AudioCircle
Other Stuff => Archived Circles => Hypex Owners Circle => Topic started by: OzarkTom on 27 Feb 2013, 03:18 pm
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At $1295, Rogue Audio’s latest hybrid integrated amplifier is also the company’s most affordable amplifier. The Sphinx is rated to deliver 100Wpc into 8 ohms; has a phono stage, headphone amp, and an optional remote; and is handmade in Pennsylvania, USA.
(http://www.stereophile.com/images/Rogue3_600.jpg)
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Who's heard it?
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Holy crap, a phonostage too?! That's sweet! :thumb:
Best,
Anand.
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Have not heard it personally but here are couple of links where folks heard it at CES
http://www.soundstagehifi.com/index.php/opinion/527
http://www.analogplanet.com/content/rogue-hybrid-integrated-amplifier-contains-mm-phono-preamplifier
http://www.stereophile.com/content/rogue-audio-sphinx
Link to product specs - http://www.rogueaudio.com/Products_sphinx.htm
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That seems like an amazing price for all you are getting.
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Not the NCore 400, but the UCD 180 module is no slouch either (see the picbelow). For $1295, that's a great value.
(http://www.rogueaudio.com/Images/sphinxinsidelarge.jpg)
Best,
Anand.
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For $100 more, you can add a remote. Heckuva deal for 100 watts of Hypex Class D power with tubes.
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(http://www.rogueaudio.com/Images/sphinxrearlrg.jpg)
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Looking forward to the reviews and listening impressions as I'm thinking of consolidating my tube amp and preamp into an integrated to drive my Songtowers and this looks like it might have the best of both world (ss and tube).
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Dunno about the lightbulbs in front of the module, but the UcD180 is a surprisingly powerful little thing. I have an amp using it (Pro-Ject Amp Box SE) and it sounds just like a good class AB amp to me. I've not done a blind test on it, but I suspect the actual sonic difference going from UcD to Ncore would be de minimis at best.
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Wow, this is an extremely compelling amp - especially at this price, build quality, and component quality!
Can anyone please confirm if this amp is rated at 180W at 4 ohms (based on hypex UcD180HG spec)?
Will it also support 4 ohm loads (or dips of 3 ohms for hard to drive speakers)?
The product spec doesn't contain these details and hence I ask.
Thanks,
Arun
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I am also interested in this amp. I gave it an audition and liked it-imaging, sound stage, not fatigueing. However, this was literally right out of the box, and it is supposed to benefit from being plugged in for 24 hours, so maybe I will like it even more. It would also help if I was auditioning them with my own speakers. I could do without the bluelight and don't have a need for the phono stage or headphone jack.
I have read a few comments about Hypex treble sounding veiled or strange, should this be a concern?
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IIRC Bruno said last year that most of the Ncore improvements were being added into the UCD modules.
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What Hypex amp and power modules in it?
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What Hypex amp and power modules in it?
It looks like it is a standard UCD180 and not the UCD180HG (High Grade).
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=76948)
The power supply looks like it is a linear supply of their own design and fabrication.
Steve
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from Hypex..."They use our OEM versions." and "Yes the modules they use have already got some of the Ncore technology inside"
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I heard this clever and unique integrated at AXPONA, driving a pair of Harbeth Model 30's ($6K). To me it was top five sound at the show. I think the signature British BBC (i.e warm but not mushy or veiled..caveat, I've ALWAYS like Harbeths) sound of the Mdel 30's mated perfectly with this mostly-Class D amp. And you can tube roll the front end. :thumb:
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Hmm, that combo was exhibited by Decibel Audio up the road from me in Chicago. may have to go in for a little listen (skipped most of the local shops' rooms at AXPONA due to time concerns).
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I heard the Rogue-Harbeth combo at Axpona Chicago. Tonally and transients could be described as sluggish old school tube sound. I heard it Saturday morning so maybe they weren't warmed up yet. Tried to hear in afternoon but fire drill slowed down afternoon schedule for me. I would like to hear both with other equipment to see what was happening.
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Has anyone had a chance to do some serious listening and/or comparisons for the Sphinx?
I'm in the market for an integrated and am looking at the Rogue Cronus Magnum but the Sphinx intrigues me a lot ....
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I did have a chance to hear the Sphinx in town at Decibel Audio, and quite liked its sound with the Harbeth 30.1s. Couldn't get a great feel for its sound since the speakers were new to me. But didn't strike me as sluggish with the material I listened to.
And as I type this, I am patiently waiting for my Stereo 90 that just returned from getting upgraded to Super Magnum to warm up so I can bias the KT120 output tubes. My baby is back!
Alexdad54, what speakers are you using? I think that the speakers power demands may best determine which model best suits your needs. As well as the amount of control you need to have on your woofers (Class D amps often have a quite high damping factor, though the Rogue all-tube amps are solid enough in the bass that this might not be as much of a concern as it might be with other all-tube amps).
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Hi Roscoeiii, Thanks for the info. I'm using Salk Song towers (silk tweeter) and was looking at (as you know) the Rogue Cronus Magnum.
I have a possible line on one used but it's still a bit rich for me, which is why I'm wondering about the Sphinx.
I was thinking that the Sphinx might be suitable as the amp has to be able to handle everything from folk to reggae and rock....
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at 88dB for those Salks, I think you'd be fine with a Cronus Magnum. But I'd check in and see what other folks on the Salk Circle think on SS vs tube on the SongTowers. I know Salk and AVA often show together, so I'd think tubes would be a good match. Rogue all-tube's gear's ability to do rock, reggae etc are part of the reason I went with the Stereo 90 (impressions to come once broken in).
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Fwiw, I use a KT120 powered Cronus Magnum with 87 db speakers (8 ohm nominal, 3.9 ohm minimum) with excellent results.
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I had a pair of Salk SongTowers in my condo and used an old Fisher tube receiver (30 watts) with them and they worked fine. TAS did a review of the SongTowers with a 35 watt Van Alstine amp and they were happy too. The Rogue should be an even better choice with its extra power.
http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/audio-by-van-alstine-ultravalve-power-amplifier-salk-sound-songtower-qwt-loudspeaker-tas-204/
(http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/audio-by-van-alstine-ultravalve-power-amplifier-salk-sound-songtower-qwt-loudspeaker-tas-204/)
Bob
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Thanks for all the answers , much appreciated. I currently use a JWN KT-88-based custom amp with a Mapletree Ultra 4A SE pre with my ST's and it sounds great but now need to downsize hence the interest in the Sphinx or the Cronus. I have been aiming at the Cronus but the initial very positive reviews of the Sphinx have made me start to take a second look as it's considerably cheaper...I just don't want to lose the tube sound that I currently enjoy....
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I just don't want to lose the tube sound that I currently enjoy....
Silverspike RubyTube (http://www.silverspike.com/?Products:RubyTube) :)
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Thanks for all the answers , much appreciated. I currently use a JWN KT-88-based custom amp with a Mapletree Ultra 4A SE pre with my ST's and it sounds great but now need to downsize hence the interest in the Sphinx or the Cronus. I have been aiming at the Cronus but the initial very positive reviews of the Sphinx have made me start to take a second look as it's considerably cheaper...I just don't want to lose the tube sound that I currently enjoy....
If you don' t want to lose that tube sound, then safest bet is to go all-tube.
