Candela vs Schiit Freya

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. Read 2122 times.

VonHess

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 29
Candela vs Schiit Freya
« on: 16 Aug 2017, 09:03 pm »
I'm going to be looking for a new pre-amp soon and was weighing different options.  I have Kismet in Khartago monos (no xlr) and I know the obvious answer is the Candela but the Schiit Freya seems to be well-loved and I'm sort of intrigued with the 3 different modes.  Does anyone have experience with both of these?  Any reason I should even consider the Freya over the Candela?  Most likely I'd buy the Candela used as they seem to come available fairly often.  So the price wouldnt be that different.
Listen mostly to Cambridge bdp cd player and streaming Tidal and flac from my PC through my AVR temporarily.  Spatial M2 Turbos. 

Stablemate

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 13
Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #1 on: 17 Aug 2017, 11:40 pm »
I was in a similar dilemma when deciding upon the Candela Vs Schiit Saga preamp. In the end I went with the Saga, and it's amazing for the price. Totally transparent with a deep soundstage and great separation. For the money, the Schiit stuff is a no brainer, and the Freya will work great if you need to add some gain to the signal. My signal was already hot enough with my Stratos and super efficient speakers, plus everything is single ended - so the Saga fit the bill. I've heard the Candela at a friends house and it also sounds great, so I don't think you can go wrong either way. The Freya will probably sell faster if you ever upgrade, as they seem to be very popular.

Delta77

Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #2 on: 18 Aug 2017, 09:42 pm »
I have the Candela preamp with Odyssey's Stratos amp And Tekton Pendragon speakers.

I was trying out Schiit brand DAC's . I tried out the MODI 2 (muli-bit) it was okay but I wanted better, so I traded for the " GUNGNIR " much better product..

As the Schiit products were good , I tried a SEGA preamp, it was okay ,but not even close to what the Candela does (TUBE MAGIC ).

I asked Schiit what the difference between the SEGA & FREYA was , Schiit told me the only difference was the Balanced outputs, no difference in sound quality ,, I ask several times to be sure I was understanding what they meant.

 (IMO) the Candela blows the schiit preamps out of the water..


Stablemate

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 13
Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #3 on: 19 Aug 2017, 03:22 am »
The Saga has a tube in it, but it's a buffer that doesn't add gain to the signal. The Candela definitely adds gain to the signal (as will the Freya) which might be a louder = better illusion. Did you get a chance to A/B directly, Delta77?

Seems that all three of us have speakers that are around 95db efficient (Spatial M2 Turbos, Pendragons, Lores) which means when using a Kismet or Stratos amp, you would not need the extra gain. With a Candela in the mix it might get very loud at 9 o clock on the volume dial. With a preamp that adds no gain I've found gets you to about 12 o clock until very loud, which yields better dynamics and stereo balance. YMMV though?

JLM

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 8111
  • The elephant normally IS the room
Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #4 on: 19 Aug 2017, 12:03 pm »
Tried the Gungnir MB and Freya here (with well respected Temple Audio 70 watt mono-blocks/90dB, 8 ohm, 25-20k $3200/pair single driver speakers and Dynaudio BM5 MkIII active monitors) and sent both of them back versus DSPeaker Anti-Mode 2.0 Dual Core ($1200 MSRP).  Neither made a significant improvement in any sonic regard, unlike the mono-blocks which made a nice improvements.  The three modes of the Freya sounded almost identical to me.  Was looking for tube magic and Freya fell flat on that count (tried with stock and nice matched pair NOS tubes).  But gain was not an issue, either in passive or JFET buffer modes (so obviously tube gain mode provided plenty of output).  Note that I run the system with all XLR (balanced) low voltage analog cabling.

If it matters to you, the Saga has larger attenuation steps than Freya.

Schiit tech support is very quick to reply but frustratingly weak in providing useful (subjective) advice.

Delta77

Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #5 on: 19 Aug 2017, 03:32 pm »
The Saga has a tube in it, but it's a buffer that doesn't add gain to the signal. The Candela definitely adds gain to the signal (as will the Freya) which might be a louder = better illusion. Did you get a chance to A/B directly, Delta77?

Seems that all three of us have speakers that are around 95db efficient (Spatial M2 Turbos, Pendragons, Lores) which means when using a Kismet or Stratos amp, you would not need the extra gain. With a Candela in the mix it might get very loud at 9 o clock on the volume dial. With a preamp that adds no gain I've found gets you to about 12 o clock until very loud, which yields better dynamics and stereo balance. YMMV though?

