[Bob in St. Louis]

Hey Ken,
I bought the 2000. In fact, HERE'S a link to the auction on Ebay.
The pictures are less than flattering. The outside is a bit scratched, but physically it's in very good shape. The front panel is cosmetically perfect, which is great since it's the only part you'll see from the front of the equipment rack. The inside is immaculate.

Bob

[kyyuan]

cool.  I noticed you had to get a new outlet to accommodate the plug -- wonder if the 1500 model needs that mod.  Also, is it at all noisy?  Thanks.

[Bob in St. Louis]

I've got all the wiring finished. Since by breaker box was full, I robbed (tapped) power from my little daughters room. Definitely less than ideal, but until I can afford something better, this'll have to do. It's not like she'll be using anything that would disturb the circuit anyway.

Literally seconds ago, I plugged the Liebert into it's new plug.  aa
"Smoke test" successful....meaning that I haven't seen any smoke. 

Ken, Assuming you're in the States, all of the models "smaller" than the 2000 require what we would refer to as a "normal" plug...that is a NEMA 5-15P (pictured below).
As far a decibel level, YES it's loud. It would not be acceptable in the same room as the listening position. The good news in my situation is that all of my stuff is behind a pretty thick tempered glass door with a rubber gasket around it. That being said, I can still hear it when the room is quite. When time and money allows, I'll be purchasing a couple of the super quiet fans that Frank linked to a couple pages ago. If memory serves, they're $17 each.
Also Ken, Here is a link to the GTX2 line of UPS units Liebert sells. That's where I found what input receptacle is required for the various models.

Bob

{The "P" means 'plug', the "R" means 'receptacle'}:

[JDUBS]

I'm thinking about using one of the bigger models...like the 2700...and replacing the plug with a 15 amp plug.  The biggest model with a 15 amp plug will only handle 1050 watts, which at 120 volts is only 8.75 amps.

The 2700 model can take 1890 watts which at 120 volts is 15.75 amps and only slightly higher than my line is rated for.  The limiting factor will still be the breaker, which won't let you pull more power than the 15 amps.  I want to be as close to this 15 amps as possible. 

Anything wrong with this thinking?

Thanks,
Jim

[kyyuan]

Bob...thanks for the information.  The noise part of the Liebert unit may present a big challenge to me in that my system is in the living-room, which doesn't have any place to "hide" the unit.  Oh well.  Nonetheless, thanks for taking the time to answer my question.

Good luck.  And, actually, I'm not in the US as I live in Texas.   

Ken

[JDUBS]

I think Frank said that the fans are replaceable making it something you can have in your listening room.

-Jim

[Bob in St. Louis]

Yes, Frank has his in the listening room. The fans he linked to (apparently) are quiet enough to be in the same room as his equipment, and him.

By the way, I removed the Fluke from the house outlet, and installed it into one of the Liebert outlets. In the last nine hours or so it has recorded a Min/Max of 120.4/122.8.
That's pretty darn stable. In all fairness, the batteries are still charging...Not sure if that'll effect how stable the output voltage is or not, but I'm pretty happy so far.

Jim, I asked Frank the same question about cutting the plug off the unit and replacing it with a "regular" plug. He wasn't too fond of that idea.

As a side note, the unit has run pretty cool in my rack so far. The fan outlet and top of the case are cool to the touch. I wonder if a fella could put a resistor on the fan to slow it down. The fans that are in there seem overkill. But then again, I've not "run it through it's paces" yet.
Not sure what it's BTU capabilities are. 

Bob

[Speedskater]

I'm thinking about using one of the bigger models...like the 2700...and replacing the plug with a 15 amp plug.  The biggest model with a 15 amp plug will only handle 1050 watts, which at 120 volts is only 8.75 amps.
The 2700 model can take 1890 watts which at 120 volts is 15.75 amps and only slightly higher than my line is rated for.  The limiting factor will still be the breaker, which won't let you pull more power than the 15 amps.  I want to be as close to this 15 amps as possible.
Anything wrong with this thinking?
Thanks,
Jim

Jim, the question is can the UPS start on a 15 Amp circuit?  Maybe if you have a 20 Amp circuit anywhere nearby and the UPS has been un-plugged for a period of several days. You could recharge the batteries overnight on the 20 Amp circuit then move it to your listening room.

The 15 Amp breaker will only limit power (or current) when it trips!  A 15 Amp breaker is rated at 15 Amps continuous,  continuous is 3 hours.  Audio equipment use high power only very intermittently.  So if you can get the UPS started, you won't be limited by your 15 Amp breaker.

A Kill-a-watt meter is a fun toy for your system, but I think that they all have 15 Amp connectors.

