Sonore exD DSD DAC on a Mac

InfernoSTi · « **on:** 28 Apr 2013, 08:55 pm »

I'm going to be trying out a Sonore exD DSD DAC for DSD playback using JRiver for Mac and was wondering if anyone here had already tried that out? If so, any tips or hints for a DSD newbie?

I anticipate receipt of the Sonore exD by the end of the week and am starting to get excited about it! This will be my first try at DSD, so I'm a little nervous about all the proper settings, playback of the different types of DSD files/sizes, etc.

I would appreciate any comments at all that might get me moving in the right direction. Thank you in advance!

Best,
John

ted_b · « **Reply #1 on:** 28 Apr 2013, 10:13 pm »

You should know two things:
1) I reviewed the Sonore/EXD DAC and loved it, especially at its $1299 price tag. It has a very organic nice neutral-to-warm (although that doesn't mean rolled off; not at all).
2) JRiver on the MAC is brand new, still has issues, as it is still beta software

So cutting one's teeth on both DSD playback and JRiver's MAC improvements is going to go less than perfectly. Just be aware. Let us know how it goes; I can offer JRiver advice (from Windows expertise side) and DSD setup help.

InfernoSTi · « **Reply #2 on:** 29 Apr 2013, 12:37 am »

Thanks, Ted. It sounds like I'll be one of the first with this combo, then. I'm good with that and will set my expectations of "plug and play" in proper perspective.

One quick follow up: do you know if I can play DSD128 files via DoP v1? I thought I had read somewhere one couldn't but I don't know if that is true. If it is, will that make a difference (typically)?

Thanks,
John

PeteG · « **Reply #3 on:** 29 Apr 2013, 01:16 am »

I have a modified Mac mini partitioned using Boot Camp with jriver (both Mac & Win7). The Mac version is not up to par with the Win version but its coming along as you know its very new, I’m running the mini into an Sonore exD dac and I echo what Ted has said about the dac, very smooth and pleasing in its stock form. I'm extremely happy with this combo.

ted_b · « **Reply #4 on:** 29 Apr 2013, 01:35 am »

DSD128 should work. However, I wanna put a plug in for a CAPs server and Win 8 with JRiver and Jplay. You'll be amazed with this DAC.

InfernoSTi · « **Reply #5 on:** 29 Apr 2013, 01:41 am »

Quote from: PeteG on 29 Apr 2013, 01:16 am

I have a modified Mac mini partitioned using Boot Camp with jriver (both Mac & Win7). The Mac version is not up to par with the Win version but its coming along as you know its very new, I’m running the mini into an Sonore exD dac and I echo what Ted has said about the dac, very smooth and pleasing in its stock form. I'm extremely happy with this combo.

Thanks, Pete. It's good to know I can always convert to JRiver for Windows for the price of the program and a copy of Windows (only if all else goes wrong, right?!!!)

Quote from: ted_b on 29 Apr 2013, 01:35 am

DSD128 should work. However, I wanna put a plug in for a CAPs server and Win 8 with JRiver and Jplay. You'll be amazed with this DAC.

Thanks, Ted. At this point, I'm not sure if that is an issue or not but now I know I don't have to worry about it.

The CAPs server and Windows 8 with JRiver and JPlay? Hmm...these upgrades are always slippery slopes, aren't they! I will start reading up on CAPs Servers. Do you have a particular model you favor? There are several versions, it seems....

Best,
John

PeteG · « **Reply #6 on:** 29 Apr 2013, 01:45 am »

DSD128 plays fine for me.

InfernoSTi · « **Reply #7 on:** 29 Apr 2013, 04:57 am »

Thanks, Pete....great to know.

Ted, I have answered my own question on the CAPs server based on your build notes (V2+): http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=110542.0

Thanks for the support, guys. I'm feeling a lot more confident now...

Best,
John

InfernoSTi · « **Reply #8 on:** 2 May 2013, 02:03 am »

The Sonore exD DAC arrived tonight...hooked up via USB.

All PCM files play from 16/44.1 to 24/192. That is great!

However, the DSD files load and appear to "play" but without any audio output.

Specifically, the song loads in buffer then plays (you can see the play bar moving and the seconds ticking up/down). In DSP Studio under Output Format, it says "Not available while bitstreaming" and the internal says "bitstreaming" and the source says 176.4/24 2 channel. All that is as expected...just no audio coming out.

When I click a PCM song, it automatically adjusts to the proper playback for PCM playback and audio comes out.

Any suggestions on what to try next? I'm hoping it is a simple "unclick the mute button" type deal, right?

Thanks for your thoughts....

John

EDIT 1: I can get some stuttering/hissy/static music to play...and played with the output rates (taking them all the way up to 384 and down to 176.4 then back to 192. Then I turned the DAC completely off and then back on...it played smoothly on DSD for the first 3:45 of the song, then it went back to scratchy static. Hmmm....progress of some kind.

EDIT 2: Playback is now smooth without clicks/pops...I fiddled around and then for no apparent reason it started working fine. I would describe it as if some capacitors needed to warm up to play right...and once they did, all was fine. Perhaps something got loose during shipping? I'll explore that later...for now it's working fine!

Initial comments: DSD has greater depth and air (I found myself closing my eyes and picturing a much larger stage), it sounds better when you turn it up...nothing harsh, just more detail (I suspect I'll play DSD louder than PCM), and the cymbals sound more natural...softer, with huge decay.

So the bottom line is the Sonore exD plays DSD on a Mac via JRiver and it sounds great!

Best,
John

ted_b · « **Reply #9 on:** 2 May 2013, 03:57 am »

If Jriver on the MAC is anything like its Windows counterpart make sure bitstreaming is set to "DoP" not "DSD".

