Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub

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Rclark

Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« on: 24 Aug 2012, 07:35 am »
http://hometheaterreview.com/tekton-design-pendragon-floorstanding-loudspeaker-reviewed/?page=2

"There is a wide variety of loudspeakers available to consumers at or even below the Pendragon's $2,500 per pair asking price. Based solely on price, the options include, but are not limited to Aperion Audio's Grand Verus Towers ($1,798/pair), GoldenEar's Triton Two ($2,500/pair), Zu OMEN DEF ($3,100/pair), MartinLogan ElectroMotions ($2,000/pair) and Paradigm Studio 100s ($3,000/pair). All of the above-referenced items are fine speakers and, based solely on their asking price, seem like worthy competitors. However, I don't consider them to be such, not because any of the aforementioned speakers are bad - they're not - but because I feel the Pendragon's sound is one that has more in common with some of the bigger speakers.

Yes, I'll say it, I believe the Pendragon competes, and favorably, with speakers along the line of Wilson Audio's MAXX 3 ($68,000), Wisdom Audio's LS4 ($70,000), and even pro speakers such as Meyer Sound X-10s ($30,000). I've spent considerable time with all of these heavy hitters and would not make such a bold comparison if I didn't believe it to be accurate. I'm not saying that the Pendragon is better than say a pair of MAXX 3s; I'm simply stating that there are more similarities between a pair of MAXX3s and the Pendragons than there is between the Pendragons and, say, a pair of GoldenEars. These are two speakers, MAXX and Pendragon, which are cut from similar cloth. I recently went back and logged a couple of hours on a pair of MAXX 3s just to be certain. At the extremes, there are differences, but at their core, they check many of the same boxes"

I'd really love to know your opinion here because I know that you deal regularly in speakers that cost astounding amounts of money. Have you any experience with Tekton?
« Last Edit: 1 Sep 2012, 03:41 am by Rclark »

Letitroll98

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Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #1 on: 1 Sep 2012, 01:57 am »
Hey Rc.  You did all the right things here listing the quoted source right up front and all, but could I gently suggest that you indicate a little more clearly that this is quoted text from a review?  For old farts like me who don't always click on links and read the review, it might seem (ok, it seemed) like these were your own words, which could be interpreted as pretty pompous like you've been suddenly travelling in rarefied company.  It's only when you click the link and read through the review you understand that you've quoted a source.  Perhaps quotation marks or italics would do the trick, or maybe a note, "quoted from the linked review" or something.  Just sayin'.

On to the Tekton Pendragon, I just don't think a lot of small speaker builders get much play, so not too many people have heard them.  I've been to several shows and a zillion dealers and have yet to run into them displayed anywhere.  No one I know owns them.  Nothing against Tekton Design, just the realities.  It's good they're getting a review, I wish them all the success in the world, I hope he ends up like Gedlee speakers with too many orders to fill.  The lack of response to your thread may be something to do with the harsh realities of the marketplace.

On a side note about Tekton speakers, on the "Media" tab on his website he has a video entitled "Tekton Design Lore neat video, running through the frequencies".  It sounded like he was using the "Music Articulation" cut from Stereophile Test Disc #2.  If so, the results were very disturbing, what I would call a failure.  Additionally there was extreme woofer pumping at low frequencies, to the point of possible damage.  But it's all through a Youtube video and my cheap computer speakers.  Could anyone confirm this? 

bhakti

Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #2 on: 1 Sep 2012, 02:29 am »
It all depends on how you listen and what is important to you.  Have you noticed you can only focus on one area at a time?

This is why the smarter crowd knows it takes time to assess a component/speaker.  Double blind is for the double blind (eyes and ears)!   :lol:

I think blanket statements like yours are not fully fleshed out!

morganc

Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #3 on: 1 Sep 2012, 02:51 am »
I owned a pair of Pendragons which I even upgraded ( mundorf SIO caps) and they are very good speakers but I do prefer my newly acquired Zu definition mkiii's.  The bass via the powered subs are of course better in the Zu's as they should be considering the price differential.  In many other regards the Zu definitions and the new Zu Omen Def mkii's are much more similar than different from the Pendragons.  Both are dynamic with great imaging and a huge soundstage. I find the Zu's to be better in the vocal range and with the new Nano Driver more detailed as well. 

Another speaker which is in the same ballpark is the Super V's and they demolish the Pendragons (and are superior to the Zu def iii's but maybe not the Def IV's. 

I think the Lore with dual servo subs would easily smoke the Pendragons.  The tweeter on the Lore is superb, and at least for me (poorly treated room), the Pendragon bass was boomy.  However I never tried the Pendragonswith a high powered SS amp, which Eric at Tekton said would be his first choice of amps.   

saisunil

Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #4 on: 1 Sep 2012, 02:59 am »
that is an over the top - super bold review ...
sure some big name speakers have garnered a lot of undue press - both good and bad ...

a speaker with three tweeters competing with speakers almost 30 times in price ... either you ignore it entirely or find a way to listen ... don't know!

