LampizatOr Generation 4/Level 4... Now we're talking!

Gopher · « **on:** 19 Apr 2013, 02:49 pm »

I recently obtained a somewhat customized LampizatOr L4/G4 (started as a demo level 3 and I paid for the upgrades after). My unit was built with a solid state rectified power supply along with the somewhat expensive upgrade to Fikusz' favorite Jensen caps. I was going to continue putting this thing through its paces before commenting on the forums about it, but I've gotta say Lukasz knocked this one out of the ball park!

I was not shy in sharing my opinion that I wasn't in love with the Lampizator Gen 3/Level 3 I owned previously and, more over, that I felt my Metrum Octave was just as good with the added benefit of a low noise floor and greater linearity making a wider variety of music suited to it. To be truthful, I'd had all but written off LampizatOr as overpriced gear that is good but not great...

Then came the L4/G4 and from the very first note, I was floored by this thing. Amazing tone, dynamics, staging quality and just an awesome life like presentation. Its good... really good. I don't think I've heard better and its still got a good bit of burn in to go through.

LampizatOr doesn't seem to generate much talk these days, however they really should. Anyone on the fence with digital who can afford to try one of these really should do so.

I'll write more as my burn in continues.

ted_b · « **Reply #1 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 03:32 pm »

Fred, we look forward to your feedback. As you know, these modern DACs all seem to sound more similar than different, and often the real ah-ha moments come from subtle colors (timbres) that still shine through even though the detail is so freaking high that it is that feature which first catches your attention, then often later tires you out. It is that special DAC that brings both detail and harmonic coloring/texture/timbre that makes music IMHO.

BTW, Norman (Wisnon) and Guy (PlayintheBlues) are both big Lampizator fans and often post about his products..so AC is pretty well-versed in Lampizatorness.

but I agree that he is seldom talked about elsewhere.

Jon L · « **Reply #2 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 03:57 pm »

Quote from: Gopher on 19 Apr 2013, 02:49 pm

I recently obtained a somewhat customized LampizatOr L4/G4.

Well, "obtaining" one of these is a major problem. The average Joe will have issues ordering sight-unseen from Poland (!) especially at those prices. There does not seem to be any local stores that demo them, and the website lists one "dealer" that "services" USA , Canada , Hong Kong and Taiwan, but his website only lists website links back to Lampizator website.eu.

rpf · « **Reply #3 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 04:06 pm »

Quote from: Jon L on 19 Apr 2013, 03:57 pm

Well, "obtaining" one of these is a major problem. The average Joe will have issues ordering sight-unseen from Poland (!) especially at those prices. There does not seem to be any local stores that demo them, and the website lists one "dealer" that "services" USA , Canada , Hong Kong and Taiwan, but his website only lists website links back to Lampizator website.eu.

Agreed. A lack of a US presence is a major detriment, IMHO. Not that I could afford one anyway.

Gopher · « **Reply #4 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 04:41 pm »

Ted,

I'll hold back from saying too much until this has more hours on it, but its not a case of just impressing with resolution. I think its a whole package deal. I'm quite impressed in the short/medium term, but will see how things shake out long term in a month or so.

Jon L,

Not entirely accurate. Rocket Ronney right here on AC is a dealer and sold me my Level 3/Gen 3. Ming is also the US distributor that handles things domestically and I know personally he's a good and generous guy. Also, I do believe there is a trial period to decide if you want to keep the piece or return it so its not a final sale unless you're happy.

rpf,

Life is a little crazy on my end at the moment with the birth of my daughter a couple weeks ago, but once things settle down a bit you should swing on out and hear it for yourself. Feel free to bring your own dac.

wisnon · « **Reply #5 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 04:47 pm »

Quote from: Jon L on 19 Apr 2013, 03:57 pm

Well, "obtaining" one of these is a major problem. The average Joe will have issues ordering sight-unseen from Poland (!) especially at those prices. There does not seem to be any local stores that demo them, and the website lists one "dealer" that "services" USA , Canada , Hong Kong and Taiwan, but his website only lists website links back to Lampizator website.eu.

