[Mitsuman]

Thank you all for your wonderful suggestions!

I'd like to clarify my needs. Originally I said I wanted a "simple" system, so many of you recommended integrated. Perhaps "basic" is a better word. Another thing I want to clarify is the budget. I understand it's hard to make recommendations without a budget. Honestly, I don't know my budget yet, since I don't know how much is needed for a decent system. And one purpose of this research is to propose a budget to my wife. After receiving your suggestions, I did more research and thought $5k to 6k perhaps is a good bet. I plan to distribute it as such:

• Speakers $2k
• Amp $1k
• Preamp $1k
• DAC $1k
• Source $400: universal player CD, DVD-audio, SACD, USB (for computer)

Again, many of you advised to choose the speaker first, then we can choose pre/amp. Now, I am leaning to salk SongTower for $1900. For others, I am thinking of Wyred 4 Sound DAC-1 $1k and used oppo-83 (or 83se).

Some other comments:

• Room: I definitely will take Cardas dimensions when I finish the basement. Above, I have a living room with 33L x 15W x 18H; this should be my first choice, comparing to the 20x17 family room (second choice) and the 11x11 office.
• Integrated: perhaps it will be a good idea to use one integrate around my computer in the 11x11 office, with the Tweek City Audio WAF-1 that I recently bought.
• vintage: my understanding is vintage good speaker is still good, but vintage electronics is no good.]

With all due respect, that is the silliest thing I've ever heard.

[roscoeiii]

There is certainly some fantastic vintage equipment out there. In general, I have often heard it said that digital playback (CD players and DACs) are where big improvements over vintage equipment has been made. Of course, this is in general. There may be some vintage gems even among CD players and DACs. Or it may be the case that some audio folks prefer the sound of the vintage equipment to newer equipment (even though the newer equipment may measure better).

[fwguo]

The Wyred4Sound DAC seems like it would be a good choice. If you are using a DAC, no need to get the 83SE, since its improvements are in the Oppo's internal DAC chip which you wouldn't be using since you'd have the DAC.

I looked at the audiogon listings, hard to find a cheap transport without DAC for <$400; while a used oppo is worth about $400, and oppo is highly praised. Perhaps I should look for an oppo transport, instead.

Mitsuman, pardon me for my ignorance about vintage; it was just my newbie thought. As long as one is sufficient for my need, I don't oppose vintage equipments. It may be easier to find a good deal there.

[roscoeiii]

There is no pure oppo transport, but all of their players have a digital out so they can be used as a transport. They are a good bet, and if you don't need Blu-Ray they can be gotten pretty cheap. The non-BluRay Oppos are also very easy to convert to universal DVD players, meaning you can watch DVDs from anywhere on the globe on it (China, Europe, you name it).

[Mariusz]

Thank you all for your wonderful suggestions!

I'd like to clarify my needs. Originally I said I wanted a "simple" system, so many of you recommended integrated. Perhaps "basic" is a better word. Another thing I want to clarify is the budget. I understand it's hard to make recommendations without a budget. Honestly, I don't know my budget yet, since I don't know how much is needed for a decent system. And one purpose of this research is to propose a budget to my wife. After receiving your suggestions, I did more research and thought $5k to 6k perhaps is a good bet. I plan to distribute it as such:

• Speakers $2k
• Amp $1k
• Preamp $1k
• DAC $1k
• Source $400: universal player CD, DVD-audio, SACD, USB (for computer)

Again, many of you advised to choose the speaker first, then we can choose pre/amp. Now, I am leaning to salk SongTower for $1900. For others, I am thinking of Wyred 4 Sound DAC-1 $1k and used oppo-83 (or 83se).

Some other comments:

• Room: I definitely will take Cardas dimensions when I finish the basement. Above, I have a living room with 33L x 15W x 18H; this should be my first choice, comparing to the 20x17 family room (second choice) and the 11x11 office.
• Integrated: perhaps it will be a good idea to use one integrate around my computer in the 11x11 office, with the Tweek City Audio WAF-1 that I recently bought.
• vintage: my understanding is vintage good speaker is still good, but vintage electronics is no good.

Why not keep it really simple with......
STi500 integrated
W4S DAC1
Oppo bdp-83 universal player

and speakers such as Salks, Emerald Physics CS 2.3 (used 2-3K) or new Zu speakers (high wife acceptance factor) and call it a day???


Mariusz

[Mariusz]

........Almost forgot ( you can think about this ones everything is in place)...........
 to sweeten the deal and to get everything dialed in, use this link and check out art acoustic panels from GIK Acoustics
Expect to pay anywhere between 7-14 hundred $$$  for these art acoustic panels. Not only will this help you get the most out of your system but it will also look just as good (you can use your pictures or art). Making wife happy goes a long way ....... especially in this hobby.



here is an example (one of my systems)

[JLM]

Vintage can sound great, but...

Parts do age (drivers/surrounds, and caps especially) and contacts (connections/controls) get dirty/rust with time.