InfernoSTi · « **Reply #10 on:** 2 May 2013, 04:21 am »

Thanks, Ted...I just managed to get it set right (or something)...I've got DSD (DFF) files playing right now!

Per my edit, above:

Initial comments: DSD has greater depth and air (I found myself closing my eyes and picturing a much larger stage), it sounds better when you turn it up...nothing harsh, just more detail (I suspect I'll play DSD louder than PCM), and the cymbals sound more natural...softer, with huge decay.

Best,
John

ted_b · « **Reply #11 on:** 2 May 2013, 11:44 am »

Great! Now when extracting SACD ISOs try to extract DSF instead of DFF, cuz DFF doesn't accept tagging and DSF does. There is no downside.

InfernoSTi · « **Reply #12 on:** 2 May 2013, 01:30 pm »

Thanks for the format heads up, Ted!

And it's back to no audio this morning...I am using Alpha software that is a bit buggy even for some on PCM so I'm just going to have to work through this.

Best,
John

EDIT: I left JRiver and the DAC playing PCM files when I left for work...at lunch I came home and it played DSD files flawlessly immediately.

EDIT 2: I figured out the buggy nature of this was due to another USB drive (my backup drive) being plugged in...the Sonore wants to be the only USB for DSD over DoP. Once I unplugged my backup drive (points for backing up), the DSD has been flawless.

InfernoSTi · « **Reply #13 on:** 3 May 2013, 05:12 am »

DSD is magnificent....

Best,
John

ted_b · « **Reply #14 on:** 3 May 2013, 01:37 pm »

Quote from: InfernoSTi on 3 May 2013, 05:12 am

DSD is magnificent....

Best,
John

Welcome to the Club.

InfernoSTi · « **Reply #15 on:** 4 May 2013, 04:29 pm »

A couple of items:

First, things are playing pretty consistently for two days now (crosses fingers). The major thing that seems to have made a difference is I removed all other USB drives from the Mac Mini and things started playing fine. I have a Oyen Firewire drive for my music storage but had a USB drive connected for backing up...I had done that but forgot to remove it. Once removed, things were fine (or so it seems...I will give it a few weeks to confirm).

Second, I downloaded some x2 DSD recordings and those play great through JRiver for Mac and the Sonore exD DSD DAC.

Third, I really like my other DAC for PCM recordings (but will reserve final judgement for after 100 hours). This is from memory and may be simply the difference between PCM and DSD is so pronounced. My other DAC is a Bolder Cable Co. modified Eastern Electric DAC with a nice tube, the volume bypassed, and running off a Bolder Cable Co. modified linear power supply. That is so hard to beat on PCM files. But DSD playback is so nice, I may be overly critical of the PCM sound from the Sonore...that wouldn't surprise me if it were true.

Best,
John

InfernoSTi · « **Reply #16 on:** 6 May 2013, 03:09 am »

Quote from: ted_b on 29 Apr 2013, 01:35 am

However, I wanna put a plug in for a CAPs server and Win 8 with JRiver and Jplay. You'll be amazed with this DAC.

Ted,

I'll take you up on this...in the scheme of things, it isn't that expensive. I'm going to build a version of your CAPs V2+ server...a basic build at first and then I can add the fancy stuff (better USB card, better USB power, better computer power). Any comments/suggestions would be welcome! Here is my "basic" build list:

Basic Build Parts Ordered:
1. Wesena ITX6-S (Silver) Mini HTPC Chassis $78.00
2. Intel Innovation DN2800MT Desktop Motherboard - Intel NM10 Express Chipset $97.99
3. Mushkin Enhanced Atlas Series MKNSSDAT60GB-DX mSATA 60GB SATA III MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) $89.99
4. Mushkin Enhanced Essentials 4GB 204-Pin DDR3 SO-DIMM DDR3 1066 (PC3 8500) Laptop Memory Model 991644 $30.99
5. SIIG DP USB 3.0 2-Port PCIe - Value Model JU-P20811-S1 $32.99

Software:
1. Windows 8 Pro (Full Version) $139.99
2. JRiver Media Center 18 for Windows ($50)
~~3. JPlay ($130)~~

Parts To Be Upgraded:
1. Sonore USB Card ($300)
2. Sonore Batter Power Supply for USB Card ($400)
3. Teddy Pardo 12v DC Linear Power Supply ($400) or PI Audio BatteryBUSS ($500)

If anybody has suggestions on an affordable power supply (say under $250), that would be great!

Best,
John

ted_b · « **Reply #17 on:** 6 May 2013, 03:14 am »

John,
Jplay is wonderful, but a cpu hog. I am likely going to build a Zuma sized server (I am investigating something not so big a step from the CAPS V2+, something like an i5) to accommodate Jplay the right way (with the CAPS v2+ as controlpc in dual setup as next step).

The CAPS v2+ is minimalist and silent and great...but for jplay it is just a little too weak in the horespower department. not to say it doesn;t sound good...it does, but you can't get to ulitmate jplay setup (directlink on all sample rates) with an Atom processor.

InfernoSTi · « **Reply #18 on:** 6 May 2013, 03:32 am »

Ted,

Thanks for the heads up...that is $130 closer to a nice linear power supply!

I sourced my parts list from your build thread...and took a few items from here and there different (the mSATA SSD for example). I'm going to have a heck of a time loading Windows without a Windows machine to start with....funny, that is the thing I'm most concerned about.

Best,
John

InfernoSTi · « **Reply #19 on:** 7 May 2013, 03:01 am »

Quote from: ted_b on 6 May 2013, 03:14 am

(with the CAPS v2+ as controlpc in dual setup as next step).

Ted,

Where would I get information on this concept? I've not heard of a "control PC" dual motherboard setup before....

Best,
John