Nah, Ming is the distributor and he has dealers that work with him. Pick up the phone and call him to find out which dealer may be close by.

wisnon · « **Reply #6 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 04:51 pm »

Quote from: ted_b on 19 Apr 2013, 03:32 pm

Fred, we look forward to your feedback. As you know, these modern DACs all seem to sound more similar than different, and often the real ah-ha moments come from subtle colors (timbres) that still shine through even though the detail is so freaking high that it is that feature which first catches your attention, then often later tires you out. It is that special DAC that brings both detail and harmonic coloring/texture/timbre that makes music IMHO.

BTW, Norman (Wisnon) and Guy (PlayintheBlues) are both big Lampizator fans and often post about his products..so AC is pretty well-versed in Lampizatorness. but I agree that he is seldom talked about elsewhere.

Well I can tell you that I know one person who has ditched the Vega for a L5 ...and he loved the Vega till he heard the Lampi. What's more, with an L5, he will have the option to have 2 complete circuitries in the Digital box to have R2R PCM AND the DSD circuit when it is ready in a few months. As this is all point to point hand craft, it can easily be done for a reasonable upgrade cost. I hear that the Gen 1 DSD prototype is SUPERB...their software guy is saying its hard to go back to PCM, and that is the SUPERB Lampi PCM! Gen 2 shoul be something to behold when its finally worked out!

ted_b · « **Reply #7 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 05:36 pm »

Quote from: wisnon on 19 Apr 2013, 04:51 pm

Well I can tell you that I know one person who has ditched the Vega for a L5 ...and he loved the Vega till he heard the Lampi. What's more, with an L5, he will have the option to have 2 complete circuitries in the Digital box to have R2R PCM AND the DSD circuit when it is ready in a few months. As this is all point to point hand craft, it can easily be done for a reasonable upgrade cost. I hear that the Gen 1 DSD prototype is SUPERB...they software guy is saying its hard to go back to PCM, and that is the SUPERB Lampi PCM! Gen 2 shoul be something to behold when its finally worked out!

Great stuff. This is why it is tough to spend huge $$ (assuming you have it) on digital these days, as folks like Fikusz are re-imagining the way we listen to digital. However, these new discoveries cost big $$ so we're back to the conundrum!!

this_is_vv · « **Reply #8 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 06:49 pm »

How much these costs??

V

wisnon · « **Reply #9 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 08:06 pm »

A Level 4 is about $6K

ajayrav · « **Reply #10 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 09:34 pm »

So Gopher, in your opinion to order the Dacs you've had so far, would it be fair to say that the LAMP 4 is at the top of the heap, followed by the Metrum and the LAMP 3. I believe you also had a Bolder modded Eastern Electric DAC at one time. Where would that fit in to this progression? Also, how different are these DACs from each other?

Cheers,
Ajay

Gopher · « **Reply #11 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 10:05 pm »

The Goto USA DAC made by Ming, the Lamoizator importer was pretty damn exceptional, but a lot of time has passed since I heard it. That was only a prototype then, but was supposed to be in the for $8k range. I think the Lamoizator performs at the same level, possibly better, but there was a speaker change in the middle.

These dacs are on a significantly higher level then the others..from here I'd probably rank:
Metrum Octave
Lamp 3/AMR DP777 (yea I preferred the Metrum.and didn't really care for the AMR)
Bolder EE DAC.

I actually probably got more enjoyment out of the bolder EE relative to the Lamp 3 and Octave, but much of that had to do with how seasoned I was.

ajayrav · « **Reply #12 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 10:18 pm »

I still really like my Bolder EE DAC. I use a Bolder modded touch and an ART modded Duet as a source. For 44.1, I have to give the ART duet the nod. I am getting a Modwright Oppo BDP-105, so it will be interesting to see how that compares to the EE. I don't like the stock Oppo very much as a DAC/ lo-rez music player. It is very good with SACD though! That being said, while the Lamp is much more expensive, the Metrum Octave is in the same ballpark price-wise as the Modwright Oppo.

wisnon · « **Reply #13 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 10:46 pm »

He was talking about the OLD Lampi 3 which was Gen 2.5. He now has a modded Gen 4 Lampi 4 (solid state recification).