[Bob in St. Louis]

I've run the Liebert through it's paces over the last 48+ hours.
I like this unit. Very much in fact. Today I did the shuffle game with eleven power cords. They all now go through the Liebert (with the use of power strips, of course). I was just able to turn on the second (of four) LEDs that measure the load on the unit. Illuminating the second LED is an indicator that I'm somewhere between 26%-50% of it's rating.

I had the Fluke on the Liebert's output for over 48 hours. The Min/Max is 120.8/123.2
I'm pretty happy with a voltage variance of 2.4 volts. Certainly MUCH better than 44 volts.

The guy from the power company removed the monitoring device from my meter after downloading what it's recorded the past couple days. As it turns out, the peak amperage was 162 when the A/C unit came on. The standard "running" amperage of the entire house was around 30, which means the A/C takes 132 amps to start. The tag on the compressor unit says the spec is 131, so that's dead on. Good thing, I'd hate to buy a new A/C compressor.

Again, the guy told me they'd either install a new, and larger transformer on my pole, install a capacitor bank "upstream", or boost the voltage "upstream".

Not sure if this is a blog of my electrical issues, or a review of the Liebert UPS. 
Either way, I assume there's a couple of you still interested.

I owe Frank a public Thank You for directing me to the Liebert.
Frank....You're the man. 

Bob

[Frank S.]

Again, your welcome Bob. Although the power company appears to be doing the right thing, it's nice to know your equipment will not suffer anymore power problems. It also sounds like you have plenty of headroom available with the 2 kVA version.

Did you test the batteries yet? There are some pretty good deals on E Bay right now. There's an external battery pack for your unit at a bid price of $10 (not sure what it will sell for). While not needed, it just a reflection of the type of AC system you can put together for WAY cheaper than the "audiophile" alternatives.

Bob- any comments on the sonics of the Liebert? Although we talk about the other tangible benefits, I think regenerated, on line conversion is the way to go for awesome sound as well. My system has never sounded better since I added the Liebert. A lot of audiophile products attempt to correct for problems on the AC line, whereas the Liebert pretty much eliminates them and keeps it that way regardless of what's going on with the power company.  I used to hate when a small brown out would flash my system off due to low voltage and then quickly turn everything on all at once when it passed. In case there is a total power failure the UPS will give you plenty of time to power down and unplug you components (unless your not around.)  That's one of the reasons I went with two external battery backs, gives me about 12 hour window to be around to take care of things.

[Philistine]

I don't want to divert the flow of the thread, but I have a question that is relevant - is their any legislation on what power companies have to deliver in terms of voltage, and if so does anyone know the range they have to meet?

[Bob in St. Louis]

Philistine - Absolutely it's relevant. And a very good question.
Not sure if it's a law, but my electric company said that a 7% variance is their standard. Again, I'm not sure if that's a federal thing, or theirs. Seems to me that 7% is a pretty tight spec on 120VAC.
I'd be interested in hearing the law though.

Did you test the batteries yet?

Oh yea...I'm testing the batteries alright. 
Right now as a matter of fact. I didn't do it per the manufacturers specs, I did it my way.  aa
I yanked the cord. 

At a listening level of about 90dB, I had the following components running off the Liebert:
- Harman Kardon AVR 645 (big monster solid state home theater receiver. 550 watts max consumption).
- Behringer DCX2496 (not much power consumption. About 12 watts)
- Legion LSA-900 (800 watt amp) not sure what consumption is.
- 250 watt Plate amp (400 consumption)
- Jolida JD202a 40wpc Tube amp (not sure what the consumption is, but I'm sure it's a lot)

While watching the LED indicators, I continued to listen at about 90dB. After 23 minutes, I got down to the last LED, indicating that I've got less than 25% reserve power remaining.
Cool stuff. Frank, if we ever meet, you're getting a big wet sloppy kiss.   

As far a sonic benefits are concerned....Of course it sounds better. Because I've just spent money. That's why it sounds better. duh.
Honestly, I've not critically listened yet. No opinion just yet.

Bob

[Frank S.]

Sounds like the batteries are right up to spec. According to the manual, with a 30% load and the internal battery you would be good for about 26 minutes and with a 40% load about 19 minutes.

[JakeJ]

Now maybe I can request one that's been cryo'd. 

Hey Bob, don't forget to have them custom wind the transformer with UPC OCC wire and line the case with Shakti stones. 

Best of luck and it's great to see someone get good customer service from their utility.  There are some that have the attitude of "We don't care because we don't have to".

