ONE.2 listening impressions

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virtue

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ONE.2 listening impressions
« on: 5 Mar 2010, 05:25 am »
The postal fairies are delivering amps and I thought I'd start a new thread for listening impressions and suggestions.

coemaudio

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Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #1 on: 5 Mar 2010, 06:21 am »
Seth mate, I can't wait to receive my ONE.2 amplifiers!!  :D

jtsnead

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Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #2 on: 5 Mar 2010, 05:27 pm »
Well I could not wait the 48 hours I wanted to to let the one.2 w/ 30v/130watt ps break in.

I am comparing it to a Rogue Stereo 90 Super Magnum with Genalex KT88's
a $510.00 amp versus a $3200.00 amp, I did move the jumpers over on the
Virtue to use it as an amp w/o volume control.




First impressions, listening to a Ray Brown cut The Real Blues from the Concord SACD Sampler 2, the attack and decay on the plucked strings is better defined, also in the beginning of the cut a phone rings in the back right hand soundstage (which the audience laughs at) with the Virtue I can hear more air/echo around the phone which makes it so much more musical HAHA, the piano has as good a tone as the Rogue, very impressive.

The next cd I listened to was by a group called Fever Ray which is kind of a more electronic version of Dead Can Dance , has acoustic and electonic sounds all over the soundstage. With the Virtue I thought the sound was good but a little more granier in the mid and upper ranges, this cd also has some Q sound going on which was not as present w/ the Virtue. Then I noticed that in my audiophile impatience I had the amp plugged into a cheap power strip that I use for background lighting, so I plugged it directly into the wall, much better mid's and highs now, this with the standard power cord that was supplied with the amp, so naturally the next step was to try a better power cord so I hooked a Signal Cable pc (the cheap one) another step in the right direction, now I am hearing more of the Q sound effects off to the rh side of my listening chair.

The above cd made me think of another Q sound cd Roger Waters Amused to death, from what I remember this cd I had listened to recently now sounded better with the doggie in the opening track more detailed on the right side of my room, vocals sound just as good so does the guitar. Marv Albert in cut four saying that it is a beautiful day at my old stomping ground Memorial Stadium in Baltimore (now gone and how I miss it and the old Orioles team) sounds just as out of phase but also as centered around the left speaker as I remember.

This is amazing sound from a product this affordable it has me thinking about looking at the upper range of the Virtue line, very impressed.

danieljtb

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Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #3 on: 6 Mar 2010, 02:30 am »
Well, the postal guy brought me my new ONE.2 today and I thought i'd give some initial comments.     

First, what i have been listening to... an amp4 tripath 2024 a friend built with a pyramid linear psu. Also a Trends tube preamp to give the little tripath some more umph.

I hooked up the ONE.2 straight from the dac rather than using the pre amp, as i want to burn in and listen with pure virtue; then decide if the pre amp is necesary.  Speakers are Klipsch bookshelves with 92db sensitivity.

the ONE.2 propeller connects are really nice, tho the thru holes are too small for my 14 guage flat speaker wire.  I split the strands and ran halve thru the hole and the other strands wrapped around the post...those thick brass washers that the propellers tighten onto are way cool.

One disappointment; the amp isn't quiet. there is a raggedy hiss when I but my ear up to the speaker...more on the right channel than on the left. I tried using a different heavyduty cord; ; different wall jacks etc...tried two powerstrips  the hum remains.  the last thing left to try is straight cord, no power strip.   Seth, is this something that should burn out, or possibly a bad psu?

On to the good stuff.  for the first 1.5 hours I put on various bluegrass, Indian classical, and some heavy duty Arvo Part.  While the amp is just starting out, and a sort of a study in contradictions sonically..I am hearing more detail, more separation of instruments, and better soundstage.  Several times i found myself looking up, trying to figure out where a certaion sound was coming from almost outside the 12 x 12 room.  its already more musical than my old 2024
and much more ballsy.  Its just a more full bodied mature sound  - if still compressed dynamically compared to what it will be when burned in.  HIgher dbs are easier to listen too, and running low volumn is more engaging than my old amp.  and that's with the 24v psu.

Other than the speaker hiss,we are off to a very, very good start
Daniel


dvenardos

Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #4 on: 6 Mar 2010, 03:43 am »
If you stick your ear right up to the speaker you should hear a hiss, how loud depends on the sensitivity of your speakers. This is a result of switching power supplies. If your ear isn't right up next to the speaker you shouldn't hear it.
I haven't heard one, but the amp4 is supposed to be a very good amp.