Is there no way to audition both for you? If not and you get a Cronus used, if you don't like it you'd probably be able to sell for around what you paid and only be out the cost of shipping.
Over on Audio Asylum AbeCollins was not a big fan of the more expensive Rogue hybrids that he has heard. But he is a big fan of the Stereo 90, and he is now running a Rogue integrated (forget which one).
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I'm in Vancouver so shippng costs are a major factor so it looks like I'll have to take a trip south to Seattle to the Rogue dealer there and give both the Sphinx and the Cronus a listen..
AFAIK, AbeCollins and now Dynobot over on AA are using the Cronus Magnum. but there are raves there as well for the Sphinx....
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If you don' t want to lose that tube sound, then safest bet is to go all-tube.
I suspect Roscoe is right here. I'm sure the Sphinx is a great sounding unit but nothing, NOTHING I've heard that claims to have 'that tube sound without the tubes' has delivered. The magic's in the bottle, most of it being in the power tubes.
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I suspect Roscoe is right here. I'm sure the Sphinx is a great sounding unit but nothing, NOTHING I've heard that claims to have 'that tube sound without the tubes' has delivered. The magic's in the bottle, most of it being in the power tubes.
So true...
Jim
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So true...
Jim
Also agree.
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Point taken! :thumb:
Now all I have to do is wait for a Cronus Magnum to come along......
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Also agree.
Me, three. No glass, just won't pass !!!!!!
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Me four. Hybrids. or tube preamp and non-tube power amp, or non-tube preamp and tube power amp don't have the full tube sound.
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Somehow I thought this thread was supposed to be about a hypex-powered amp...
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Me four. Hybrids. or tube preamp and non-tube power amp, or non-tube preamp and tube power amp don't have the full tube sound.
Yes however do we want coloration or accuracy? For years I used all tubed systems. From Audio Research to CJ lastly SET custom Cyber 211s with NOS GE, RCA and United 211 tubes. Sounded great until we tried a hybrid class "D" amps in direct comparison. Yes the all tubed system was cozy and colored. Colored in a natural way but veiled and dark in direct comparison. One size does not fit all.
Realism, slam, presence in spades. Tonally correct with all the harmonics in tact. The concept of the Rouge is interesting especially for the right price. $15,000 and $12,000 for hypex modules is a bit of a stretch. Good to see one priced within reach.
charles
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Yes however do we want coloration or accuracy? For years I used all tubed systems. From Audio Research to CJ lastly SET custom Cyber 211s with NOS GE, RCA and United 211 tubes. Sounded great until we tried a hybrid class "D" amps in direct comparison. Yes the all tubed system was cozy and colored. Colored in a natural way but veiled and dark in direct comparison. One size does not fit all.
Realism, slam, presence in spades. Tonally correct with all the harmonics in tact. The concept of the Rouge is interesting especially for the right price. $15,000 and $12,000 for hypex modules is a bit of a stretch. Good to see one priced within reach.
charles
Funny, I get all of that except for the dark and veiled from my all tube setup :scratch:
Jim
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Funny, I get all of that except for the dark and veiled from my all tube setup :scratch:
Jim
Agreed. And I have yet to hear a hypex module that gets all the tonal harmonics right. And I have heard professionally (by a well respected resident here) modded NCores and the Arions.
Maybe the Dueland Cast cap upgrade will get it right, Charles. Looking forward to hearing it. :thumb:
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Agreed. And I have yet to hear a hypex module that gets all the tonal harmonics right. And I have heard professionally (by a well respected resident here) modded NCores and the Arions.
Maybe the Dueland Cast cap upgrade will get it right, Charles. Looking forward to hearing it. :thumb:
Class D seems very sensitive to caps, cables, etc... basically needs lots of tweaking to get good sound. Whether it's as good or better than a well designed tube amp depends mostly on the speakers it's driving IMO.
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Whether it's as good or better than a well designed tube amp depends mostly on the speakers it's driving IMO.
+1, not to mention the listening preferences of the listener
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I have yet to hear a hypex module that gets all the tonal harmonics right
Tube amps do "tonal harmonics". Ncores just amplify the signal.
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Class D seems very sensitive to caps, cables, etc... basically needs lots of tweaking to get good sound.
Not sure what class D amps you have worked with, but I find the opposite to be true with the Hypex ncores. No need for tweaking, and quite insensitive to cables etc. - the only thing to take care of is proper differential wiring and twisting the cables.
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Yes, the ncore seems to be a special beast...
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Am I correct in thinking that the Sphinx doesn't use the ncore modules but uses UCD 180's and if so, what would the differences be?
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That's correct that it isn't the ncore. Not sure what modules were used or what mods were made to them
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This image on Rogue Audio's website shows the module numbers but I have no idea how they've been implemented......http://rogueaudio.com/Images/sphinxinsidelarge.jpg
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Tube amps do "tonal harmonics". Ncores just amplify the signal.
Sounds boring to me. I'd rather like what I'm hearing than know it's the 'true' nature of the input signal...whatever that means.
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Yes however do we want coloration or accuracy? For years I used all tubed systems. From Audio Research to CJ lastly SET custom Cyber 211s with NOS GE, RCA and United 211 tubes. Sounded great until we tried a hybrid class "D" amps in direct comparison. Yes the all tubed system was cozy and colored. Colored in a natural way but veiled and dark in direct comparison. One size does not fit all.
Realism, slam, presence in spades. Tonally correct with all the harmonics in tact. The concept of the Rouge is interesting especially for the right price. $15,000 and $12,000 for hypex modules is a bit of a stretch. Good to see one priced within reach.
charles
Charles,
You took my statement out of context and missed the point Roscoe, Eric, Rob, Decal, Jim and I were making. That is, in order to get true tube sound no combination of tube and non tube separate components will result in rich tube harmonics that only an all tube preamp and power amp can achieve. That's not to say it's absolutely better, it ultimately depends on the listener's sonic preference. Also, not all modern tube components sound veiled and colored. There are many tube components nowadays which measure and are tonally more neutral, more akin to solid state components. One example is the Rogue 99 Super Magnum preamp I reviewed and ended up buying. The Rogue 99 and others of its kind are relatively neutral sounding, transparent and resolving but provides tonal harmonic colors that no solid state or class D amp I've heard can duplicate. But it's up to Alex to determine whether he prefers all tube, hybrid, all ss, or any other combination thereof since he is the one shopping.
Cheers,
Paul Mah
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Sounds boring to me. I'd rather like what I'm hearing than know it's the 'true' nature of the input signal...whatever that means.
I greatly prefer just the amplified signal to a bunch of added flavor. You find there's plenty of sauce and variations of seasoning in the music itself.
Just gimme that straight wire with gain and you go ahead and keep your house sound.
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I greatly prefer just the amplified signal to a bunch of added flavor
You're not alone.
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Sounds boring to me. I'd rather like what I'm hearing than know it's the 'true' nature of the input signal...whatever that means.
Sure. Nothing wrong with that - it is a personal preference. All I am saying is that if you like tube harmonics, you are probably not going to like the sound of the ncores.