Design philosophies have changed over the decades too.  Homes have gotten bigger, stereo (with importance on imaging/soundstaging) has been invented, bass has gotten tighter, more emphasis on speed and less emphasis on warmth.

Not too different from vintage cars.

[JLM]

Since you obviously have a computer, have you considered a music server like a Logictech Duet or Touch?  (Logictech bought out what was formerly known as a Squeeze Box.)  For $350 - 400 you have wired or wireless access to music stored on your hard drive plus internet streaming (radio) with a remote control.  The sound is good and Bolder Cable (another circle here at AC) can mod either one to very good levels (probably not to the level of the W4S DAC).  Additional (modded or un-modded) units can be added to bring music into any number of rooms in the house (with amplification/speakers added of course).  And these units are very small.  They simply plug into the wall for power and your pre/integrated amp.

[fwguo]

Since you obviously have a computer, have you considered a music server like a Logictech Duet or Touch?  (Logictech bought out what was formerly known as a Squeeze Box.)  For $350 - 400 you have wired or wireless access to music stored on your hard drive plus internet streaming (radio) with a remote control.  The sound is good and Bolder Cable (another circle here at AC) can mod either one to very good levels (probably not to the level of the W4S DAC).  Additional (modded or un-modded) units can be added to bring music into any number of rooms in the house (with amplification/speakers added of course).  And these units are very small.  They simply plug into the wall for power and your pre/integrated amp.

Someone also suggested to use a computer as the source such as: Mac Mini + dB audio labs Tranquility DAC. I am doing research about that now. The big concern to me is the Tranquility DAC has only one input - USB. I also saw people replacing Squeezebox with the Mac+Tranquility combo.

[dvenardos]

Regarding speakers you need to decide if you can do open baffle or not. Open baffle speakers need to be pulled out at least 3' from the boundaries.
If you can be 1.5 - 2' from the rear wall then you can go with a rear ported speaker.
Any closer than that and you need to go with a sealed or front ported speaker.

A speaker that I really like is the GR research Neo line. You can demo the Neo 2X which is a sealed monitor for free if you go over to the GR circle and signup. There is nothing like listening in your home.

The DAC that I use from my squeezebox 3 is the channel islands VDA-2. There have been lots of reviews on it and it is an excellent DAC.

For amplification I use the Virtue Audio Two.2 with sonicaps, very detailed and tube like sound.
They also have an Integrated the Sensation which is on tour over in the cheap and cheerful circle. If you signup try to get the M901 that has upgraded caps.

There is no substitute for listening in your home and when you can get free (shipping only) demos there is no reason to not try different stuff out.

Don

[JLM]

So you're starting with the room, great!  And now that you have a budget in mind, speakers are the best place to start.  Any interest in vinyl (I didn't see any mention of it)?

But what are your musical and audiophile preferences?  What are your favorite musical genres?  How loud do you listen?  Will you be including home theater use with this room/system?  Do you dig loud/deep bass?  Do you crave a warm/luscious sound?  Do you demand absolute levels of detail?  Is pin point imaging or an expansive soundscape important to you?

Sorry to make life so complicated, but if you gave me $50k to buy a car for you, wouldn't you specify SUV, sports car, or family sedan?

[John Casler]

Thank you all for your wonderful suggestions!

I'd like to clarify my needs. Originally I said I wanted a "simple" system, so many of you recommended integrated. Perhaps "basic" is a better word. Another thing I want to clarify is the budget. I understand it's hard to make recommendations without a budget. Honestly, I don't know my budget yet, since I don't know how much is needed for a decent system. And one purpose of this research is to propose a budget to my wife. After receiving your suggestions, I did more research and thought $5k to 6k perhaps is a good bet. I plan to distribute it as such:

• Speakers $2k
• Amp $1k
• Preamp $1k
• DAC $1k
• Source $400: universal player CD, DVD-audio, SACD, USB (for computer)

Again, many of you advised to choose the speaker first, then we can choose pre/amp. Now, I am leaning to salk SongTower for $1900. For others, I am thinking of Wyred 4 Sound DAC-1 $1k and used oppo-83 (or 83se).

If you were not all that concerned about SACD and DVD-Audio you could 86 the Preamp and get a DAC w/volume control running directly to the power amp.

This would eliminated the preamp, and the additional cables, as well as provide a very clean direct route with fewer compression connections.

[Delta Wave]

Since you obviously have a computer, have you considered a music server like a Logictech Duet or Touch?  (Logictech bought out what was formerly known as a Squeeze Box.)  For $350 - 400 you have wired or wireless access to music stored on your hard drive plus internet streaming (radio) with a remote control.  The sound is good and Bolder Cable (another circle here at AC) can mod either one to very good levels (probably not to the level of the W4S DAC).  Additional (modded or un-modded) units can be added to bring music into any number of rooms in the house (with amplification/speakers added of course).  And these units are very small.  They simply plug into the wall for power and your pre/integrated amp.

I LOVE my Squeezebox! Best thing since sliced bread.