One disappointment; the amp isn't quiet. there is a raggedy hiss when I but my ear up to the speaker...more on the right channel than on the left. I tried using a different heavyduty cord; ; different wall jacks etc...tried two powerstrips  the hum remains.  the last thing left to try is straight cord, no power strip.   Seth, is this something that should burn out, or possibly a bad psu?
« Last Edit: 6 Mar 2010, 06:39 am by dvenardos »

danieljtb

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Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #5 on: 6 Mar 2010, 06:22 am »
Don   thanks for the info about the switching supply. My preamp, spdif converter, and dac all have those wallwort acdc adaptors....are they switching also.  they dont add any speaker hiss.  the amp hiss isnt a smooth hiss i.e.  sssssss   but ragged   kqskqskqs.  Is this normal?  I can hear the hiss at about 3 inches from the right speaker and 1 inch from the left.  speaker sens is 92db      amp is off for the night...tomorrow I will hook up less sens speakers 87db and see is hiss is less   thanks again   Daniel

dvenardos

Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #6 on: 6 Mar 2010, 06:50 am »
No, it should be like white noise and the same for each channel. I don't recall the technical details of the cause, but never noticed it until I had another class D amp that had a huge amount of hiss and when comparing it to my Virtue Two discovered that the Two did indeed have a small amount of hiss.

Don   thanks for the info about the switching supply. My preamp, spdif converter, and dac all have those wallwort acdc adaptors....are they switching also.  they dont add any speaker hiss.  the amp hiss isnt a smooth hiss i.e.  sssssss   but ragged   kqskqskqs.  Is this normal?  I can hear the hiss at about 3 inches from the right speaker and 1 inch from the left.  speaker sens is 92db      amp is off for the night...tomorrow I will hook up less sens speakers 87db and see is hiss is less   thanks again   Daniel

littletree76

Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #7 on: 6 Mar 2010, 11:31 am »
I remember when I received my classic One with both standard bundle 24V/65W switching PSU and upgrade 30V/130W switching PSU, the standard 24V/65W switching PSU caused severe hissing which render it unusable whereas the upgrade 30V/130W switching PSU has been completely silent when the One is not supplied with input signal till today. I am also using Klipsch RB-51 bookshelf speakers with high sensitivity of 92dB. First thing to check against hissing/humming noise is to ensure no ground loop exist in your audio system.

I suggest upgrade the power supply to linear power supplies offered by Virtue Audio with much higher current output. The 30V/130W switching PSU can only supply up to 130W/30V=4.3A which is much lower than those linear power supplies. For cost of power supply upgrade, it will provide better bass response and hopefully resolve the hissing issue (one stone for two birds).

Don   thanks for the info about the switching supply. My preamp, spdif converter, and dac all have those wallwort acdc adaptors....are they switching also.  they dont add any speaker hiss.  the amp hiss isnt a smooth hiss i.e.  sssssss   but ragged   kqskqskqs.  Is this normal?  I can hear the hiss at about 3 inches from the right speaker and 1 inch from the left.  speaker sens is 92db      amp is off for the night...tomorrow I will hook up less sens speakers 87db and see is hiss is less   thanks again   Daniel

virtue

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Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #8 on: 7 Mar 2010, 03:24 am »
Fellas, great thread.  Yip, these amps aren't "dead" quiet but they're pretty quiet and you'll hear less as the power supply is upgraded -- up to batteries which are the ringers for no switching noise (surprise!).  Comparing hiss from a power amplifier to that from a DAC is really not fair... you can't regulate out the noise on the power amp as you can on a device drawing only millivolts... also, the power amp is amplifying the hiss!

Those 65w supplies are as good as we could find among "mass market" supplies that aren't built for special industrial and medical uses.  It was one of the only supplies of it's kind (cheap) that would not fold back on itself (shut off) with our amp, which can draw lots of current.  Sadly, our new 90w supplies failed this way and we're eating a lot of them (and the "boutique" 80w supplies cost us 2x what the 90w was running).

Like I say on the site, the 65w supply is recommended for "burn-in" only... is this a cop-out from us?  I've written about it elsewhere... it's our way of letting you "get into" the amp at a low price, upgrade as you see fit and can afford.  I hope that you don't feel "let down" - I try to keep expectations rather low for that supply.

So... the hiss will go down with a better supply; not to ICEPower levels but it shouldn't be annoying.


danieljtb

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Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #9 on: 7 Mar 2010, 07:09 am »
I don't feel let down...I am really enjoying the amp,  and its only on day two.  It's already giving me a new window into the music.       

