Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. Read 35229 times.

JackD

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1399
Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #200 on: 15 Mar 2018, 03:17 am »
And the S700's can be bought for attractive prices in some places. :thumb:

debjit.g

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 79
Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #201 on: 15 Mar 2018, 03:21 am »
And the S700's can be bought for attractive prices in some places. :thumb:

 yes  :D

OzarkTom

Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #202 on: 15 Mar 2018, 11:50 am »
PS Audio at Music Direct at full price but with a 60 day return policy.  :thumb:

The one I would like to try is the S-300 for 1499. Trade an amp woorth $500 at PS Audio website and the price is $1050.

Specs of the S-300

 dual mono, each with their own power supply
Zero-loss Analog Cell input stage
Powerful MOSFET output stage
RCA Single ended input
XLR “true” balanced input
140 watts per channel 8Ω
300 watts per channel 4Ω
2Ω stable
Less than 0.1% thd 20Hz to 20kHz at rated power
Damping factor greater than 550 for excellent loudspeaker control
Front panel standby button
Efficient operation with very little heat
Dual, solid copper, plated, output binding posts
27 pounds
Input 12 volt trigger

Roninaudio

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 163
  • I don't necessarily agree with everything I say.
Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #203 on: 15 Mar 2018, 12:29 pm »
The S300 is a great amp with good reviews as well.  I had it hooked up with Dynaudio speakers.  You won't be disappointed for the $$.  I have since traded the S300 in for the M700 mono blocks (then upgraded speakers) and am very pleased.  I also use the PSA Direct Stream DAC.  Good luck!

Tomy2Tone

Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #204 on: 15 Mar 2018, 12:36 pm »
How different is the s700 from the m700? Or was it just a typo.

brother love

Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #205 on: 15 Mar 2018, 12:48 pm »
deleted

Roninaudio

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 163
  • I don't necessarily agree with everything I say.
Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #206 on: 15 Mar 2018, 12:50 pm »
The M700s are part of the Stellar series so perhaps that is where the "S" originates. I am referring to these Class D's for clarifications sake:

https://www.psaudio.com/products/stellar-m700-power-amplifier/

Roninaudio

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 163
  • I don't necessarily agree with everything I say.
Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #207 on: 15 Mar 2018, 12:53 pm »
The M700s are part of the Stellar series so perhaps that is where the "S" originates. I am referring to these Class D's for clarifications sake:

https://www.psaudio.com/products/stellar-m700-power-amplifier/

There is a S300 (stereo) amp but no S700.  Just the mono blocks..

maty

Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #208 on: 15 Mar 2018, 01:01 pm »
PS Audio Stellar M700 monoblock power amplifier

https://www.stereophile.com/content/ps-audio-stellar-m700-monoblock-power-amplifier

Quote
In the Stellar M700, the Gain Cell drives a 700ASC class-D power module from the Danish company ICEpower. I asked Paul McGowan, CEO of PS Audio, why they chose this module rather than, say, one from Hypex, another class-D specialist. He said that they spent a lot of time listening to modules from various manufacturers, and the 700ASC was the one whose sound quality most closely matched that of the Gain Cell...

-> https://www.stereophile.com/content/ps-audio-stellar-m700-monoblock-power-amplifier-measurements

H3 predominance :(


Buffer? + Icepower 700ASC

Buffer or Icepower 700ASC, who is the guilty?

Well, I do not like the harmonic profile. Where are H2 or little H4? H2 at -110 dB, H3  at -80 dB. Vade retro.

OzarkTom

Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #209 on: 15 Mar 2018, 01:03 pm »
The S300 is a great amp with good reviews as well.  I had it hooked up with Dynaudio speakers.  You won't be disappointed for the $$.  I have since traded the S300 in for the M700 mono blocks (then upgraded speakers) and am very pleased.  I also use the PSA Direct Stream DAC.  Good luck!

How much better are the M700's over the S300 in SQ?

Roninaudio

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 163
  • I don't necessarily agree with everything I say.
Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #210 on: 15 Mar 2018, 01:51 pm »
I do not have a Spectrum Analyzer or data to answer your question. However there was a distinct difference my system which may be also be attributed to overhead given the difference in power etc.  Your system experience may vary but the 700 was  a step up and a great value point. My system had better imaging and I use the power- not always but at higher SPLs the difference was readily apparent in overall performance.   Above that was the BHK 250 ($7500) and the BHK monos (15K) which personally, did not fit my system goals or budget. 

To quote Paul McGowen:

You see, it’s not an easy black and white question because the S300 and M700 are totally different amps. Sure, they were crafted by the same hands, voiced by the same two people, both based on an Analog Cell in the front end, but they do not sound the same.

One is not a smaller identical sounding version of the other.

PSA does have a trail period btw... However, deals can be found "out in the wild"....  Hope this help...


maty

Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #211 on: 15 Mar 2018, 01:56 pm »
The answer is blowing in other review.

https://www.stereophile.com/content/ps-audio-stellar-m700-monoblock-power-amplifier-measurements

Quote
As the M700 is a class-D design, all measurements were taken with Audio Precision's auxiliary AUX-0025 passive low-pass filter, which eliminates noise above 200kHz that might otherwise overload the SYS2722's input circuitry. Without the filter, 877mV of ultrasonic noise was present at the speaker terminals, with a center frequency of 465kHz. (This is very similar to the Peachtree Audio nova300, which Art Dudley reviewed in June 2017 and which also uses an ICEpower module.)

https://www.stereophile.com/content/peachtree-audio-nova300-integrated-amplifier-measurements

Quote
Because of it uses ICEpower class-D modules...


