HT3s in the house

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Wayne1

HT3s in the house
« on: 4 Nov 2005, 02:50 am »




I received the demo pair of HT3 yesterday afternoon. These were the same pair that were shown at RMAF.

My first impressions are very positve. These have a VERY small footprint. They take up less space and are less imposing than my VMPS 626Rs on stands. Very high WAF.

They are less efficient than the 626Rs. My modded Panny SA-XR70 has to work a little bit harder.

They do  have a wider dispertion then the VMPS both vertically and horizontally.

The cabinet finish is very nice. Not quite up to the furniture quality of the VMPS MLS cabinets but quite a bit less money.

I have lived with four different version of 626Rs for about 3 years now. I am very used to that sound. The HT3s are a bit different so it is taking me awhile to get used to them. I can say that I do like the cone midrange a LOT better than most I have heard. There is no cabinet sound that I hear with most cone speakers. The mids are not quite as transparent as the 626s but still VERY good.

For a speaker that is less than 1/2 the price of my tricked out VMPS, to come even close is quite an feat. Great job, Al

RAW

HT3s in the house
« Reply #1 on: 4 Nov 2005, 03:11 am »
Thanks for the photos Wayne.
And good to hear things are going well.

I will point out for those who may not know.
The tweeter in these HT3 is our RA104.5 motor with the last photo type face plate.

The responce is the same as the RA104.5 both vertical and Horizontal.
Last to change was the OD of the face plate Both OD, and bolt holes were added to this ribbon.
 :mrgreen:

For those looking and noting the 4 bolt holes not the 6 as on the RA104.5

Bingenito

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HT3s in the house
« Reply #2 on: 4 Nov 2005, 04:53 am »
I have been very happy with the Raw HT3.

Over the past few weeks I have had them in my reference system.

Today I put them into another room with a Panasonic XR55 and I am happy to report that the receiver has no trouble driving them. I was jamming earlier at over 95db at listening position and could not hear a strain.

The bass on the XR55 with the Raw HT3 was very deep and articulate. Not bad for $215 :D This could be a very satisfying combo.

LAL

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HT3s in the house
« Reply #3 on: 4 Nov 2005, 04:58 pm »
The narrow cabinet has its advantages but I can't help but wonder how well the Extremis woofer integrates with the midrange when located so far away from it with a relatively high crossover point(as opposed to other speakers using larger side mounted woofers but lower crossovers) Perhaps Al or others who have heard it could comment on this.  Any plans for a 3 way speaker with the same drivers but with a forward facing Extremis located near the midrange?

LAL

RAW

HT3s in the house
« Reply #4 on: 4 Nov 2005, 05:32 pm »
I will leave the comments of sound to those who have listened to them and you can find that info in a few links on the forum already.

As for a 3way with a forward Extremis no we are not looking at this for our designs.

A smaller foot print is the the design intent not a large cabinet to look at .Very high approval factor :wink:

The Apex is a 3way with  rear firing fullrange driver.The matching center channel does not have the rear firing driver.

mcgsxr

HT3s in the house
« Reply #5 on: 4 Nov 2005, 08:15 pm »
Interesting that Wayne comments positively about the WR125 - I find those really entrancing too - at the moment, they are in my KIT41 that I use as my mains for TV and light theatre (just 2 channel in the family room, no surrounds or sub etc).

I love how they sound with the satellite music channels.

I have also heard the FR version, and was impressed with those.

mgalusha

HT3s in the house
« Reply #6 on: 5 Nov 2005, 03:34 am »
Wayne is going to come by with the HT-3's tomorrow and I am really looking forward to it. My current system is a modded Squeezebox 2 directly into a pair of R.E. Designs LNPA 150 amps driving Meadowlark Blue Heron 2's. I'll post my thoughts here.