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It's not true now, and it has never been true than tube amplification = distortion and added "flavor". No more than stereotypes of any other topology. It's in the implementation... :duh:
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It's not true now, and it has never been true than tube amplification = distortion and added "flavor". No more than stereotypes of any other topology. It's in the implementation... :duh:
Yep. :thumb:
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It's not true now, and it has never been true than tube amplification = distortion and added "flavor". No more than stereotypes of any other topology. It's in the implementation... :duh:
The problem with valves is that you usually have much less gain in your typical valve amp than in a semiconductor amp, and that seriously restricts the amount of feedback you can apply to reduce distortion.
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The problem with valves is that you usually have much less gain in your typical valve amp than in a semiconductor amp, and that seriously restricts the amount of feedback you can apply to reduce distortion.
Using feedback to lower distortion in a amplifier is not a desirable solution.
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There are great amps that use feedback, there are great amps that use none. There are great amps that use tubes, there are great amps that use none. There are great SET amps, there are great push-pull amps. There are great Class D amps.
All comes down to your speakers, your associated components, your preferences and your budget.
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Using feedback to lower distortion in a amplifier is not a desirable solution.
And why not?
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There are great amps that use feedback, there are great amps that use none. There are great amps that use tubes, there are great amps that use none. There are great SET amps, there are great push-pull amps. There are great Class D amps.
All comes down to your speakers, your associated components, your preferences and your budget.
Doesn't that pretty much become "there are amps that you like and that work with your speakers and associated components"?
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No, I'd say that there are not-so-great amps that also fall under those categories, and which may contribute to giving a type of amp a bad name if a less than good design (or less than good match for the speakers) is what you have been exposed to.
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No, I'd say that there are not-so-great amps that also fall under those categories, and which may contribute to giving a type of amp a bad name if a less than good design (or less than good match for the speakers) is what you have been exposed to.
Good point - but I would also say that an amp that is sensitive to speakers and other components is not a great amp. A great amp should do its job no matter what it is driving (OK, as long as it is not just an iron nail across the output terminals).
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Good point - but I would also say that an amp that is sensitive to speakers and other components is not a great amp. A great amp should do its job no matter what it is driving (OK, as long as it is not just an iron nail across the output terminals).
Nope. I disagree with you on this one. I'd rather have an amp that is better suited to a particular speaker than a jack-of-all trades amp.
I mean, c'mon, your "great amp" would exclude fabulous designs such as SETs and OTL amps. Not to mention the low-watt SS Class A FirstWatt beauties of Nelson Pass.
Even with much more conventional amps and speakers, I have found amp-speaker matching to be crucial. My SP Tech Minis (88dB or so) worked great with the Hybrid Butler 2250 I had paired with them, and didn't sound as good with the Rogue Stereo 90 (which was providing more than adequate power in my smallish listening room). My Von Schweikert VR-4s (~91dB) on the other hand sounded (and are sounding as I type) better with the Rogue Stereo 90 (now Super Magnum upgraded) than with the Butler 2250. Neither was terrible, but it was a nice improvement to really dial in an ideal match for my different speakers.
To each his own, I suppose.
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And why not?
Many respected amplifier designers frown on using negative feedback because it creates its own set of problems.http://http://www.6moons.com/industryfeatures/distortion/distortion_5.html
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Nope. I disagree with you on this one. I'd rather have an amp that is better suited to a particular speaker than a jack-of-all trades amp.
OK, we might be arguing semantics - I would call that a great system or combination, but not a great amp.
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Many respected amplifier designers frown on using negative feedback because it creates its own set of problems.
And many other respected designers don't.
Neither is any sort of a factual argument for or against feedback. What are your factual issues with feedback?
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The problem with valves is that you usually have much less gain in your typical valve amp than in a semiconductor amp, and that seriously restricts the amount of feedback you can apply to reduce distortion.
I've been reading up lately about how high gain itself distorts the input signal regardless of negative feedback. It seems that you can have high gain, which distorts the signal at the extremes, then send back NF to correct some of that distortion or you can use less overall gain with no NF and stay truer to the input signal. NF, it appears, is not a panacea.
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And many other respected designers don't.
Neither is any sort of a factual argument for or against feedback. What are your factual issues with feedback?
I gave you citation with the Nelson Pass experiment from six moons and I am done with the discussion of the drawbacks of applying negative feedback to lower distortion numbers. :duh:
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Negative Feedback or better stated "Inverted Feedback" is so low in most well designed and implemented tube amps is so low that it is a non-issue, at least for me it is. In anything Audio, there will always be some compromises....
Jim
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The part time audiophile did a little piece on the Sphinx and I think it is nice looking in black with the silver knobs. the idea of buying one of these and playing with it appeals to me so I think I might. http://http://parttimeaudiophile.com/2013/01/19/ces-2013-rogue-audio-and-the-sphinx/
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I gave you citation with the Nelson Pass experiment from six moons and I am done with the discussion of the drawbacks of applying negative feedback to lower distortion numbers. :duh:
Sure. I just need to point out that six moons isn't exactly a scientific publication.
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Sure. I just need to point out that six moons isn't exactly a scientific publication.
Nelson Pass wrote the article did the testing and generated the graphs. he is a professor of amplification if there ever was one :lol:
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Nelson Pass wrote the article did the testing and generated the graphs. he is a professor of amplification if there ever was one :lol:
I read it and it is spot-on. Good article and easy for anyone to understand.
I also agree with Jim that in a well designed tube amp the amount of feedback required is little to none, because tubes can be very linear amplification devices. Often the price paid for lowering distortion using feedback results in an overall reduction in sound quality.
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Nope. I disagree with you on this one. I'd rather have an amp that is better suited to a particular speaker than a jack-of-all trades amp.
I mean, c'mon, your "great amp" would exclude fabulous designs such as SETs and OTL amps. Not to mention the low-watt SS Class A FirstWatt beauties of Nelson Pass.
Even with much more conventional amps and speakers, I have found amp-speaker matching to be crucial. My SP Tech Minis (88dB or so) worked great with the Hybrid Butler 2250 I had paired with them, and didn't sound as good with the Rogue Stereo 90 (which was providing more than adequate power in my smallish listening room). My Von Schweikert VR-4s (~91dB) on the other hand sounded (and are sounding as I type) better with the Rogue Stereo 90 (now Super Magnum upgraded) than with the Butler 2250. Neither was terrible, but it was a nice improvement to really dial in an ideal match for my different speakers.
To each his own, I suppose.
I really agree so much with this statement. System synergy is everything.
I think the New Rogue Integrated will resonate with alot of people. I am eager to give it a listen so I can determine to with what type of speakers to recommend it or the Cronos version. I really think highly of the Rogue approach to audio equipment.
Steve
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I just ordered a Sphinx in black with the remote control and I should get it on monday or tuesday. I have some holy grail 12AU7's like Amperex Holland 7316's and Siemens nickel plates sitting here and I have a matched pair of grade A Psvane 12AU7-T II coming here shortly too so it may get interesting :thumb:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=79718)
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Bruno Putzeys has given several talks on negative feedback and his work speaks for itself, so.
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I just ordered a Sphinx in black with the remote control and I should get it on monday or tuesday. I have some holy grail 12AU7's like Amperex Holland 7316's and Siemens nickel plates sitting here and I have a matched pair of grade A Psvane 12AU7-T II coming here shortly too so it may get interesting :thumb:
Congrats on the new purchase. The show reports made it sound like the Sphinx performs way above it's price range. It's amazing to me that they're selling it at that price and it's not factory direct. I look forward to your tube rolling impressions.