@morganc - thanks for your impressions - they sound very believable ... cheers :thumb:

Rclark

Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #5 on: 1 Sep 2012, 03:40 am »
None of those words are mine, and I couldn't go back and edit in quotes. I think the paragraphs that followed were even more heavy duty. Anyway, review like that made mw curious.

Trung actually has these, modded crossovers too, buy he is a man of few words and simply loves them.

Rclark

Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #6 on: 1 Sep 2012, 03:44 am »
Thanks Morgan, my interest was Lore S and Katzmeow, but this was quite a review so I had to post it.

morganc

Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #7 on: 1 Sep 2012, 04:37 am »
Sure, no problem.   My review comes with one caveat, I only spent six months with the Pendragons and I didn't try them with a hundred different combinations of amps, preamps, and DAC's.   And the amps that were the best for the Zu's,the Decware Torii and the Coincident Frankenstein 300B did not mate will with the Dragons for whatever reason.   I even was lucky enough to demo Hugh's beautiful Melody AN 211, which Ive heard from reliable sources to be amazing, and the Pendragons didn't really change that much.   In some ways maybe that's great as you can get top performance from a low cost amp, but unlike the Zu's you don't get a huge improvement with every amplifier change that you make with the Tekton line.   

I only wish now that I have the Zu's I could try the Melody AN 211 again or even better the new AN845! 

DaveC113

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Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #8 on: 1 Sep 2012, 05:00 am »
And the amps that were the best for the Zu's,the Decware Torii and the Coincident Frankenstein 300B did not mate will with the Dragons for whatever reason.   I even was lucky enough to demo Hugh's beautiful Melody AN 211, which Ive heard from reliable sources to be amazing, and the Pendragons didn't really change that much. 

Crossovers. Zu runs their full range driver full range while the Tektons, from what I have heard, use a more conventional 2 way xover.

I think the review was a little over the top. I have pair of Omega XRS I got for $550, they are single drivers with a 4.5" cone, and it does some things better than pretty much any multi-way speaker, but to claim that it is better or equal to a speaker 20x it's price is naive and even a little ridiculous. Audio has it's compromises and trade offs and it's great that particular reviewer liked the Pendragons because they fit in with what is important to HIM... but that doesn't mean they are better than any of the speakers he claims. When you write like that I think a little credibility goes out the window... I'm sure the compromises my Omegas make would be completely unacceptable to some people.

JLM

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Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #9 on: 1 Sep 2012, 09:08 am »
Cheap oranges versus expensive apples = meaningless comparison.

Separate subs generally can sound better than passives simply because they can be moved around apart from where you'd want to higher frequency drivers to be located.

Personnally I don't like the whole design idea of 3 tweeters.

Letitroll98

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Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #10 on: 1 Sep 2012, 03:23 pm »
None of those words are mine, and I couldn't go back and edit in quotes. I think the paragraphs that followed were even more heavy duty. Anyway, review like that made mw curious.

Trung actually has these, modded crossovers too, buy he is a man of few words and simply loves them.

Just click the "modify" tab and you can edit your previous posts, but please don't take my suggestion as a demand, I'm sure all the quicker witted folks here realized it was a quoted review, only slow thinking old fools like me didn't catch on right away.

As far as the review goes, I think you picked a representative couple of paragraphs, you're right, the whole thing was a little over the top.  Unlike some, I like reading professional reviews, especially ezine ones.  The ezines aren't as stuffy as the print magazines and they allow for someone going gaga over a product like this reviewer did.  It's more like your best friend just got these speakers and he's telling you all about them.  Like most best friends, you take his opinions with a big grain of salt, but you're happy to hear from him (or her).

doug s.

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Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #11 on: 1 Sep 2012, 03:37 pm »
i don't like the 3-tweeter idea either, (even the 2-tweeter design of the daedalus ulysses's has me skeptical, but they have gotten uniformly excellent rewiews), but i still would love to hear these - they have gotten generally decent reviews, if not quite as over the top as the one rclark cited.  but, it makes me really curious about tekton's upgraded iteration...

http://tektondesign.com/seas-pendragon.html

doug s.

morganc

Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #12 on: 1 Sep 2012, 06:14 pm »
Cheap oranges versus expensive apples = meaningless comparison.

Separate subs generally can sound better than passives simply because they can be moved around apart from where you'd want to higher frequency drivers to be located.

Personnally I don't like the whole design idea of 3 tweeters.

I agree on the three tweeters.   For me the magic of the Lore tweeter was lost a bit with the Pendragons.

Rclark

Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #13 on: 1 Sep 2012, 06:44 pm »
According to that review the things the tweeter array were capable of was the best part.