A big thanks to Al for sending these around for demos. :thumb:

mike

BradJudy

HT3s in the house
« Reply #7 on: 5 Nov 2005, 04:20 am »
I heard these briefly at the RMAF and enjoyed them.  An excellent combination of sound, looks and price.  Too bad you two are on the far side of town, otherwise I would get together more often.  Apparently there is nothing left from the last system I heard at Mike's place.  :)

audiojerry

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HT3s in the house
« Reply #8 on: 5 Nov 2005, 05:00 am »
I really like the narrow baffle, but it seems like it could a bit unstable. Would mounting it to a wider base plate be possible?

mgalusha

HT3s in the house
« Reply #9 on: 5 Nov 2005, 01:19 pm »
Quote from: BradJudy
 Apparently there is nothing left from the last system I heard at Mike's place.  :)


Oh I still have all the other gear, it's just not part of the system right now. I will likely connect up the analog gear as well, so there will be plenty of tubes in the system. :)

RAW

HT3s in the house
« Reply #10 on: 5 Nov 2005, 08:44 pm »
Yes we do bases for the HT3
Size 11 X 15 Black with spikes

These have been on a custom order only,but a few things will be added to the HT3 in the new year.And yes in January the price for the HT3 will be going up.

Along with a new HTFR
Same size cabinet as the HT3 using just the FR fullrange driver rolled off the lower end to match a single side firing 6.8 woofer.

mcgsxr

HT3s in the house
« Reply #11 on: 6 Nov 2005, 12:18 am »
Will the HTFR be a passive speaker, or will the Extremis be active, using a sub amp?

Just pestering!   :wink:

RAW

HT3s in the house
« Reply #12 on: 6 Nov 2005, 12:43 am »
Passive
WE are not going to custom make a plate amp for a Fullrange speaker.
Better off doing another model with a custom plate that will hit a larger market.

mcgsxr

HT3s in the house
« Reply #13 on: 6 Nov 2005, 05:32 pm »
Excellent point Al, did not think like a manufacturer, I was stuck in DIY mode there!

I guess if you did isolate a good plate amp for the Extremis, it could be incorporated into any of the floorstanding speakers that use that bass driver.

Then again, like most things, there is probably WAY more to it, than my simplification!

In any case, let us know when those HTFR's are up and running, I would like to see a pic or two of those.

mgalusha

HT3 Mini Review (or not so mini)
« Reply #14 on: 8 Nov 2005, 05:21 am »
After having the HT3's here for a few days it's time for a few words.

This is a tale of two speakers. One that was not very good and one that sounds very nice indeed.

Why two speakers? Well, that is the interesting part. :)

Wayne dropped the HT3's off on Saturday morning and of course I couldn't wait to get them in the system. Once set up and connected I was very disappointed in the sound. My wife popped out of the bedroom upstairs and said they didn't sound good and that I was making bad noises. Apparently I was vocalizing my unhappiness. I didn't know what I expected them to sound like but what I was hearing was most certainly not it. In addition I had to turn the volume way up just to get a decent listening level. I knew they had a lower sensitivity than my BH2's but this was pretty severe.

Thinking that perhaps they did not mate well with my amps or my fairly large volume (5500 ft3) room I moved them into the basement into the room where I keep my records and CD's. That system was a modded Denon 2900, Decware ZSLA preamp (buffer really) and a pair of Odyssey Extreme mono's. With considerably more power I figured the lower sensitivity wouldn't be a problem. This is also a very small room, about 11 x 13.

I tried moving them around, putting the woofer on both the inside and outside. All sorts of toe in angles, different speaker cables and I was still not very happy with the results. A little voice in my head kept saying that if I didn't know better I'd say they were broken... I kept trying to get them to image halfway well and just couldn't do it and I knew on the recording I was playing (88 Basie Street) that there was supposed to be an electric guitar dead center. Then it hit me, it sounds just like one of the speakers is out of phase with the other. Checking my connections for about the hundredth time I assured myself all was connected properly. Having nothing to lose, I swapped the connections on one speakers.

Ta-da, here was sound much more like what I was expecting. Images were where they were supposed to be and I was much happier. Of course this meant that indeed something was wrong internally.