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Bruno Putzeys has given several talks on negative feedback and his work speaks for itself, so.
Please enlighten all of us as to what Bruno says about Negative FB and at what point does it become a detriment? Most tube amp designers are well aware of the effects of Negative FB and can design the topography to keep it under the point were it becomes a factor.
In many cases the Negative FB is local and never reaches outside of the amp.
Jim
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Have at it:
"The F-word - or, why there is no such thing as too much feedback"
Bruno Putzeys
http://www.linearaudio.net/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=97:the-f-word-or-why-there-is-no-such-thing-as-too-much-feedback&catid=41:volume-1&Itemid=73 (http://www.linearaudio.net/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=97:the-f-word-or-why-there-is-no-such-thing-as-too-much-feedback&catid=41:volume-1&Itemid=73)
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You can pretty much google them or there should be links in the Hypex circle for a few of them. The man is a genius, and he was actually designing tube amps when he was a teenager. Anyway, with his class d Ncore amps, lots of negative feedback is one of the tricks that makes it work the way it does. Welcome to 2013.
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The amps in the OP look pretty cool for the money :thumb: Look forward to your impressions Bunky.
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You can pretty much google them or there should be links in the Hypex circle for a few of them. The man is a genius, and he was actually designing tube amps when he was a teenager. Anyway, with his class d Ncore amps, lots of negative feedback is one of the tricks that makes it work the way it does. Welcome to 2013.
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The amps in the OP look pretty cool for the money :thumb: Look forward to your impressions Bunky.
Interesting, lots of Negative Feedback is one of his tricks, very interesting to say the least....
Jim
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I have a lovely pair of 93 db Silverline Audio Sonata III's that are tube friendly and easy to drive and I am interested in hearing the 10" Dynaudio woofers powered by a amp with a dampening factor of 1000.
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I have a lovely pair of 93 db Silverline Audio Sonata III's that are tube friendly and easy to drive and I am interested in hearing the 10" Dynaudio woofers powered by a amp with a dampening factor of 1000.
Speakers are a huge consideration when choosing an amp....the good thing for having maggies is that dampening is not an issue, just enough voltage with enough watts! However, that will lead to arguments around here....
Jim
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Speakers are a huge consideration when choosing an amp....the good thing for having maggies is that dampening is not an issue, just enough voltage with enough watts! However, that will lead to arguments around here....
Jim
I have a pair of both the Sonatina II and the Sonata III"s and they play nicely with 15wpc SETs or 150 wpc ultralinear. that and the fact that they are gorgeous is why I hold on to them.
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Speakers are a huge consideration when choosing an amp....the good thing for having maggies is that dampening is not an issue, just enough voltage with enough watts! However, that will lead to arguments around here....
Jim
You would hope so :lol:
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Anyway, with his class d Ncore amps, lots of negative feedback is one of the tricks that makes it work the way it does.
That is why I found all the anti-feedback stuff in a thread about hypex-powered amps somewhat ironic...
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Please enlighten all of us as to what Bruno says about Negative FB
Bruno's AES Master Class (http://www.hypex.nl/component/weblinks/weblink/27-papers/62-aes123bp.html) should be mandatory reading for every audiophile. He specifically addresses the Nelson Pass graphs. Anyway, Bruno's conclusion was "Don't be a wimp. Use NFB and use tons of it". That is why the hypex modules sound so good.
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Negative Feedback is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negative_feedback_amplifier
http://www.aikenamps.com/NegativeFeedback.htm
Why Op Amps (Class D) use more negative FB than other topologies:
http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/vol_3/chpt_8/4.html
Jim
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I just ordered a Sphinx in black with the remote control and I should get it on monday or tuesday. I have some holy grail 12AU7's like Amperex Holland 7316's and Siemens nickel plates sitting here and I have a matched pair of grade A Psvane 12AU7-T II coming here shortly too so it may get interesting :thumb:
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=79718)
I look forward to your positive...or negative feedback on the Sphinx!
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Bruno's AES Master Class (http://www.hypex.nl/component/weblinks/weblink/27-papers/62-aes123bp.html) should be mandatory reading for every audiophile. He specifically addresses the Nelson Pass graphs. Anyway, Bruno's conclusion was "Don't be a wimp. Use NFB and use tons of it". That is why the hypex modules sound so good.
I read through the first 20 pages or so of that link. I don't see any information there at all. I see graphs with no keys and reprints of basic op amp circuits and the rest just sounds like an infomercial. It's as if this is the slide show to accompany a full lecture, but we don't have the lecture. Should I scroll down more or is the rest just a waste of more time?
The concept of 'use a ton of NF to make the amp work properly' sounds to me a bit like a speaker designer stating 'use a lot of graphic equalization with my speakers in order to get an acceptably flat frequency response.' Maybe I'm not getting the whole picture here but it sounds like NF is the only bandage holding the whole circuit together. Is this good engineering? :dunno:
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Maybe I'm not getting the whole picture here but it sounds like NF is the only bandage holding the whole circuit together. Is this good engineering? :dunno:
The ncores do sound great. Again, see my comment above re: "there are great sounding amps with negative feedback, there are great sounding amps without negative feedback."
I may be wrong on this, but somewhere along the way I got the impression that the excellent bass from the all-tube Rogue's may in part be due to their use of negative feedback. As well as power supplies, tubes and transformers that are up to the job. But not sure where I got this impression, so take this comment with a huge grain of salt.
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It's as if this is the slide show to accompany a full lecture, but we don't have the lecture.
That's exactly the case.
Should I scroll down more or is the rest just a waste of more time?
There is some pretty good information there, but you have to pick it up from the somewhat cursory slides.
Maybe I'm not getting the whole picture here but it sounds like NF is the only bandage holding the whole circuit together. Is this good engineering?
I suggest you read through the whole set of slides. The parts relevant to feedback are between slide 25 and slide 50.
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I look forward to your positive...or negative feedback on the Sphinx!
I want to start out with a positive attitude when I audition this amp,i will let it run for a few days or maybe a week with the stock tubes in it and then roll in some other 12AU7 variants and find out if it is a keeper. :wink:
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Some comments by a Sphinx owner are available here (scroll down to the bottom half of the page): http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/rogue-audio-sphinx-hybrid-integrated-amplifiers-are-now-shipping.310051/page-3
His comparisons are interesting......
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Some comments by a Sphinx owner are available here (scroll down to the bottom half of the page): http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/rogue-audio-sphinx-hybrid-integrated-amplifiers-are-now-shipping.310051/page-3
His comparisons are interesting......
I have read the Steve Hoffman thread and just about everything else online that I could find about the Sphinx. i like fast tube amps that are not overly warm or euphonic. the midrange is the most important aspect for me because that is where the music lives. my Sonata III's use very lively Dynaudio Esotar tweeters and I am thinking that if the Sphinx is a little dry on the top end it wont be very noticeable in my system. before I saw this thread I was eyeing a pair of 40 wpc 805 SET monoblocks with over 1000 volts on the plate and chances are that I will still head in that direction.
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Alright Julf, I'll spend a little more time with the link.
