[Hipper]

What is the minimum distance for a listener from the RM30Ms?

Would 140cm - 4' 8" - be too close?

I've tried it and it sounds OK to me but it does seem a bit close. I'm testing out the 'Thirds' speaker set up system. I'm using them with wave guides off.

[John Casler]

As different from most other types of speakers, the VMPS can be used quite nearfield.

This is for a couple reasons:

1) The Neopanels cover an exceptionally broad ranger of frequencies
2) the crossovers are such that the drivers blend at close range.

So you should have no problems with a well integrated sound.  It will likely sound like headphones "with a soundstage".

And it should be quite cohesive.  I remember years ago reading a VMPS detractor stating how he could hear the different drivers (of a 626R) quite clearly.  Bull Hockey!  I knew immediately he either never heard a pair of VMPS, or he was just making things up.

Now this only applies to the RIBBON (Neopanel equipped) Speakers only where we have such broad band reproduction on that panel.

[Hipper]

Thanks John.

Headphones with soundstage describes it well.

Before trying this I had the speakers wide apart almost in the corners with my seat on the other wall. I got a flat but wide soundstage.

I'm not sure which I like best but as I'm very fond of the headphone detail I may prefer the real nearfield option.

Tests continue!

[anmtspace]

I've got the RM30Cs which don't have the side-firing woofers. In my old setup I was listening at 6' (1.7m) seated against the back wall because I had no choice. I always felt I was cramping these speakers and that although they sounded okay I was missing their best. The small 8' x 8' square room had bare walls and a bass boom that was a bit annoying at moderate volumes. I never got the chance to play with dampening reflection points. Where I'm moving to now is an even smaller room but with a cathedral ceiling. I've got encouragement from Hipper on another post and spoken to John and I'm confident that these magical speakers will give me a totally acceptable extreme nearfield listening experience. The mental trick is to think of them as a humongous pair of ear speakers. John told me that they arguably sound better with the ribbon tweeter aimed above the seated ear height and suggests trialling placement on 3"-6" risers. They're not particular about wall placement and the depth of the cabinet is enough to get the speaker plane out from the facing wall when squeezing them into the corners. Brian designed them to sit flat on the floor so no spikes and they slide easily on carpet to allow them to be parked flat against the wall and slid into position for listening sessions.  I was contemplating having to sell them but John has told me it's unnecessary. He sits 7' from his RM40s and they work perfectly. The VMPS perform well at lower volumes, the treble and mids can be adjusted to balance the bass output and listening nearfield also limits room-overloading and reduces the 'annoy the neighbours' for apartment or late-night listening. Mine are fitted with the external crossover and the waveguide. They're a 'keeper' and are just so totally versatile. Take heart fellow owners and try this nearfield positioning, you may begin to love the intimacy of sound. It seems outrageous to be able to sit in such a minuscule 5' 6" triangle with these full floor-standers but Brian Cheney produced magic with this speaker design.

[Housteau]

What is the minimum distance for a listener from the RM30Ms?

Would 140cm - 4' 8" - be too close?

I've tried it and it sounds OK to me but it does seem a bit close. I'm testing out the 'Thirds' speaker set up system. I'm using them with wave guides off.

If you find that too close for comfort, either with what you hear or what you see, you could try the rule of fifths instead.  I went with the Rule of Fifths for my new room.  Both the Rule of Fifths and Thirds avoid those nasty 1/4 dimensions and I think that is the most important thing.  You can even mix the two with one for the length and the other the width.

A friend of mine always sets his speakers up as you described and it is just like headphones.  He did that with the larger Infinities, Martin Logans, Beveridge, everything.  That set up does remove a lot of the room sound, but personally I can't accept what it always looks like.  For him this was a choice since his room was not that small.  But, for smaller rooms where there are not a lot of choices the nearfield listening does have it's own form of magic.

[ZAKski288]

I'm thought I was pretty close also.  In my work area I have a pair 626Rs  to the side of me like headphones approximate 3 1/2 feet from me, and they sound incredible. 

[Hipper]

I tried 'the thirds' but in the end I could never get it quite right.

At first it sounded fresh and interesting but ultimately there seemed to be too many anomalies with the recordings for me to be happy with it. At least that's what I put it down to.

My current arrangement is using more or less the fifths (using REW I had determined that the two best positions were around the thirds and fifths positions - the fifths appeared best by these measurements). In my room of 420cm x 386cm, my speakers are 84cm off the long wall (exactly 0.2), 80cm off the other wall (0.207), and my ears 70cm (0.181) from the back wall. Distance from ear to driver is 266cm (just under 8' 9") and driver to driver is 252cm apart. Toe in is to an imaginary central point that exists a small bit behind the back wall.

It took me eight months of experimenting and settling in to get there and now I'm listening to my music for listening to music's sake. In fact I'm revisiting albums I rarely listened to and am now asking myself why that was. They sound good!

[Hemy]

? Do the 30's sound cleaner thatn like the RM-2's or Tower ii's, less bass but more full sound? How would you describe it?

[John Casler]

All neopanel based speakers will have a similar sound.  The tweeters, and woofers will adjust that sound accordingly.

More panels will allow a speaker to play louder with less stress.  Larger woofers will of course give you deeper and more dynamic bass.

There will also be a small difference  relative to a cabinets "shape".  The RM30, RM2, and RM v60 will all have a slightly different sonic signature due to some cabinet and baffle differences.

The Neopanel based speakers will also sound different than the cone driver speakers of the past.  They will have slightly more detail, resolution, microdynamics, and presense.

The Cone drivers will have greater macrodynamics.

[Hemy]

Thanks John