He says that this new Dac is at different level to the Metrum/Boulder modded EE.

ajayrav · « **Reply #14 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 10:52 pm »

Yup, I got that. In the last line I was referring to the Oppo. Should have been clearer. The new Lampi is ahead of the Metrum and certainly, of the EE DAC, as it should be at the price. Basically, the concept of 'you get what you pay for' holds....

wisnon · « **Reply #15 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 11:03 pm »

Yes, and in this case a bit more. The friend I referred to above who sent back the Auralic has a GBP12K Dac that he will replace with a fully specced out Level 5 for half the money.

ajayrav · « **Reply #16 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 11:07 pm »

Yes, I have heard nothing but good things about the Lampi DACs....

Lampizator · « **Reply #17 on:** 20 Apr 2013, 02:47 pm »

I am so glad that you liked the Level 4. Technically speaking, we at LampizatOr labs think the best we can conceive is Level 3 DAC. So what is about L4 that is so important ? Well, it is TIME. It takes one full day to build Level 3 and to build Level 4 takes 3-4 days more. Based on the same circuit and principles, L4 is a super refined animal. It is not just enough to take the well tested and proven circuit and parts and put this together. We adjust every part during listening tests, even resistors, wires, capacitors, operating points - and step by step we pull the DAC by the hair to sound the way Fikus likes it.
Normally the L4 is sounding properly out of the lab - what we want is the three-dimensional cloud of sound that stretches beyond speaker line, beyond side walls of the room and BEHIND the listener too. The listener becomes inserted inside this cloud in the continuum of stage depth and width. This aspect is the hardest one to get. During 2013 alone we spent at least 4-5 hours every day improving the Level 4 series of DACs. If it is possible - some new tricks also go down to Level 3 if easy to implement. It is very exciting to be on that learning curve and seeing what is possible with enough time and patience. We are simply outdoing ourselves every month or so.

jriggy · « **Reply #18 on:** 20 Apr 2013, 03:30 pm »

Its really to bad that this particular AMR unit Fred heard did not have the right board in it... Its to bad that the original owner did not send it back for its proper fix and instead sold it on the used market to someone here on AC. It might not of changed Gophers opinion of this unit but we will never know. It is my understanding that the board used in the beginning production of the AMR DP-777 was not up to spec and put out a rather lackluster sound.

Although I am glad that this new Lamp G4L4 is so much better!
My G3L4+ relationship only lasted a week. But possibly same situation with this spoken of AMR, my L4+ could of been defective. Well, it did arrive broken, with shattered tubes inside (shotty packing from previous owner or customs officers) and had to go for an immediate $500 repair. So just as Gopher will likely never know the intended performance of the AMR, I may never know the real sound of Lampizator.
But sounds like we could all just wait a couple months and get a unit that might sound even better than the reviewed.

Berto · « **Reply #19 on:** 20 Apr 2013, 07:29 pm »

I recently bought a used L4 GEN 3 overseas and the seller arranged for Lukasz to upgrade it to a GEN 4. Gotta log more hours for burn in, but right out of the box from Europe, I could tell it was special.

I would say it's not a cliche audiophiles DAC, I would say it's more of a music-philes dac. No matter what a piece of gear does sonically, if it can't suck you into the music, it's a dealbreaker for me. This DACs is the most addicting and involving digital source i've heard and it's not even close. I've also owned a L3 GEN 3 and can say that the GEN 4 is more revolutionary then evolutionary. Evidently Lukasz's hardwork has paid off. This is a totally different beast.

Holy holographic Batman! Sonically I am MOST impressed with the staging. The depth, width and height are all exemplarily. Not used to this, I have stopped my music, wondering if certain sounds are coming from outside my room. Dynamic contrasts are also impressive. From gentle to bombastic all the while very composed. The Gen 4 has a bold, weighty presentation that to me is the antithesis of digital.

BRAVO Lukasz, a job/DAC well done and one that has reinvigorated my love for music!