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OK, i am working ten hour days on night shift during a power plant shut down. my daughter signed off to UPS for the Rogue Audio Sphinx integrated amp yesterday and I came home at 3:00am this morning and hooked it up to the Silverline Audio Sonata III's via Black Cat Morpheus speaker wires and jumpers and I hooked my modded MiniMax DAC to the Sphinx via Black Cat Morpheus IC's and connected my DAC to my Canary Audio CD200 with a Black Cat Silverstar 75 digital cable and let it play at low volume for eight hours while I got some sleep. once awake with a cup of fresh ground coffee in hand i played the Steve Stevens live acoustic guitar track Dementia and Zappa's title guitar track Zoot Allures and my initial impression is that it is a very nice sounding integrated amplifier. i will roll some NOS tubes in the front end next week and give some insight on it as I go.
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Working long hours is a mixed blessing. Not to get all religious. I hope you get some time to give your new Rogue a serious listen. I like to reccomend Rogue Integrated amp products to friends. The Cronos does price them out of the market. This could be the right product for them.
Tubes in front of class D works for me in my application. Thanks for taking the time to lay out the system particulars in your test. Looking forward to hearing your thoughts and observations.
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I just pulled the stock tubes which are JJ ECC802S and I replaced them with a brand new matched pair of Psvane 12AU7-T.the Sphinx sounds really good with the stock tubes and I am curious as to what improvement the 12AU7-T might bring once they are broken in.
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I bought the Sphinx out of sheer curiosity and to be honest I did not really believe that it would pass muster in my main two channel rig. the truth is that in conjunction with my speakers in my system the Sphinx sounds great on the bottom end, midrange and the top end. the noise floor is non existant.i have had the Sphinx in my system for a couple of days shy of a month and I like it so much that I am going to keep it in my main rig. the Psvane 12AU7-T are fine tubes and they do everything well in the preamp section of the Sphinx.
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How about a pic of it on the rack?
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I read through the first 20 pages or so of that link. I don't see any information there at all. I see graphs with no keys and reprints of basic op amp circuits and the rest just sounds like an infomercial. It's as if this is the slide show to accompany a full lecture, but we don't have the lecture. Should I scroll down more or is the rest just a waste of more time?
The concept of 'use a ton of NF to make the amp work properly' sounds to me a bit like a speaker designer stating 'use a lot of graphic equalization with my speakers in order to get an acceptably flat frequency response.' Maybe I'm not getting the whole picture here but it sounds like NF is the only bandage holding the whole circuit together. Is this good engineering? :dunno:
I agree. I still find Class D amps lacking in some critical sonic aspects. I think at least some of it has to do with feedback.
You either like them or do not like them. Most audiophiles I know who are tube enthusiasts in general don't care for them. No amount of finger pointing or hand wringing is going to change that. It's a bit like the vinyl vs. hi-res, tubes vs. solid state debates, etc. This subject will continue to be debated ad-nauseam . Celebrate the differences.
BTW, here is Nelson's article on feedback:
http://www.firstwatt.com/pdf/art_dist_fdbk.pdf (http://www.firstwatt.com/pdf/art_dist_fdbk.pdf)
As one can see, Nelson holds a different view on the subject. I am more in Nelson's camp on this issue. The cynic in me thinks the manufactures are pushing class D more for their profit margins over actual audio performance. :lol:
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The cynic in me thinks the manufactures are pushing class D more for their profit margins over actual audio performance. :lol:
First you trash class d, then you gush about the Millenium class d, now it's back to trashing them. Your credibility on the issue is clearly compromised.
Please do share one tube amp with actual measured audio performance superior to the ncore class d from Hypex. Not interested in any meaningless subjective comments.
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Am I the only one wondering why you continue to post in the Hypex forum if you are not a fan of class d? I don't see people hanging around tube forums bashing tubes....Seems like troll behavior and reminds me of some one else who is no longer here...
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Music reproduction is a complex waveform, not individual frequencies for representation on graphs. The measurements provided by reviewers do not tell the entire story. They certainly do NOT tell anyone how it will actually sound. The most accurate method to measure musical performance is by using a spectrum analyzer, and comparing the outputs. There is a lot more going on with impedance loading and phase/angle into a speaker load that measurements of individual frequencies into a resistor does not adequately capture.
The TBI amp is a nice entry level low wattage amp. Let's not get carried away. The earlier post was in reference to the slide show discussed.
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Freo,
I don't think most folks appreciate being called Kool-Aid drinkers. If an objective in this hobby is to "celebrate the differences" then comments like yours are inappropriate, at best.
Cheers,
Dave.
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Great, now why don't you read the heading for this forum:
"For owners and builders of Hypex products, including but not limited to NCore and UCD amplifier modules."
Why do you continue come to this forum and spread your tube gospel? Continuing to trash class d in a class d forum is bad form. Most would call it trolling. One would expect better behavior from Volunteers. Be a gentleman and spread the gospel somewhere else.
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I own six tube amps including two Class A SET amps a pair of 100 wpc monoblocks and a 90 wpc tube integrated and I am very much a tube guy. the Sphinx is not lush nor does it sound strident. with my full range speakers in my system the Sphinx sounds very musical and it does respond well to tube rolling.
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Yes, Davey, you are correct. Sorry if anyone is offended. Post edited to remove that comment.
The post was intended to be in reference to the slide show discussed, period. (Specifically on feedback).
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How about a pic of it on the rack?
I will put up a picture of my rack when one of my daughters shows up with a digital camera :lol:
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I own six tube amps including two Class A SET amps a pair of 100 wpc monoblocks and a 90 wpc tube integrated and I am very much a tube guy. the Sphinx is not lush nor does it sound strident. with my full range speakers in my system the Sphinx sounds very musical and it does respond well to tube rolling.
What does this have to do with "For owners and builders of Hypex products, including but not limited to NCore and UCD amplifier modules."???
I don't understand all the off topic posts here...It's a forum for Hypex products....Mods?
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A not unreasonably priced US manufactured product, that should sufficiently drive a decent variety of loads. Cool.
I guess my only quibble is the fact that the tubes aren't visible (like with my Yaqin VK2100), which tends to have a profound impact on the sound, for some.
cheers,
AJ
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I do like the idea of a tube front end and linear power supply with this unit.
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What does this have to do with "For owners and builders of Hypex products, including but not limited to NCore and UCD amplifier modules."???
I don't understand all the off topic posts here...It's a forum for Hypex products....Mods?
Are you restricted because of your sparkling personality? I think not :nono: the Sphinx has tubes and it uses Hypex modules and I own it and I will comment any way I wish. you cant restrict the flow of ideas because it does not sit well with your beliefs :duh:
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A not unreasonably priced US manufactured product, that should sufficiently drive a decent variety of loads. Cool.
I guess my only quibble is the fact that the tubes aren't visible (like with my Yaqin VK2100), which tends to have a profound impact on the sound, for some.
cheers,
AJ
I can see the tubes thru the vent in the top :thumb:
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Are you restricted because of your sparkling personality? I think not :nono: the Sphinx has tubes and it uses Hypex modules and I own it and I will comment any way I wish. you cant restrict the flow of ideas because it does not sit well with your beliefs :duh:
If it is indeed a Hypex based product, then I apologize.
I hardly think requesting people stick to the topic of this forum is restricting the "flow of ideas". It's called proper etiquette.
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No if. It's IS Hypex based.