Yea, I had both preamps at the same time. ( auditions)
I thought the Saga sounded Okay & it was not as "HOT" as the Candela,, But...
I didn't like the cheesy remote control, or the funky clicking noise it made when the volume was adjusted,
And the On/Off switch in the back was not easy for me to access ( TV Cabinet)..

You hit the nail on the head ( 95 db ) Speakers & the Candela/Startos combo was very " hot" ...
Got too loud too fast ( not good for talking to wife , we had to kind of yell at each other).No low level listening.

I sent the Sega back .. It was okay but couldn't do as much " magic " as the Candela & the funkiness of the clicking just seemed cheap for some reason..

So .. I still needed a way to tame the Voltage Output of the Candela ,
At this time I had the GUNGNIR DAC from Schiit, with no way to adjust the DACs output either..What do I do?.
I bit the bullet and bought a DAC with Volume adjustment, the OPPO 205 ... I also needed to upgrade my CDP as well so a (2) for (1) $1400 ..
Now I can adjust the Volume to any level I want , from Very Low to Pretty F'ing loud.. works and sounds Very Nice..

So it was hard to swallow, ($900 loss) by taking the GUNGNIR out of the system..But I really didn't like the way the GUNGNIR made clicking noises either.. The GUNGNIR seems to be a solid buy though,, decent quality looks, and solid sounding DAC..

So I would take the Candela over the Schiit products if it were me..


VonHess

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 29
Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #6 on: 19 Aug 2017, 03:38 pm »
oh I'm all over the place.  I'm now also thinking about some of the Rogue amps and the tubes4hifi sp14 gets rave reviews....  nice Pendragons, those are kind of a Shindo green, no?

fredgarvin

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1048
Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #7 on: 19 Aug 2017, 04:16 pm »
oh I'm all over the place.  I'm now also thinking about some of the Rogue amps and the tubes4hifi sp14 gets rave reviews....  nice Pendragons, those are kind of a Shindo green, no?

If you are running high sensitivity speakers neither the Freya or Candela is a good choice because of the high gain. Saga is a low gain design and might be a better choice. it's much better to buy an appropriate preamp than have to buy associated pieces to fix the gain problem.

fredgarvin

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 1048
Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #8 on: 19 Aug 2017, 04:27 pm »
Another one you might consider is the Van Alstine Transcendance 10 RB. I've been reading good reports.

http://avahifi.com/products/pre-amplifiers/transcendence-10-rb-preamplifier

VonHess

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 29
Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #9 on: 19 Aug 2017, 04:34 pm »
If you are running high sensitivity speakers neither the Freya or Candela is a good choice because of the high gain. Saga is a low gain design and might be a better choice. it's much better to buy an appropriate preamp than have to buy associated pieces to fix the gain problem.

see, now this is why I post questions, I always learn something and possibly avoid costly mistakes.  I think the m2 turbos are 95db, would that be sort of middle of the road bordering on high?  I noticed the tubes4hifi sp14 has gain controls.  That would give me a lot more leeway and tweak-ability, right?

VonHess

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 29
Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #10 on: 19 Aug 2017, 04:36 pm »
Another one you might consider is the Van Alstine Transcendance 10 RB. I've been reading good reports.

http://avahifi.com/products/pre-amplifiers/transcendence-10-rb-preamplifier

Thank you sir, all I need is more choices, lol.  First world problems :duh:

jseymour

Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #11 on: 19 Aug 2017, 04:53 pm »
In January my system was Schiit Yggy > Freya > Class D Audio SDS-470 > Spatial M3 Turbo S.  All XLR interconnects.  No issues with gain.  In May I upgraded my speakers to M3 Triode Masters.  No issues with gain.  A month ago I replaced the amp with mono pair of Schiit Vidars.  No issues with gain.

I don't mind the relay noise of the volume control.  One is not constantly turning it.  I don't use the remote.  I can hear distinct differences between the 3 modes.  Passive is too lean, SS is good, but tube is where the magic is at.  But do not use the stock tubes to judge it.  I am a firm advocate of NOS tubes.  They don't make them like they used to.  Just my 2 cents.