A call to Wayne and I learned that he had heard something clunking around in one of the cabinets when he first unpacked them but not since and he had not had time to check into it. A email to Al about the phase problem and I found that someone had pulled one of the speakers apart of a demo at which he was not present and apparently had not reassembled it correctly. Al was kind enough to send me the schematic so armed with the needed info and the permission of the builder I set about repairing the speakers.

Wayne was not hallucinating. One of the big, and I do mean big, like beer can sized, caps had been ripped lose during shipping. It had managed to wedge itself in so that it no longer thunked around but it was not connected on one end and of course this could not be doing good things to the sound. A liberal amount of hot melt glue and some solder and that speaker was back to factory specs.

The other speaker had both the midrange and tweeter wired out of phase. Easy enough to fix now that I had a schematic. I know Al would not have shipped these wired like this and I'm certain that it occurred after he built them given his email.

Once everything was buttoned up I fired up the system and sat down for a listen. The first track ended and the only word I could say was "wow". They could not have been more different. The HT3's went from shockingly bad to shockingly good. I listened until I had to go to bed and I was really enjoying the sound.

Tonight I brought them back upstairs and put them into the main rig. All the troubles I had before were gone. Now they sounded very good in my main room. No problem with room filling volume, bass was nice, clean and extended. Images were clearly defined and there was also nice layering to the sound stage. Plenty of body to wooden instruments but without extra resonance from the cabinets. In short, I thought they sounded very nice and are exceptional at the $1,600 price. I think Wayne will be pleasantly surprised when he hears the HT3's again. They are a very different speaker than what he heard the first time.

A huge thanks to Al for sending these out for demo and for allowing a stranger to work on his product. It turned out the little voice in my head was right, they really were broken. Listening to them now is a true pleasure and it's hard to believe the difference in sound considering that none of the parts have changed, only the connections.

A plea to any other folks who demo these. Please don't take them apart as it's all too easy to get it wrong and it would be an injustice if you didn't get to hear these as they are supposed to be.

From my perspective, these offer an outstanding value and not just for the money, they are an excellent speaker regardless of cost. Can you do better? Sure, but it will cost you and the small footprint and high WAF make these a very nice choice.

Mike

BradJudy

HT3s in the house
« Reply #15 on: 8 Nov 2005, 02:08 pm »
Glad to hear they are up and running and sounding good.

RAW

HT3s in the house
« Reply #16 on: 8 Nov 2005, 03:37 pm »
YEs a big thanks to Mike.
Thanks Thanks again.
We had a issue as some helped out with taking one apart when they had them to see the crossovers ect.

And we just happen to have Mike find this out before the HT3 went any were else.

Thanks again Mike.

Now to his review.

Thanks Mike and glad you could get a few minutes to listen after the repair.

audiojerry

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HT3s in the house
« Reply #17 on: 8 Nov 2005, 06:10 pm »
Not to get picky, but shouldn't there be a concern about what kind of inadvertant alterations might have occurred from taking the speaker apart?
Even something as simple as changes to the gasket between the drivers and cabinet, or how tightly the driver was fastened to the cabinet, or the type of solder joint could all impact the overall sound.

Al, you might want to have them returned to RAW for a once-over before sending them back on the demo trail.  

Thanks, Mike, for recognizing a problem and taking steps to correct it.

RAW

HT3s in the house
« Reply #18 on: 8 Nov 2005, 06:13 pm »
Yes once they are done in Denver they are coming back.
We will be going threw them and checking to see what has been done to them.

Darn can not trust any one!

Thanks to Mike again for finding the issues.

Wayne1

HT3s in the house
« Reply #19 on: 8 Nov 2005, 06:28 pm »
I will try to get them back from Mike this week. I will take another listen to them and send them back to Al.

Now I am beginning to wonder if Denver is jinxed :?

The last 3 or 4 items that came here for audition had to be repaired before they were sent on.