The actual company was Slim Devices that Logitech bought out. Do they still make the Transporter? That can be used as a preamp as well.

[fwguo]

So you're starting with the room, great!  And now that you have a budget in mind, speakers are the best place to start.  Any interest in vinyl (I didn't see any mention of it)?

But what are your musical and audiophile preferences?  What are your favorite musical genres?  How loud do you listen?  Will you be including home theater use with this room/system?  Do you dig loud/deep bass?  Do you crave a warm/luscious sound?  Do you demand absolute levels of detail?  Is pin point imaging or an expansive soundscape important to you?

Sorry to make life so complicated, but if you gave me $50k to buy a car for you, wouldn't you specify SUV, sports car, or family sedan?

I am a newbie and just want a near audiophile quality system. Economically, it's better to use this 2 channel music system with HT; however, I would be happy to have only 2 channels for HT, optionally with a sub woofer. In other words, what I want is just a nice luxury family sedan. Good sound qualities, such as what you have mentioned, are desired but not craved.  I don't dig loud/deep bass. I like classical, vocal, pop, .... I haven't got into the vinyl world.

[MaxCast]

Be sure to read up on the Odyssey system.

Klaus and Alex set up along the long wall this year to optimize imaging and it worked.  Candela, mono Khartago's, and Lorelei's.  As someone said, they are consistently good every year and it was no different this year.  $5k or so with cabling, still a terrific value.

The Odyssey room was a room I could have spent all day listening. The sound was detailed, balanced and non-fatiguing. I can't imagine one could find better sound than this for $5,500. We listened to vinyl on an Alex G modded Technics 1200. Very nice vinyl playback for not a lot of money. Congratualtions to Klaus and Alex on a great sounding room.

[adydula]

Onkyo 608 AVR - $ 389
Oppo BD 83SE  - $ 899
Salk SongTowers with Ribbon Tweeter - $2599

I ran this setup for several years (without the Ribbon Tweeter in the SongTowers, saves $700).

The AVR makes HT and 2 ch stereo easy to do. Well integrated.

If your more on the 2 ch audiophile side, then there are a ton of options t replace the AVR with, intergrated and seperates.

More seperates, more cables, more cost.

All the best
Alex
 

NOTE: I still have an Onkyo AVR for HT. But for 2 ch I use a AVA Ultravalve Amp, $1699. The Oppo BD83SE (use the analog outs for the dacs), and AVA Insight + Preamp. Salk SongTowers (wonderful speakers).

Very nice open and transparent sounding from the AVR, but the AVR today are really pretty good....u can save alot until you really know where you want to go in audio. I liked the lonewolfyny integrated pre + amp suggestion as well.

[fwguo]

Why not keep it really simple with......
STi500 integrated
W4S DAC1
Oppo bdp-83 universal player

and speakers such as Salks, Emerald Physics CS 2.3 (used 2-3K) or new Zu speakers (high wife acceptance factor) and call it a day???


Mariusz

I like the DAC-1 + STi-500 recommendation, how about DAC-2 + ST-500 as I was suggested, which I like better?

Another thought: I should definitely consider AVA DAC/preamp/amp, especially if I choose salk's speakers.

[Stu Pitt]

If I were to spend about $6k into a new system and wanted to keep it very simple, here's what I'd get without thinking twice -

Naim Uniti - $3850 and Totem Arro - about $1500.

I like the Arros as they're a bit leaner and faster sounding speaker.  I could easily live with Vandersteen 2CE Sigs for about $2200.  Those will sound a bit warmer and smoother.  They'll also fill a larger room better.

The Uniti has everything in one box - integrated amp, CD player, digital inputs, FM and internet tuner, and music streamer.  The only thing it won't play is vinyl.  And it sounds phenominal.  Far better than any "receiver" has any right to sound.  Sounds identical to the Naim Nait 5i and CD5i.  Get this system and call it a day IMO!

[Stu Pitt]

Did I mention the Uniti also has an iPod input, and that it'll most likely be upgraded to a digital iPod input like a Wadia iTransport?   The UnitiQute and Naim N-DAC both have the iPod digital input.   And the Uniti can be controlled by an iPod touch/iPhone/iPad.

The Naim Uniti is easily the best thought out piece of audio equipment I've seen in years, maybe ever.   And again, it sounds fantastic. 

[turkey]

I'm planning to build a 2-channel music system, my budget is very flexible. The followings are my requirements:

• CD player: thinking about Emotiva ERC-1 for $400
• preamp: perhaps also Emotiva USP-1
• amp: perhaps Emotiva UPA-2 $300
• speakers: sierra-1, salk songTower, HT3, B&W CM9; a subwoofer if needed

It sounds like you've got a pretty good system going here. I'd recommend the Salk speakers over the others though. I've heard several of Jim's speakers and they're nicely done.

I own a pair of GedLee Nathans, so I'd obviously recommend those or the Abbeys too. I feel they're better than any of the Salk speakers, but they're probably not as pretty as some of the Salks are.