The PS BUFFER is the guilty

I do not remember ever seeing a harmonic profile where H2 is 30 db below H3, it is amazing.

I do not understand how they can search on purpose, it is inconceivable to me. They are using engineering to obtain the opposite of what is desirable in audio. Again: incredible.

maty

Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #212 on: 15 Mar 2018, 02:04 pm »
[Polish Review] PEACHTREE AUDIO Nova 150 V2

https://audio.com.pl/testy/stereo/wzmacniacze-stereo/2857-peachtree-audio-nova-150-v2

to English with Google:

https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=pl&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=https%3A%2F%2Faudio.com.pl%2Ftesty%2Fstereo%2Fwzmacniacze-stereo%2F2857-peachtree-audio-nova-150-v2&edit-text=

Quote

The third harmonic is the strongest in the spectrum in Figure 2, and its level is low -90 dB; you can see the next odd, but already below -100 dB. In the high level of THD + N indicator (Fig. 3), this noise is involved, which makes the characteristics fall above the level of 0.1%, but in this case it is not a cause for great distress. It's good, pulse technique and here it came out with a shield, although it triumphs elsewhere - in C388.

* C388 is NAD C388 with Hypex UcD.

By the way, the SNR is only 75 dB !!!!!!!!!

THROWBACK

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 317
Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #213 on: 15 Mar 2018, 02:28 pm »
Maty (#211)
Lincoln (or Confucius, or Solomon, or Samuel Johnson, or Mark Twain, or Homer Simpson) once said: "Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than speak and remove all doubt."
Well, I need help in understanding your harmonic chart and I don’t mind displaying my ignorance to get it.
Since I am more comfortable using % distortion rather than dB, I used the THD to dB converter at http://www.sengpielaudio.com/calculator-thd.htm to obtain from your chart:
100% distortion at 50Hz
.0003% distortion at 100Hz
.1% distortion at 150Hz
0.0000178% at 1,000Hz
I’m guessing you are bothered by those distortion figures at low frequencies.
When I Googled “distortion figures at low frequencies” I came across several entries which suggest that high distortion at low frequencies is not as terrible as high distortion at high frequencies. (OK, 100% at 50Hz does seem a bit much.)
But the rap on Class D, as I understand it, has been high distortion at high frequencies, and there seems to be none of that here.
Care to elaborate?

maty

Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #214 on: 15 Mar 2018, 02:36 pm »
They are not my charts, my measures, my graphs....

Again: H2 is 30 dB below H3. With H3 at -80 dB.

What logic does it have? What sound is sought? A very analytical sound? Why spoil the harmonic profile of the Icepower module?

maty

Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #215 on: 15 Mar 2018, 02:41 pm »
[Polish Review] NAD C388, with the old Hypex UcD modules

https://audio.com.pl/testy/stereo/wzmacniacze-stereo/2856-nad-c388

to English with Google:

https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=pl&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=https%3A%2F%2Faudio.com.pl%2Ftesty%2Fstereo%2Fwzmacniacze-stereo%2F2856-nad-c388&edit-text=&act=url


Quote
The S / N value of 88 dB is particularly pleasing, as it is an impulse system. The low noise level and high output power create very high dynamics - 112 dB.

The C388 also coped well in the difficult (for class D amplifiers) test of transfer characteristic (Figure 1), which almost does not reveal that we are dealing with such a construction. The characteristics for both loads are perfectly convergent, they fall gently already above 20 kHz, but the points -3 dB are determined only above 70 kHz.

In the distortion spectrum (Figure 2), only the second harmonic lies at the limit of -90 dB, while the next one manages to see above the low noise spectrum, but it will be completely irrelevant.

THROWBACK

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 317
Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #216 on: 15 Mar 2018, 02:45 pm »
Maty
That was not a challenge. I simply do not understand the significance of what you are saying.

"Again: H2 is 30 dB below H3. With H3 at -80 dB."

What does that signify? What should that tell us?

Roninaudio

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 163
  • I don't necessarily agree with everything I say.
Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #217 on: 15 Mar 2018, 02:46 pm »
I might add that I understand none of the graphs etc. at least as it relates to sound quality.  What I do understand is how the 300 and 700s sound in my system. I also know the guys that build these and the testing, listening and manufacturing that went into them.  There is nothing anyone on this forum or most others is going to "catch" good or bad that has not been reviewed buy the team at PSA after 40+ years experience.  My opinion anyway.  Lot's of great options out there- PSA is  one of them and the 700s are getting killer reviews and that's is not by accident. Best and by far the most definitive test= try one in your home. 

maty

Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #218 on: 15 Mar 2018, 02:49 pm »
I do not know why this harmonic profile was sought.

Would not it be better to ask the manufacturer to explain it?

I honestly do not understand why.

Tomy2Tone

Re: Are we on the verge of a SS revolution???
« Reply #219 on: 15 Mar 2018, 02:51 pm »
I might add that I understand none of the graphs etc. at least as it relates to sound quality.  What I do understand is how the 300 and 700s sound in my system. I also know the guys that build these and the testing, listening and manufacturing that went into them.  There is nothing anyone on this forum or most others is going to "catch" good or bad that has not been reviewed buy the team at PSA after 40+ years experience.  My opinion anyway.  Lot's of great options out there- PSA is  one of them and the 700s are getting killer reviews and that's is not by accident. Best and by far the most definitive test= try one in your home.

What are the m700’s currently driving? I think you mentioned earlier you used the S300 with Dynaudio but then upgraded both speakers and amps if I read that right. And are you using the Direct Stream as volume control?