[Danny Richie]

I hear you Davey, but having measured a handful of them and seen measurements on several others I find myself having a hard time believing that a humped up response, or a response with a rolled off top end, or a response with a thin or falling lower range (responses that are all over the place) are somehow desired or chosen responses. I just can't see varying the response away from a reference that represents some level of accuracy to some abstracted response because it will sound better that way. And the quality level of the components used does not suggest to me that a lot of time was spent in their selection. So why would I believe that a lot of time and effort was put into designing an acoustic response that varies so much from a typically desired level of accuracy?

[Danny Richie]

And in regards to this comment:

Regardless, if you want to really improve those speakers you need to remove the whole stock crossover and reconfigure the setup for bi(tri)-amp operation.  Anything else is just turd polishing.  If this is beyond the capabilities of any contributors, I think I would be inclined to just leave well enough alone.

As you know many of these designs use a series crossover. So re-configuring them for bi-wiring or tri-wiring would require designing a new crossover. Plus, just using multiple amps to drive these verses a single amp is not much more than a drop in the bucket compared to a lot of other things that can be done to them. And just because you don't understand something does not make it turd polishing. Feel free to contribute here Davey, but don't disparage others from their quest to make things sound better. 

[Danny Richie]

And lastly, I'll respond to this one.

No doubt you would find these speakers would not measure acoustically flat and would not conform to some idealistic response curve you had in mind.  However, that's essentially irrelevant because we don't know what acoustical target the Magnepan guys had in mind.

It is naive to think that because something is messed up that it is supposed to be messed up, and that a shift in frequency response or tonal balance back to a higher level of accuracy would some how sound worse.

[Davey]

Danny,

Now you're resorting to straw man arguments.

I made no mention of a measured and/or targeted response that is "messed up."  I'm simply saying that Magnepan is probably designing to an objective that neither you or I understand.  (That shouldn't be a difficult premise to grasp.)
Your assumption is that a shift in tonal balance to a "higher level of accuracy" would sound better?  That's speculative and assumes that you know what a "higher level of accuracy" is relative to the folks at Magnepan designing these particular speakers.  "Accuracy" is more than objective in the crazy world of speaker design.  You should well know that. 

Regards switching the configuration:  Again, you've created an argument against something that I didn't say.  I said nothing about bi-wiring or tri-wiring with some sort of passive bi-amping scheme.  I  would agree that is a drop in the bucket.
I was referring to a complete reconfiguration to a line-level crossover with power amplifier bandwidth limiting and all the other benefits that approach entails.  I've done this many times with Magnepan speakers so I know of what I speak.

My turd-polishing comment is accurate.  Whether you believe it or find it disparaging is your point of view....not mine. 

Cheers,

Dave.

[Danny Richie]

I made no mention of a measured and/or targeted response that is "messed up."  I'm simply saying that Magnepan is probably designing to an objective that neither you or I understand.  (That shouldn't be a difficult premise to grasp.)
Your assumption is that a shift in tonal balance to a "higher level of accuracy" would sound better?  That's speculative and assumes that you know what a "higher level of accuracy" is relative to the folks at Magnepan designing these particular speakers.  "Accuracy" is more than objective in the crazy world of speaker design.  You should well know that. 

My comment regarding messed up refers to a response curve that is not accurate.

In a way you are right about them possibly having a design objective that we don't understand as I find it hard to understand why a more accurate response wouldn't be desired especially since adjusting the response to produce a more accurate output level is so easy.

And are you suggesting or assuming for some reason that a shift in tonal balance away from accurate would sound better?

And in terms of accuracy, that is pretty simple really. Greater deviations from the input signal is less accurate. Less deviation from the input signal is more accurate. One doesn't have to speculate to understand that.

Regards switching the configuration:  Again, you've created an argument against something that I didn't say.  I said nothing about bi-wiring or tri-wiring with some sort of passive bi-amping scheme.

 

Sorry, I meant bi-amping or tri-amping just as you stated. I wrote bi-wiring and bi-amping by mistake.

My turd-polishing comment is accurate.  Whether you believe it or find it disparaging is your point of view....not mine. 

I find your turd polishing point of view to be that of a narrow minded man that won't allow himself to understand the performance gains of higher quality components, wire, connectors, etc. And I typically don't say things like that but the point was not to express my point of view, but to help you understand how such remarks come across. And then what if I said, oh did my point of view poo poo on you? I'm sorry, I still find it to be accurate. If it sounds disparaging then maybe that's just your point of view... I mean really Davey, why poo poo on someone interested in upgrades to their speakers?

[*Scotty*]

Here is a frequency response graph from Home Theater Shack speaker comparison done in Nov. 2013
It doesn't look that bad, it appears that 1/12 octave smoothing was applied from the boxes checked below the graph.

Scotty

[FLEMKE]

I have decided to buy Myestands first and then tackle to crossovers a little later.
Tim

[Danny Richie]

I have decided to buy Myestands first and then tackle to crossovers a little later.
Tim

When you're ready, I'll be glad to help.