All you do is attack others. Isn't that off topic?
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No if. It's IS Hypex based.
All you do is attack others. Isn't that off topic?
Did I come here calling people "kool aid drinkers" and put down class d? No.
Is it too much to ask of people to keep the anti-class d talk somewhere more appropriate?
Is it too much to ask that people stay on the topic intended for this forum?
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If it is indeed a Hypex based product, then I apologize.
I hardly think requesting people stick to the topic of this forum is restricting the "flow of ideas". It's called proper etiquette.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=81592)
did you look at the heading of this thread that you are posting on ? because if you did you might have a clue :scratch:
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Cab - why the anger? Bunky's comments are very appropriate for this thread. The Rogue uses a Hypex amp module it's not NCore but I believe the amp has some Ncore technology.
Bunky's experience with tube amps provides some interesting and valuable perspective. I hope you continue to contribute to this site and share your experiences.
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Bunky's experience with tube amps provides some interesting and valuable perspective. I hope you continue to contribute to this site and share your experiences.
Yes. I am interested to find out impressions with a tubed front end and a linear power supply. Both seem like they would help improve the sound.
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Freo, your heels appear to be dug in so deep, I can't imagine you will ever accept Class D. I haven't heard the Rogue but I have a Hypex Ncore amp with a SAS tubed preamp and really like the combo. I had Steve from SAS lower the gain on my preamp to 7dB and I'm liking the sound more than ever. It is very quiet with exclent tonal accuracy and a detailed, smooth top end. Instruments have "weight" and the overall presentation is musical and non-fatiguing. The SAS 50wpc push-pull tube amps sounded better overall than the Ncore amp, but the cool running Class D design is very impressive.
For the money, this Rogue integrated appears to be a very good value. I look forward to hearing it in person and reading more reviews.
Cheers
Jack
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Freo, your heels appear to be dug in so deep, I can't imagine you will ever accept Class D. I haven't heard the Rogue but I have a Hypex Ncore amp with a SAS tubed preamp and really like the combo. I had Steve from SAS lower the gain on my preamp to 7dB and I'm liking the sound more than ever. It is very quiet with exclent tonal accuracy and a detailed, smooth top end. Instruments have "weight" and the overall presentation is musical and non-fatiguing. The SAS 50wpc push-pull tube amps sounded better overall than the Ncore amp, but the cool running Class D design is very impressive.
For the money, this Rogue integrated appears to be a very good value. I look forward to hearing it in person and reading more reviews.
Cheers
Jack
I agree that this seems like it could be a good value for the money. I've had a lot of Class D amps over the years, going all the way back to the Sony S-Master Pro series. Each one initially grabs you, because it does present music differently. Wound up selling each of them.
I also agree that they are improving over time. As stated, I am interested in sonic impressions with this one, as it does have both tubes and a linear power supply. Trust me, at some point, it would make me happy to get high power for decent money, and Class D does have the potential to provide it.
My post earlier had strictly to do with the point/counterpoint of use of negative feedback. Again, sorry if that point was missed. A buddy will be dealing in these. Perhaps I'll get one to audition it.
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Thanks, I look forward to your comments and hope you have a chance to audition the amp soon.
Also, I commend Rogue's decision to use the Hypex technology in an original design and offering it in a modest enclosure at a reasonable price.
Too many "cake decorators" out there slapping off the shelf Hypex (okay these are Ncore modules which are technically different) modules in fancy CNCd cases and selling them for five figures. At least Rogue's product is unique and appears to be a good value.
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No worries, will do!
Currently auditioning a Yamaha A-S2000 integrated, so would like to be able to compare the two. The Yamaha is really nice, definitely a high end piece (which should not really be all that surprising).
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Cab - why the anger? Bunky's comments are very appropriate for this thread. The Rogue uses a Hypex amp module it's not NCore but I believe the amp has some Ncore technology.
Bunky's experience with tube amps provides some interesting and valuable perspective. I hope you continue to contribute to this site and share your experiences.
As I said, if the product is made with Hypex modules, then I apologize.....my mistake.....sorry....
Jackman, email me if you have time. kuribo at tds dot net
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Yes. I am interested to find out impressions with a tubed front end and a linear power supply. Both seem like they would help improve the sound.
What makes you think that? I can see tubes adding a bit of low-order harmonic distortion that a lot people find pleasant and "musical", but I am not sure what the benefit of a linear power supply would add.
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What makes you think that? I can see tubes adding a bit of low-order harmonic distortion that a lot people find pleasant and "musical", but I am not sure what the benefit of a linear power supply would add.
For audio, numerous. Low to no ripple is the single most obvious. Check this out for a balanced set of arguments:
http://digital.ni.com/public.nsf/ad0f282819902a1986256f79005462b1/7438e77138bddf1b86256f660008e9cc/$FILE/linear_versus_switching.pdf (http://digital.ni.com/public.nsf/ad0f282819902a1986256f79005462b1/7438e77138bddf1b86256f660008e9cc/$FILE/linear_versus_switching.pdf)
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As I said, if the product is made with Hypex modules, then I apologize.....my mistake.....sorry....
Jackman, email me if you have time. kuribo at tds dot net
Hi Cab - message sent.
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I did send Mark at Rogue an email with this thread link. Maybe he'll comment on it. If not, maybe he'll allow me to re-post what he emails to me.
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For audio, numerous. Low to no ripple is the single most obvious. Check this out for a balanced set of arguments:
http://digital.ni.com/public.nsf/ad0f282819902a1986256f79005462b1/7438e77138bddf1b86256f660008e9cc/$FILE/linear_versus_switching.pdf (http://digital.ni.com/public.nsf/ad0f282819902a1986256f79005462b1/7438e77138bddf1b86256f660008e9cc/$FILE/linear_versus_switching.pdf)
So are you looking at a regulated linear supply (that is what that document is talking about), or just the usual transformer-rectifier-large caps-style supply? Two very different animals. A linear shunt regulator for a 600W power supply will be very inefficient and produce an impressive amount of heat.
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From Rogue:
We use the OEM modules that do have some of the NCore parts. They are not the same as the NCore modules that they sell to the DIY community.
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From the Rogue website regarding the power supply:
" A high capacity linear power supply provides tremendous energy storage to recreate the deepest bass passages while various regulated power supply stages provide ultra smooth sound in the midrange and treble."
This unit does look interesting, and will be keen to hear feedback/observations with it. If I do get my hands on one for evaluation, will compare it to a Yamaha A-S2000. I reckon both units should be able to provide satisfying musical performance.
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I own six tube amps including two Class A SET amps a pair of 100 wpc monoblocks and a 90 wpc tube integrated and I am very much a tube guy. the Sphinx is not lush nor does it sound strident. with my full range speakers in my system the Sphinx sounds very musical and it does respond well to tube rolling.
Bunky, Now that you've had some hours on the Sphinx, are you still enamored? If you can play music, be drawn in to the emotion, and relax, then the Sphinx is a winner in my opinion. I will try to get a loaner to try on my Legacy Focus speakers.
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Bunky, Now that you've had some hours on the Sphinx, are you still enamored? If you can play music, be drawn in to the emotion, and relax, then the Sphinx is a winner in my opinion. I will try to get a loaner to try on my Legacy Focus speakers.