Part-Time Audiophile

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Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #14 on: 1 Sep 2012, 08:41 pm »
I think a priori expectations are fine and dandy, but it's interesting to see how well they hold up to experience. In my experience, Eric is on to something with his array. Given that I'm not an engineer, nor do I play one on TV, I can't really explain what it is he's doing with it or why it had to be a triple tweeter array -- but it's not just "for fun". Eric did some interesting work in commercial audio design (as in, sound systems for large spaces) and he told me that it was some stuff that fell out of that research that led him to this particular arrangement of drivers.

I can't comment on the comparison to the Wilsons, never having had them here, but reading the review over, the comparison feels like hyperbole (duh). That said,  I have had the 'dragons for a good long visit. And they're really, really good -- and not just "for the money".

Personally, for my tastes and with my gear in my room, I preferred the Lore S, which I though presented as more "audiophile", if bass challenged by comparison. That doesn't take anything away from the 'dragons, though -- they play louder and way deeper.

I should mention that I'm happily anticipating the new "Pendragons with SEAS drivers" -- which Eric says are rapidly nearing production. These will be 4ohms and 95dB, which should be very interesting to pair with some lower-power amps.

boniccie

Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #15 on: 19 May 2013, 12:32 am »
I own both  the pendragon and the lore since November 2012 and yes i agree with many members the super tweeter in the Lore is much better then the tripple array in the pendragon. I kept moving back and forth between the 2 rooms where i set up the tekton's and everytime i feel i am getting more satisfaction when i listen to the pendragon driven by KT88 amp playing vinyl (mostly Jazz). I believe system synergy, placement and room treatment has to do a lot with the sound you get from the Pendragon..

srb

Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #16 on: 19 May 2013, 05:38 am »
None of those words are mine, and I couldn't go back and edit in quotes.

Why not?  Simply enclose the quote in HTML quote tags like this:
Beginning quote tag:  {quote author=Andrew Robinson from www.hometheatrereview.com on August 13, 2012}
Actual quote in the middle:  yada, yada, yada
Ending quote tag:  {/quote}

with square brackets instead of curly brackets, of course.

Quote from: Andrew Robinson from www.hometheatrereview.com on August 13, 2012
There is a wide variety of loudspeakers available to consumers at or even below the Pendragon's $2,500 per pair asking price. Based solely on price, the options include, but are not limited to Aperion Audio's Grand Verus Towers ($1,798/pair), GoldenEar's Triton Two ($2,500/pair), Zu OMEN DEF ($3,100/pair), MartinLogan ElectroMotions ($2,000/pair) and Paradigm Studio 100s ($3,000/pair). All of the above-referenced items are fine speakers and, based solely on their asking price, seem like worthy competitors. However, I don't consider them to be such, not because any of the aforementioned speakers are bad - they're not - but because I feel the Pendragon's sound is one that has more in common with some of the bigger speakers.

Yes, I'll say it, I believe the Pendragon competes, and favorably, with speakers along the line of Wilson Audio's MAXX 3 ($68,000), Wisdom Audio's LS4 ($70,000), and even pro speakers such as Meyer Sound X-10s ($30,000). I've spent considerable time with all of these heavy hitters and would not make such a bold comparison if I didn't believe it to be accurate. I'm not saying that the Pendragon is better than say a pair of MAXX 3s; I'm simply stating that there are more similarities between a pair of MAXX3s and the Pendragons than there is between the Pendragons and, say, a pair of GoldenEars. These are two speakers, MAXX and Pendragon, which are cut from similar cloth. I recently went back and logged a couple of hours on a pair of MAXX 3s just to be certain. At the extremes, there are differences, but at their core, they check many of the same boxes.

raysracing

Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #17 on: 19 May 2013, 11:47 am »
I personally have struggled with my Lore's in imaging, soundstage mostly and in not sounding up to the hype, but I believe they just will not sound good with the low level of equipment i own in electronics. Whereas some speakers are more tolerant of electronics so they sound fine and image well with the same equipment.

I would love ot hear my Lore's on someone elses high end system in town, but I dont know any audiophiles locally.

DaveC113

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Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #18 on: 19 May 2013, 03:47 pm »
ray, IMO you can get good results without spending a ton of cash... something like the TBI Millenia amp that's going around on tour ($500) and a basic DAC (lots to choose from) will do the job. It won't be as good as a high end SET / $1k+ DAC, but it will be  surprisingly close... 

raysracing

Re: Tekton Pendragon .. calling Tonepub
« Reply #19 on: 21 May 2013, 02:29 am »
ray, IMO you can get good results without spending a ton of cash... something like the TBI Millenia amp that's going around on tour ($500) and a basic DAC (lots to choose from) will do the job. It won't be as good as a high end SET / $1k+ DAC, but it will be  surprisingly close...

I put my Lore's up for local sale, but not holding my breath on a buyer. I will research the TBI. Thanks.