JakeJ

[Bob in St. Louis]

Jake, When the guy told me they might have to change my transformer, I almost asked about cyro'd..... as a joke of course. But I was worried he wouldn't get the joke and would want an explanation. Then I'd look like a jackass. Regarding the OCC wire....ain't gonna happen Brother. If I can't bring myself to ask about cryo, then I CERTAINLY won't give preference to a particular wire type.   

Franks, Yes, I think I'm in great shape. To be honest, I would have been happy with one or two minutes of reserve time. If the power goes out in the house for an extended period of time, I've got bigger things to worry about than listening to tunes (meat in the freezer, climate control, keeping the family comfortable etc....).
If the power goes out for an extended period of time, I've got a large generator that does a great job of powering the necessities (including the system).
My biggest concern was damage to the system components due to the random shut-downs.

  IMPORTANT: If you're interested in purchasing a UPS....., Frank has privately taught me a little about how UPS units work. There is a difference. The method the Liebert uses is called "Online UPS", also known as "True UPS". This unit powers my system from the internal battery as opposed to the power provided by utility company. This, as a byproduct of the circuitry, will act as a power conditioner/filter to an extent. Most UPS units I've researched (by "big name" companies) use a circuit topology called "Line Interactive". This is a less desirable unit as the "trash" that's coming through your electric utility is being fed right into your equipment. Also, there's a certain amount of latency while the unit switches from AC to DC (battery backup), then back to AC. The biggest advantage of an "Online UPS" is that the "trash" is filtered out internally before your equipment see's it, as the unit is always running off the battery (and keeping it charged/charging in the background). This would translate into an audible/sonic improvement in your system since the power it's being fed is cleaner.
Quite possibly clean enough that another piece of "cleaning" equipment wouldn't be necessary?

Frank, (or anybody) please correct me if I'm wrong.

Bob

EDIT........Whoops.....I mean to give a link about the different topologies of UPS circuit.
HERE'S a link........

[JakeJ]

I agree Bob, it's tough to tell audiophile jokes to the uneducated.

I also have a Liebert but much smaller.  Mine was a throw-away, dumpster special from work.  Cleaned it up and installed two fresh batteries and has been perfect ever since.  It just runs my PC as I lost two power supplies and a motherboard due to not having the protection of clean, regulated power.  Not a glitch since the Liebert was added and on the one power outage the PC didn't even know it happened.  Calculations tell me the Liebert will power my PC for about half an hour before shutting it down and it emits a loud alarm when the utility goes down.

I'll also give a thanks to Frank S.  His info is another excellent contribution to AC. 

BR,
Jake

EDIT for spelling (I hate it when I forget an 's')

[JDUBS]

Yep, huge thanks to Frank for the Liebert tip.

I scored a new 15A GXT2 on eBay for $102.50 + shipping.  I'm going to give it a try on my front end stuff (ahead of my balanced power transformer).  This will be in my listening room, so I need to pick up some of those quiet / silent fans, too.

-Jim

[Bob in St. Louis]

Good deal Jim!!
Which one did you get? If memory serves, there's several 15A models.

But it sounds like Jake got the best deal of them all. 

Bob

[Frank S.]

Jim has it right- if you want to use something like the Liebert in combination with a balanced power product, it must be placed ahead of it. The Liebert would not power up if plugged into a balanced power unit.

When changing the fans, I just left the factory clips connected to the circuit boards and cut the wires (red & black) at the stock fan. I then cut the 3 pin connector off the new fan and simply spliced the the two wires (red>red & black>black) together. Most of the replacement fans have either 3 or 4 wire clips that are not compatible with the connection point on the board inside the Liebert.

I also lined the inside of the top cover and the front plastic faceplate with some PC Sound Dampening material to further absorb any fan noise. My unit has three fans (1 front, 2 rear) so I was trying to make them as quiet as possible.

[JakeJ]

Hmmm...this application of placing a Liebert ahead of the audio power conditioner does make good sense.  Especially in my case as my Audio Magic PLC isn't a regenerator or a regulator.  It is essentially a very good "grunge-buster", i.e. simply a filter for RF, EMI, and any other crap on the line.

The online double-conversion would feed the AM much nicer AC power and then it could do it's job on the grunge.

The Audio Magic was such a giant leap forward in overall performance on my system that I just couldn't do with out it.  Thanks to Jerry Ramsey of AM for coming up with this stuff and thanks to AC member Mr. Pig (aka John Hoffman of Affordable Audio) for turning me on to it which included him bringing is AM gear over and letting me hear it on my system.  I compared the RSA Jaco, the Majik Buss, and the AM all at the same time purely by coincidence and the AM gear was the clear winner.  Just my .02 on that.

BR,
JakeJ