WGH

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 2825
  • Artwork that Opens and Closes
    • WGH Woodworking
Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #12 on: 19 Aug 2017, 05:00 pm »
The Van Alstine Fet Valve CF vacuum tube preamp has a low gain button which totally solves the gain problem. I use the button once in a while and it is completely transparent.
http://avahifi.com/products/pre-amplifiers/fet-valve-cf-vacuum-tube-preamplifier

I am a strong believer in using a preamp and amp from the same manufacturer, better synergy and all that, so ask Klaus what his solution would be, it could be as easy as a user changeable resister.

JackD

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 777
Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #13 on: 19 Aug 2017, 07:10 pm »
This is a simple fix for the gain problem that is both transparent and works.  I have both SE and XLR.

http://www.rothwellaudioproducts.co.uk/html/attenuators.html

A_shah

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 112
Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #14 on: 19 Aug 2017, 10:19 pm »
see, now this is why I post questions, I always learn something and possibly avoid costly mistakes.  I think the m2 turbos are 95db, would that be sort of middle of the road bordering on high?  I noticed the tubes4hifi sp14 has gain controls.  That would give me a lot more leeway and tweak-ability, right?
I have a VTA-SP 14 on loan from Whitestix using it with my Kismet/Stratos and OPPO 203UHD , it is very quite and the SQ is very realistic specially the voices, but I think with a SS amp like Kismet it needs higher capacity caps . just ordered my Don Sach pre amp yesterday, Don Suggested we use the 3Uf capacitors , unfortunately Klaus does not give you the exact input impedance for his amplifiers on  one page  it says >10K-ohms and on another page it says >22K-Ohms
 VTA-SP-14 Sometimes I think it sounds tube like other times   it sounds more like SS , also since I am using OPPO 203 to control the volume at times  it gets loud and other times it seems to be very soft ?, but than it could just be my ears ? but than again I am not a reviewer,  sound is pretty detailed and 3D holographic(depending on the type of music  I am playing , it is "not forgiving" if you play a bad recording I have Magniipan 1.7i in my system as well as passive KEF LS 50 in my 2nd system in the same room. I find the Parasound Halo integrated amplifier to be very very good match for the Kismets , I am using the Halo as a SS pre-amp,(via its analog outputs) has GR8 Bass, very detailed , excellent control over the volume the mid's are fabulous, I just wanted a tube amplifier in the signal path that is

 why I have ended up ordering Don Sachs pre-amp although I did check out some other pre amps including prema-Luna

Stablemate

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 13
Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #15 on: 20 Aug 2017, 03:29 am »
In January my system was Schiit Yggy > Freya > Class D Audio SDS-470 > Spatial M3 Turbo S.  All XLR interconnects.  No issues with gain.  In May I upgraded my speakers to M3 Triode Masters.  No issues with gain.  A month ago I replaced the amp with mono pair of Schiit Vidars.  No issues with gain.

How'd you like those Vidars? With two 100W monos combined with the high gain Freya (if using tube mode) it seems like it'd be pretty hot. Aren't the M3 Triode Master pretty efficient speakers?

Edit: I see from another posting that you're listening in a huge room. That would explain it. I think most of us I battling this out in small to medium rooms, and things get loud fast.
« Last Edit: 20 Aug 2017, 07:13 am by Stablemate »

klaus@odyssey

Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #16 on: 20 Aug 2017, 10:07 pm »
Synergy,  synergy,  synergy....and the Candela is designed with the amps, and voiced, obviously.....and it's also a frickin steal at $ 1600.  period...however,  applications and different tastes are always a factor as well...

Eduardo AAVM

Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #17 on: 25 Aug 2017, 01:37 pm »
Please take a look inside, take a look, it may  help you also to decide, different worlds, Schiit, honestly... well  I would say only, I would go for Candela

 :o :scratch:



« Last Edit: 27 Aug 2017, 08:06 pm by Eduardo AAVM »

A_shah

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 112
« Last Edit: 26 Aug 2017, 05:23 am by A_shah »

uncola

Re: Candela vs Schiit Freya
« Reply #19 on: 27 Aug 2017, 10:12 am »
here's an inside look at the candela, might be outdated, I know Klaus evolves his designs over time.. interesting that he seperates the stages on seperate little pcbs while schiit just uses one giant pcb, not sure what that tells us..  also note one toroid vs schiits two ei transformers