice, if you have a good stereo do not waste money with the Rhino 2018 remaster.

The End. I must to cook a good paella.