I have had the Sphinx in my rig for a month and the fact that it is still in my rack is a testament as to how good it sounds. It works really well with the Psvane 12AU7-T in the preamp section. not only does the Sphinx sound excellent for the money it just sounds excellent period. :thumb:
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Bunky, Thanks for your reply. It is a real testament to the Sphinx to survive in your system with all the full tube alternatives you have available. Also nice to hear you are enjoying listening to music, as well as it being a great value. The Sphinx must not do much additive wrong, which is how most gear I listen to gets the boot, some parameters great- but adds something that is annoying long term that is too much? Cymbals sound real, voices natural with air , bass dynamic and quick, recording venue revealed, spacious and layered depth when on source, pulled into the music and moved by the musicians emotions?
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First you trash class d, then you gush about the Millenium class d, now it's back to trashing them. Your credibility on the issue is clearly compromised.
Please do share one tube amp with actual measured audio performance superior to the ncore class d from Hypex. Not interested in any meaningless subjective comments.
There are two Ncore owners on the present Millenia tour that preferred the midrange of the TBI to their Ncores. I guess their credibility is also questionable?
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You missed the point.
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There are two Ncore owners on the present Millenia tour that preferred the midrange of the TBI to their Ncores. I guess their credibility is also questionable?
I guess the key word here is "preferred", implying a preference. The fact that someone prefers or likes A more than B does in no way imply that A is better than B in absolute, objective terms.
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Calling Bunky, Too busy listening to reply to the blog?
Bunky, Thanks for your reply. It is a real testament to the Sphinx to survive in your system with all the full tube alternatives you have available. Also nice to hear you are enjoying listening to music, as well as it being a great value. The Sphinx must not do much additive wrong, which is how most gear I listen to gets the boot, some parameters great- but adds something that is annoying long term that is too much? Cymbals sound real, voices natural with air , bass dynamic and quick, recording venue revealed, spacious and layered depth when on source, pulled into the music and moved by the musicians emotions?
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Different amplifiers do sound different, but is incorrect to assume there is a "class D sound". There are many class D amplifiers now, and they all sound different, just as a 5W SET sounds very different from Audio Research Reference series amps. Generalizing about the sound of a class D amplifier these days is a big mistake, and anyone who does it is likely to be wrong.
Additionally, equating the potential effects of global feedback on a class D circuit, with the effects it may have on class A and A/B circuits is another mistake; my understanding is that the feedback loops in a class D amplifier operate in an entirely different way than they do with class A and A/B amplifiers. So suggesting that feedback is a problem for class D, because it is a problem for conventional amps, is a non-starter for me.
I would recommend listening to the amps in question before speculating about how they sound.
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Calling Bunky, Too busy listening to reply to the blog?
The Sphinx sounds very good in the bass, midrange and the topend.my speakers are high resolution four ways and they reveal nothing that sounds objectionable.
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Bunky, Thanks for the positive update.
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Bunky, I just checked your gallery, are the VMPS being driven by the Sphinx? If so that is truly impressive. I'm betting my Legacy Focus 20/20s would also be a good match with the Sphinx.
The Sphinx sounds very good in the bass, midrange and the topend.my speakers are high resolution four ways and they reveal nothing that sounds objectionable.
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(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=82901)
Bunky, I just checked your gallery, are the VMPS being driven by the Sphinx? If so that is truly impressive. I'm betting my Legacy Focus 20/20s would also be a good match with the Sphinx.
I am using Silverline Audio Sonata III's.
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Bunky, What a nice setup you have, the Silverline's look great. What is the wood block under them, and where do you have them spiked? I'm surprised the Sphinx can hold your attention compared to what's available in your amp stable, it's flaws must be subtractive not additive? I hope to hear the Sphinx at the Capital Audio Fest later this month, Mark is sending one for John Gatski to use in his Everything Audio Review suite.
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A new Sphinx review:
http://www.goodsound.com/index.php/equipment-reviews/472-rogue-audio-sphinx-integrated-amplifier
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Bunky, The Goodsound review was very positive with the only exception being the remote control volume? In your setup did you have any trouble using the remote to achieve the precise level you wanted? He mentioned a slight edge/brightness, but he still preferred the Sphinx over other units for the sheer enjoyment of listening to music.
The Sphinx sounds very good in the bass, midrange and the topend.my speakers are high resolution four ways and they reveal nothing that sounds objectionable.
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Bunky, What did the Psvane tubes bring out beyond the stockers? What mods did you make to your EE Minimax DAC, Opamps, more? The MiniMax and newest Bifrost are on my shortlist.
OK, i am working ten hour days on night shift during a power plant shut down. my daughter signed off to UPS for the Rogue Audio Sphinx integrated amp yesterday and I came home at 3:00am this morning and hooked it up to the Silverline Audio Sonata III's via Black Cat Morpheus speaker wires and jumpers and I hooked my modded MiniMax DAC to the Sphinx via Black Cat Morpheus IC's and connected my DAC to my Canary Audio CD200 with a Black Cat Silverstar 75 digital cable and let it play at low volume for eight hours while I got some sleep. once awake with a cup of fresh ground coffee in hand i played the Steve Stevens live acoustic guitar track Dementia and Zappa's title guitar track Zoot Allures and my initial impression is that it is a very nice sounding integrated amplifier. i will roll some NOS tubes in the front end next week and give some insight on it as I go.
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Bunky, The Goodsound review was very positive with the only exception being the remote control volume? In your setup did you have any trouble using the remote to achieve the precise level you wanted? He mentioned a slight edge/brightness, but he still preferred the Sphinx over other units for the sheer enjoyment of listening to music.
My Sphinx came stock with Czech made JJ 802S long plates in the front end and the stock tubes sounded good. the reviewers unit came with Russian made 12AU7's so I don't know if the tubes or his speakers contributed to the slight edge brightness thing. :scratch: depending on the materiel being played I will get up and make a manual adjustment to the volume level to get it exactly where I want it.
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Bunky, What did the Psvane tubes bring out beyond the stockers? What mods did you make to your EE Minimax DAC, Opamps, more? The MiniMax and newest Bifrost are on my shortlist.
The Psvane 12AU7-T is a all around better performer in the Sphinx frontend over the stock tube and keep in mind that the stockers sound good.my Minimax has better Op amps and a Create Audio fuse and I use a "Holy Grail" Amperex Holland 7316 PQ longplate in it.
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Bunky, Thanks for your valuable feedback and info about your system. I'll have to call Rogue to see if there is any solution to the not so remote volume control. Both the formal reviewer at Goodsound and yourself have trouble achieving the desired volume using the remote, prompting a manual adjustment, rendering the remote moot. Congratulations on finding and owning the "Holy Grail". LOL
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Bunky, The Goodsound review was very positive with the only exception being the remote control volume? In your setup did you have any trouble using the remote to achieve the precise level you wanted?
Maybe I misread the review but I thought the remote issue he mentioned was just that the remote was not standard at asking price. I admit that I tend to skim over reviews since so much is fluff and hyperbole.
I've overcome the sensitive remote volume (Alps fault, not Rogue's) by using two different button depresses; one long and one short. So if I want just a slight increase in volume I depress 'down' quickly then use a longer 'up' depression. Annoying? Yes, but workable.