I just didn't know to expect that ragged speaker noise with the 24v switching psu, and it kind of freaked me... I am used to the silence of my pyramid 12v linear, and feared that the virtue amp or psu was faulty in some way. Its really kind of a nasty sound; brings up images of electrical arcing and burning circuits

Fortunately,  it does not seem to be discernable once I move more than 3 or so inches from the speakers.  If this remains the case,  i am a happy camper.  this amp is already outperforming my previous one... I can not imagine it once burned in and with a high quality psu.

I will give the amp a couple of weeks break in before i report back on further listening impressions.  But even at this point i am having fun  discovering new stuff hidden in familar music and hearing my speakers sounding surprisingly better

will keep you guys posted    Daniel

Rocket

Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #10 on: 7 Mar 2010, 07:24 am »
Hi,

Hiss coming from your speaker at 3 or 4 inches is fairly normal in my experience.  I wouldn't be concerned unless you can hear it at your normal listening position.

Regards

Rod

wsturner

Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #11 on: 7 Mar 2010, 04:24 pm »
UPS tracking says amp will arrive tomorrow. I will charge my batteries tonight so they are ready  :D

http://www.gr-research.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=154

I will burn-in with the standard power supply, and then move to the batteries.

I will post to let everyone know if/how the two supplies alter hiss.

I expect that the battery will "paint it black".

jtsnead

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Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #12 on: 7 Mar 2010, 05:35 pm »
UPS tracking says amp will arrive tomorrow. I will charge my batteries tonight so they are ready  :D

http://www.gr-research.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=154

I will burn-in with the standard power supply, and then move to the batteries.

I will post to let everyone know if/how the two supplies alter hiss.

I expect that the battery will "paint it black"

Please post a sound comparison w/ w/o battery supply

I have a little hiss which I am used to having a tube pre and amp

I like this little amp so much I might be upgrading my 30v/130w
ps soon,  :thumb:

Does the GR put out up to 10 amps?

virtue

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Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #13 on: 7 Mar 2010, 09:57 pm »
As Vinnie will tell you, those SLA batteries are capable of discharging well more than 10A on demand.  These amps will only draw 7A at 30v (max) so anything more is gratuitous.  It's the low noise-floor which is what's so cool about the battery supplies.  That, and the low price especially if you're willing to build your own.

wsturner

Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #14 on: 8 Mar 2010, 07:00 am »
Regarding the current capability of the GR batteries. I would not suggest trying to measure the voltage from the end of the circuit which plugs into the amplifier. If you short circuit, it will produce a VERY bright light, and melt/weld your probe to the connector.

Not that I know from experience - or anything  :o

Just be careful, and think about what you are doing!
« Last Edit: 10 Mar 2010, 04:37 pm by wsturner »

wsturner

Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #15 on: 10 Mar 2010, 04:46 am »
My speaker sensitivity = 86db. I can hear a very faint white noise when I put my ear right next to the speaker. I have to put my ear right on the grill to hear it, and it is very faint. Also, the noise does not increase as I turn up the volume. Also, the noise does not go away when I use a battery supply. This seems to imply that it is a characteristic of the amp, and not the supply.

Personally, I don't have any problem with this. It isn't detectable while listening to music.

The burn-in is happening exactly like indicated. Amazing sound for first hour, then things go a little south for a while (should be about 100 hours). I will give more impressions in about five days.

However, I was able to do enough experimenting, during that first hour, to say that you might want to start looking into batteries. I am not saying it sounded bad with the standard supply - it easily beat out my modded Trends Audio TA-10. But when I plugged in the battery....Well, more on that in a few days   :wink:
« Last Edit: 10 Mar 2010, 04:37 pm by wsturner »

OzarkTom

Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #16 on: 27 Mar 2010, 03:55 am »
Anybody here want to buy a $1200 highly reviewed integrated amp? The One.2 with standard power supply smoked it in every way, driving my Gallo Strada speakers. Unbelievable!

jtsnead

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Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #17 on: 27 Mar 2010, 01:50 pm »
or does anybody want to buy 3200.00 tube amp?

wsturner

Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #18 on: 27 Mar 2010, 04:12 pm »
I would like thank the Virtue team for giving us the ONE.2

Maybe this amp should have been branded The Virtue "David" - because it really is a giant killer  :)

I am content.




OzarkTom

Re: ONE.2 listening impressions
« Reply #19 on: 29 Mar 2010, 02:04 pm »
or does anybody want to buy 3200.00 tube amp?

After listening for the last 35 years to all types and brands of tube amps{I was a high end dealer for almost 20 years}, the downfall I hear are output transformers. They mask some of the detail no matter who makes them. Now take OTL's, that is a much different story, detail galore. That is what this Virtue amp sounds like, an OTL, but at a ridiculously low price. I sure like that, and no worry of all the heat the OTL's produce......or the price.