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ER, Thanks for the workaround, makes the Sphinx my first choice, edging out the mINT & NOVA 125. The remote is a $100 option, not standard issue.
Maybe I misread the review but I thought the remote issue he mentioned was just that the remote was not standard at asking price. I admit that I tend to skim over reviews since so much is fluff and hyperbole.
I've overcome the sensitive remote volume (Alps fault, not Rogue's) by using two different button depresses; one long and one short. So if I want just a slight increase in volume I depress 'down' quickly then use a longer 'up' depression. Annoying? Yes, but workable.
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Bunky, Thanks for your valuable feedback and info about your system. I'll have to call Rogue to see if there is any solution to the not so remote volume control. Both the formal reviewer at Goodsound and yourself have trouble achieving the desired volume using the remote, prompting a manual adjustment, rendering the remote moot. Congratulations on finding and owning the "Holy Grail". LOL
I had the same concerns about the remote volume control in my review of Rogue's 99 Super Magnum preamp but that wasn't a big enough problem since I bought the review unit. The sonics won out over the relative minor criticisms I had in my review.
Paul Mah
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I have owned the rogue sphinx for just over a month it is a great amp and a huge value. the remote doesn't bother me however, i rarely use it. I would put it high on the consideration set.
-jm
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What did the Sphinx replace, and in what ways is it better? Have you tried it with difficult loads, or are your speakers an easy load? I've got Legacy Focus 20/20 which dip to 2 ohms in the low bass, I'm wondering how the Sphinx would fare into that impedance? What does "high on the consideration set" mean?
I have owned the rogue sphinx for just over a month it is a great amp and a huge value. the remote doesn't bother me however, i rarely use it. I would put it high on the consideration set.
-jm
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What did the Sphinx replace, and in what ways is it better? Have you tried it with difficult loads, or are your speakers an easy load? I've got Legacy Focus 20/20 which dip to 2 ohms in the low bass, I'm wondering how the Sphinx would fare into that impedance? What does "high on the consideration set" mean?
this is my first attempt at building a two channel setup, i replaced a B&W Zeppelin. previous to purchasing the Sphinx i spent about 3 months driving around the dallas-fort worth metroplex auditioning many different amps (tubes/ss) and systems for that matter. i was about set on a naim nait 5si when i sent rogue an email asking for a retailer. i auditioned the sphinx on two different occasions and it delivered IMO better than many of the higher priced pieces. i am currently borrowing a friends pair of nola boxer speakers, a fairly easy load, my buddy claims the boxers sound better with the sphinx than his rig. i would put the rogue high on the consideration set as it performs well above it's price point.
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The NOLA Boxers and Sphinx should make a killer setup, enjoy. Besides the Nait 5si, what other integrateds did you compare it to? In what parameters did the Sphinx sound better than the contenders? I just found out a Sphinx will be playing at the Capital Audiofest driving Legacy Studio HDs, I'll spend some time in the Everythingaudioreview room to get a feel for it's sonic signature. Have you even considered rolling 12AU7s in the Sphinx yet?
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The NOLA Boxers and Sphinx should make a killer setup, enjoy. Besides the Nait 5si, what other integrateds did you compare it to? In what parameters did the Sphinx sound better than the contenders? I just found out a Sphinx will be playing at the Capital Audiofest driving Legacy Studio HDs, I'll spend some time in the Everythingaudioreview room to get a feel for it's sonic signature. Have you even considered rolling 12AU7s in the Sphinx yet?
too many but here are some off the top: linn, nad, nait, rega, jolida, and mcintosh. i wanted an amp that could provide a realistic/live music experience and sonically the sphinx delivered.... retailer knocked off some dollars and rogue threw in a remote as it took two weeks past the promise date to deliver, guess they are having troubles keeping up with demand. i have considered tube rolling but honestly i am quite happy with the jj's in it now, so perhaps in the future. i am researching speakers as the nola loan is not indefinite. considering tekton or omega loudspeakers, any opinions on those? i tried the rega rs5 and wasn't thrilled with the bottom end but it was a different amp.
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Tekton Pens are a great value and sound perfect for your "live" sound. They are huge, and the wait is a couple of months. Golden Ear and the new Sonus Faber Venere lines should also be considered. If you need stand mounts, Legacy Studio HDs, Kef LS50s, and Totem are safe choices. Have you had trouble getting the right level with the remote?
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pendragons way too big my wife will kill me. i'll check out the couple you mentioned but i prefer a speaker with no crossover or very minimal one. i mostly use the remote on iphone/ipad (apple tv into dac) but the rogue remote works just fine.
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The Gallo Strada 2s have very little crossover, 1 cap I think, and are small, good WAF.
pendragons way too big my wife will kill me. i'll check out the couple you mentioned but i prefer a speaker with no crossover or very minimal one. i mostly use the remote on iphone/ipad (apple tv into dac) but the rogue remote works just fine.
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You can't get better than these for $500. Are you in Jersey?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Meadowlark-Audio-Shearwater-Hot-Rod-Loudspeakers-/141009164325
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You can't get better than these for $500. Are you in Jersey?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Meadowlark-Audio-Shearwater-Hot-Rod-Loudspeakers-/141009164325
those would fit the bill nicely however, i live in fort worth, tx.
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Got my first listen to a Rogue Sphinx amp this weekend.
The system,
Pioneer Elite CD/SACD/DVD player
Tara RSC Prime Speaker wire
Monster Reference interconnect
Montana SPX Loud Speakers
HSU Sub
Un treated room, carpet floor, drywall walls and ceiling, raised subfloor.
Impressions. Nice open sound. Very refined for the size & price. Sweet top end tight well controlled bass. I only got to listen to a hand full of songs as our families were together for dinner and a movie. From the cuts I heard, I was impressed. Female vocal was amazing, very natural with the proper size and weight. Nice ambiance from the open sounding top end and of course LOTS of power on tap. No "digital" edge that I could notice. I would say the $900. Pioneer CD player was the weak link in this system and it's very good for the money too.
A little plain looking, but cool running and nice feature set. Good enough to make me want to try a model with balanced input at home. Nice implementation of the Hypex tech. :thumb:
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Do you know what tubes your friend had in it?
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Do you know what tubes your friend had in it?
Stock Tubes from the factory. I'm not sure is they are or if they have option's on those. We installed it in a cabinet so the lid won't be off any time soon for tube rolling. He is a "set it and forget it" kind of guy. He was actually looking at Macintosh used integrateds. I think the Rogue just seemed like a better deal to him.
I'm not much of a tube roller myself, so I'm not the right person to get him to start. :) I do enjoying reading about opinions on that kind of thing (Dick Olsher comes to mind).
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I just rolled in a pair of circa 1958 Amperex Holland ECC82/12AU7 17mm long plate slanted D getter's with the foil strip and the rare script logo. well the Sphinx is still in my system and with these vintage long plates installed it is sounding better than ever.
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Bunky, How rare & expensive are those scripted tubes?
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This pair has well matched triode sections and both test higher than the average numbers for a new pair.i negotiated a price of $130 when the seller was asking for $150.the script logo is extremely rare. Brent Jesse is asking $250 per pair for 1950's Amperex D getter 12AU7's with the foil strip.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=86428)
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purchased Tekton s-lore speakers and their sound matched with the Sphinx is excellent. very happy camper right now. next move will probably be psvane tubes.